Episoder
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Natalie Cassidy and Joanna Page chat about all things on and off the telly.
This week Nat and Jo catch up about the new series of I'm A Celeb, what they think of the second series of Bad Sisters and a new series starring Sophie Turner called Joan. Nat also gives Jo a taste of what her time was like filming The Bake Off Xmas special.
What they can’t stop watching, what they definitely aren’t going to bother with, new releases and comforting classics – TV is timeless and no telly is out of bounds. As well as having a natter about what’s on TV, they share backstage goss from the world of telly, whilst also cracking up about the more humbling moments in their lives. Self-confessed TV addicts and stars of two of the biggest shows on our screens, EastEnders and Gavin and Stacey, Natalie and Joanna are the perfect companions to see what’s occurring on and off the telly. Timecodes for shows discussed this week are:
29:33 - I'm A Celebrity...Get Me Out Of Here! on ITV1 and ITVX28:46 - Bad Sisters Series 2 on Apple TV+34:04 - Joan on ITVX
Get in touch by sending us a message or voice note via WhatsApp to 03306 784704.
Hosts: Natalie Cassidy and Joanna PageProducer: Georgia KeatingExecutive Producer: Richard MorrisCommissioning Editor: Rhian RobertsProduction Co-ordinator: Becky Carewe-JeffriesSounds Editor: Arlie AdlingtonMusic by MCasso
Off The Telly is a BBC Studios Audio Production for BBC Sounds.
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In this bonus episode Nat and Jo hear from listeners about their ultimate TV Huns. We're talking Pam from Gavin and Stacey, Gemma Collins, Jane McDonald and Nat Cass herself! The girls also chat to Hunsnet aka Gareth Howells who's an expert in the Hun field and helps Jo finally pin down what a Hun actually is and how she could be one.
Natalie Cassidy and Joanna Page chat about all things on and off the telly. What they can’t stop watching, what they definitely aren’t going to bother with, new releases and comforting classics – TV is timeless and no telly is out of bounds. As well as having a natter about what’s on TV, they share backstage goss from the world of telly, whilst also cracking up about the more humbling moments in their lives. Self-confessed TV addicts and stars of two of the biggest shows on our screens, EastEnders and Gavin and Stacey, Natalie and Joanna are the perfect companions to see what’s occurring on and off the telly.
Get in touch by sending us a message or voice note via WhatsApp to 03306 784704.
Hosts: Natalie Cassidy and Joanna PageProducer: Georgia KeatingExecutive Producer: Pete StraussCommissioning Editor: Rhian RobertsProduction Co-ordinator: Becky Carewe-JeffriesSounds Editor: Arlie AdlingtonMusic by MCasso
Off The Telly is a BBC Studios Audio Production for BBC Sounds.
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Manglende episoder?
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Natalie Cassidy and Joanna Page chat about all things on and off the telly.
This week Nat and Jo celebrate their boys getting through to Blackpool on Strictly, plus they catch up about the true crime drama Until I Kill You starring Anna Maxwell Martin and new rom com Nobody Wants This on Netflix.
What they can’t stop watching, what they definitely aren’t going to bother with, new releases and comforting classics – TV is timeless and no telly is out of bounds.
As well as having a natter about what’s on TV, they share backstage goss from the world of telly, whilst also cracking up about the more humbling moments in their lives.
Self-confessed TV addicts and stars of two of the biggest shows on our screens, EastEnders and Gavin and Stacey, Natalie and Joanna are the perfect companions to see what’s occurring on and off the telly.
Timecodes for shows discussed this week are:
20:06 - Until I Kill You (ITVX)26:42 - Nobody Wants This (Netflix)
Get in touch by sending us a message or voice note via WhatsApp to 03306 784704.
Hosts: Natalie Cassidy and Joanna PageProducer: Georgia KeatingExecutive Producer: Pete StraussCommissioning Editor: Rhian RobertsProduction Co-ordinator: Becky Carewe-JeffriesSounds Editor: Arlie AdlingtonMusic by MCasso
Off The Telly is a BBC Studios Audio Production for BBC Sounds.
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Natalie Cassidy and Joanna Page chat about all things on and off the telly.
This week Nat and Jo catch up on two shows everyone seems to be talking about - Rivals and Ludwig. One they describe as a "romping good show" and the other as "the new Jonathan Creek", tune in to find out which one is which. Plus Nat chats about watching Strictly on Saturday live in the studio for Icons week.
What they can’t stop watching, what they definitely aren’t going to bother with, new releases and comforting classics – TV is timeless and no telly is out of bounds. As well as having a natter about what’s on TV, they share backstage goss from the world of telly, whilst also cracking up about the more humbling moments in their lives. Self-confessed TV addicts and stars of two of the biggest shows on our screens, EastEnders and Gavin and Stacey, Natalie and Joanna are the perfect companions to see what’s occurring on and off the telly. Timecodes for shows discussed this week are:
14:45 - Rivals (Disney+)27:00 - Ludwig (BBC iPlayer)
Get in touch by sending us a message or voice note via WhatsApp to 03306 784704.
Hosts: Natalie Cassidy and Joanna PageProducer: Georgia KeatingExecutive Producer: Pete StraussCommissioning Editor: Rhian RobertsProduction Co-ordinator: Becky Carewe-JeffriesSounds Editor: Arlie AdlingtonMusic by MCasso
Off The Telly is a BBC Studios Audio Production for BBC Sounds.
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In this bonus Halloween episode Nat and Jo hear from listeners about the telly that's scared them the most. From shows like Psychoville to The Haunting of Hill House, plus some not so scary ones like the Bergerac Christmas special from 1986. We also find out why Nat calls herself a scaredy-cat and the show that still haunts Jo to this day from her childhood.
Natalie Cassidy and Joanna Page chat about all things on and off the telly. What they can’t stop watching, what they definitely aren’t going to bother with, new releases and comforting classics – TV is timeless and no telly is out of bounds. As well as having a natter about what’s on TV, they share backstage goss from the world of telly, whilst also cracking up about the more humbling moments in their lives. Self-confessed TV addicts and stars of two of the biggest shows on our screens, EastEnders and Gavin and Stacey, Natalie and Joanna are the perfect companions to see what’s occurring on and off the telly.
Get in touch by sending us a message or voice note via WhatsApp to 03306 784704.
Hosts: Natalie Cassidy and Joanna PageProducer: Georgia KeatingExecutive Producer: Richard MorrisCommissioning Editor: Rhian RobertsProduction Co-ordinator: Becky Carewe-JeffriesSounds Editor: Arlie AdlingtonMusic by MCasso
Off The Telly is a BBC Studios Audio Production for BBC Sounds.
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Natalie Cassidy and Joanna Page chat about all things on and off the telly.
This week Nat and Jo catch up about Nat’s time on Bake Off: Extra Slice, plus they discuss why The Secret Lives of Mormon Wives wasn’t for them and how much they love Alma’s Not Normal.
What they can’t stop watching, what they definitely aren’t going to bother with, new releases and comforting classics – TV is timeless and no telly is out of bounds. As well as having a natter about what’s on TV, they share backstage goss from the world of telly, whilst also cracking up about the more humbling moments in their lives. Self-confessed TV addicts and stars of two of the biggest shows on our screens, EastEnders and Gavin and Stacey, Natalie and Joanna are the perfect companions to see what’s occurring on and off the telly. Timecodes for shows discussed this week are:
20:26 - The Secret Lives of Mormon Wives (Disney Plus)30:22 - Alma’s Not Normal (BBC iPlayer)
Get in touch by sending us a message or voice note via WhatsApp to 03306 784704.
Hosts: Natalie Cassidy and Joanna PageProducer: Georgia KeatingExecutive Producer: Richard MorrisCommissioning Editor: Rhian RobertsProduction Co-ordinator: Becky Carewe-JeffriesSounds Editor: Arlie AdlingtonMusic by MCasso
Off The Telly is a BBC Studios Audio Production for BBC Sounds.
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Natalie Cassidy and Joanna Page chat about all things on and off the telly.
This week they catch up about Bake Off (Channel 4) and Heartstopper (Netflix), plus they have a chat about why they both decided to wear woolly clothes when it's 20 degrees outside. They also chat about the telly their kids are watching at the moment and why Jo's fear of spiders has come up this week.
What they can’t stop watching, what they definitely aren’t going to bother with, new releases and comforting classics – TV is timeless and no telly is out of bounds. As well as having a natter about what’s on TV, they share backstage goss from the world of telly, whilst also cracking up about the more humbling moments in their lives. Self-confessed TV addicts and stars of two of the biggest shows on our screens, EastEnders and Gavin and Stacey, Natalie and Joanna are the perfect companions to see what’s occurring on and off the telly. Timecodes for shows discussed this week are:
18:06 - The Great British Bake Off24:29 - Heartstopper
Get in touch by sending us a message or voice note via WhatsApp to 03306 784704.
Hosts: Natalie Cassidy and Joanna PageProducer: Georgia KeatingExecutive Producer: Richard MorrisCommissioning Editor: Rhian RobertsProduction Co-ordinator: Becky Carewe-JeffriesSounds Editor: Arlie AdlingtonMusic by MCasso
Off The Telly is a BBC Studios Audio Production for BBC Sounds.
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In this bonus episode Nat and Jo hear from listeners about their favourite TV heroes, ranging from proper 'heroes' like Jack Bauer in 24 to absolute icons like Pam in Gavin and Stacey. Plus Nat tries to explain to Jo what a 'hun' is.
Natalie Cassidy and Joanna Page chat about all things on and off the telly. What they can’t stop watching, what they definitely aren’t going to bother with, new releases and comforting classics – TV is timeless and no telly is out of bounds. As well as having a natter about what’s on TV, they share backstage goss from the world of telly, whilst also cracking up about the more humbling moments in their lives. Self-confessed TV addicts and stars of two of the biggest shows on our screens, EastEnders and Gavin and Stacey, Natalie and Joanna are the perfect companions to see what’s occurring on and off the telly.
Get in touch by sending us a message or voice note via WhatsApp to 03306 784704.
Hosts: Natalie Cassidy and Joanna PageProducer: Georgia KeatingExecutive Producer: Richard MorrisCommissioning Editor: Rhian RobertsProduction Co-ordinator: Becky Carewe-JeffriesSounds Editor: Arlie AdlingtonMusic by MCasso
Off The Telly is a BBC Studios Audio Production for BBC Sounds.
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Natalie Cassidy and Joanna Page chat about all things on and off the telly.
This week Nat and Jo are feeling very autumnal and delve into the world of Gilmore Girls (Netflix). They also chat about Halloween, dry robes and Jo's last ever day on Gavin and Stacey.
What they can’t stop watching, what they definitely aren’t going to bother with, new releases and comforting classics – TV is timeless and no telly is out of bounds. As well as having a natter about what’s on TV, they share backstage goss from the world of telly, whilst also cracking up about the more humbling moments in their lives. Self-confessed TV addicts and stars of two of the biggest shows on our screens, EastEnders and Gavin and Stacey, Natalie and Joanna are the perfect companions to see what’s occurring on and off the telly. Timecodes for shows discussed this week are:
20:07 - Gilmore Girls
Get in touch by sending us a message or voice note via WhatsApp to 03306 784704.
Hosts: Natalie Cassidy and Joanna PageProducer: Georgia KeatingExecutive Producer: Richard MorrisCommissioning Editor: Rhian RobertsProduction Co-ordinator: Becky Carewe-JeffriesSounds Editor: Arlie AdlingtonMusic by MCasso
Off The Telly is a BBC Studios Audio Production for BBC Sounds.
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Natalie Cassidy and Joanna Page chat about all things on and off the telly.
This week Jo admits she’s now got a crush on Jamie Borthwick after watching his rumba on Strictly, and so naturally Nat decides to give him a call to tell him. Jo also shares what kind of tattoo she’d get and they debate whether you can eat olives out of the bin. Plus they have a catch up about Bad Sisters (Apple TV) and Nightsleeper (BBC iPlayer).
What they can’t stop watching, what they definitely aren’t going to bother with, new releases and comforting classics – TV is timeless and no telly is out of bounds. As well as having a natter about what’s on TV, they share backstage goss from the world of telly, whilst also cracking up about the more humbling moments in their lives. Self-confessed TV addicts and stars of two of the biggest shows on our screens, EastEnders and Gavin and Stacey, Natalie and Joanna are the perfect companions to see what’s occurring on and off the telly. Timecodes for shows discussed this week are:
7:44 - Bad Sisters24:30 - Nightsleeper
Get in touch by sending us a message or voice note via WhatsApp to 03306 784704.
Hosts: Natalie Cassidy and Joanna PageProducer: Georgia KeatingExecutive Producer: Richard MorrisCommissioning Editor: Rhian RobertsProduction Co-ordinator: Becky Carewe-JeffriesSounds Editor: Arlie AdlingtonMusic by MCasso
Off The Telly is a BBC Studios Audio Production for BBC Sounds.
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In this bonus episode Nat and Jo discuss their favourite costumes from the telly, plus they hear from listeners about the costumes that stick out for them. We're talking iconic characters from shows like EastEnders, Sex Education, Ru Paul's Drag Race and The Traitors.
Natalie Cassidy and Joanna Page chat about all things on and off the telly. What they can’t stop watching, what they definitely aren’t going to bother with, new releases and comforting classics – TV is timeless and no telly is out of bounds. As well as having a natter about what’s on TV, they share backstage goss from the world of telly, whilst also cracking up about the more humbling moments in their lives. Self-confessed TV addicts and stars of two of the biggest shows on our screens, EastEnders and Gavin and Stacey, Natalie and Joanna are the perfect companions to see what’s occurring on and off the telly.
Get in touch by sending us a message or voice note via WhatsApp to 03306 784704.
Hosts: Natalie Cassidy and Joanna PageProducer: Georgia KeatingExecutive Producer: Richard MorrisCommissioning Editor: Rhian RobertsProduction Co-ordinator: Becky Carewe-JeffriesSounds Editor: Arlie AdlingtonMusic by MCasso
Off The Telly is a BBC Studios Audio Production for BBC Sounds.
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Natalie Cassidy and Joanna Page chat about all things on and off the telly.
This week emotions are running high as filming for Gavin and Stacey is nearly at an end, plus Jo explains why she got to eat a doughnut with her own face on it. Nat also shares what she's been up to this week, including having to do a 'sweat test'. We also find out how much fun Jo had watching Strictly live in the studio, and they have a good old natter about Dating Naked UK (Paramount Plus), All Creatures Great and Small (Channel 5) and The White Lotus (NOW).
What they can’t stop watching, what they definitely aren’t going to bother with, new releases and comforting classics – TV is timeless and no telly is out of bounds. As well as having a natter about what’s on TV, they share backstage goss from the world of telly, whilst also cracking up about the more humbling moments in their lives. Self-confessed TV addicts and stars of two of the biggest shows on our screens, EastEnders and Gavin and Stacey, Natalie and Joanna are the perfect companions to see what’s occurring on and off the telly. Timecodes for shows discussed this week are:
9:50 - Dating Naked23:46 - All Creatures Great and Small27:29 - The White Lotus
Get in touch by sending us a message or voice note via WhatsApp to 03306 784704.
Hosts: Natalie Cassidy and Joanna PageProducer: Georgia KeatingExecutive Producer: Richard MorrisCommissioning Editor: Rhian RobertsProduction Co-ordinator: Becky Carewe-JeffriesSounds Editor: Arlie AdlingtonMusic by MCasso
Off The Telly is a BBC Studios Audio Production for BBC Sounds.
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Natalie Cassidy and Joanna Page chat about all things on and off the telly.
This week they find out how Jo's last filming day on Stacey's street in Barry went, plus they chat about Friday Night Dinner which is one of Nat's fave shows all of time. They also see what all the fuss is about with The Perfect Couple on Netflix starring Nicole Kidman, and chat about finally getting round to watching The Split.
What they can’t stop watching, what they definitely aren’t going to bother with, new releases and comforting classics – TV is timeless and no telly is out of bounds. As well as having a natter about what’s on TV, they share backstage goss from the world of telly, whilst also cracking up about the more humbling moments in their lives. Self-confessed TV addicts and stars of two of the biggest shows on our screens, EastEnders and Gavin and Stacey, Natalie and Joanna are the perfect companions to see what’s occurring on and off the telly. Timecodes for shows discussed this week are:
20:50 - Friday Night Dinner28:40 - The Perfect Couple32:55 - The Split
Get in touch by sending us a message or voice note via WhatsApp to 03306 784704.
Hosts: Natalie Cassidy and Joanna PageProducer: Georgia KeatingExecutive Producer: Richard MorrisCommissioning Editor: Rhian RobertsProduction Co-ordinator: Becky Carewe-JeffriesSounds Editor: Arlie AdlingtonMusic by MCasso
Off The Telly is a BBC Studios Audio Production for BBC Sounds.
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In this bonus episode they hear from listeners about their most iconic reality TV moments! Be prepared to reminisce about some of the best Big Brother has to offer, as well I'm A Celeb and The X Factor.
Natalie Cassidy and Joanna Page chat about all things on and off the telly. What they can’t stop watching, what they definitely aren’t going to bother with, new releases and comforting classics – TV is timeless and no telly is out of bounds. As well as having a natter about what’s on TV, they share backstage goss from the world of telly, whilst also cracking up about the more humbling moments in their lives. Self-confessed TV addicts and stars of two of the biggest shows on our screens, EastEnders and Gavin and Stacey, Natalie and Joanna are the perfect companions to see what’s occurring on and off the telly.
Get in touch by sending us a message or voice note via WhatsApp to 03306 784704.
Hosts: Natalie Cassidy and Joanna PageProducer: Georgia KeatingExecutive Producer: Pete StraussCommissioning Editor: Rhian RobertsProduction Co-ordinator: Becky Carewe-JeffriesSounds Editor: Arlie AdlingtonMusic by MCasso
Off The Telly is a BBC Studios Audio Production for BBC Sounds.
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Natalie Cassidy and Joanna Page chat about all things on and off the telly.
This week they catch up about how Gavin and Stacey filming is going for Jo, and how Nat has found time to unwind at an art gallery. They also celebrate the return of Strictly Come Dancing, chat about The Twelve which Jo had been told was a must watch, and discuss their obsession with Aussie comedy Colin from Accounts.
What they can’t stop watching, what they definitely aren’t going to bother with, new releases and comforting classics – TV is timeless and no telly is out of bounds. As well as having a natter about what’s on TV, they share backstage goss from the world of telly, whilst also cracking up about the more humbling moments in their lives. Self-confessed TV addicts and stars of two of the biggest shows on our screens, EastEnders and Gavin and Stacey, Natalie and Joanna are the perfect companions to see what’s occurring on and off the telly. Timecodes for shows discussed this week are:12:15 - Strictly Come Dancing24:17 - The Twelve28:38 - Colin from Accounts
Get in touch by sending us a message or voice note via WhatsApp to 03306 784704.
Hosts: Natalie Cassidy and Joanna PageProducer: Georgia KeatingExecutive Producer: Pete StraussCommissioning Editor: Rhian RobertsProduction Co-ordinator: Becky Carewe-JeffriesSounds Editor: Arlie AdlingtonMusic by MCasso
Off The Telly is a BBC Studios Audio Production for BBC Sounds.
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What are we watching? Natalie Cassidy and Joanna Page chat about all things telly.
This week they chat about Alan Carr's autobiographical sitcom Changing Ends on ITVX, a new James Bond inspired entertainment series called 007: Road to a Million on Amazon Prime, and a superpower sitcom called Extraordinary on Disney Plus.
In Off the Telly, Natalie and Joanna talk about what they can’t stop watching, what they definitely aren’t going to bother with, and what you’re all watching at home. From new shows to comfort telly to guilty pleasures, there’s no judgement here. What’s kept us all glued to our screens this week?
Self-confessed TV addicts and stars of two of the biggest shows on our screens, EastEnders and Gavin and Stacey, Natalie and Joanna are the perfect companions to your weekly viewing habits.
Timecodes for shows discussed this week are:
Changing Ends - 9:51007: Road to a Million - 14:41Extraordinary - 20:36
Get in touch by sending us a message or voice note via WhatsApp to 03306 784704.
Hosts: Natalie Cassidy and Joanna PageProducer: Georgia KeatingExecutive Producer: Richard MorrisCommissioning Editor: Rhian RobertsProduction Co-ordinator: Becky Carewe-JeffriesSounds Editor: Arlie AdlingtonMusic by MCasso
Off The Telly is a BBC Studios Audio Production for BBC Sounds.
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What are we watching? Natalie Cassidy and Joanna Page chat about all things telly.
The girls are back after their summer break and this week are discussing The Jetty on BBC iPlayer, Only Murders in the Building on Disney Plus and Mr Bigstuff on NOW and Sky Max.
In Off the Telly, Natalie and Joanna talk about what they can’t stop watching, what they definitely aren’t going to bother with, and what you’re all watching at home. From new shows to comfort telly to guilty pleasures, there’s no judgement here. What’s kept us all glued to our screens this week?
Self-confessed TV addicts and stars of two of the biggest shows on our screens, EastEnders and Gavin and Stacey, Natalie and Joanna are the perfect companions to your weekly viewing habits.
Timecodes for shows discussed this week are:
12:38 - The Jetty18:20 - Only Murders in the Building24:00 - Mr Bigstuff
Get in touch by sending us a message or voice note via WhatsApp to 03306 784704.
Hosts: Natalie Cassidy and Joanna PageProducer: Georgia KeatingExecutive Producer: Richard MorrisCommissioning Editor: Rhian RobertsProduction Co-ordinator: Becky Carewe-JeffriesSounds Editor: Arlie AdlingtonMusic by MCasso
Off The Telly is a BBC Studios Audio Production for BBC Sounds.
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In this Summer Special they get a chance to hear more voicenotes from listeners about their favourite TV villains. They hear about baddies from EastEnders, The Traitors, Big Brother and Doctor Who, plus a surprise voicenote for Joanna!
In this Summer Special it's round 2 of voicenotes about listeners' favourite TV detectives. They chat about iconic characters like Sherlock, Jessica Fletcher, Poirot and Luther.
In Off the Telly, Natalie and Joanna talk about what they can’t stop watching, what they definitely aren’t going to bother with, and what you’re all watching at home. From new shows to comfort telly to guilty pleasures, there’s no judgement here. What’s kept us all glued to our screens this week?
Self-confessed TV addicts and stars of two of the biggest shows on our screens, EastEnders and Gavin and Stacey, Natalie and Joanna are the perfect companions to your weekly viewing habits.
Get in touch by sending us a message or voice note via WhatsApp to 03306 784704.
Hosts: Natalie Cassidy and Joanna PageProducer: Georgia KeatingExecutive Producer: Richard MorrisCommissioning Editor: Rhian RobertsProduction Co-ordinator: Becky Carewe-JeffriesSounds Editor: Arlie AdlingtonMusic by MCasso
Off The Telly is a BBC Studios Audio Production for BBC Sounds.
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In this Summer Special it's round 2 of voicenotes about listeners' favourite TV detectives. They chat about iconic characters like Sherlock, Jessica Fletcher, Poirot and Luther.
In Off the Telly, Natalie and Joanna talk about what they can’t stop watching, what they definitely aren’t going to bother with, and what you’re all watching at home. From new shows to comfort telly to guilty pleasures, there’s no judgement here. What’s kept us all glued to our screens this week?
Self-confessed TV addicts and stars of two of the biggest shows on our screens, EastEnders and Gavin and Stacey, Natalie and Joanna are the perfect companions to your weekly viewing habits.
Get in touch by sending us a message or voice note via WhatsApp to 03306 784704.
Hosts: Natalie Cassidy and Joanna PageProducer: Georgia KeatingExecutive Producer: Richard MorrisCommissioning Editor: Rhian RobertsProduction Co-ordinator: Becky Carewe-JeffriesSounds Editor: Arlie AdlingtonMusic by MCasso
Off The Telly is a BBC Studios Audio Production for BBC Sounds.
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In this Summer Special they get a chance to hear more voicenotes from listeners about their favourite comfort telly. They discuss shows including Drunk History, Motherland, Friends and The Kardashians. Plus Jo tells us about what it was like reading the Gavin and Stacey Christmas Special script for the first time.
In Off the Telly, Natalie and Joanna talk about what they can’t stop watching, what they definitely aren’t going to bother with, and what you’re all watching at home. From new shows to comfort telly to guilty pleasures, there’s no judgement here. What’s kept us all glued to our screens this week?
Self-confessed TV addicts and stars of two of the biggest shows on our screens, EastEnders and Gavin and Stacey, Natalie and Joanna are the perfect companions to your weekly viewing habits.
Get in touch by sending us a message or voice note via WhatsApp to 03306 784704.
Hosts: Natalie Cassidy and Joanna PageProducer: Georgia KeatingExecutive Producer: Pete StraussCommissioning Editor: Rhian RobertsUnit Manager: Lucy BannisterSounds Editor: Arlie AdlingtonMusic by MCasso
Off The Telly is a BBC Studios Audio Production for BBC Sounds.
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