Episodes
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Join Jonathan Youssef to navigate the complexities of truth and love. In this episode of Candid, Jonathan will examine the challenges of understanding these concepts, including whether absolute truth exists and the multifaceted nature of love.
The conversation touches on the Christian perspective of being salt and light to a dying world that lacks an understanding of truth and love. It highlights the importance of living out the truth of our faith with love and patience in the community.
Further, we explore the apostle John's transformation from a zealous youth to a wise elder who embodies truth and love. Through his letter to Gaius, we uncover the joys of faithfulness to the Gospel, the significance of hospitality, and how to discern true from false teachings.
This episode aims to inspire a deeper understanding and practice of truth and love in listeners' lives. It encourages reflection on personal beliefs and actions in light of these foundational principles. Join us to explore how these ancient virtues remain relevant and transformative today.
After you listen to this episode, you may have questions. We would love to hear from you! To ask Jonathan a question or connect with the Candid community, visit https://LTW.org/Candid
Also, join the conversation on our social media pages:
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/candidpod
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Twitter: https://twitter.com/thecandidpod
This transcript recounts Candid Conversations with Jonathan Youssef Episode 244, Are You Walking in Truth?:
Today I want to talk to you about Truth and love. These are two words with many different definitions. When I say truth and love, you don’t even know what I could say next. I could say anything. Is it my truth? Is it your truth? Is it his truth, her truth, their truth? It’s almost as if it’s just a subjective topic, a subjective term. Is there anything like absolute truth?
And love, my goodness, are we talking about romantic love, brotherly love, or agape love? Are we talking about love that is just tolerance and acceptance? Do we love each other only as long as we agree with each other? Or is it just a feeling or an emotion? Is love self-defined? Love is love.
The world today is tied up into knots over these two terms. Can a person have truth and not love? Can a person have love but not truth? Here’s the reality: I don’t expect the world to get this right. I don’t have a great hope that things will get a lot better at any point in time because this is not our home. But at the same time, I have not been called to run out into the hills and build a bunker and stock up on ammunition. We have been called to look at a dying world that does not know the truth and does not understand love, and we are called to be salt, and we are called to be light to them.
We are called to encourage one another, to gather and praise God's name together, and to go out and witness to the world together because our message is far greater than any message they will ever hear. No matter your age or stage of life, if you put your saving trust in the Lord Jesus Christ, then your calling is to be obedient to the truth and to walk the truth out in love.
A. W. Pink was a reformed theologian who wrote several great books and many fantastic sermons. His writing is so helpful; I’ve used several of his writings in research that I’ve done for other sermons. Martin Lloyd-Jones, who was succeeded by our dear friend R. T. Kendall at Westminster Chapel said, “Don’t waste your time reading these other theologians,” like Karl Barth and Bruner. He said, “Go and read Arthur Pink. Read Pink.”
Pink would tour around America and Australia preaching and teaching, but he was never well-known until after he died. Pink finished out his days living in isolation in Scotland with his wife. They never really became part of a church body. They never got situated with a good church community.
Lloyd-Jones also said of Pink, “As it related to his inability to be patient with people and remain in a particular church, if I had behaved as Pink did, I would have achieved nothing. I could see that the only hope was to let the weight of truth convince people, so I had to be very patient and take a long-term look at things; otherwise, I would have been dismissed, and the whole thing would have been finished.”
Pink was a man who was grounded in the truth and yet, for whatever reason, was not walking it out. And his own friends testified against him. That’s why Scripture is very careful to teach us that we walk these two things out together—truth and love. We should be people who are marked by truth, strong in our convictions, and hold fast to the Word of God, by the Spirit of God, for the glory of God. But we should also be marked by love and generosity, grace and humility, hospitality, and care because all of these are the markings of Jesus’s life and ministry on Earth.
So, we read about these two things, truth and love, in the shortest letter in the Bible, John’s third epistle. Before we go any further, let’s take a minute and read from Third John:
The elder, To my dear friend Gaius, whom I love in the truth. Dear friend, I pray that you may enjoy good health and that all may go well with you, even as your soul is getting along well. It gave me great joy when some believers came and testified about your faithfulness to the truth, telling how you continue to walk in it. I have no greater joy than to hear that my children are walking in the truth. Dear friend, you are a faithful ... you are faithful in what you are doing for the brothers and sisters, even though they are strangers to you. They have told the church about your love. You will do well to send them on their way in a manner worthy of God. It was for the sake of the Name that they went out, receiving no help from the pagans. We ought therefore to show hospitality to such men so that we may work together for the truth.
John wrote the Gospel of John and First, Second, and Third John. He would also later write the book of Revelation. First John was written to a very general audience. Second John was written to a specific church. And this letter, Third John, was written to a very personal and specific person.
Let’s take a minute to get to know John. He was a disciple, and he was nicknamed by Jesus, with his brother James, the “sons of thunder”. When Jesus and the disciples were turned away from hospitality from a Samaritan village, it was James and John who went to Jesus and said, “Can we call for fire to come down to judge these people,” - a la Elijah and the prophets of Baal.
Jesus rebukes them because his first coming was not one of judgment but to preach the good news, to bring healing, and to bring life. But compare John in his youth to this John here in writing his third letter, and he is referred to simply as “the elder.” John grew from a brash, arrogant young man filled with fire, to this wise, gentle, loving older man who is full of love and truth.
What happened to John? How did he move from a son of thunder to the loving elder? What had he experienced? He had witnessed a lot. He had witnessed Jesus’s teachings, Jesus’ miracles, Jesus’ preaching. He witnessed Jesus’ patience with the disciples. He witnessed the transfiguration and saw Christ with Moses and Elijah, a depiction of the Law and the prophets. He also witnessed His Lord and Savior crucified on the cross. It was then he was given the position of caring for Jesus’s mother, Mary. This is John, who would also see His Resurrected Lord and Savior. John is a man who has been used mightily by the Lord.
And John is writing this letter to a man called Gaius. Now, we don’t know anything about Gaius. He doesn’t appear to be in any sort of leadership in the church that we can tell. All we see is Gaius’s character, and that character is being reported back to John. We see that there was some conflict in the church over who was trustworthy. They wanted to know who they could believe.
There are so many mixed messages. A preacher would travel from house church to house church and depend on other believers to show them hospitality. In John’s second epistle he warns the believers not to welcome in or even greet the false preachers and teachers because that would only help them spread a false gospel. He’s saying, “Do not endorse these people, but take the faithful in and welcome them.”
So, what are the distinguishing marks between a false teacher and a faithful teacher? Now, these weren’t denominational issues. They weren’t in disagreement over infant baptism and believer’s baptism. They disagreed over whether Christ had physically come in the flesh. John says, “Leave these people alone. Let them go on their way. The truth itself will testify to the faithful teachers.”
In essence, he is saying, “If you are a believer who has heard and received the Gospel and your spiritual eyes have been opened, your spirit inside you will resonate with what is being taught and you will know a true teacher of the Gospel.”
Teachers were dependent on hospitality. They didn't have Holiday Inn or Motel 6. This is why hospitality was such a major issue in the early church. When Jesus sends out the 12 and the 72, He tells them they will be provided for by people of peace. When Paul writes to the Romans, he fully expects that they will financially support his mission journey to Spain. And the book of Hebrews urges the hearers not to neglect hospitality to strangers. Two great needs, truth and love, together.
So John writes to Gaius, verse 1, “The elder to the,” in the ESV, beloved, I’m going to use that term, “the beloved Gaius, whom I love in the truth.”
What does it mean to love in the truth? John says that Gaius continues to be faithful to the truth concerning Jesus Christ. And it is the truth that binds us together. We know love because we know the truth.
John writes in his first epistle, 1 John chapter 3 verse 16, “By this, we know love, that he laid down his life for us, and we ought to lay down our lives for the brothers because of the truth of the gospel.” Because of the gospel's truth, we are called to love one another. Strangers? Never heard of it, not in the church. I may not know your name, but we are brothers and sisters in Christ. We have more commonality than flesh and blood oftentimes do.
Listen to what John writes in verse 2, “Beloved, I pray that all may go well with you and that you may be in good health as it goes well with your soul.”
How does he know it’s going well with Gaius’s soul? We read it in the next verse: "For I rejoiced greatly when the brothers came and testified to your truth, as indeed you are walking in the truth.”
John knows it is going well with Gaius’s soul because he is living out the gospel's truth. They testified about his faithfulness to the gospel. Gaius is living out the truth of the gospel in love. He’s walking in the truth.
John emphasizes that Gaius’s faithfulness involves his holding to true doctrine and his persistence and actions, which are consistent with what is in the doctrine. In verse 4, John says that his greatest joy is not that his 401(k) is strong, not that his children’s academic and athletic successes are great, not that the design of his home is beautiful, nor that his favorite sports team won a big game. His greatest joy is that his children fellowship with him and actively walk in the truth.
In each of his three letters—to the general church, to the specific church, and to the individual—he goes out of his way to say, “This is important to me. I’m conveying what brings me joy: that you are walking in the truth.”
Gaius has remained faithful to the gospel. He has not fallen to the false teachings that were swirling around. And he is a source of the elder’s greatest joy. Moms and dads, what is your greatest joy regarding your children? Is it that they are academically successful and get into a fantastic college? Is it that they are athletically successful and get scholarships? Is it in your position and the status of your vocation? Is it in the appearance of your home?
And this goes beyond families because Gaius is not John’s physical son; he’s his spiritual son. And so when we are here together as a body, we are, again, brothers and sisters in Christ, and we’re constantly putting forth and putting on display what we prize. I wonder if we went around and asked all the children, “What is it that your mom and dad prize, or your grandma and your grandfather?” What are we displaying as the greatest value to the next generation?
But I also understand that this can be a source of great pain for many people. Your children may not be walking with the Lord, so instead of being a source of great joy, it is a source of great struggle and pain. I think John would give the word to those in that situation to remain in the truth and love. Don’t take truth as a 2 x 4 to your children and try to beat them up with it, insisting that this is right. Your children will despise you for that, and they will despise the truth. But you walk this out in love, with compassion. Don’t forget the truth. Instead, hold it together with love. That is the gospel's message as it was put on perfect display by our Lord and Savior, Jesus Christ.
Then John praises Gaius for his hospitality to traveling preachers. “Beloved, it is a faithful thing you do in all your efforts for these brothers, strangers as they are, who testify to your love before the church.”
His efforts for the faithful brothers is what John commends as faithful. It isn’t just what Gaius believes is faithful, but also his actions. And it is because of what Gaius believes, what he has planted his faith in, that he can be faithful with his actions. Because if you’re not planted in something faithful, your actions won’t reflect faithfulness. But Gaius is planted in a living hope. He is planted in a resurrected hope. He is planted in an unconquerable hope.
These believers go back to Ephesus, where John was, and they say, “We had an amazing time preaching in this little town. You wouldn’t believe it. In this little town, there was a brother in Christ called Gaius, and he was a brother who was strong in the truth. And he was a brother who loved well. He took us in, cared for us, and introduced us to people in the church. He is a dear brother.”
How good is it when people speak well of us? Have you ever been conversing with someone you didn't know very well, and you mention a friend, and that person immediately starts to gush over that person?
“Oh, I love that person. They are so fantastic! Let me tell you. We were moving, and they came and helped us move.” And then you’re sharing stories about how fantastic this person is, how much you love this person, how helpful and insightful they are, and what a blessing they are to know them.
I remember in Australia, there was a well-known evangelist and preacher who was contemporaries with John Stott and Dick Lucas, and just like those two men, this man never married. And the Lord used their singleness to serve the global church so well. This man’s name was John Chapman, and in typical Australian lingo, they shortened it incredibly and just called him Chapo. He was funny, he was kind, he was generous, he was hospitable. He was a mentor to my pastor in Sydney. He had done some work with Dad in the past as it related to evangelism.
And I remember after Chapo died watching his funeral online. The Archbishop of Sydney got up and shared, and he mentioned how deep of an impact Chapo had on so many people. And then he said, “Why don’t we all take a minute right now and have everyone just share your Chapo story with your neighbor?” I mean, I almost burst into tears because it was immediate. Not a second had passed, and the room was filled with smiles, laughter, love, and storytelling. And the problem was that they finally had to get up and say, “Stop. Be quiet. Stop. We have to keep going with the service.” Because they could have gone on like that for hours.
I have a feeling that would have been Gaius. Maybe on a smaller scale, but that would have been Gaius. People would have gone on and on about how dearly he was loved and his impact on them.
I wonder what people would say at a celebration of your life? Would people easily share what an encourager you have been and what a great help you were? Or would they talk about how you may have had your doctrine perfect, dotted every I, and crossed every T, but had no love, like Arthur Pink?
There weren’t universities, trade schools, or tertiary education in the first century. There were these philosophers who would gather in the town square and philosophize. They would just drone on and on about how their philosophy was right. Nothing has changed.
They would try to attract hearers, and then they would start these schools with the hopes that some of these families would say, “We want to send our son to your school,” and then they would train them in that philosophy. Some thought that just as there were stoics, cynics, and epicureans, Christians would have a school like this, and then they would just train up their people like this, that they were just another philosophy of life.
But Christians refused to take this money because Christians were not saying they were just another philosophy amongst the rest. They were announcing the Kingdom of God. They were telling people the good news of the gospel of Jesus Christ. That is not just a philosophy; that is a total worldview perspective that affects everything and everyone.
So John says, “These men come in the name of Christ, preaching the word of Christ, and they refuse help from the pagans; therefore, we ought to support people like these, that we may be fellow workers for the truth.”
Now listen, I understand we may not be in the same position as Gaius or this church, but think about your missionary care and support. Think about your care and your support for ministries that strive to take the gospel to the lost and those on the outside. Think about how you care for and support the pastoral team in your church. Think about how you care for and support your small group leader; how you care for and support your Bible study leader. Think about what it means to support people in ministry. We are all fellow workers for the truth. Your support carries on our work as preachers.
It allows for ministries like Leading The Way to exist, and that work leads to ultimate destinies being changed in people's lives. I read a letter from a young Muslim convert a while back. He was watching the Genesis series we did a while back and talked about how it served, blessed, encouraged, and equipped him. So, your support of the truth motivated by love is serving and blessing this community here and to the rest of the world. What a privilege it is to be a part of something bigger than ourselves, to be supportive of something outside ourselves. When we see that people are blessed and are walking in the truth, that can serve as our greatest joy.
I want to leave you with three questions. It would be good to write them down and to think about them this week.
First, where does your great joy come from?
Second, do people speak well of you regarding truth and love?
And finally, are you a fellow worker for the truth?
I hope these will serve you well today, tomorrow, the week ahead, and the rest of your life. I hope that they will serve as great motivation.
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How do you forgive when you feel deeply wronged and wounded? Is it important to ask for forgiveness when we have wronged someone else?
On today's episode of Candid, Jonathan Youssef unpacks the parable of the unmerciful servant in Matthew 18 and reveals how giving and receiving forgiveness are intertwined.
After you listen to this episode, you may have questions. We would love to hear from you! To ask Jonathan a question or connect with the Candid community, visit https://LTW.org/Candid
Also, join the conversation on our social media pages:
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Missing episodes?
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Good Friday invites us to witness Christ's profound love and sacrifice, urging us to ponder our role in this redemptive narrative. It calls us to seize the hope and transformation found only in Jesus’s death and Resurrection, motivating us to live lives that reflect Christ's calling.
Join Jonathan Youssef for a thoughtful reflection on the events of Good Friday. We'll explore the depth of Jesus's suffering and its crucial role in delivering salvation and hope to the world. We’ll also explore the critical moments at Golgotha, including Jesus’s crucifixion, the division of his garments, and the powerful expressions of love and sacrifice from that day.
By the end of this episode, you’ll gain insights into the significance of Good Friday in the foundation of Christianity, emphasizing the salvation plan and the transformative impact of Jesus’s ultimate sacrifice.
Stand alongside Jonathan at the base of the cross where Christ was crucified and contemplate the magnitude of God’s love for humanity during this Holy Week.
After you listen to this episode, you may have questions. We would love to hear from you! To ask Jonathan a question or connect with the Candid community, visit https://LTW.org/Candid
Also, join the conversation on our social media pages:
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Is your prayer life effective? Like many, you may ask, "What is an effective prayer life?"
Join Jonathan Youssef to explore the question of what makes prayer effective. With insights from James 5:16 and the prophet Daniel's prayer life, listeners are guided through the foundational aspects of a prayer that resonates with God, including righteousness, praise, confession, mercy, and bold petitions.
Jonathan emphasizes the importance of aligning our prayers with God's will, as revealed through Scripture. He demonstrates how a righteous life and heartfelt prayer can lead to significant spiritual growth and transformation. This episode encourages listeners to re-evaluate their approach to prayer, ensuring it's rooted in a deep relationship with Christ and a sincere desire to see God's will done on earth.
Whether seeking to invigorate your prayer life or deepen your spiritual walk, this episode offers valuable insights into connecting more meaningfully with God through prayer. Tune in for a journey that promises to uplift and inspire your faith.
After you listen to this episode, you may have questions. We would love to hear from you! To ask Jonathan a question or connect with the Candid community, visit https://LTW.org/Candid
Also, join the conversation on our social media pages:
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Twitter: https://twitter.com/thecandidpod
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In this enlightening episode of Candid Conversations, Jonathan Youssef welcomes Phylicia Masonheimer, an influential writer, speaker, and the founder of Every Woman a Theologian. With a Bachelor of Science in Religion and author of pivotal books such as Every Woman a Theologian: Know What You Believe, Live It Confidently, Communicate It Graciously, and Stop Calling Me Beautiful: Finding Soul-Deep Strength in a Skin-Deep World, Phylicia shares her compelling journey from growing up in a culture adjacent to legalism to empowering women in their faith and understanding of the Bible.
Phylicia delves into the critical issues surrounding purity culture, the importance of theological education for women, and the nuanced challenges of navigating legalism and fluffy, feel-good teachings within the Christian community.
Further exploring the balance of family life, ministry, and personal growth, Phylicia and Jonathan discuss practical strategies for managing time, the value of intentional living, and the profound impact of home discipleship on children's spiritual development. Phylicia's insightful perspectives on critical thinking, engaging with Scripture, and the transformative power of the Gospel offers you a refreshing approach to your faith journey.
This episode is not just a conversation but a heartfelt invitation to embrace theology with open arms and discover the strength and grace that come from a deeper understanding of God's Word.
After you listen to this episode, you may have questions. We would love to hear from you! To ask Jonathan a question or connect with the Candid community, visit https://LTW.org/Candid
Also, join the conversation on our social media pages:
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/candidpod
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Twitter: https://twitter.com/thecandidpod
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Join Jonathan to discover the roots and the dangers of the prosperity gospel. In this insightful reflection, Jonathan highlights the danger of the prosperity gospel and its power to distort faith into a tool for material gain, urging listeners to prioritize their devotion to Jesus Christ over wealth. He emphasizes the importance of choosing eternal treasures over worldly ones, using Moses and Jesus Christ as models for forsaking earthly riches for God's glory.
The episode of Candid challenges listeners to reflect on their values and the true meaning of living a life of Biblical prosperity, encouraging a life aligned with God's purposes rather than pursuing material wealth.
After you listen to this episode, you may have questions. We would love to hear from you! To ask Jonathan a question or connect with the Candid community, visit https://LTW.org/Candid
Also, join the conversation on our social media pages:
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Jordan Taylor was entrenched in the New Age for more than ten years. She practiced witchcraft, performed spells, was a tarot card reader, and enrolled in classes to sharpen her psychic abilities. She was a certified Reiki master and yoga teacher. She used crystals as a means of healing, protecting, and manifesting. She worshiped nature and worked with goddesses. She found her spirit guides and let them lead the course of her life. She believed she created her reality and was her god, controlling her life.
But she grappled with darkness, deception, and a yearning for more…until she had an encounter with God.
Jordan Taylor first shared her testimony of giving her life to Christ on Facebook, which went viral. She then turned that post into an article for the Gospel Coalition. We wanted to know more, so Jordan joins Jonathan for a Candid Conversation to discuss what led her into the New Age, what prompted her to consider a relationship with Christ, and how that relationship has transformed her life from anxiety and darkness to peace, love, and light in Christ.
After you listen to this episode, you may have questions. We would love to hear from you! To ask Jonathan a question or connect with the Candid community, visit https://LTW.org/Candid
Also, join the conversation on our social media pages:
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/candidpod
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TRANSCRIPT
This transcript recounts Candid Conversations Episode 238: New Age to New Life with Jordan Taylor.
Jonathan Youssef: Today, my guest is Jordan Taylor. She wrote an article on the Gospel Coalition website, and Jordan, you mentioned that your testimony went viral. Was it that article on Gospel Coalition, or was there another platform on which your testimony went viral?
Jordan Taylor: Yes, my testimony on Facebook went viral.
Jonathan: Facebook. Okay. Jordan Taylor comes out of New Age, so don’t worry if you’re a Christian. If you’ve heard that term a thousand times and still have no idea what it is, Jordan Taylor will define it for us. And it’s a wonderful testimony of how the Lord has drawn you to Himself. It sounds like He’s using you to help others who are caught up in this worldview, particularly young people who are getting caught up in this—I know I’ve seen it quite prevalently, even in the most recent years, so thank you so much, Jordan Taylor, for joining us on Candid Conversations.
Jordan: Thank you so much for having me.
Jonathan: Let’s start with a definition of “New Age.” You could use that term, and maybe 10 percent of the people in the room would have an accurate definition; the rest just nod along and assume they know what you’re talking about.
Jordan: True. So, it is very difficult to define because there is no systematic doctrine for the New Age, and it borrows from many different religions, belief systems, and esoteric traditions. So you might find it’s sort of an umbrella term for a mixture of these concepts drawn from things like Hinduism, Buddhism, metaphysics, astrology, occultism, and mysticism. So it pulls from all different places, and you can say one thing, and another person in the New Age may not be doing that same thing.
Jonathan: Right. Is it sort of the view of they’re at the top of the mountain, and they’re saying, “Hey, all the paths lead to the top, don’t worry” sort of thing?
Jordan: Yeah. You will find that. You will find that all roads lead to heaven sort of mentality.
Jonathan: Interesting. Will you tell us your story? Let’s start with origins and how you got into this, and then we’ll get to the rest of your testimony and how the Lord saved you from it.
Jordan: I was in the New Age for about 13 years. I started by getting involved with yoga, and eventually, that led into meditation, so it was sort of a snowball effect. I started going to therapy—and you’ll see in any modern therapy as well as if you google stress management or how to deal with anger or how to deal with anything, you’ll see that the results are yoga, breathing, meditation. You’ll find a lot of that. So, I started seeing a therapist who recommended taking yoga, and I was not really into that. I wasn’t sold on it. But eventually, after enough encouragement, I decided to try it. I was already into psychic mediums, and I had an obsession with crystals, so I was already there. I had moved to Salem, Massachusetts, at the time, so I was engrained in—
Jonathan: Witchcraft.
Jordan: Yeah. Witchcraft—
Jonathan: Right at the heart of it, Salem.
Jordan: Yeah, my interests were piqued in that matter, so being in Salem definitely overwhelmed me with more of that. Then, being encouraged to try yoga just kind of fits. So I did. I tried yoga and thought I could see how people would like this and how people would feel better after a class like this. I still wasn’t 100 percent sold, but eventually, I liked it so much that I got certified as a yoga teacher. So, I was a yoga teacher. I also became a reiki master- an energy healer. I did hands-on energy healing. I was doing crystal healing. I was an oracle card reader. I was doing intuitive readings with people. And I built a whole business around this, so—
Jonathan: Is this about finding peace, connection with the universe, and alignment? I’m assuming astrology probably comes into this. Yeah, so it’s a seeking of oneness and purpose. These are kind of the main thrusts behind this mindset.
Jordan: Yeah, I was certainly seeking my purpose. I came from a childhood of trauma. I had a pretty rough childhood growing up, and so I had a lot of unhealed trauma that I hadn’t processed.
Jonathan: And that's why you were seeing a therapist to begin with?
Jordan: Yes.
Jonathan: Okay. All right.
Jordan: Yes. I was really searching for ways to heal, for peace, and for my purpose on this earth, and the New Age really played into all of that.
Jonathan: Yeah. Yeah, and it gives you a lot of answers, too; I know the term they like to use a lot is holistic, right? It’s mind/body/spirit, things that are not uncommon to the Christian faith in terms of thinking through those things. Our body is a temple, etc., the renewing of your mind. But the connection to the Earth and the universe, from our perspective now, now that the Lord has saved us, and given us a mind to think, and given us His Word, right, there’s some truth in the elements of creation and the display of the wonder of God, but it’s been warped, it’s been twisted. I remember reading in your article about this is sort of buying into the original lie of Adam and Eve in the Garden.
Jordan: Yes.
Jonathan: That's sort of a helpful thought. I mean, I think everything originates there, right? It’s, in a sense, even in the seeking of oneness, there’s this element of divinity within ourselves and not outside of us so much. Yeah.
Jordan: Totally. I would say that witchcraft started in the Garden of Eden. I mean, Adam and Eve believed the greatest lie ever told, that you would be as gods, and so when you think about it, a lot of times you’re thinking, okay … Well, in the New Age you believe that you can create your reality. You believe that you can manifest what you want. And so essentially, you are thinking that you are your god.
Jonathan: Speaking things into existence and power over all sorts of things. Okay, so you’re headlong into it. You’re teaching yoga, you’re a reiki master, you’re reading cards. Where does the metaphorical stop sign come, or what does it look like, a yield sign or …?
Jordan: I was just so deep into this stuff and at the darkest time in my life. I can remember struggling with depression. I was putting on this façade like I had all the wisdom of the universe and all the secrets and the keys to life and abundance, manifesting joy and peace. And really, behind the scenes, I was struggling deeply with anxiety and depression. And I was at such a low point and such a dark point that I remember saying I preferred not to live anymore. And I was also experiencing things. Because my intentions were good, I thought that I was helping myself; I thought that I was helping other people, and my intentions were good. But what I didn’t know was that I was playing in the spiritual realm, and I was opening doors to places that I didn’t realize I shouldn’t be going. And so I was welcoming in darkness, and I was welcoming in the enemy. In my article, I said that I was laying down a welcome mat for deception and darkness.
And so it got so bad, I was experiencing sleep paralysis, just so many things were happening, and I reached such a low. And at that time, I was dating someone, and the guy that I was dating had just lost his brother. He was an atheist, and he told me one morning that he had a dream, and in the dream, he had met Jesus. And so he told me about this dream, and I didn’t know what to do with it because I had all of these opinions about Christianity, I had all these opinions about Jesus. I believed that Jesus was just a prophet, a historical figure, a teacher. I had even subscribed to the fact that maybe Jesus was some ascended master—you’ll hear that in the New Age. And I also had so many opinions about the bible, and I had never read it.
So hearing him say, “I had this dream about Jesus,” I didn’t know what to do with it, but I thought, you know, he’s going through a lot, and I’m going to support him, no matter what that looks like. So I just kind of listened. And then he started—next thing I know, like every time I see him, he’s got his nose in the Bible. And then he’s like, “I want to go to church. I want to find a church.” And I’m just like, “What is happening?”
Jonathan: Where’s my atheist boyfriend?
Jordan: Yeah! It served me when I was in the New Age because I could kind of pull from any sort of belief and make it true, or true in my mind, I should say. And so being with an atheist matched that for me.
Jonathan: He wasn’t giving you any insight.
Jordan: No, and he wasn’t challenging me in any sort of way, either, to think otherwise. Because I could think whatever came my way, I could think that it was true. And so I’m seeing him checking out churches and reading the Bible, and I remember one time, it was on a Saturday, and I was working, and I text-messaged him and said, “What are you up to?” And he said, “Oh, I’m just watching Passion of the Christ.” And I was like, “For fun? Like this is what you do for fun now?”
Jonathan: Just another Saturday afternoon.
Jordan: I was really confused. But I did become curious. So, since I’d seen him reading the Bible so much, I wondered, “What is in there that has gotten your attention? What are you reading?” And he started to tell me some things he was reading, and I was like, “Really? That's in the Bible?” I didn’t know what was in the Bible; I’d never read it, but I thought I knew what it was all about. I feel silly thinking back on it. And so I remember him asking me to watch a movie called Son of God. And I just really was like, I don’t think that I want to watch a movie about Jesus in my spare time. I don’t want to watch a movie about Jesus for fun. And I was just so averse to that—even though a part of me was curious about what was happening in him, curious about what he was learning, that I eventually did say, “Okay, I’ll watch this movie.”
And so I sat down to watch the movie. I remember very distinctly that I don’t remember what part of the movie, and I can’t even tell you how the movie was, whether it was good or not, but all I can remember was there was a moment where I just started weeping. And it was a cry that I’d never cried before. And I was weeping, and at the same time that I was weeping, I felt this overwhelming feeling of love. I was just enveloped in this overwhelming feeling of love.
And I was just crying and crying, and I remember looking over at my boyfriend and him looking at me, and I was just like, “What? What? Don’t look at me! I’m having this experience. I don’t know what's going on.”
But I realized at that moment that it was God. And I knew that God was after my heart. Ever since that moment, I have thought, I want to feel that again and know what this is all about. I want to know what God is all about. I thought I knew best because I’d had so many different experiences throughout my life, especially in the New Age. And after that moment, I felt compelled to read the Bible. I ended up going and buying a Bible. Once I started reading the Bible, I realized that so many things were taken from the Bible and repackaged in the New Age so that people could either digest it better or make it more appealing to people. And ultimately, I guess, make it less offensive.
So I was reading these things, and I’m like, Oh my goodness. I remember learning about this in the New Age, but under such different circumstances, under deception. And so as I was reading, I felt this sorrow that I knew what I had been doing was wrong, and I knew that I had been sinning against God, and I felt really bad, but in a way that it was a godly sorrow. But I’m realizing, Oh my goodness, I see the truth. I see the truth now. And as I’m reading God’s Word, I’m like, Oh my gosh, I was doing all of these things unknowingly against the God who created me. And so I thought that I knew who “God,” I say in quotation marks, who God was. I always called God “the universe” and thought that this universe was handing me my cards in life, not knowing that God is a person who is alive and—
Jonathan: Revealed Himself and—
Jordan: He has revealed Himself to me, and I’m learning the truth.
Jonathan: You mentioned that you thought you knew what the Bible was about. So, in that lifestyle, what did you think the Bible was about?
Jordan: I thought the Bible was just this tool to oppress people. I thought that it was so outdated and that it was just a tool for the patriarchy. I thought that it was anti-women. You know, I was really big into feminism, so I thought it was anti-women. I thought it was just anti-people, really, and that it was trying to create systems of oppression. And yeah, I just thought that people who read the Bible and Christians were stuck in an old paradigm and not realizing that it was me who was deceived.
Jonathan: You mentioned that as you began to read Scripture, you found some of the things taught in the New Age were disambiguation or twisting of scriptural text. What were some examples of things you read and found the original purpose versus the twisted interpretation you were given?
Jordan: Yeah, I remember one thing when I read about God’s loving-kindness. That word stuck out to me because, in the New Age, there was something called meta meditation, a loving-kindness meditation that focuses first on the self. So, you’re meditating, focusing on yourself, and giving love to yourself. And then it goes out to other people and returns to yourself. You always start and end with yourself and other people in between, and so you’re giving loving kindness to yourself and others. But when I read about God’s loving-kindness, and I saw that word, I was like, Oh my gosh, here I am just really glorifying myself in this and thinking that, Oh, because I’m thinking of others, my intentions are good and pure, not realizing—
Jonathan: Ultimately, you’re thinking about yourself.
Jordan: Yes. A big part of the New Age is the huge emphasis on self and the glorification of self. So yeah, that was a big one for me, the meta meditation that I learned in the New Age and then seeing that it’s God’s loving-kindness that all this stems from.
And then the biggest one was I remember doing a meditation, I think it was with Eckhardt Tolle, that one, and he, in this meditation, he said when you meditate, and you ask yourself who you are, you’re probably going to come up with all the wrong answers. And I’m paraphrasing here, but he said that the real, the correct answer to “Who are you?” when you’re meditating is “I am.”
Jonathan: Whoa!
Jordan: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And you know now as a Christian that is so blasphemous.
Jonathan: Old and New Testament, right?
Jordan: Yes. Yes. So you know you think about this. You’re sitting there in meditation saying, “I am,” and yeah, now thinking back on it, I’m just…
Jonathan: Fascinating.
Jordan: Yeah. So blasphemous. And believing, again, that's just like emphasis on the self.
Jonathan: Yeah, and again, back to the garden. I am a god.
Jordan: I am a god, yes. Yeah.
Jonathan: I’d be curious to hear your thoughts on this. I feel like we are seeing some believers being tempted; it’s very much in the Hollywood culture to combine some New Age with Christianity as a form of getting closer to Christ. I know you talk about the Christ consciousness in your article, which I think is Friedrich Schleiermacher, but because you’re so aware of the New Age practices, you lived it out; maybe you’d give us some examples of where you’re seeing that in churches or individuals and maybe kind of throw out some of the warning signs of where people could be leaning into that, and the red flags are going up for you.
Jordan: Yes. Another phrase for that would be “religious syncretism.” This means fusing more than one religion or belief to create a new religion. And that's exactly what the New Age is—borrowing from different religions. I would say there’s so much that can be said about this, where you’re seeing the New Age pervade the church today.
One of those things that I’ve run across a lot lately is yoga in the church, and Christians are turning it into holy yoga and and so taking a practice that comes from Hinduism and Christianizing it. But you can’t Christianize a practice that comes from another religion and think that you’re glorifying the God of the Bible. So I see a lot of that happening. I also see even churches not preaching from the Bible, not preaching the gospel, or using the Bible. I had a friend tell me before that he was attending church, and he loved it because they didn’t use the bible at all.
Jonathan: It’s the best church ever.
Jordan: I was thinking, Wow! That's not church.
Jonathan: Yeah, yeah. What's the authority they’re teaching on?
Jordan: Yeah, yeah. So even that, I would say, is New Age in and of itself. I would also say the law of attraction. You see a lot of that in churches—name it, and claim it.
Jonathan: Right. Sort of a prosperity gospel kind of, yeah.
Jordan: Yeah, that. So you’re seeing a lot of that come into the churches. Even crystals themselves come into the churches or meditate. But Scripture tells us to meditate on the Word of God, not to empty our thoughts, not to empty our minds of thoughts, but our thoughts are supposed to be focused on what is good and holy.
Jonathan: Yeah, right.
Jordan: So, there’s that. Along with the law of attraction, there’s that word of faith. I would also say the whole follow your heart, believe in yourself—
Jonathan: Be true to yourself.
Jordan: Yeah, be true to yourself. There is so much emphasis on self, which will also lead you down a road of chasing after what feels good. If you’re following your heart, you’re chasing after what feels good, but that's not what we’re supposed to do as Christians. We’re supposed to follow Jesus.
Jonathan: Well, and to see that our hearts are deceived … deceitful, wicked, they’re bent in on themselves, as Calvin says. They’re inwardly bent on worshiping themselves. Yeah, that's true, and that's part of pop culture, right? That seems like the motif of almost every child’s movie through Disney. It’s the belief in yourself, trust in yourself, and you just want to say that won't end well.
Jordan: It’s not going to end well. No, it’s not. Yeah, I think Jeremiah says that the heart is deceitful.
Jonathan: That’s right. There will be people listening to this who have a friend or a relative who may be dabbling in this or caught up in it. What's your suggestion for the best way to start a conversation? Is it just to order many copies of the Son of God or Passion of the Christ and then start showing movies? Obviously, that's how the Lord worked for you. But what are your recommendations for beginning those conversations?
Jordan: When I told my testimony, many people said, “Well, what movie is it?”
Jonathan: We need to go buy it!
Jordan: Yeah. And I want to say even if you watch that movie, it doesn’t mean you’ll have the same experience that I had. And if you have people who are in the New Age, there’s a disconnect here that I think Christians are missing. Part of that is understanding the root cause of why people went to the New Age in the first place. So, understanding what it is drew them there first and validating their experience. So if it’s childhood trauma, if you’ve had experiences and people are telling you you’re crazy, it’s listening to understand someone to start, instead of jumping down someone’s throat and saying, “Well, you’re wrong, and this is the truth, and this is what's right,” it’s understanding what brought them there in the first place and validating their experience that got them there.
But then let them know that there is a better way and that the truth is that there is hope in Jesus Christ, a peace that surpasses all understanding in Him, and give your testimony of how Jesus has worked in your life. And so I think if people have loved ones that are stuck in New Age that it’s more of being a good example of Jesus, being the hands and the feet of Jesus, and like I said, listening to understand; knowing there’s a root cause for why they got there. And I do get pushback from Christians who will say, “Well, you don’t want to enable the sin.” But you can’t have someone conclude that they are a sinner until they’ve first heard about where they’re at and why they’ve come to this place. And if they don’t understand what that is, then, of course, they’re not going to want to listen.
I have a friend with whom I’ve been friends for 30 years, and she has been praying for me for just as long. There were times that she would want to speak to me about Jesus and want to talk about the Gospel and would send me books and movies and things like that, and my first reaction was to throw it out. And it wasn’t because she was doing anything wrong; it was where I was. And I think people have to understand that it’s not personal. So if you are talking to someone in the New Age and they are not taking what you’re saying and just suddenly becoming a believer, it’s not personal, and that this really is a spiritual battle and you’re told to plant the seed.
Jonathan: One of the fruit of the Spirit is patience.
Jordan: Absolutely. A lifetime of 40 years is a long time to be patient, but if there’s any encouragement in that, it’s that I’ve spent 13 years in the New Age, my friend has been praying for me for 30 years, and ultimately, I came to Christ. And so for people who are stuck in this, watch them suffer and watch them go down these paths to just stay steadfast in your faith and stay steadfast in prayer. And know that this is a spiritual battle and it’s not personal. It’s not about you.
Jonathan: And it’s not over.
Jordan: It’s not over, that's for sure.
Jonathan: In your Gospel Coalition article, you mentioned that you’re working on resources to help guide people in the New Age to freedom in Christ. What are some of those resources? Are they available at the moment? Are we still working on them?
[31:25] Jordan Taylor: Yeah. Unfortunately, I don’t have anything available yet. I wish I did. I’m pausing social media at this point. Since my testimony went viral on Facebook, my platform has become kind of crazy, and I always get DMs. I have a lot of similar or common questions that come up or topics that come up, so I’d like to—right now, while I’m off of social media, I’m kind of working on some content and information to put out there so that people can find something to either find encouragement for the Christians that have people that are in the New Age.
Or encourage people who are in the New Age and want out. Believe it or not, some people are in the New Age and are being called by Jesus, and they know it and are struggling to—
Jonathan: They feel imprisoned.
Jordan: Yes. So, I’m working on some resources. I don’t know when they will all be available, but for right now, I will probably be off social media through Easter, and I’m hoping that come springtime, I’ll have some stuff to put out there for people.
Jonathan: Wow, that's wonderful. I think it’s an absolutely needed resource, again, as we’ve said, in this day and age where young people are looking for answers, they’re dealing with hurts, and they’re turning to all sorts of things—different religions, different … and New Age is definitely one of those near the forefront of those options. As you said, that tends to come up for Google searches, yoga, meditation, and everything else. And so, Jordan Taylor, we’re just so grateful for how the Lord is using you, and we pray that He will equip you with what you need as you put those resources together. We’ll keep our listeners up to speed as those become available. Your article on the Gospel Coalition, for those who are interested, is called “I Left New Age for Jesus.” And that's thegospelcoalition.org.
Jordan, thank you so much for taking the time to be with us on Candid Conversations.
Jordan: Thank you so much for having me.
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With the average day filled with endless smartphone scrolling and binge-watching, how often do we pause to reflect on the deeper longing behind our screen time? Join Jonathan to explore the complex relationship between modern entertainment and our spiritual well-being.
Jonathan shares the balance between enjoying life's pleasures and not letting them overshadow our primary purpose: to glorify God and enjoy Him forever. Inspired by insights from the digital age and the wisdom of scripture, this reflection confronts the challenges of navigating a world designed to capture our attention, discussing the impact of entertainment on our spiritual journey.
Listen now to receive Biblical insight on how to live intentionally in a distraction-filled world, finding joy and purpose in God's presence above all else.
After you listen to this episode, you may have questions. We would love to hear from you! To ask Jonathan a question or connect with the Candid community, visit https://LTW.org/Candid
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In this NEW episode of Candid Conversations, host Jonathan Youssef welcomes Dave Hubbard back to the program. Dave is a former NFL football player and pastor at The Church of The Apostles. In this encouraging episode, he shares his rich experiences and insights on serving both within the church and in the broader community. With a background that spans professional sports to full-time ministry, Dave offers a unique perspective on the importance of active service and its challenges and rewards.
After you listen to this episode, you may have questions. We would love to hear from you! To ask Jonathan a question or connect with the Candid community, visit https://LTW.org/Candid
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Jonathan sits with internationally renowned author, apologist, evangelist, and former investigative journalist Lee Strobel. Known for his bestselling book, The Case for Christ, Strobel shares insights from his remarkable journey from skepticism to faith. The discussion then turns to his latest book, Is God Real? Exploring the Ultimate Question of Life, where he blends his investigative skills with theological inquiry.
The episode offers an enlightening perspective on the recurring question of God's existence, backed by logical arguments, scientific evidence, and profound personal experiences. Listen and then share it with a friend who may benefit from this conversation.
After you listen to this episode, you may have questions. We would love to hear from you! To ask Jonathan a question or connect with the Candid community, visit https://LTW.org/Candid
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The question that weighs heavily on so many hearts and minds is, "How do I pray for and reach my unsaved loved ones for Christ?"
On today's episode of Candid, Jonathan Youssef unpacks this question and provides Biblical insight into why we pray, the relationship between divine sovereignty and human responsibility, and the blessing we have in bearing witness to and praying for our unsaved loved ones.
After you listen to this episode, you may have questions. We would love to hear from you! To ask Jonathan a question or connect with the Candid community, visit https://LTW.org/Candid
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Explore the transformative power of God’s Word in this new Candid Conversations episode. Learn how it acts as a guardian, strengthens character, sustains through life's pressures, and heals the spirit. Join Jonathan as he reflects on the cleansing, covering, and correction offered through God's Word as outlined in Psalm 119.
Listen now, discover practical ways to integrate God’s Word into your daily life, and experience the enrichment available only in the Truth of Christ.
After you listen to this episode, you may have your own questions. We would love to hear from you! To ask Jonathan a question or connect with the Candid community, visit https://LTW.org/Candid
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As we walk closely with Christ, there will be times when we must choose between the calling God has put on our lives and something else like a relationship, friendship, family, or career choices.
Can you imagine being at the top of an illustrious career when God asks you to leave it for vocational ministry? When most people revel in success and stay to move up to their dream position, today's Candid Conversations guest chose to follow the call of God on his life to serve Christ and His church in pastoral ministry.
Rocky Seto, former Seattle Seahawks assistant head coach, talks with Jonathan about his journey to football, salvation, and rise in coaching from college to the NFL. Rocky gets candid about his struggles and the deep calling to serve Christ and His church in pastoral ministry.
You don't want to miss this episode. It is a beautiful reminder of God's goodness when we delight in Him and are faithful to live out His calling.
After you listen to this episode, you may have your own questions. We would love to hear from you! To ask Jonathan a question or connect with the Candid community, visit https://LTW.org/Candid
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Have you ever wondered what God's call is for your life? Do you think about what He created you to do? Do you wrestle and ask if you are in the center of His will? These are questions we all wrestle with periodically. If you are in that place now or know someone who is, today's podcast is for you.
Jonathan welcomes Clay Kirkland back to Candid Conversations. Clay is a life coach who served 18 years as the Director of Staff Development at The Wesley Foundation at The University of Georgia, where he mentored and coached thousands of young adults. He is also a certified Strengths coach and consultant who helps people discover and operate in their God-given strengths.
Together, Jonathan and Clay will navigate deep questions of purpose using Scripture as their guide. Join them now.
To ask Jonathan a question or connect with the Candid community, visit https://LTW.org/Candid
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In this new reflection on renewal, Jonathan Youssef delves into the power of the new year as a time to reflect on our faith with a powerful message from Hebrews 13:5-6. First, he reminds us of God's unchanging promise never to leave us and explains how understanding this truth will allow us to live without fear, embracing contentment and courage in Christ.
Join Jonathan and be encouraged to reflect on how God is shaping you to be more like Christ and to serve others in the coming year. He will guide you in writing prayers to seek a renewed mind and spirit and to commit to ministering love and hope. As we review these prayers, we're urged to thank God for His faithfulness and step into the new year with joy and anticipation for His continued work.
After you listen to this episode, you may have questions. We would love to hear from you! To ask Jonathan a question or connect with the Candid community, visit https://LTW.org/Candid
Also, join the conversation on our social media pages:
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The Christmas season is ending, but before it's over, we wanted to share some special Christmas Caroling with Mac Powell and Jonathan Youssef.
Mac Powell is the worship leader at The Church of The Apostles. He is also a Grammy award-winning recording artist. In this Christmas episode, Mac and Jonathan have a lot of fun talking about their favorite Christmas traditions, songs, and the incredible reality of God’s saving love through His son Jesus. Oh, and yes… Mac will be serenading us with a few of his favorite tunes. It's a special episode you definitely don’t want to miss!
After you listen to this episode, you may have questions. We would love to hear from you! To ask Jonathan a question or connect with the Candid community, visit https://LTW.org/Candid
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The Christmas season often captivates us with its superficial wonders—exchanging presents, festive gatherings, and decorating our spaces. In this new Christmas reflection, Jonathan warns that these things can sometimes overshadow the reason for the Advent season, preventing us from focusing on the profound meaning of Christmas—Emmanuel, God with us.
After you listen to this episode, you may have questions. We would love to hear from you! To ask Jonathan a question or connect with the Candid community, visit https://LTW.org/Candid
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To give to Leading The Way's Triple Matching Challenge, please visit us at https://ltw.org
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Could you be missing a miracle of God? Are you too busy for God's intrusion into your life?
God took on flesh in Bethlehem on a night when the streets were bustling with congestion created by a mandatory census. People were busy, but the Messiah quietly came into the world. Some stopped what they were doing and followed God's prompting, but so many missed it.
How will you spend Christmas? Will you join the hustle and bustle and miss the true gift of the season? Or, will you slow down, seek the heart of the Father, and prepare to encounter the living Christ?
Join us as Jonathan shares a special Christmas reflection and reminds us that the true beauty of the Christmas story is this- God's power makes regular intrusions even when we make no room. No room in the Inn? God still took on flesh. No room in your holiday traditions? God still calls to your heart. No room in your isolation? The Savior still invites you to intimacy with Him. We pray this episode will encourage you to make room for Christ this Christmas and each day that follows.
After you listen to this episode, you may have your own questions. We would love to hear from you! To ask Jonathan a question or connect with the Candid community, visit https://LTW.org/Candid
Also, join the conversation on our social media pages:
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To give to Leading The Way's Triple Matching Challenge, please visit us at https://ltw.org
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As a Christian parent, you undoubtedly yearn to guide your children in nurturing their love for Christ. But the question remains: How can you enjoyably accomplish this meaningful task? If you want to connect your children with the love of Christ, you won't want to miss this episode.
Today, Jonathan is delighted to welcome back Zack Carden to Candid Conversations. Jonathan and Zack share a deep bond, with both serving for many years on staff at The Church of The Apostles. Zack now holds the role of senior pastor at Marietta Community Church.
In this enlightening Candid Conversation, Zack introduces us to The Adventures of Greybobby, a lovable cartoon character who doubles as a podcast host on a mission to equip parents with rich yet accessible and entertaining Biblical resources for the spiritual development of their children.
Join Jonathan in unraveling the backstory of Greybobby and discover more about this captivating character who plays a pivotal role in devotional content and engaging videos, all designed to effectively convey the message of Christ's love to the little ones in your life.
To ask Jonathan a question or connect with the Candid community, visit https://LTW.org/Candid
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Watch The Adventures of Greybobby
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Should Christians allow their children to trick-or-treat? Is Santa Claus ok? Are we free to send our children to public school? The list of debatable issues is endless - places where Biblical principles should be applied, but will every Christian apply them the same way?
Join Jonathan Youssef and Dr. Bruce Lowe to explore the delicate balance between conviction and grace, navigate the complexities of disagreements within the Christian faith, and understand when to hold Christian beliefs with a closed hand and embrace Christian liberty.
Bruce Lowe is a scholar, author, and a favorite professor at Reformed Theological Seminary.
Please take a few minutes to settle in and listen to a thoughtful and inspiring Candid Conversation.
To ask Jonathan a question or connect with the Candid community, visit https://LTW.org/Candid
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