Episoder
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Anne-Marie Zanzal, a coming out coach and former chaplain, shares her profound journey of self-discovery and acceptance after coming out later in life. She discusses the complexities of navigating her sexuality while being married and raising children, emphasizing the importance of community and support for those in similar situations. Anne-Marie highlights the concepts of cognitive dissonance, internalized homophobia, and compulsory heterosexuality, shedding light on the challenges many face when reconciling their identities with societal expectations. Through her personal story and professional work, she aims to help others find their own paths to authenticity. Listeners will gain insight into the significance of kindness, shared experiences, and mindfulness in the coming out process, along with practical tips for those considering their own journey.
Anne-Marie Zanzal joins Sarah St. John to share her profound journey of self-discovery and coming out as a queer woman later in life. Having spent years grappling with her identity, Anne-Marie reflects on her early experiences with attraction and the societal pressures that led her to suppress her true self. Her candid recounting of moments filled with shame and confusion resonates with many who have felt the weight of societal expectations. The episode explores the complexities of navigating one's sexuality amidst a heteronormative environment, highlighting the importance of community support and the journey toward self-acceptance. Anne-Marie's story serves not only as a personal narrative but as a beacon of hope for those who may be struggling with their identities, emphasizing the idea that it's never too late to embrace who you truly are.
As the conversation unfolds, the dialogue shifts toward the themes of internalized homophobia and cognitive dissonance that often accompany late-in-life realizations of queerness. Anne-Marie articulates the challenges faced by individuals who have lived much of their lives conforming to societal norms, only to discover that their true selves have been stifled. Her insights into the psychological aspects of coming out, including the necessity of creating new neural pathways in the brain to accommodate a shift in identity, provide listeners with a deeper understanding of the emotional intricacies involved. The discussion also touches on how Anne-Marie transformed her experiences into a supportive framework for others, ultimately becoming a coming out coach to guide women through similar journeys.
Takeaways:
Anne-Marie Zanzal discusses her journey of coming out later in life and how she navigated her sexuality. The importance of community and support for those coming out later in life is emphasized throughout the episode. Zanzal highlights the concept of compulsory heterosexuality and how it affects one's self-acceptance and identity. Cognitive dissonance plays a significant role in the struggle to reconcile one's feelings and societal expectations. Understanding terms like internalized homophobia and heteronormativity can help clarify one's own struggles. Anne-Marie advocates for small, actionable steps in exploring one's identity and finding supportive communities.Resources
https://annemariezanzal.com/
https://wingwomenweekend.com/
https://comingoutsupport.net/coaching-program
(use coupon code Lesbihonest for 10% off any services)
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💡 Guest bio
Britt went through a period of self-discovery and came out to her family after getting divorced in 2012. She was nervous but had a supportive conversation with her parents and sister, who were all understanding and accepting. Her dad even lightened the mood with a joke, showing his support. Britt is grateful for the positive experience and the acceptance of her family.
ℹ️ Introduction
Welcome to another episode of Lesbi-Honest! In this episode, Sarah St John invites her girlfriend, Britt, as her special guest. They delve into their shared interests, such as trying new restaurants, watching scary movies, and attending concerts and events. The two of them discuss experiences with online dating, the importance of meeting in person early on, and the value of effective communication in relationships. They also touch on topics like piercings, tattoos, and their frugal approach to shopping. Join them as they share their journey, from dating to building a meaningful relationship.
📚 Timestamped overview
00:00 Accepted my truth, came out to family.
05:16 Positive work relationship turned uncomfortable after disclosure.
08:08 Personal beliefs affected work, led to quitting.
10:23 Appreciation for confidence, surprise over curious inquiries.
13:08 Henna paste for temporary skin designs lasts 2 weeks.
18:35 Remote work, flexible schedule, constant communication. First girlfriend.
20:42 Frustrated, gave up, then found unexpected connection.
23:42 Balancing dates, hesitant to cancel, feeling obliged.
28:08 Divorced, got twin bed, then upgraded.
29:31 Sarah is kind, thoughtful, and fun-loving.
32:56 Both individuals enjoy planning and thinking ahead.
36:53 Seeking late life lesbians for guest appearances.
❓ Questions
1. How do Sarah and Britt's similar activities and interests contribute to their strong connection and compatibility?
2. What are the benefits and challenges of having a strong interest in foreign cuisines, such as their love for boba tea?
3. How does their shared love for planning and making itineraries impact their relationship and activities they engage in together?
4. What are your thoughts on their experiences with meeting and dating in the LGBTQ+ community, and how do they navigate the challenges that arise?
5. How does the support of friends and family, particularly in relation to coming out and facing discrimination, impact their experiences and decision-making processes?
6. In what ways do their shared values of honesty, open communication, and the importance of meeting up in person early on in online dating influence the success of their relationship?
7. How does the episode shed light on the importance of self-care and taking mental health breaks, especially in the context of online dating and navigating the LGBTQ+ dating scene?
8. How does their frugal approach to activities and their shared sense of humor contribute to their bond and shared experiences?
9. In what ways do their experiences with online dating platforms and frustrations with dating apps resonate with your own experiences or stories you've heard?
10. What are your thoughts on the idea of having a future episode with a Q&A or a game format, and how can the audience engage with the show through these interactive formats?
❇️ Key topics and bullets
Primary Topic: Introduction and Background
- Sarah St John as the host of Lesbi-Honest podcast
- Introducing Britt as a guest
- Sarah's recent divorce and living situation
- Shared activities and interests between Sarah and Britt
- Love for foreign cuisines and boba tea
- Both being planners and enjoying making itineraries
- Interest in attending church and exploring...
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Manglende episoder?
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Episode Summary
How would you feel if you discovered your true sexuality after years of marriage and starting a family? Join us as we explore the remarkable stories of Aime and Lisa, two brave women who came to terms with their lesbian identities in their 30s. They share their deeply personal journeys of self-discovery, reflecting on the societal pressures and personal expectations that initially concealed their true selves. Through their candid conversations, Aime recounts her apathy towards men and the suppressed feelings for women, while Lisa narrates her pursuit of an elusive sense that led her to her authentic self.
In a heartfelt discussion, we unravel the emotional complexities of coming out later in life. From supportive families to the arduous path of self-acceptance, Aime and Lisa offer contrasting yet equally moving narratives. They discuss the importance of self-reflection and the powerful impact of finding others who share similar experiences. We explore the courage it takes to confront internal conflicts and the eventual liberation that comes with embracing one's true identity, highlighted by an anonymous online exchange that underscores fear, vulnerability, and courage.
Transitioning from heterosexual marriages to a same-sex relationship presents its own set of challenges, and Aime and Lisa don't shy away from sharing their struggles. They talk about their early meetings filled with confusion, the difficult conversations with their ex-husbands, and the need to prioritize their children's well-being. The episode also delves into the cultural and generational hurdles of coming out to traditional Sicilian parents, and the ongoing journey of blending families with love, patience, and grace. Listen in to understand the significance of living authentically and the resilience required to build a new life together.
Chapter 1: Late-Life Lesbians
The episode begins with an introduction to Aime and Lisa, both late-life lesbians who discovered their true sexualities in their 30s after being married to men and having children. Reflecting on their individual paths, Aime recounts her apathy towards men and the struggle to suppress her feelings for women, while Lisa describes chasing an undefined emotion before realizing her true self. Their stories highlight the profound moments of clarity and the societal expectations that delayed their self-recognition.
Chapter 2: The Evolution of Coming Out
In this chapter, Aime and Lisa explore the deeply personal and emotional challenges of coming out. They share contrasting narratives of supportive families and internal battles of self-acceptance. The significance of self-reflection and anonymous online exchanges emerges as a pivotal theme, illustrating the fear, vulnerability, and eventual courage required to confront and share one's truth. The chapter emphasizes the internal conflict and liberation that comes with acknowledging and expressing one's authentic self.
Chapter 3: Navigating Marriage and Coming Out
Transitioning from heterosexual marriages to a same-sex relationship posed unique challenges for Aime and Lisa. They candidly recount their weekly meetings amidst confusion, the delicate conversations with their ex-husbands, and the priority of their children's well-being. This chapter also touches on the cultural hurdles of coming out to traditional Sicilian parents, emphasizing the cultural and generational gaps that made acceptance a lengthy and repetitive endeavor. Through their experiences, Aime and Lisa highlight the emotional highs and lows and the steps toward building a new life together.
Chapter 4: Navigating Blended Families With Grace
The final chapter focuses on the importance of love and authenticity in relationships. Aime and Lisa discuss the gradual process of blending families, including introducing children...
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About the Episode and Guest
Cherish Amber, a seasoned queer sex, intimacy, and relationship coach, takes us on an extraordinary journey of self-discovery and acceptance. From identifying as bisexual at 15 to embracing her identity as a lesbian, Cherish shares the challenges and triumphs that have shaped her path. She offers poignant insights into the emotional and sexual differences between relationships with men and women, underscoring the authenticity and freedom she finds in her queer relationships. Cherish's narrative illuminates the power of safe queer spaces and underscores the importance of self-acceptance.
Listeners will gain valuable insights into the intricate relationship between pleasure, consent, and intimacy within the queer community. Cherish highlights her initiatives like coming out coaching and the Pleasure Zone at pride events, which encourage open conversations about pleasure. We dissect the orgasm gap in heterosexual relationships and the unique dynamics of sex in lesbian relationships, revealing how rethinking sexual expectations can significantly enhance relationship satisfaction. Cherish's practical wisdom, drawn from long-term lesbians, offers a fresh perspective on navigating intimate connections.
Our conversation further delves into the nuances of consent, using relatable analogies like offering a cup of tea to clarify that consent can be withdrawn at any time. We discuss the concept of arousal non-concordance and the importance of focusing on mutual pleasure rather than just achieving orgasms. Cherish shares practical tips for those new to lesbian relationships, emphasizing the importance of a safe and fulfilling sexual experience. From vaginal health and the impact of diet to the dynamics of sharing sex toys in long-term relationships, this episode is a treasure trove of insights aimed at empowering individuals in their sexual journeys.
(00:00) Queer Sex Coach Shares Journey
Cherish Amber shares her coming out journey, discussing labels, trauma, and the freedom of queer relationships.
(07:40) Exploring Pleasure, Consent, and Intimacy
Pleasure, consent, and challenges in queer relationships, including disparities in sexual experiences and rethinking expectations for enhanced satisfaction.
(18:32) Navigating Consent and Pleasure in Sex
Consent can be withdrawn at any stage, arousal non-concordance can create confusion, physical responses during assault are purely physiological, and mutual pleasure should be prioritized in sexual experiences.
(27:18) Exploring Sensuality and Communication in Sex
Nature's safe and fulfilling sexual experience for new or inexperienced lesbian partners, emphasizing connection, comfort, and acceptance.
(33:46) Exploring Vaginal Health and Pleasure
Nature's diversity of female anatomy, gentle and respectful intimacy, vaginal health and hygiene, and preparation for anal play.
(45:05) Sharing Sex Toys in Relationships
Toy preferences in lesbian relationships, sharing and practicality, online coaching services, upcoming episodes and mutual promotion.
Chapters
(00:48 - 02:15) Coming Out Journey and Relationships
(04:59 - 06:15) Exploring Sexual Identity and Labels
(13:41 - 15:34) Reimagining Definitions of Sex
(21:05 - 21:40) Consent and Arousal Incongruence
(26:24 - 27:39) Importance of Post-Sex Care
(29:26 - 30:46) Communicating Feedback During Intimacy
(33:08 - 34:04) Understanding Different Sexual Preferences
(43:15 - 44:37) Reusing Sex Toys and Hygiene
Learn More About Cherish Amber:
https://www.cherishamber.com/
Listen to my guest episode on Apple:
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💡 Host bio
Sarah St John is a woman who faced a major crossroads in her life after being married for 18 years and getting divorced. Despite not having children, she had to navigate the difficult transition from a comfortable and seemingly problem-free marriage to being on her own. Throughout her marriage, she had enjoyed the financial stability and companionship that came with being married, but now she is forging a new path for herself. Her experience has given her a unique perspective on the challenges of starting over and she hopes to inspire others who may be facing similar situations.
ℹ️ Introduction
Welcome to the latest episode of the Lesbi-Honest Podcast! In this episode, our host, Sarah St John, sits down with special guest Suzette Mullen, a remarkable book coach and author who is dedicated to amplifying LGBTQ+ voices. Suzette shares her inspiring journey of coming out in her mid-fifties and her subsequent work as a book coach for memoir and nonfiction writers, particularly within the LGBTQ+ community. With warmth and wisdom, she delves into her experiences, the choices she faced, and the ongoing process of living authentically. Join us as we explore Suzette's powerful story, the complexities of coming out, the value of authenticity, and the importance of finding joy and freedom in living one's truth. Stay tuned as we uncover valuable insights and hear more about Suzette's memoir and coaching services.
📚 Timestamped overview
00:00 Transitioning to writing, becoming a book coach.
03:48 Editing nonfiction while cultivating a supportive environment.
06:43 Discovery of true self, challenging journey ahead.
10:38 Kept my sexuality secret until unbearable pain.
15:32 Acknowledging one's sexual orientation against resistance.
17:03 Christian friend questioned coming out as gay.
20:35 Being queer has risks but brings joy.
26:26 Struggling with coming out in a marriage.
27:46 Husband's support, fear, and advice for women.
❇️ Key topics and bullets
Primary Topic: Suzette's Journey and Work
- Suzette's professional background and transition to writing and coaching
- Lawyer, stay-at-home mom, social justice advocate
- Late start in writing and editing
- Suzette's memoir and book coaching focus
- Memoir about coming out in her mid-fifties
- Focus on memoir and nonfiction writers, particularly LGBTQ+ community
- Creation of a safe space for vulnerable writers
- Suzette's coming out journey
- Realization of love for a female friend
- Difficult decision about sexual identity and established life
- Balancing staying in a safe, comfortable life vs. risking it all for an envisioned life
Primary Topic: The Process of Coming Out
- The ongoing nature of coming out
- Decision-making process
- Dropping breadcrumbs of truth
- Balancing unbearable pain of lying with fairness to others
- Discomfort with labels and language
- Embracing the pride flag
- Negative experiences and reactions
- Experiences and reactions to coming out
- Different reactions from individuals in Suzette's life
- Privilege as a heterosexual person
- The cost of authenticity and potential joy and freedom
Primary Topic: Living Authentically
- Joy and freedom on the other side of coming out
- Finding a way to live fully and authentically
- Capturing the joy and glow desired for oneself
- Fear, peace, and freedom accompanying being true to oneself
- Facing crossroads and big decisions
- Holding both joy and grief in an authentic life
- Work on the second memoir, "After the Leap"
- Challenges of realizing one's identity within a marriage
- Grappling with the decision of what to
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💡 Speaker bios
Susan Cottrell and her husband were deeply involved in the evangelical church for 20 years, finding a sense of community and family within it. However, their perspective changed when two of their five children came out as queer. This prompted a re-examination of their beliefs, as one of their children expressed that they had tried to resist their identity but ultimately realized they could not deny who they were. This experience led Susan to become an advocate for the LGBTQ+ community within religious spaces, and she has since dedicated herself to supporting and affirming queer individuals within faith communities.
ℹ️ Introduction
Welcome to "Lesbi-Honest," where we dive into the stories and experiences of the LGBTQ community and those who advocate for their rights and acceptance. In this episode, we are joined by the inspiring Susan Cottrell, founder of Freehearts, an organization dedicated to helping families accept and support their LGBTQ children. Susan shares her powerful journey of questioning traditional religious teachings and finding a new path of embracing love and acceptance. She challenges the notion that God wants parents to reject their LGBTQ children and urges them to seek a community that aligns with unconditional love. From discussing the concept of hell as a metaphor to unpacking the church's resistance to change, Susan offers profound insights and encouragement. Join us as we explore her wisdom and experience, and embrace the message of love and inclusion.
❇️ Key topics and bullets
Primary Topic: Susan Cottrell's Work with Freehearts
- Susan Cottrell's encouragement for parents to accept their LGBTQ children
- The challenge against the idea that God wants parents to reject their LGBTQ children
- The importance of separating God from the church's teachings
- The advice for parents to seek a new community that embraces acceptance and love
- Understanding LGBTQ issues through the Freedhearts community
Primary Topic: Susan Cottrell's Personal Journey and Freehearts Organization
- Susan and her husband's experience in the evangelical church
- Founding Freehearts as a blog and expanding it to include resources, online groups, and a podcast
- Susan's ongoing work on a book about deconstruction and reconstructing faith
Primary Topic: Concept of Hell and the Church's Teachings
- The absence of the concept of hell in the Jewish Bible
- Hell as a pagan belief introduced between the Old and New Testaments
- Criticism of the traditional teaching that humans are inherently sinful and wretched
Primary Topic: Jesus' Teachings and the Church's Responsibility
- Jesus' deconstruction of empires and his focus on valuing regular people
- Jesus' criticism of religious leaders in the Bible
- The church's teaching of contempt against LGBTQ individuals, contrary to Jesus' teachings
Primary Topic: The Future of the Church Regarding LGBTQ Issues
- The potential trend towards affirmation for LGBTQ individuals within the church
- Resistance to change within the church due to reluctance to admit wrong
Primary Topic: Interpretation of Hell in the Bible
- The interpretation of hell as metaphorical rather than a literal place of torment
- The belief that the idea of a punishing God goes against the essence of God's love and the freedom of humanity
Primary Topic: Encouragement and Reassurance
- Reassurance to the queer community that feelings of rejection, inadequacy, and unworthiness are not from God
- The encouragement to trust in the God that loves them
- The emphasis to rely less on the religious community that tells them God doesn't
Primary Topic: Conclusion
- Sarah St John's appreciation for Susan's time and her thanks for reaching out
📚 Timestamped
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💡 Guest bio
Rev. Brandan Robertson's journey to becoming a pastor began at the age of 12, when he had a conversion experience at a Baptist church in Maryland. Despite growing up in a non-religious household, he felt a distinct calling to pursue a career in the ministry. Now, at the age of 32, he has dedicated himself to fulfilling that calling and is on the path to becoming a pastor.
ℹ️ Introduction
Welcome to the Lesbi-Honest podcast, where we talk openly and candidly about the experiences of later in life lesbians. In this episode titled "Brandan Robertson.mp3," your host Sarah St John engages in a thought-provoking conversation with Reverend Brandan Robertson. They explore the impact of TikTok in spreading discussions about sexuality and religion, challenges faced by the LGBTQ+ community in religious spaces, and the importance of creating inclusive environments. Brandan shares his personal journey, challenges faced within the evangelical community, and his advocacy for an inclusive modern gospel. From the historical context of anti-LGBTQ teachings in Christianity to advice for those coming out later in life, this episode is filled with insightful reflections and empowering messages. Join us as we delve into this fascinating and illuminating conversation.
❇️ Key topics and bullets
1. Brandan Robertson's Personal Journey
- Upbringing in a non-religious environment
- Joining a Baptist church at age 12
- Attending an evangelical school in Chicago
- Experiencing resistance and threat of expulsion for questioning evangelical theology
- Being subjected to conversion therapy at his school
- Facing backlash from the evangelical community after coming out
- Finding support from other Christians and a different kind of Christianity that embraced inclusion
- Mission to help queer people find their space in the church and challenge the church to change its teachings regarding the queer community
- Family's reaction and support
- Shock from the hate received from evangelicals and Christians
2. Christianity and LGBTQ+ Community
- Historical context of anti-LGBTQ stance in Christianity
- Comparing current anti-LGBTQ teaching to ancient perspectives on same-sex male sexuality
- Harmful effects of current teachings on LGBTQ individuals
- Presence of queer individuals in scripture, citing references to eunuchs and their potential representation of nonbinary or gay people in ancient texts
- Highlighting the baptism of the Ethiopian eunuch as evidence of inclusion in the Christian church
- Acknowledging the selective acceptance of adoption by straight couples and challenging the belief that children need both a male and female parent for proper development
- Emphasizing the need to contextualize biblical teachings within the cultural norms of the time
- Challenging the idea that procreation is the sole basis for valid marriage and advocating for supporting queer people in adopting and raising children
- The Bible as descriptive, not prescriptive, and the need to interpret biblical teachings within their cultural context
- Debate on traditional heterosexual relationships being the only ones displayed in the Bible
3. Queer Representation and Marginalization
- Role of societal norms in perpetuating fear and misunderstanding of queer individuals
- Impact of lack of representation on harmful legislation and violence
- Marginalization of intersex, trans, and non-binary individuals
- The destabilization of existing societal structures and perceptions by increased visibility and exploration of gender by younger generations
- The world's tendency to simplify everything into binary choices, and why it's not helpful
4. Advocacy,...
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ℹ️ Introduction
Welcome to another captivating episode of Lesbi-Honest! I'm your host, Sarah St John, and today we have a very special guest joining us. Please give a warm welcome to Lacy Jones, a talented musician, former ministry leader, and an advocate for LGBTQ+ rights. Lacy's journey is one filled with personal struggles, navigating religious institutions, and ultimately finding her true authentic self. In this episode, Lacy opens up about her experiences in ministry, the challenges she faced as a queer individual, and her courageous decision to come out. From her encounters with discrimination to the complexities of family relationships, Lacy's story is captivating and inspiring. Get ready as we dive into the depths of Lacy's journey and explore the power of embracing one's true identity. You won't want to miss this heartfelt and honest conversation. Let's get started!
❓ Questions
Question 1: In this episode, Lacy Jones discusses her experience with a ministry that discriminated against LGBTQ+ individuals. How do you think this type of discrimination impacts the mental health and well-being of those affected?
Question 2: Lacy shares her struggle with being labeled as a "lipstick lesbian" by a person she sought counseling from. How does this labeling affect their sense of identity and self-acceptance?
Question 3: Can you relate to Lacy's experience of feeling pressured to hide her true identity and conform to a certain image in order to be accepted by her church community? How do you think this pressure can impact an individual's authenticity and mental health?
Question 4: Lacy talks about her journey of self-discovery and therapy, which led her to realize they were in a cult. How important do you think it is for individuals to seek therapy and professional help when they suspect they might be in a harmful or manipulative environment?
Question 5: Lacy mentions the fear of losing her church family and the implications it would have for her music ministry if she were to come out. How do you think fear of rejection and losing support networks can affect a person's decision to come out and live authentically?
Question 6: Lacy emphasizes the importance of sharing stories, especially those that happen in secret or in the dark. How can storytelling and sharing personal experiences contribute to breaking the silence surrounding LGBTQ+ discrimination and fostering understanding and empathy?
Question 7: Lacy discusses the concept of "bearing their cross" and facing criticism as an opportunity for growth and refinement. How do you think facing criticism and adversity can shape a person's resilience and personal development?
Question 8: Lacy shares her experience of finding love and support in the church after growing up in a dysfunctional home environment. How can faith communities provide a sense of belonging and support for individuals who come from challenging backgrounds?
Question 9: Lacy's journey involves reconciling her faith with her identity. Have you or someone you know experienced a similar struggle? How did you navigate the intersection of your identity and your beliefs
Relevant Links:
Lesbihonest.show
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💡 Guest bio
Candice's story is one of self-discovery and resilience. Growing up in a Christian environment, she grappled with her own identity and struggled with depression and anxiety. It wasn't until she reached college that she realized she was gay, a realization that completely caught her off guard. This revelation propelled her to want to help others in similar situations, leading her to pursue a career as a therapist. Drawing upon her own experiences, Candice is determined to provide support and guidance to individuals who may be facing similar challenges. She understands the pain of feeling conflicted and aims to help others accept and embrace their authentic selves.
ℹ️ Introduction
Welcome back to another episode of Lesbi-Honest, the podcast where we dive into the stories and experiences of individuals who have overcome challenges, found self-acceptance, and built fulfilling lives. I'm your host, Sarah, and today we have a special guest joining us. Please welcome Candice Zuberty, a therapist and founder of The Christian Closet, dedicated to providing LGBTQ affirming counseling, coaching, and spiritual direction.
In today's episode, Candice opens up about her personal journey into counseling, the launch of The Christian Closet, and her own discovery and acceptance of her homosexuality. We'll explore the complexities of coming out later in life, the intricacies of navigating non-affirming families, and the importance of finding a supportive community.
Sarah and Candice discuss the difference between being tolerated, accepted, and affirmed, especially in the context of churches that claim to welcome everyone. They shed light on the potential impacts of internalizing homophobia and how seeking therapy from an LGBTQ+ affirming clinician can be transformative.
Throughout this candid conversation, you'll hear stories of resilience, love, and healing. We'll also explore practical advice for those who may be struggling with their own identities or facing challenges within their families and communities.
Join us as we listen to Candice's insights, personal experiences, and the valuable lessons she's learned along the way. So grab a cup of tea, find a cozy spot, and get ready for another inspiring episode of Lesbi-Honest.
📚 Timestamped overview
00:00:42 Intersecting story, self-acceptance, and painful struggle.
00:06:42 Bible college friends, disagreement, reconciliation, acceptance.
00:08:57 Mom feared hell, dad's heart attack. Burdened secrecy, painful distancing. Relief in death desired.
00:13:23 Build a supportive team, find independence, be brave.
00:17:01 Fear of being discovered on podcast.
00:20:10 Supporting LGBTQ+ individuals navigating relationships, spirituality, and self-acceptance.
00:21:20 Rediscovering and healing spiritual path to God.
00:27:05 Seeking counseling for religious affirmation and acceptance.
00:27:56 Important distinction: Tolerate vs Celebrate LGBTQ+ individuals.
❇️ Key topics and bullets
Primary Topic: Introduction and Background
- Introduction to the podcast episode and the guest, Candice Czubernat
- Curiosity about the difference between being welcoming or accepting versus affirming in the context of churches
Primary Topic: Candice's Journey and The Christian Closet
- Candice's journey into counseling and the launch of The Christian Closet
- Her personal experience in discovering her own gayness
- The focus of The Christian Closet on helping individuals heal from spiritual abuse and trauma, and coming out to non-affirming families
- The prevalence of individuals coming out later in life due to growing up in a Christian context
Primary Topic: Personal Experiences and Relationships
- Candice's personal experiences with being in the closet and hiding her true...
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ℹ️ Introduction
Welcome to "Lesbi-Honest," the podcast where we dive deep into the stories and experiences of LGBTQ+ individuals and explore the intersection of their identities with faith, love, and society. In today's episode, we have a very special guest, Jennifer Knapp, a talented musician who has experienced both the highs and lows of the Christian music industry. Jennifer will share with us the challenges she faced after coming out and the impact it had on her career and other LGBTQ+ artists in the industry. Despite the backlash, Jennifer found incredible support and positivity from the queer community, which fueled her desire to be a voice of strength for others. Join us as she takes us through her journey of self-discovery, self-expression, and the importance of living authentically. We'll also explore the role of Christianity in shaping her character and the ongoing process of self-love and understanding her relationship with God. Furthermore, Jennifer challenges the interpretations of biblical teachings on homosexuality and emphasizes the need for love and kindness towards one another. So grab a cup of coffee, sit back, and get ready for an inspiring and thought-provoking conversation with Jennifer on "Lesbi-Honest."
📚 Timestamped overview
00:02:04 Jennifer Knapp officially came out in 2010.
00:05:04 Quit industry due to frustration and discontent. LGBTQ+ revelation. Needed private nurturing environment.
00:12:38 Mourning loss, slowly returning to music industry.
00:15:52 Retailers disapproved, but positive support prevailed.
00:23:23 People unaware of artist; focusing on self-discovery.
00:30:04 Years of reading The Bible and self-reflection.
00:35:52 Marriage doesn't magically protect ethical behavior.
00:40:36 Pleasure and joy are important for motivation.
00:44:54 Reconciliation through love, liberation, and self-acceptance.
00:48:09 Touring, secret project, collaborations, faith community advocacy.
❓ Questions
1. How do you think the negative reaction from Christian music retailers affected Jennifer's career and the careers of other LGBTQ+ artists in the industry?
2. What role do you believe the queer community played in supporting and uplifting Jennifer after they came out?
3. How do you interpret Jennifer's sense of responsibility to fight for others and be a voice of strength for them? Do you think this is an important aspect of coming out?
4. Why do you think Jennifer chose to come out, even knowing that it could potentially harm her career?
5. In your opinion, what is the significance of Jennifer's emphasis on knowing oneself and taking the time to come out when ready? How important is it to have a supportive network during this process?
6. How do you think Jennifer's experience of having people come up to shows without knowing who they were influenced their understanding of their own identity?
7. What are your thoughts on Jennifer's perspective of labels? Do you agree that personal growth and focusing on who one wants to be as a person is more important than rigidly defining oneself?
8. Discuss Jennifer's connection between her Christian faith and her journey towards self-love and understanding. How did her understanding of her relationship with God evolve over time?
9. How do you interpret Jennifer's argument for a more compassionate and inclusive interpretation of the Bible's stance on homosexuality? Do you think religion and LGBTQ+ acceptance can coexist?
10. Reflect on Jennifer's views on morality, commitment, and the concept of traditional marriage. How does her perspective challenge traditional beliefs around these topics?
❇️ Key topics and bullets
Primary Topic: Backlash and Support After Coming Out
- Negative reaction from Christian music retailers
- Impact on other
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Bio
As an unapologetically queer writer and creator, Shohreh Davoodi is especially skilled at making thoughtful connections, explaining difficult concepts clearly and concisely, and handling tough topics with warmth and humor. Driven by a passion for equal rights and representation for LGBTQIA+ folks and people of color, her work supports and celebrates the queer and BIPOC communities of which she's a proud member. She's currently working on her first novel.
ℹ️ Introduction
Welcome back to another episode of Lesbi-Honest, the podcast where we explore the journeys, experiences, and triumphs of individuals who have embraced their true selves. I'm your host, Sarah, and today we have a very special guest joining us, Shohreh. In this episode, Shohreh shares their personal story of discovering their sexuality later in life and the journey they embarked on to fully embrace their identity as a lesbian. We delve into the complexities of understanding their attraction to women, their struggles with acceptance, and the empowering role of a supportive queer therapist. Shohreh also opens up about facing criticism and ridicule online, their brave act of putting up a pride flag in a conservative neighborhood, and their decision to move to a more LGBTQ-friendly city. This episode is filled with inspiration, honesty, and a reminder that it's never too late to live authentically. So sit back, relax, and let's dive into Shohreh's incredible journey on this episode of Lesbi-Honest.
❇️ Key topics and bullets
- Late-in-life lesbians going through a process of understanding their sexuality
- The Shohreh's gradual transition in understanding her attraction to women
- Identifying as bisexual before fully embracing the identity of a lesbian
- Struggles with accepting her sexuality and questioning past experiences
- Supportive queer therapist helping navigate feelings and guilt
- Criticism and ridicule online for their experience from men
- Process of accepting attraction to women
- Acknowledging body's signals and realizing unhappiness in marriage due to queerness
- Response video to HOA situation
- Counter flag response to conservative flag in living room
- Buying a progress flag with "you are loved" slogan
- Putting up the flag to support and provide representation for queer individuals in the neighborhood
- Recognizing attractiveness in men, but not personally attracted to them
- Interest in dating women if circumstances were different
- Learning about bisexuality through close friendships with bisexual individuals
- Initial identification as bisexual before realizing being a lesbian
- Biphobia and the pressure to choose a side
- Discovery process during the pandemic leading to divorce from ex-husband
- Happiness in current lesbian relationship
- Lack of children, but co-parenting two dogs with ex-partner
- Initial plans to open relationship disrupted by the pandemic
- Realization of being meant to be with a woman
- Guilt and unfulfillment in closeted lesbian marriage
- Asking for a divorce due to deep friendship rather than a romantic partnership
- Painful process of divorce after being together since early twenties
- Catalyst of "Untamed" by Glenn Doyle for questioning sexuality
- Friends and ex-husband suggesting Shohreh might be gay
- Initial identification as queer before realizing she is a lesbian
- Confirmation of lesbian identity through dating current partner
- Desire to live in Colorado and concerns about LGBTQ+ rights in Texas
- Safety concerns for partner presenting as masculine in Texas
- Presence of speaker's sister and family members in Colorado
- Extreme heat in Texas and desire for a different climate
- Understanding there is no 100% safe...
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💡 Guest bio
Kari comes from a conservative background, with her father being a Baptist preacher and a long family history of preachers. She has been married three times and has five children, constantly questioning if the problem lies within her. At the age of 39, a family tragedy shook her and made her reevaluate her life. Feeling stuck and unhappy, she asked for a divorce in 2016 and started afresh. It was during this time that she realized she was not straight, which explained the troubles in her previous marriages. This discovery led her on a journey of self-discovery and she started coaching and supporting other late bloomers like herself. Coming out in 2018, she initially thought she was the only one with a delayed coming out, but she soon connected with other individuals who had similar experiences. Kari started a Facebook support group for late bloomers, which now boasts over 7600 members. This journey also helped Kari with her own personal development, allowing her to overcome shame and guilt and be comfortable sharing her story. She is currently writing a book to inspire others and let them know that they are not alone, advocating for everyone to embrace their true selves.
ℹ️ Introduction
Welcome back to another episode of Lesbi-Honest! I'm your host, Sarah St John, and today we have a fabulous guest joining us, Kari. Get ready for an inspiring and heartfelt conversation as Kari shares their journey of self-discovery, acceptance, and embracing their true identity as a lesbian. They open up about the supportive and unsupportive reactions they've received from within the LGBTQIA community, their boundaries with people who hold beliefs against their community, and the importance of not conforming to societal expectations. We'll also delve into their personal experiences, from their late bloomer realization to their journey toward self-acceptance and the intersection of religion and queerness. Stay tuned as Kari takes us through their inspiring story, filled with triumphs, personal growth, and the importance of living one's authentic truth. Let's dive right in!
❇️ Key topics and bullets
- Challenges of accepting one's true self in the LGBTQ+ community:
- Both supportive and unsupportive reactions from the LGBTQ+ community
- Doubt and disbelief from girlfriends due to past relationships with men
- Confrontations with straight religious individuals who are not accepting
- Setting boundaries with people who hold beliefs against the LGBTQ+ community
- Not being responsible for changing others' beliefs
- Surprise at others feeling entitled to label and judge others for their identity
- Awakening of understanding and acceptance in 2020
- Pushing boundaries of personal expression and breaking societal expectations:
- Importance of exploring and pushing boundaries
- Encouragement to draw one's own lines and not conform
- Joy of exploring new experiences and trying different styles
- Prioritizing personal satisfaction over external opinions
- Seeking validation and self-awareness in breaking free from codependency:
- Reflecting on seeking validation from others
- Need for self-awareness and healing
- Embracing eccentricity and enjoying attention
- Late bloomers and societal expectations:
- Impact of societal programming on understanding and accepting oneself
- Difficulties faced by those who realize their LGBTQ+ identity later in life
- Feeling mislabeled and uncertainty about how others label them
- Journey toward self-acceptance and embracing true identity:
- Denial, guilt, shame, and fear of accepting attraction to women
- Influence of meeting an authentic and inspiring woman
- Rejection of societal expectations and embracing...
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💡 Guest bio
Katherine Johnson earned her B.A. in Christian Ministries from Spring Arbor University and has over 20 years of ministry experience in a wide variety of fields, both in churches and parachurch organizations. She has also earned an M.A. in Biblical and Theological Studies from Western Seminary and a Th.M. from Columbia Theological Seminary with a focus on Hebrew and Old Testament exegesis.
Katherine is passionate about helping people to encounter Scripture in ways that foster a life-giving relationship with God and personal growth in Christlike love. She is dedicated to The Reformation Project’s mission because she is convinced that the full inclusion of LGBTQ believers in the life of the church would lead to greater flourishing not only for LGBTQ Christians but also for the Kingdom of God “on earth as it is in heaven.”
ℹ️ IntroductionLadies and gentlemen, welcome to another episode of Lesbi-Honest, the podcast where we delve into the stories and experiences of LGBTQ+ women in all their diverse and beautiful forms. I'm your host, Sarah St John, and today we have a truly powerful and inspiring tale to share with you.
In this episode, we'll be exploring the journey of Katherine, who has undergone a profound process of self-discovery and acceptance of her sexual orientation. What sets Katherine's story apart is the deep connection she has with her faith in Jesus, which has always been a guiding force in her life.
Growing up, Katherine felt different, struggling to fit in with either boys or girls. She wasn't interested in typical teenage pursuits like makeup, hair, and boys, which left her feeling alienated and weird. To cope with the pressure to conform, she pretended to have crushes on boys, all the while suppressing her true feelings.
But it wasn't until she experienced intense emotions for a woman that Katherine began to realize she wasn't straight. Yet, deeply ingrained beliefs associating homosexuality with sin made it difficult for her to reconcile her faith and her identity. Feeling like an outsider, Katherine yearned for belonging and authenticity.
Her journey took an unexpected turn when she met her partner, Erin. They both approached their beliefs and understanding of homosexuality from different angles – Katherine with deep study and intellectual analysis, and Erin with a more relational perspective. Their paths intertwined as they embarked on separate journeys of research and self-discovery, discovering new understandings and challenging their preconceptions.
Through their exploration, Katherine felt called to work with the Reformation Project, a mission dedicated to advancing LGBTQ inclusion in the church. Katherine's role in the organization involves overseeing programming and supporting ambassadors who promote LGBTQ inclusion in their respective contexts.
Amidst this incredible transformation, Katherine and Erin also navigated the delicate process of coming out to their loved ones. They carefully chose who to share their truth with, based on the expected difficulty of the conversation. And while they feared losing friendships, family, and their faith community, they found support and affirmation in unexpected places.
Join us as we unravel Katherine's remarkable journey of self-discovery, faith, and love. We'll explore the challenges she faced, the moments of triumph, and how she found strength and community along the way. It's a story that showcases the power of embracing one's true self, regardless of the expectations and barriers imposed by society and religion.
So grab your headphones, settle in, and get ready for an emotional and enlightening journey on this episode of Lesbi-Honest.
❇️ Key topics and bullets- Discovering and accepting one's sexual orientation
- Feeling different and not fitting in with boys or girls while growing up
- Coping with pressure
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💡 Speaker bio
Sally grew up in Wichita Falls, Texas, in a devout Christian family. She was raised in a Church of Christ congregation and was taught from a young age that her church community was like family to her. However, there were also difficulties in her home due to her father's past and his struggles with anger. Despite these challenges, Sally's mother emphasized the importance of prioritizing God in their lives.
As Sally grew older, she realized that she was different but could not identify why. It wasn't until her junior year of college that she discovered she was attracted to women. However, during that time, there was no acceptance or conversation about homosexuality, especially within Christian circles. Sally kept her feelings to herself for 15 years, even as she pursued her career in law and coaching.
Eventually, Sally reached a breaking point and felt compelled to share her secret. She wrote a letter pouring out her heart to God and sought counseling. The counselor received her with kindness and understanding, offering her a safe space to talk. This experience helped Sally understand that God could handle her confusion and emotions.
After sharing her secret with the counselor, Sally gained the courage to come out to her parents, who joined her in seeking therapy to address unresolved family issues. Sally had hoped that working on her relationship with her father would, in turn, change her sexual orientation, but that was not the case. Despite this, Sally remains grateful for the progress they made, and she now cares for her 93-year-old father as his primary caretaker.
Sally's journey has been one of self-discovery, acceptance, and overcoming societal pressures. Through it all, she has relied on her faith to guide her and has learned the importance of being true to herself.
ℹ️ IntroductionOn this episode of Lesbi-Honest, host Sarah St. John interviews guest Sally, who shares their journey of self-discovery, acceptance, and the challenges they faced in their Christian community. Sally discusses the importance of reading books for wisdom and promotes the website centerpeace.net. They delve into the difficulties of coming out as affirming to their church, family, and friends, highlighting the subconscious challenges individuals may face. Sally expresses frustration with those who refuse to do the necessary research on the subject, praying for fellowship and understanding amongst each other. They reflect on the progress made in LGBTQ+ resources over the years, emphasizing the importance of not getting discouraged by naysayers.
Sally, coming from the tradition of autonomous churches of Christ, discusses the struggle some churches have with accepting someone as both gay and Christian. They explore the transition from "side B" to "side A", embracing relationships and potentially marriage with the same sex, and seek to understand the process of transitioning. Sally shares their lifelong process of interpreting Scripture and the journey that led them to become affirming of same-sex relationships based on their interpretation. They recommend books, including their own memoir, "Affirming: A Memoir of Faith, Sexuality, and Staying in the Church," and a book by Karen (presumably their wife) called "Scripture Ethics and the Possibility of Same-Sex Relationships," for those seeking a deeper exploration of Scripture.
Sarah discovers Sally through their books and attends events hosted by their organization, Centerpeace, which nurtures a supportive community. Sally sheds light on their personal story, acknowledging the fear and frustration they once felt regarding God's love and acceptance. They stress the importance of understanding that sexual orientation is not a choice and dismantling stereotypes about LGBTQ individuals. Sally encourages listeners to read books on the topic and have open discussions about them, especially with trusted pastors. They highlight...
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🌈🎙️ Today, we have an incredible guest, Kirby, who shared their journey as a non-binary, late-life lesbian. 🌟💕
🔀 Kirby's story started with their exploration of gender identity and expression as non-binary.
🌈 They built a strong community in the LGBTQ+ space on TikTok, where they discovered their true identity as a lesbian. 🌺🌈
💔 Kirby also opened up about their previous marriage to a man and the challenges of coming out to their partner, Tommy. But their bond remains solid as co-pilots in life, raising their kids together and making beautiful music. 🎶👩👩👦👦
🧡 Kirby's soulmate, Ember, went through a similar journey, and their long-distance relationship blossomed into a beautiful connection. 💞 Their love and support for each other are undeniable!
🎉 Join us on our podcast, "Lesbi-Honest," as we share inspiring stories like Kirby's and explore the complexities of love, identity, and self-discovery in the LGBTQ+ community. 🌈✨
Together, let's celebrate love, break barriers, and build a world where everyone can be their authentic selves! 💖✨ #LesbiHonest #LoveIsLove #QueerJourney
Relevant Links:
Find Kirby on TikTok
Kirby's LinkTree
Subscribe to the show
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ℹ️ Introduction
On this episode of Lesbi-Honest, our guest Marisa shares her personal journey of grappling with her sexuality and faith. Raised in a mixed religious household, Marisa had a strong foundation in faith but began experiencing a sense of difference from an early age. She struggled with her identity and the conflict between her faith and being gay, initially dismissing Christians. However, through reading books and connecting with a supportive church community, Marisa began questioning and reevaluating her beliefs.
Marisa emphasizes the importance of finding peers who share similar experiences and understanding. She found a sense of belonging and acceptance in a church that embraced her as a gay individual. Her faith and church community have become anchors in her life and have helped her navigate the challenges of her sexuality.
Throughout the episode, Marisa also discusses her current relationship with her partner, which is long-distance but strong. Despite the challenges, they make time for each other through regular visits, FaceTime, and Bible study together. They are committed to making the relationship work and have even discussed the possibility of one of them moving to Dallas.
Marisa shares her admiration for Kathy Baldock's book, "Walking the Bridges Canyon," which explores the acceptance of diversity in terms of gender identity and sexuality. She questions why anyone would refute the arguments presented in the book after reading it and uses the diversity in nature as an analogy to advocate for acceptance in humans.
Join host Sarah St John and guest Marisa as they dive deep into Marisa's personal journey, the importance of community, and the intersection of faith and sexuality. This thought-provoking episode will inspire listeners to embrace their own identities and seek understanding and acceptance.
❇️ Key topics and bullets- The podcast opens with a discussion about the creation of Eve and her role as a companion for Adam. It focuses on the fact that Eve is another human, emphasizing her similarities and sameness rather than her visual differences. The bond between Adam and Eve is described as a kinship bond similar to that of family or friends.
- Marisa shares her personal experience with online dating and the struggles of finding a genuine connection. She discusses the frustration of dealing with fake profiles and scammers. She then shares how she met her current partner and how their relationship feels divinely ordained. She talks about their shared values and interests and the positive reactions from her church community and parents towards their partner.
- Marisa talks about her upbringing in a mixed religious household and her strong faith foundation. She shares her struggles with depression, self-identity, and reconciling her faith with her sexuality. She discusses the importance of finding supportive peers and a church community that embraces her as a gay individual. She emphasizes the role of community and the importance of holding onto hope and staying true to one's self.
- Marisa mentions books she has read related to the topic, particularly ones that explore the compatibility of being gay and Christian. Marissa and Sarah discuss the clobber passages, explaining that they don't refer to committed same-sex relationships but to ancient times involving domination and violence. They praise the availability of new books that provide more depth and understanding on the topic.
- Marisa opens up about a negative confrontation with her family over a relationship with a woman in high school and shares her personal experience of being in an abusive relationship. She discusses her conflicting thoughts and feelings about her sexual orientation. She expresses gratitude for the supportive relationship she now has with her parents and her current partner being accepted into the family.
- Marisa and her partner are in a...
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❇️ Key topics and bullets
- Opening Segment: Expressing Hope for Maintaining Friendship Despite Changing Circumstances
Emphasizing the importance of friendship even after major life changes Sharing personal experiences and perspectives on maintaining connections- Seeking Solace and Support from Local LGBTQ+ Groups
Exploring the importance of community in times of personal growth and change Specific focus on finding LGBTQ+ groups that cater to gay Christians- Personal Journey: Coming to Terms with Authenticity
Reflecting on childhood experiences and early signs of attraction Realizing the yearning for authenticity in later years Discussing the impact of societal expectations and internalized beliefs- Divorce Process: Civil, Amicable, and Uncontested
Sharing experiences of navigating the divorce journey Highlighting the importance of open communication and mutual respect- Hope for Future Relationships and Friendship
Expressing wishes for personal fulfillment and growth for oneself and former spouse Discussing the desire to maintain a friendship and support each other's happiness- Listening to the Narratives of Others
Finding strength and inspiration through hearing stories of similar experiences Encouraging listeners to share their own stories and experiences- Introducing the Podcast's Goal and Format
Explaining the objective of inspiring and validating unique journeys Encouraging engagement through voice messages and guest forms- Connecting through TikTok Tuesdays
Announcing the start of live TikTok sessions for community engagement Giving details about the initial schedule and possibility of changes based on feedback- Call to Action: Subscribing, Rating, and Sharing the Podcast
Encouraging listeners to subscribe to the podcast for future episodes Requesting 5-star ratings and reviews if enjoying the content Asking listeners to share the podcast with someone who could benefit from the message- Closing Segment: Farewell and Future Engagement
Expressing gratitude for listeners and promising future episodes Signing off with a reminder that their unique journey is valid and valuable
🧞♂️ Discussion questions1. Have you ever had a longing or yearning for something that you couldn't quite understand? How did you navigate through those feelings?
2. Can you relate to Sarah's experience of feeling like they were living a charade or not being true to themselves? How did you handle those emotions if you've been in a similar situation?
3. What role do you think societal expectations play in shaping our identities and relationships? How have these expectations influenced your own life?
4. How do you think Sarah's conservative Christian upbringing affected their understanding of their own sexuality? Have you had any experiences or beliefs that conflicted with your own identity?
5. Sarah expressed a desire to remain friends with her ex-spouse. Do you think it's possible to still maintain a close friendship with someone after a romantic relationship ends? Why or why not?
6. Sarah mentioned finding strength and solace through listening to the narratives of others who have gone through similar experiences. Have you ever found comfort in hearing someone else's story? How has it affected your own journey?
7. The podcast aims to emphasize that it doesn't matter how or when someone comes to terms with their reality. How do you think this message can empower and validate individuals who may be struggling with their own journey?
8. Sarah is specifically looking for...
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💡 Guest bio
Emily Bettdur's story begins with her conservative Catholic upbringing that provided little exposure to homosexuality. Despite this, she found herself frequently commenting on attractive women while dating her ex-husband. It was her husband who eventually confronted her about her potential attraction to women, leading Emily to question her own feelings. Over time, she realized that she was indeed attracted to women. However, she struggled with societal expectations and the idea of following a predetermined checklist for life. Despite having a good relationship with her husband, Emily's desire and longing for women continued to grow. Eventually, the conflict caused issues in their marriage, and they both recognized the need for each of them to figure things out individually. Emily's husband suggested that she explore her feelings further by going on a date with a woman. This experience confirmed for Emily that she desired a life with a woman and staying in her marriage would only lead to unfulfilled yearning. She understood that staying in her marriage would lead to dissatisfaction and unfairness for both her and her ex-husband. They made the difficult decision to get divorced and separate, allowing Emily to embrace her true identity.
ℹ️ IntroductionOn this episode of Lesbi-Honest, host Sarah St John invites guest Emily Bettdur to share her experience of going through a divorce and realizing her true sexuality. Emily opens up about the sadness and grief she felt during the divorce process, but also highlights how both she and her ex-spouse knew it was the right thing and approached it logically. They were able to navigate the divorce relatively easily, sitting down together to file paperwork and create a plan. Despite the emotions that arose, the couple remained mature and amicable, resulting in a strong friendship that continues to this day. Emily's ex-spouse has even found love with a new girlfriend, whom Emily accepts and loves.
However, not all divorces are as amicable, and Emily shares the contrast with her wife's relationship with her own ex-husband, who is not on good terms with her. Emily and her current wife both identify as late-life lesbians, and Emily dives into their belief in true love and their dating history. They met on a dating app and, despite past negative experiences, felt an instant connection. After eight months of dating, they got married and have been together for almost three years. Emily emphasizes the strong communication and love they share, which surpassed their expectations. Yet, she also discusses the fear and anxiety they experienced before getting married again due to their previous divorce. Nevertheless, they are grateful for finding the right person and having a strong relationship.
The conversation takes a turn as Emily delves into coming out as LGBTQ+ to her family while going through the divorce. Her mother had a shocking and initially incomprehension reaction, questioning if therapy couldn't save the marriage. She needed time to process and sought guidance from a priest, but eventually accepted Emily's partner. Emily stresses the importance of giving families time to process and grieve when accepting LGBTQ+ loved ones, acknowledging that the grieving process may involve anger and need to be met with grace and space.
The episode touches on the difficulties of grieving and guilt in this situation. People often feel guilty for grieving because they feel responsible for the relationship ending. Emily highlights how women, in particular, may question their own feelings if they miss their ex-husbands while identifying as lesbians, and the common experience of feeling jealous when ex-husbands move on. She reassures listeners that it is normal to experience extra emotions and question one's sexuality during this process. Grieving is allowed and necessary, even if one feels responsible for the end of the relationship. Emily acknowledges
