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It’s the Year of the Metal Dragon, a new millennium, and Dui Hua’s debut as an official NGO. John Kamm and China trade pioneer-turned-Dui Hua board member Bill Simon find themselves trying to explain the Supreme Court’s Bush v. Gore decision to a confused Chinese audience. This episode of Dragon Years: Remembrance of Times Past journeys to 2000 for a discussion of how China has changed and how it has stayed the same. Kamm and Simon discuss their time in the Middle Kingdom during Dui Hua’s first year. Their discussion traverses the 1990s, dips back into 1988, and explores how the events of Tiananmen and the MFN trade policy have shaped this century so far. The duo reflects on their work with Dui Hua and what US officials got wrong about increased trade with China while finding reasons to be optimistic for the future of US-China relations.
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Dragon Years: Remembrance of Times Past - 1976 & 1988Bai Li (John Kamm Remembers)1999: Dui Hua Begins its Work (John Kamm Remembers)Dui Hua’s First Trip to Beijing, May 2000 (John Kamm Remembers)John Kamm Remembers Timeline: 1972-1989 -
The latest episode of Dui Hua’s limited podcast series, Dragon Years: Remembrance of Times Past flashes back to 1988, the Year of the Earth Dragon. China is reckoning with floods, increased foreign trade, and calls for reform. In Episode 2, John Kamm speaks with Richard Glover, a pioneer and veteran of US-China trade. The two former colleagues discuss how their paths crossed, the politics of doing business in China in the lead-up to Tiananmen, and what lessons 1988 has for today’s China watchers. Kamm and Glover’s recollections on their work selling chemicals in China in the late 1980s range from the humorous to the poignant. From the golf course to Tiananmen Square in the days before the nation hurtles toward a great tragedy, the two men witness a run on the banks and come face-to-face with the increasingly tense student movement.
Dragon Years: Remembrance of Times Past (1976)All Business is Local: The Macau Subcommittee (John Kamm Remembers)Nothing Starts Without a Sale: Learning to Sell in Cultural Revolution China (John Kamm Remembers)Guangzhou in the Waning Days of the Cultural Revolution (John Kamm Remembers)John Kamm Remembers Timeline: 1972-1989 -
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To mark the Year of the Dragon and Dui Hua's 25th anniversary, we are excited to bring you a limited podcast series, Dragon Year: Remembrance of Times Past. This five-parter explores key developments in John Kamm's life and Dui Hua's history, spanning the Dragon Years between 1976 and 2024. And through conversations, we gain insights from friends and colleagues who have been integral to Dui Hua’s mission. In this inaugural podcast, Kamm discusses the decisions that led to his first trip to China as a trade representative in 1976 and subsequent experiences on the Chinese Mainland during the waning days of the Cultural Revolution. He recalls the death of Premier Zhou Enlai, being caught in the Tangshan Earthquake, acupuncture anesthesia, and interactions with a senior liaison officer in Guangzhou.
Related for this episode:
Nothing Starts Without a Sale: Learning to Sell in Cultural Revolution China (John Kamm Remembers)Guangzhou in the Waning Days of the Cultural Revolution (John Kamm Remembers)John Kamm Remembers Timeline: 1972-1989Video: Guide to the Canton Trade Fair -
In the lead-up to China’s human rights review at the United Nations on January 23, host Samy Amanatullah speaks with Dui Hua executive director John Kamm about Dui Hua’s work at the United Nations, the Universal Periodic Review of human rights, and how an NGO like Dui Hua can advocate for political and religious prisoners at the United Nations. This far-reaching conversation also dissects how the Universal Periodic Review works, the international treaties that underpin human rights norms, and how the United States and China compare when it comes to adhering to human rights treaties.
Related for this episode:
A Very Special Status (John Kamm Remembers)Action in Geneva & New York (Digest)UN Submission Focuses on Persecution of Women in Unorthodox Religions & Dueling Statements, and Visions, at UN Human Rights Council (Human Rights Journal)Dui Hua UN Submissions -
In this special podcast, host Szewah Leong speaks with Executive Director John Kamm on the recently concluded APEC Summit in San Francisco, with a focus on the meeting between President Joe Biden and President Xi Jinping, the first time the two men have seen each other in a year. Topics explored include what was achieved and what wasn’t achieved, the tone of the meeting, the controversial banquet for President Xi hosted by two organizations after the meeting between the two presidents, the likelihood that commitments made will be realized, and how the meeting gave Dui Hua an opportunity to add its voice to the dialogue.
Related for this podcast:
APEC Summit Highlights Need for Stable Relations (Human Rights Journal)Action in Geneva & New York (Digest)Prisoner Updates -
In this episode, host Rebekah Enoch talks with Dui Hua founder John Kamm and retired Judge Leonard Edwards about the expert exchanges Dui Hua has facilitated between juvenile justice practitioners from the United States and China's Supreme People's Court, both in China and in the United States. Exploring questions like, "What does it mean to seal juvenile records?", "Why is it important?" and "What does it have to do with China?", the interview unpacks some of the impressions and the impact of these exchanges on juvenile justice in the United States and China, as well as what it means in the context of Dui Hua's decision to expand the mission to include women in prison and juvenile justice, in addition to political and religious prisoners.
Related for this episode:
Forging New Paths for US China Dialogue: Juveniles Justice (JKR Podcast) Turning over a New Leaf: Juvenile Offenders Benefit from Reform (Human Rights Journal) “Is the Sealing of Juvenile Records Working in Your Court?” and “Record Sealing: Its Importance for Rehabilitation” (by Judge Edwards) Juvenile Justice Exchanges -
Kamm’s List presents the remarkable stories of the cases Dui Hua Founder John Kamm worked on after launching his Prisoner Information Project initiative. In this episode, host Sze Wah Leong engages Kamm in a discussion on the recently revealed life sentence on the Uyghur ethnographer Rahile Dawut, leading to Kamm's story of his involvement with Father Giancarlo Politi, a Catholic priest in Hong Kong committed to finding information on fellow priests detained in China, and how the two men played a role in the release of Father Li Fangchun of Shangqiu South Church, Henan. The exchange sheds light on the experiences and challenges Catholic priests faced in China in the early 1990s.
Tune in and immerse yourself in this episode. Prepare to be captivated by an insightful and eye-opening conversation. For those eager to delve deeper, the full story "Two Good Priests" is available on John Kamm Remembers Blog.
Related articles to this episode:
Prisoner Information ProjectPress Statement: Life Sentence for Professor Rahile Dawut ConfirmedJKR: Two Good Priests (full story) -
In this episode, host Rebekah Enoch talks with Dui Hua founder John Kamm about his experience hosting Dui Hua’s first US-China exchange on juvenile justice in 2008. This groundbreaking event brought judicial experts from China's Supreme People's Court to study the juvenile justice system in the United States, beginning a series of exchanges that have contributed to progress made in both countries' juvenile justice systems. John shares his insights on differences in the two countries' systems, the impact of the exchanges, and why Dui Hua decided to expand its mission to include women in prison and juvenile justice, in addition to political prisoners. You can read John's story in latest John Kamm Remembers: “Doing Right by Our Children: Mutual Concern Opens Up New Dialogue”
Related articles for this podcast:
JKR: A Prison for Juveniles
Dui Hua Hosts Juvenile Justice Delegation from China (Press Statement, October 23, 2008)
Past exchanges
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In this episode, John Kamm discusses China's trade relationship with the United States with Dui Hua directors Jeffrey Muir and Harold Furman, focusing on the evolution of China's trade status, previously known as Most Favored Nation (MFN), now referred to as Permanent Normal Trade Relations (PNTR). They made a good team. Jeff had long experience doing business in Hong Kong and China. Hal knew the ins and outs of dealing with Congress and the Executive Branch. Back in 1990, in the wake of the Tiananmen incident in China, the trio worked together to prepare Kamm's testimony to the U.S. Congress arguing against revoking China's MFN status. Since 1990, improved U.S.-China trade relations have provided the foundation for Dui Hua's work of compiling and submitting prisoner lists, but China's changed domestic political landscape has since degraded access resulting in less leverage on human rights issues. Tune in to learn about their first-hand experience and how changes over the past 25 years have affected the conversation.
Related articles for this podcast:
China's trade status and PNTR in our July/August Digest newsletterAbout Dui HuaJKR: My First Testimony to Congress -
"Say the names. Focus on individual prisoners." In this episode, host Erik Tharalsen introduces the Prisoner Information Project (PIP), an initiative launched by businessman-turned-activist John Kamm after the 1989 Tiananmen Incident. During his first testimony to Congress in support of Most Favored Nation (MFN) trade status for China, Kamm pledged to use all capital gained as a result of giving market access to China to advocate for political and religious prisoners, the PIP became part of that pledge. Kamm also discusses how this led to the founding of the Dui Hua Foundation and the important role of prisoner lists for human rights dialogue with China then and now.
Related articles for this podcast:
Prisoner Information Project
MFN Redux:
JKR: My First Testimony to Congress
