Episodes
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Panu and Thomas met with with Brighton UK climate psychologist Steffi Bednarek, author of Climate, Psychology, and Change. They explored stages of Steffi’s journey into climate psychology, and the importance of Gestalt therapy in her understandings of how our selves entwine with nature and our perceptions of environmental issues and problems. They discussed how concepts like mindfulness and “creative indifference” offer additional perspectives on the seemingly hard distinction between hope and hopelessness. Steffi also shared her efforts to to create a platform for experiential learning in climate psychology.
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In another of their intimate international dialogues, Thomas and Panu discussed the significance of connecting with nature for them during the changing seasons. Panu evolved the Finnish season of Marras, the gray time of the year as Autumn transitions to darker Winter, and when it’s normal for us all to be sensitive to feelings associated with grief. Thomas reflected on holidays of remembrance like Veterans Day (dating to WWI Armistice day), Remembrance Day for Species, and the Day of the Dead that help to mark our losses and celebrate our continuing bonds. Their conversation emphasized that "We create our own light when we need to" – and reminds you of the the value of your community and connections in your own place this season.
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Thomas and Panu had a wide ranging exchange with journalist Anya Kamenetz (The Stolen Year, The Golden Hour) on the intersections of climate change, parenting, and mental health – in the context of the recent US elections. They discuss the importance of having open conversations with children about difficult topics that are geared to children and teens’ emotional and intellectual development. Each reflected on how they create a sense of hope, meaning, and resilience in their own families. Anya also shared some of her personal story growing up on the Gulf Coast of the US, and her journey as a writer, activist and parent.
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Thomas and Panu discussed Thomas’ upcoming book Surviving Climate Anxiety: A Guide to Coping, Healing, and Thriving – a comprehensive resource for the general public that includes practical examples and stories drawn from people Thomas has worked with. Thomas shared insights about the book’s five part structure, which is designed to move readers from basic skills for coping with eco and climate stress, through developing environmental identity, healing from eco-anxiety and despair, finding happiness and flourishing using the arts and spirituality, and taking action on environmental problems. Panu reflected on the importance of addressing the dark and light aspects of climate feelings and having a survivor mission. Surviving Climate Anxiety will be published in 2025 by Little Brown Spark.
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Thomas and Panu had a conversation with Seattle Washington therapist Andrew Bryant about the intersections of climate change and mental health therapy. Andrew reflected on his personal journey, the Climate and Mind website, and his experiences creating a community among therapists to explore climate issues in their lives and practices. Andrew described some of his methods of “professional and compassionate listening” that focus on creating community and holding space for feelings, especially for people who are isolated or not talking. The discussion also touched on the significance of outdoor therapy and how nature-based rite of passage experience can help individuals to navigate their paths in the face of climate distress.
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Thomas and Panu discussed the intersection of spirituality and climate change. Specifically, Panu shared his work on the challenges faced by individuals who experience spiritual crises when their ecological fears or grief aren’t validated in their religious community, and who may feel isolated and unsupported. This may lead to feelings of combined ecological and spiritual grief. Faith leaders are in a key position regarding the validation of such feelings. Coping requires a holistic approach that recognizes the connections between spirituality and environmental values, finding support, and constructive engagement with climate emotions and with climate action in spiritual and religious communities.
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In this episode of Climate Change and Happiness hosts Thomas and Panu engaged with filmmakers Tehya Jennett and Maxfield Biggs from Stranded Astronaut Productions. Tehya and Maxfield shared their personal journeys related to climate emotions. They reflected, together with Panu and Thomas, on the impact of food choices on climate awareness and ethics, and the need for intergenerational dialogue. The conversation also highlighted the importance of creativity as a coping mechanism. Most recently, Maxfield and Tehya were part of the team that produced the Healing Lahaina documentary about the deadly Lahaina wildfire on Maui, premiering at the Hawai’i Int’l Film Festival. Tehya and Maxfield are also collaborating with Panu and Elin Kelsey to create new content on climate emotions. Join us in the quest of understanding how climate change is engaged with by young people.
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Panu and Thomas had a warm chat with UK climate psychology theorist Sally Weintrobe, author of The Psychological Roots of the Climate Crisis and other books. Sally reflected on her childhood growing up in apartheid era South Africa and insights that led her to climate advocacy after years of providing psychoanalysis. She, Panu and Thomas spent time grappling with concepts like disavowal, group silencing, “active not caring” and “emotional privilege.” Listen in to a great episode for therapists, and also anyone interested in how these often unconscious processes manifest in our lives.
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Thomas and Panu reflected on the often overlooked process of re-entry into life after a holiday or vacation. They considered Thomas’s idea of the “half-life” of restorative experiences. That is, how long the mental benfits of the experience enhance your normal or usual existence, such through increased perspective or calm, and how to extend these positive effects. They also recognized how technology and consumerism have infiltrated into seasonal breaks and holidays. And the shadow impacts of guilt regarding travel impacts on the environment, and emotional risks of returning from a holiday to face unsatisfying aspects of life. Mindfulness and intention are important for bringing the gifts and perspectives gained from a trip back into your everyday life, whether from a simple, local holiday or an ambitious journey. We hope this episode will be inspiring for listeners returning from seasonal holidays in the Northern and Southern hemispheres.
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Thomas and Panu spoke with three graduate student researchers from the The Development, Environment, & Wellness Lab at Columbia University Teachers College in New York: Paritosh Joshi, Rian Maxwell-Williams, and Danny DeBonis. All three are deeply engaged in environmental psychology and justice issues. They discussed their personal backgrounds, environmental identities, and the values and goals for their research. Join us for an inspiring conversation!
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Thomas and Panu spoke with Judith Anderson and Tree Staunton, two therapists and co-editors (along with Jenny O’Gorman and Caroline Hickman) of the recent collection Being a Therapist in a Time of Climate Breakdown. The foursome explored their experiences of mental health, research and healing work in the context of climate change and the psychologicals impact of climate distress. Tree and Judith shared their personal journeys towards climate awareness. The episode included an overview of the structure and themes of the book, which includes chapters on climate science, mental health impacts, first person accounts, systemic understandings, and techniques to address climate distress (including a contribution on climate sorrow from Panu).
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This episode is dedicated to teachers and educators of all kinds. Thomas and Panu discussed the new Existential Toolkit for Climate Justice Educators and the emotional, political, personal and pedagogical challenges faced by teachers in the context of climate change. The conversation delved into the history of the Toolkit project, the lingering impact of COVID-19 on education, and the unacknowledged and inequitable impacts of climate and weather disasters on students, teachers and school systems, worldwide. Panu and Thomas reflected on their own schooling in Finland and the US, their personal teaching experiences, and advice on how to remain creative and to cope with fatigue and burnout.
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Thomas and Panu spoke with Ryan Reese, a psychologist from Bend, Oregon USA about his work developing eco-wellness theory in counseling and his recent integration of psychedelic therapy and outdoor therapy. Ryan shared his personal journey and how experiences with nature and rivers (including fly fishing for Steelhead trout) played a role in his healing and growth. Ryan, Panu and Thomas highlighted the parallels between eco-therapy and psychedelic therapy, including the importance of creating a safe setting, adopting a mindset of self-transcendence and opening to the process of expanding one's consciousness. Their talk concluded with a recognition of how Thomas and Ryan’s social connection provided needed support during challenging times in Thomas’s earlier career.
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Thomas and Panu spoke with Will White, a long time outdoor and wilderness therapy practitioner, and a long time colleague of Thomas. They discussed the evolution of therapeutic camping and outdoor programs in the US dating to the 1800’s and current approaches (with parallels in places like Finland).They explored the role of emotions in outdoor therapy, including eco-anxiety and the impact of environmental change on treasured places. Their conversation highlighted the importance of slowing down and experiencing the pace of nature in a highly technological world.
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In this episode, Thomas and Panu discussed the role of art in their emotional coping with climate stress and other environmental problems. They explored the creative tensions between art and entertainment and being mindful when we chose to challenge ourselves with taking on complex or troubling movies, photographic images, writings, and music. They shared several examples and referenced their past podcast episodes with artists. Takeaways included the importance of being intentional about the nature and climate themed art you take in and not just being a passive consumer; and the need to unplug and engage in hands-on artistic experiences.
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Thomas and Panu talked with forensic psychiatrist Lise Van Susteren about her powerful experience as an expert witness at the historic Held v. Montana youth-sponsored climate trial in 2023. Lise spoke of her life and journey into politics and environmental and climate change advocacy, and her formative experience in the first cohort of Al Gore’s Climate Reality project. Lise, Thomas and Panu reflected on how mental health professions can begin to align their rhetoric about climate change and sustainability with their actions – such as addressing the carbon footprints of their own organizations and conferences. Join us for a behind the scenes view of the legal front on combating climate change.
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Thomas and Panu had a new dialogue with UK Climate Therapy expert Caroline Hickman to discuss the concept of moral injury in relation to climate distress and its impact on people’s sense of meaning and trust. The conversation delved into feelings that arise in situations where one’s values are compromised and the impacts to relationships (e.g., feeling let down, betrayed, or having feelings denied). Caroline emphasized the need to differentiate between toxic and healthy guilt, to “locate guilt where it belongs,” and the importance of reparation and saying sorry on the part of people in power (with the example of former New Zealand Prime Minister Jacinta Arden). Panu noted that engaging in a survivor mission and taking action can provide a sense of purpose and contribute to addressing moral injury. Join us for reflections on responsibility and healing amidst a changing climate.
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In this episode, Thomas and Panu discuss the importance of finding a place, digging in, and taking responsibility in the face of climate change and environmental issues. They explore the idea of being a creator or actor rather than a passive consumer and the significance of having short-term and long-term goals. Our missions take place in a web of relationships with humans and more-than-humans. Panu and Thomas also touch on the connection between climate change and death, and the need to engage with difficult topics. The conversation concludes with a discussion on the concept of non-action and the importance of mindfulness.
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Thomas and Panu were joined by LaUra Schmidt, co- founder of the Good Grief Network and co-author of How to Live in a Chaotic Climate. Laura shared her journey of combining her background in biology and environmental studies with trauma healing and psychology to address the emotional toll of climate change. She, Panu and Thomas discussed how the 12-step inspired Good Grief program helps individuals process their grief and find resilience about climate breakdown in a safe and supportive environment. Along the way, they looked deeper at the process of steps like accepting the severity of the environmental predicament, being with uncertainty, and honoring mortality; and the importance of peer support, accountability, and finding one's unique way of taking action. Join us for an inspiring conversation!
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In this episode, Thomas and Panu discussed some real-world aspects of nature and our relationship with the natural world, including different values associated with nature and other species, such as scientific, ethical, relationship and experience-based values. Thomas illustrated a spectrum of nature settings, from virtual nature such as art and images in the home, to nearby nature in our communities, to wild and protected places – with opportunities to be a cosmopolitan traveler between these contexts. The conversation evolved into a recognition of nature (in Finnish “luonto”) as an infinite set of processes and relationships, with nature settings being a doorway or threshold into the interconnectedness and interdependence of all beings. Panu and Thomas also touched on the concept of the “more than human world” (inspired by eco philosopher David Abram) and the need for “recollective practices” (inspired by ecopsychology theorist Andy Fisher) to connect with nature and counteract the divisive aspects of modern technological society.
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