Episodes
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We hit the streets of South by Southwest with Isaac Gale—director, artist, and one-half of the Minneapolis noise outfit Marijuana Deathsquads, in town to play the fest with his band. Isaac's the kind of guy who'd rather break a piece of software than master it, and that restless, try-anything energy runs through everything he makes. We wind through Ben's old neighborhood and retrace how the two first met—around WINNEBAGO MAN, which Isaac's partner JoLynn Garnes cut an early version of—then dig into SWAMP DOGG GETS HIS POOL PAINTED, the gloriously weird doc Isaac co-directed with the famously camera-shy Ryan Olson. It premiered at South by in 2024 and got scooped up by Magnolia Pictures for a theatrical run.
We trace the whole origin story: a cold call to Ryan's label (Totally Gross National Product), a 2017 trip to shoot one sad music video, and a house so perfect—Swamp Dogg, Moogstar, and Guitar Shorty living together like a psychedelic Brady Bunch—that they never wanted to leave. The pool getting painted becomes the anchor, so everything else (Mike Judge, Johnny Knoxville, Tom Kenny, a blink-and-you-miss-it Yo La Tengo cameo) gets to be as chaotic as it wants. Isaac walks us through the hand-built AI intro—a Swamp Dogg model trained on a PC in his bedroom and iterated for a year and a half—and why he's fine getting his hands dirty with tools everyone loves to hate.
Then the good stuff for emerging filmmakers: make it like a band, keep your crew close, and if you can't find money, make it without money. Plus CRUMB and AMERICAN MOVIE as gateway drugs, a dog named Ricky, the first time in 50+ episodes we've run out of card space, and why Minneapolis—community and all—is the thing Isaac can't stop thinking about.
DISCUSSION LINKS:
SWAMP DOGG GETS HIS POOL PAINTED (2024) | THE FEARLESS FREAKS (2005) | WINNEBAGO MAN (2009) | CRUMB (1994) | AMERICAN MOVIE (1999)
TIMESTAMPS:
00:00 Markers, selfie sticks, and SXSW sunburn 01:00 Ben's old neighborhood and how he and Isaac met 03:00 Artist vs. musician: Marijuana Deathsquads 04:00 Ryan Olson, the co-director who won't be photographed 05:00 SWAMP DOGG GETS HIS POOL PAINTED premieres at South by 07:00 A Doc Walks first: the SD card fills up 08:00 Take two: the Magnolia acquisition and theatrical run 10:00 Origin story: a cold call to Total Gross National Product 11:00 Showing up to shoot a music video in 2017 12:00 Who is Swamp Dogg? Ben the music head 14:00 Crooner to country: "She's All I Got" and John Prine's "Sam Stone" 16:00 Auto-tune, Justin Vernon, and Love, Loss & Auto-Tune 17:30 The "I'll Pretend" video; meeting Moogstar and Guitar Shorty 20:00 Naming the film: the pool as the anchor 22:00 Card-table cameos: Mike Judge, Johnny Knoxville, Tom Kenny, Yo La Tengo 24:00 Ricky the dog crashes the walk 25:00 100+ music videos and art school 26:00 MCAD, flatbeds, and editing like painting 28:00 Directing in any medium: Unreal Engine and breaking the tools 30:00 The AI intro: building a Swamp Dogg model in his bedroom 33:00 Being in a band at 40; "you should try making a podcast" 34:00 Lightning round: the gateway docs (CRUMB, AMERICAN MOVIE) 36:00 Advice: make it like a band, make it no matter what 37:00 Keeping your crew close: WINNEBAGO MAN lessons 38:00 Not film: Minneapolis, community, and standing together 39:00 Where to find Isaac and the Swamp Dogg Blu-ray
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Meet Juli Berwald—a marine biologist turned science writer and the author of an invertebrate page-turner—she's the founder of a coral-reef nonprofit in Honduras, aaaaand she's producing her first doc. Throughout our waterfront walk at Ladybird Lake Juli opens up about her adventures in science writing—how getting fired off a book project (& replaced by Elizabeth Kolbert) inspired Juli to create her own destiny and finally write her own book.
What follows is a masterclass in turning science into memoir called SPINELESS—a jellyfish book secretly structured like a jellyfish lifecycle, complete with a fever dream that sent her to Japan to find the world's biggest jellyfish (spoiler: it died right in front of her). We dig into "hiding behind the facts," the boldness it takes to put yourself on the page, and the best creative-accountability advice we've heard yet: combine a tight writing group with Elizabeth Gilbert's "take your project on a date," add in some John August-style sprints while following a roommate's admonition to "write the worst book you can—"and you're on your way.
Theres's a whole lot of science, a bunch of laughs, and some doc-stuff in this one too. THE REBEL REEF: SEEDS OF HOPE is Juli's hopeful short doc about a reef to remember and divemaster Christian Carias, whose own healing becomes the heart of the film. Plus composer Chad Cannon (AMERICAN FACTORY, JOIN OR DIE), a $100K biobank dream, and perhaps an answer to the question of "how do you get to Symphony Space?"
Also: An entire taxonomy of recumbent coots; shoutout to a Charles and Ray Eames numerically inspired mid-century film; and the official-yet-disputed name of a celebrated Austin footbridge. And yes—Juli already has another book on the way…
DISCUSSION LINKS:
THE REBEL REEF: SEEDS OF HOPE (2026) | POWERS OF TEN (1977) | AMERICAN FACTORY (2019) | JOIN OR DIE (2023) | WINNEBAGO MAN (2009) | SPINELESS (2017) | LIFE ON THE ROCKS (2022) | THE SHELL SEEKER (2026)
TIMESTAMPS:
00:00 High fives and meeting Juli 01:00 Marine biologist to author 02:00 A miserable Texas postdoc (subsidence vs. sinking) 04:30 Becoming a writer: Think Well's CD-ROM textbooks 06:00 Laid off, then freelancing for National Geographic 11:00 The ONE CUBIC FOOT gig—and getting fired off it 14:30 The Pfluger footbridge and Lady Bird Lake history 18:00 THE REBEL REEF preview: a hopeful documentary 19:00 "I can't write a book like that"—finding her voice 21:00 SPINELESS: jellyfish and growing a spine 23:00 Willing to get lost 25:00 "Write the worst book you can—but write it" 27:00 A fever dream sends her to Japan 28:30 Finding the giant jellyfish (it dies) 31:00 Building a book around the jellyfish lifecycle 36:00 Our hideout: duckweed, Barton Springs, cyanobacteria 38:00 The Puum Temple and possums vs. opossums 39:30 Creative accountability and the writing group 47:00 BIG MAGIC: take your project on a date 50:00 The 20-minute timer and John August's sprints 52:00 Recumbent coots and the title hunt 53:00 THE REBEL REEF: the Honduras coral story 55:00 Christian Carias and the heart of the film 58:00 Cinematography, score, and the crew 61:00 Lightning round: the gateway book (Henrietta Lacks) 63:00 Advice for emerging storytellers: practice 64:00 Carnegie Hall, Yo-Yo Ma, and a floating cello 68:00 Crediting Dayton and where to find Juli's work
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Missing episodes?
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We hit the boardwalk with Luke Korem—the Emmy-winning documentary director behind DEALT, MILLI VANILLI, and ACTION—and somewhere between a guy blasting EDM off a portable speaker and the bats under the bridge, Luke hands us a filmmaking philosophy worth bottling: it's all the same muscle. Doc, series, scripted—storytelling is storytelling, and the trick is knowing a series is a sprint and a feature is a marathon.
Luke walks us through the whole arc: his accidental first feature LORD MONTAGU (a chairman, a castle, fifty grand, and four guys who'd never made a film), the SXSW-winning DEALT about blind card magician Richard Turner, and how the real story is never the hook—when it comes to DEALT, it's a man learning to embrace his weakness. We get the gospel of "no control" (the studio that passed on MILLI VANILLI, then came begging six months later), why he prays his way through the gambles, and why AI makes real human stories more valuable, not less.
Then Ben hijacks his own podcast with the greatest one-that-got-away in doc history: the time he tried to con conman Frédéric Bourdin—subject of THE IMPOSTER — into a movie, got double-crossed, taunted by a Photoshopped postcard from the French Riviera… and learned years later the postcard was forged by his own friend in Paris. Luke's verdict: cut that out and make it its own episode.
Plus: Luke's mom's catering empire, his magician dad, the gateway drug of renting EDTV, and plenty of advice from a man with zero social media.
DISCUSSION LINKS:
LORD MONTAGU (2013) | DEALT (2017) | ACTION (2019) | THE NEW YORK TIMES PRESENTS (2020) | MILLI VANILLI (2023) | WINNEBAGO MAN (2009) | THE IMPOSTER (2012) | CHOP & STEELE (2022) | HIGH HOPES (2023) | CHEER (2020) | LAST CHANCE U (2016) | EDTV (1999) | FIELD OF DREAMS (1989) | THE KARATE KID (1984) | ANGELS IN THE OUTFIELD (1994) | JURASSIC PARK (1993) | WHAT MAKES SAMMY RUN (1941)
TIMESTAMPS:
00:00 Two reluctant "documentary influencers" 01:00 Meet Luke — DEALT, the SXSW win & Richard Turner 01:40 LORD MONTAGU — the castle, the chairman, the first feature 03:00 ACTION, MILLI VANILLI & the NYT Presents Emmy 04:30 Texas A&M, no film school & the high-school broadcast suspensions 07:00 Doing anything for money → the uncle in the castle 08:00 Delegating your way to "all I do is direct" 09:20 On the bridge — the dancing guy with the speaker 10:30 Curiosity as the filmmaker's engine 12:00 Being authentic vs. taking the wrong job 14:30 Starting Keep On Running & selling a vision 15:30 Mom's catering empire, dad the author & magician 18:00 Every film is its own little startup 19:40 "It's the same muscle" — doc, series, scripted 22:00 Greg Whiteley's cold-call advice; sprint vs. marathon 26:00 Keeping gas in the tank; rich people making docs 29:00 Prayer, the spiritual side & character-driven stories 31:00 The hook is not the story — embracing weakness 34:00 Are your docs about you? MILLI VANILLI's real subject 36:00 The MILLI VANILLI origin & chasing Fab Morvan 40:00 Pitching & the brutal greenlight ratios 42:30 "No control" — the studio that passed, then begged 46:00 AI vs. the value of real human stories 48:00 Ben's THE IMPOSTER saga — buying Bourdin's life rights 51:30 The double-cross & the cease-and-desists 53:00 The postcard from the French Riviera 56:00 The one that got away 57:30 The twist — the postcard was forged by a friend 1:01:30 Stolen ideas & trusting no one in Hollywood 1:02:00 WHAT MAKES SAMMY RUN 1:03:30 Lightning round — EDTV, FIELD OF DREAMS, Spielberg 1:06:30 The thing he can't stop thinking about — will the show sell? 1:07:00 Where to find his work; no socials, just the Aggies
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Barlow Jacobs says: Walk to the Next Block.. easy to say when you're sitting there, not-walking on DocWalks. It's day three of the AFS Doc Intensive, and we close out our run in the room for a sit-down with actor-turned-documentarian Barlow Jacobs—a guy we've been hearing about for 20 years ever since he burst out of Sundance with LOW AND BEHOLD in 2007. Barlow brings his doc-debut, THE VOYAGE OUT to Austin for Doc Days. Shot on 16mm, fully off-grid, on a nine-day elk hunt deep in the mountains—the gear hauled in on pack goats, lenses wrapped in towels inside Igloo coolers because the Pelican cases wouldn't fit, this is a unique production setup for a unique doc, and all that extra work really pays off—every frame looks like an oil painting.
Keith's on the hunt for answers, but Barlow's quick to point out that THE VOYAGE OUT isn't a hunting film. It's a reckoning with mortality, kicked off by a 2009 brain tumor and later, a head-on collision with a dump truck, two life changing events that had Barlow questioning his own relationship to life & death. Barlow finds answers thanks to his film's three leads: hunting guide Marc Warnke (Bruce Willis meets John Wayne with a philosophy degree), off-grid survivalist Callie Russell (you might've seen her on ALONE), and fellow seeker Mansal Denton. We dig into the technical insanity—film canisters kept warm in a teepee, a rain-soaked tent, a lab calling in a panic about celluloid that smelled like smoke—and then there's the executive producers who showed up with support, including Chris & Eleanor Columbus's Maiden Voyage Pictures, Ley Line, and Sons of Rigor Films. All indie filmmaking is a roll of the dice, but Barlow owes a special thanks to the pro gambler whose $2-million poker win came through just in time to float the shoot.
He may be a first-time doc director, but Barlow's a festival and indie vet, and he's flipping the script on distribution. And this is where we can all take notes: how he's self-releasing to 75 theaters next year, building an audience of hunters (and bespoke butcher-shops) and why he wishes he'd planned for all of this before shooting a single frame. Plus, Keith namedrops Jeff Nichols and Toby Halbrooks; Barlow shares a gateway-doc run through Adam Curtis, GREY GARDENS, GIMME SHELTER, and Frederick Wiseman—and a reminder that filmmaking is completed one step at a time. So, when it all starts to fall apart, just walk to the next block.
DISCUSSION LINKS:
THE VOYAGE OUT (2025) | LOW AND BEHOLD (2007) | THE LIGHTHOUSE (2019) | EVERYTHING EVERYWHERE ALL AT ONCE (2022) | THE BIG SHORT (2015) | McCABE & MRS. MILLER (1971) | HOME ALONE (1990) | HARRY POTTER AND THE SORCERER'S STONE (2001) | BUCKS HARBOR (2026) | GREY GARDENS (1975) | GIMME SHELTER (1970) | TITICUT FOLLIES (1967) | EX LIBRIS: THE NEW YORK PUBLIC LIBRARY (2017) | VERNON, FLORIDA (1981) | HYPERNORMALISATION (2016) | CAN'T GET YOU OUT OF MY HEAD (2021) | RUSSIA 1985–1999: TRAUMAZONE (2022) | ALONE (2015)
TIMESTAMPS:
00:00 Day three of the AFS Doc Intensive 01:00 Barlow Jacobs: 20 years of near-misses and LOW AND BEHOLD at Sundance 02:00 THE VOYAGE OUT premieres tomorrow, shot on 16mm 02:30 The origin: a brain tumor, a dump truck, and mortality 05:00 Finding the hunt: Mansal Denton, Marc Warnke, and the pack goats 06:30 Callie Russell joins; everyone has a relationship with death 07:30 The goats, the fire, and the film's real subject 09:00 Six months of prep and the tech scout 11:00 Why shoot a documentary on film 11:30 Hauling gear on goats: Igloo coolers and Old Fast Glass 13:00 A linear hunt, formalistic language, planning every scenario 15:00 Working with the subjects without impeding the hunt 16:30 Gems pulled from the field audio 17:00 The only-way-to-do-it setup; feels like a million bucks 18:30 Film canisters, 12-degree nights, the rained-on tent 19:30 The Polish AC and "it's gonna have to take a bath" 20:30 Colorlab panics: everything smells like smoke 21:00 The executive producers: Columbus, Ley Line, Sons of Rigor 22:00 The $2-million poker win that funded the shoot 23:00 COVID delay and finding the film in the footage 24:00 Nature as a character; the sound-design second unit 25:00 Bringing fiction technique to nonfiction 26:30 The hunt as a built-in three-act structure 27:00 '70s docs, Altman, and McCABE & MRS. MILLER's grain 28:30 An instructional film: Marc as teacher 29:00 Did Barlow grow up hunting? Sustainability and connection 30:00 COVID, mortality, and the questions the film asks 31:00 Distribution: the indie landscape is constricting 32:00 The plan: 50–75 theaters, self-release, March 2027 34:00 Know your audience: 15 million hunters, butcher shops 36:00 Mailing lists, Callie and Marc's followings, Kinema 38:00 Why the real work begins after the premiere 40:00 Holding the audience for the next film 41:00 Marshaling the forces; a paradigm shift 42:00 Gateway docs: Adam Curtis, GREY GARDENS, GIMME SHELTER 43:00 Frederick Wiseman, TITICUT FOLLIES, VERNON FLORIDA, BUCKS HARBOR 44:30 Advice to emerging filmmakers: walk to the next block 47:00 A question worth dying for 47:30 Next week: Luke Korem and DEALT
YOUTUBE TAGS:
Barlow Jacobs, The Voyage Out, Doc Walks, documentary filmmaking, Austin Film Society, AFS Doc Intensive, 16mm film, elk hunting documentary, Marc Warnke, Callie Russell, Mansal Denton, Chris Columbus, Ley Line Entertainment, Adam Curtis, Frederick Wiseman, independent film distribution, shooting on film, Ben Steinbauer, Keith Maitland, mortality documentary
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Alisa Payne cannot be stopped… certainly not by a little rain. When the downpour chases us indoors, we're lucky enough to post up in a cozy podcast studio at Austin Public—the public-access station where, Alex Jones got his start—and the home to the Austin Film Society Documentary Intensive, where the Oscar-nominated producer is serving as a mentor. You may know Alisa as the producer behind Geeta Gandbhir's body-cam-footage based, 'Stand Your Ground' Netflix doc THE PERFECT NEIGHBOR. But it's just one (important) stop of a dynamic career that took "20 years to be an overnight success."
Flashback to the late 90s when young Alisa, a recent biochem grad quit the lab to chase Queen Latifah, presenting 500 petitions that convinced one queen to hire another. From that point on it's been nonstop. Alisa made her name as a producer, showrunner, and a production company co-founder known for her focus on pushing the documentary form. Check out STAMPED FROM THE BEGINNING with Roger Ross Williams (that wasn't exactly THE MANDALORIAN); BETWEEN THE WORLD AND ME, an ambitious production at the terrifying height of COVID; and KATRINA: COME HELL AND HIGH WATER with Spike Lee, Samantha Knowles and future business partner, Sam Pollard.
Alisa makes the case for the producer as "chief emotions officer"—and her role as the parent of everyone in the credits. What does that mean? Shielding directors from notes, restoring the historical record when journalism can't be trusted, and making film more equitable in front of and behind the camera—those are just some of her responsibilities.
This one's full of energetic wisdom and stories of production mishaps and their solutions, including: a tension-building bodega showdown over some purloined PPE fronted by one tough producer on a mission, because Alisa Payne will not be stopped!
Plus, we take a swing through the AFS Doc Intensive and meet the fellows and mentors that Alisa and Keith have been Intensive-ing with; And Alisa shares her passion for Brooklyn birding & identifying birdsong. Ben's not quite there yet, but Keith's happy to bird-up the podcast any chance he gets.
DISCUSSION LINKS:
TRUE STORIES (1986) | WHEN THE LEVEES BROKE (2006) | THE MANDALORIAN (2019) | BETWEEN THE WORLD AND ME (2020) | DEAR MR. BRODY (2022) | STAMPED FROM THE BEGINNING (2023) | KATRINA: COME HELL AND HIGH WATER (2025) | LISTERS: A GLIMPSE INTO EXTREME BIRDWATCHING (2025) | THE PERFECT NEIGHBOR (2025) | WHO MOVES AMERICA (2026) | UNTITLED FLACO DOCUMENTARY (TBD)
TIMESTAMPS:
00:00 No jumping right in: banter and transactional meetings 02:00 Rainy day, no walk: Brooklyn birds, FLACO, and the Merlin app 03:30 Two dipshits talking about birds (the pilot that wasn't) 04:30 Meet Alisa Payne + a tour of Austin Public 05:30 Inside the AFS Doc Intensive: four projects, the mentors 07:00 Studio two and the Alex Jones lore 08:00 Shooting DEAR MR. BRODY eight blocks from home 09:00 STAMPED FROM THE BEGINNING and the Mandalorian dream 10:30 COVID, a snowstorm, and the ceiling that caved in 11:30 "It wasn't the Mandalorian" 12:00 THE PERFECT NEIGHBOR: Oscar nod, Sundance, Stand Your Ground 14:00 Pushing the form with body-cam footage 15:00 Biochemistry to film: chasing Queen Latifah 17:30 500 petitions and getting hired 19:00 Wear black on set / "keep wearing your colors" 21:00 First doc: Harlem gentrification and Mart 125 22:30 BETWEEN THE WORLD AND ME: showrunning at COVID's peak 26:00 Edit drives in the mailbox at 5 a.m. 27:00 Brooklyn Tech floor plans for HBO 31:00 Hazmat on a Harlem walk-up — and the PPE heist 33:30 "You remind me of my mother" 35:00 Producing as mothering: the chief emotions officer 37:00 The director–producer partnership 39:00 The notes she never passes along 40:00 Her fingerprints: the PERFECT NEIGHBOR drone shot 41:00 KATRINA: COME HELL AND HIGH WATER and holding the POV 43:00 A seat at the table: restoring the historical record 45:00 Lightning round: WHEN THE LEVEES BROKE as the gateway 47:00 Advice for emerging filmmakers: be yourself 48:00 Back in the room: Doc Days, Holly Herrick, and the cohort
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We duck inside for the first time ever — into the Blanton Museum of Art, because it's pouring in Austin and Pete Muller had the brilliant idea to bring our show into a gallery. Pete is the National Geographic photographer behind BUCKS HARBOR, his five-years-in-the-making debut feature about lobster fishermen in Downeast Maine, premiering at Berlinale and playing Doc Days at the Austin Film Society.
We wander past Jacob Lawrence and Andrew Wyeth and Jerry Bywaters' OIL FIELD GIRLS while Pete walks us through the family that made him: his grandfather Leon Kelly (one of the pioneers of American surrealism), his art-conservator father (who once paid him to spit into a beaker so he could clean centuries-old paintings), and the paternity bombshell in his twenties that preceded his career embedded in conflict zones in Africa and the Middle East.
We dig into BUCKS HARBOR's sea critter metaphors, the editor Noel Paul who shaped hundreds of hours with a special structure, the Hiss Golden Messenger song that lands just as it's needed, and Pete's gentle insistence that "fly on the wall" is a lie — the camera is always doing something. Plus: the most admissible form of male feeling and why art belongs to everyone (no whispering required).DISCUSSION LINKS:
BUCKS HARBOR (2026) | THE FEARLESS FREAKS (2005) | BOMBAY BEACH (2011)
TIMESTAMPS:
00:00 Whispering into the Blanton — our first indoor episode 01:00 Jacob Lawrence and the Great Migration 03:00 Andrew Wyeth's SEA LEGS, painting the same people for decades 06:00 Pete's grandfather Leon Kelly — American surrealism 08:00 Crescent Fellowship, Paris 1925, André Breton 11:00 Why Pete won't call himself an artist 13:00 Mom the nighttime newspaper photographer in Lynn, MA 14:00 Dad the art conservator (and the beaker of spit) 17:00 Making art about practical, rough-and-tumble people 20:00 Thomas Hart Benton, folk + high-brow, painting on board 25:00 OIL FIELD GIRLS by Jerry Bywaters 28:00 How BUCKS HARBOR began — five years in Downeast Maine 29:00 The paternity reveal that sent Pete chasing masculinity 32:00 Cross-cultural masculinity from Sudan to New England 34:00 Anger as the only admissible male feeling 38:00 Dave's teeth, Mark's drag — lobsters molt, men molt 42:00 Mark the lobster-trap-maker as 50,000-follower TikTok star 45:00 Bill Viola, Alice Neel, Deborah Roberts 50:00 Editor Noel Paul, hundreds of hours, four-and-a-half years filming 53:00 Nathan Golden on cinematography, a shared visual language 55:00 What does "directing" a documentary even mean 58:00 Why "fly on the wall" is a lie 01:02 Festival run: Berlinale → True/False → Doc Days → Margaret Mead → Seattle 01:03 Score by Nikolai Hess + Hiss Golden Messenger end credits 01:06 Bombay Beach as inspiration 01:07 Advice: keep it cheap and close
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Ben walks Glassell Park in L.A. with Bradley Jackson—screenwriter, novelist, and the documentary writer/producer behind FACING NOLAN, DEALT, MILLI VANILLI, and the Showtime sports-betting docuseries ACTION. Bradley leads Ben up his neighborhood hill as he details exactly how he ended up in a "premium economy" English castle filming a bisexual British aristocrat for his very first doc—and why he never left doc-making behind.
Bradley lays out his role as creative-producer in his partnerships with director (& future DocWalks guest) Luke Korem. We dig into doc storytelling and why structure is the only lever a doc filmmaker really controls. And he shares some b.t.s. on what it took to inspire Nolan Ryan's family to trust him with the Hall of Famer's legacy. Ben's in heaven with all this baseball talk—Bradley's got a take on Pete Rose, and we learn why a fastball that "rises" is the most American story ever told.
A teamplayer at heart, Bradley admits he's a B-minus alone, but an A-plus with collaborators—a working theory he applies to writing partners, doc partners, and the kid-juggling-bills life of a working filmmaker post-pandemic. He explains the L.A. before/after split (zero in-person meetings in a year), how he wrote his INTRAMURAL screenplay at 6:45 a.m. before clocking in at a Texas edtech job, and why your first draft is always the scrambling of a madman.
Plus: REQUIEM FOR A DREAM as a deeply unexpected gateway drug for a guy who writes comedies and baseball docs, Bill Hader as a too-intimidating dream collaborator, and Mike Schur as the better-looking, more successful 4.0 version of himself. This one's a walk-and-talk for filmmakers who juggle, rewrite, and trust that life is funnier than anything they could make up.
DISCUSSION LINKS:
REQUIEM FOR A DREAM (2000) | WINNEBAGO MAN (2010) | INTRAMURAL (2014) | DEALT (2017) | BARRY (2018) | ACTION (2019) | THE LAST DANCE (2020) | FACING NOLAN (2022) | MILLI VANILLI (2023) | MEGALOPOLIS (2024) | MEGADOC (2025)
TIMESTAMPS:
00:00 Glassell Park walk and stepping into the future 00:35 The finer Steiner: Ben's sister and Compass Learning 01:30 WINNEBAGO MAN at the Alamo Drafthouse standby line 04:30 Screenwriter, novelist, or filmmaker? 06:30 First doc gig: a London castle and a British aristocrat 08:30 "Don't belong here" as a feature, not a bug 09:30 Randy Johnson, the Big Unit, and the Mariana Trench 10:10 Griffith Park, the observatory, and the ridge 12:00 Story structure is the doc filmmaker's only lever 14:30 From creative producer to director 15:30 Central characters and intoxicating worlds 18:30 DEALT, the blind magician, and the knife-throwing dog 21:30 FACING NOLAN: who's my Texas Michael Jordan? 29:30 The plumber-pitcher pipeline to Nolan's family 33:00 13 months from first day of shooting to picture-lock 37:00 Pete Rose, the 4,000th hit, and the pre-interview cram 38:30 The fastball that "rises" and a 27-season anomaly 40:30 Failure as the working filmmaker's baseline 41:30 Why Bradley is B-minus alone, A-plus with partners 43:00 INTRAMURAL, Kate McKinnon, and Austin to LA 43:30 Pandemic split and the death of the in-person LA meeting 46:30 Lightning round: REQUIEM FOR A DREAM as a gateway drug 48:00 Advice: write every day, draft 14 is the real draft 50:30 The thing he can't stop thinking about: a new baby 51:30 MEGALOPOLIS, MEGADOC, and Coppola yarns 52:30 Dream collaborator: Duplass Brothers, Bill Hader, Mike Schur 54:30 Where to watch FACING NOLAN and MILLI VANILLI
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Let's get into the tragic side of comedy with documentarian, comedian, and Academy Award–nominated screenwriter Jena Friedman. The BORAT SUBSEQUENT MOVIEFILM co-writer is in town for the Moontower Comedy Festival to perform her hour-long stand-up about her mother's death. Two minutes in and we're deep into the grief, as the former DAILY SHOW correspondent talks about editing her own SundanceTV true-crime show, while pregnant, and dealing with her mother's illness and death.
Jena and Keith have something in common—Keith lost his father 25 years ago—and she asks probing questions about his relationship with his dad, before and after his passing. She describes how her mom became her biggest career champion right when work was busiest, why grief comedy is "exposure therapy," and how a half-page Austin Chronicle headline once dubbed her THE MUSE OF MEDIOCRITY. (Her counter: "Mediocrity is my muse.") We dig into INDEFENSIBLE, her two-season SundanceTV true-crime show that nobody really wanted made, and Adult Swim's SOFT FOCUS WITH JENA FRIEDMAN, where she disarmed John McAfee in his own living room.
Jena makes the case for bad art in the AI era: if your work isn't optimizable enough for the robots to scrape, then you're free. We talk THE REHEARSAL, the crepe myrtle as paint-by-numbers tree, why DocWalks badly needs a drone sponsorship, and how "improv was my rosebud". We squeeze a whole lot into this rambling, lakeside chat then grab a cortado at Revolution Coffee before Jena heads to the Paramount Theatre to perform. Then it's back to work on her EPSTEIN FILES BOOK CLUB podcast and heading home to her son.
Plus: Letterman in 2011, Keith wielding two cams, how criticism can feel like a hug from mom, our shared affection for Kahane Corn Cooperman, and the power of pennies that show up exactly when you need them.
DISCUSSION LINKS:
NOT FUNNY (2023) | SOFT FOCUS WITH JENA FRIEDMAN (2018) | INDEFENSIBLE (2021) | BORAT SUBSEQUENT MOVIEFILM (2020) | THE REHEARSAL (2022) | WEEKEND AT BERNIE'S (1989) | EPSTEIN FILES BOOK CLUB (2026) | THE JOKES AI WON'T TELL - TED TALK (2025)
TIMESTAMPS:
00:00 Intro and Moontower setup 01:00 Crossing at Fifth & Trinity — who is Jena Friedman? 03:00 NOT FUNNY: an hour about losing her mom 06:00 SOFT FOCUS, John McAfee, allegedly dead 08:00 The 180-degree rule (we don't care) 10:00 Lady Bird Lake, rowing pheromones 12:00 Improv as the gateway drug 13:00 EPSTEIN FILES BOOK CLUB podcast 14:00 The crepe myrtle as paint-by-numbers 17:00 Six weeks, third trimester, the worst show 21:00 Keith's dad, 25 years gone 23:00 Pennies on the ground 26:00 Coffee break, lightning round 27:00 The BORAT NDA + Pregnancy Crisis Center 30:00 Bad art is the future 33:00 Letterman 2011 was already dead inside 34:00 INDEFENSIBLE on Sundance TV 36:00 The Daily Show as film school 38:00 Tonight at the Paramount, comments as hugs
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We walk South by Southwest with director Bryan Storkel—HOLY ROLLERS, THE LEGEND OF COCAINE ISLAND, THE PEZ OUTLAW, ALABAMA SNAKE—in town to premiere I GOT BOMBED AT HARVEY'S, his new feature about the man who built a thousand-pound bomb and walked it into a Lake Tahoe casino in 1980. Keith's on vacation, so it's just Ben and Bryan, two directors aiming cameras at each other ("this is like a Beastie Boys video"). Ben's catcher finger is wrecked from yesterday's Sandlot game. Bryan's been on a pickleball tear in LA.
We dig into how Bryan keeps making so many films—a Ken Griffey Jr. doc that fell apart the night before his first interview with Sir Mix-A-Lot, the AMC anthology TRUE CRIME STORY: SMUGSHOT (umbrella: "crimes of entitlement"), and a Hulk Hogan series now released to acclaim for Netflix. We trace his exodus from Oral Roberts University through HOLY ROLLERS (card-counting Christian pastors), FIGHT CHURCH (cage-fighting pastors), and ALABAMA SNAKE (the Pentecostal who tried to kill his wife with a rattlesnake)—each film quietly walking him further out of the faith he grew up in.
The reenactment talk is the heart of it. Bryan walks us through the COCAINE ISLAND / PEZ OUTLAW method—cast the actual subject in their own reenactments, build a scripted-feeling rough cut from a documentary edit, then shoot the recreations like a narrative. The secret: be terrified the whole time it'll be cheesy. "That terror is the thing that makes it good." HARVEY'S, he tells us, snuck up on him as a father-son story underneath the heist.
Plus: an annual dog-on-a-table photoshoot ambushes the walk, the empathy-machine theory of documentary, and why every prolific filmmaker should learn to edit first.
DISCUSSION LINKS:
AMERICAN MOVIE (1999) | OKIE NOODLING (2001) | HOME MOVIE (2001) | SUMMERCAMP! (2006) | WINNEBAGO MAN (2009) | HOLY ROLLERS (2011) | LITTLE HOPE WAS ARSON (2013) | FIGHT CHURCH (2014) | THE BATTERED BASTARDS OF BASEBALL (2014) | NOBODY SPEAK: TRIALS OF THE FREE PRESS (2017) | CASTING JONBENET (2017) | THE LEGEND OF COCAINE ISLAND (2018) | ALABAMA SNAKE (2020) | THE PEZ OUTLAW (2022) | THE SAINT OF SECOND CHANCES (2023) | DICKWEED (2024) | I GOT BOMBED AT HARVEY'S (2026)
TIMESTAMPS:
00:00 Cold open — two directors, one Sandlot finger 01:00 The Ken Griffey Jr. doc that fell through 02:00 THE BATTERED BASTARDS OF BASEBALL & THE SAINT OF SECOND CHANCES 04:00 Solo walk intro — Keith's on vacation 04:30 Premiering I GOT BOMBED AT HARVEY'S at SXSW 06:00 Theo Love, Amy Bandlien Storkel, and the long road to a feature 09:00 Why Bryan is so prolific — SMUGSHOT, Hulk Hogan, FLORIDA MAN 11:00 Sidestilt — the Norwegian word for juxtapose 13:30 Born in Seattle, Oral Roberts in Tulsa 14:30 First docs: HOLY ROLLERS, FIGHT CHURCH, LITTLE HOPE WAS ARSON 17:00 ALABAMA SNAKE and the exit from Christianity 19:00 Documentary as empathy machine 20:30 Hulk Hogan — separating Terry from the performer 22:00 The unreleased Kid Rock doc 26:30 Zilker Park, Barton Springs, the Austin pitch 28:00 The HARVEY'S premiere and the "kitschy" review 29:00 Reenactments — terror as creative engine 31:00 Casting the real subjects (Steve Glew, Cocaine Island) 33:30 An annual dog-on-a-table photoshoot 36:00 Steve Glew's beard test, hotel hallway, duffel of Pez 37:30 The CASTING JONBENET trick on a Smugshot episode 40:00 HARVEY'S as a father-son story 42:00 Lightning round — gateway docs at SXSW 44:00 Best advice: learn to edit 45:30 Pickleball, two teenage daughters
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We mark 50 walks with business partner, co-conspirator, and professor of things cinematic—Berndt Mader, co-founder of The Bear and Ben's filmmaking better-half of nineteen years. Lady Bird Lake, placid gray spring weather, and Berndt tracing his arc from sandbag-slinging grip on David Gordon Green's GEORGE WASHINGTON to Austin's hybrid-film provocateur.
The main event: the $2M Kid Rock documentary that was, until it wasn't. Berndt pulled Ben past "no way" and into Nashville, where Danny McBride's blessing got them into Bob Ritchie's house weeks before COVID locked everything down. Katie Steinbauer sewed a mask, Berndt drove up anyway, and they captured an apology scene where an aging rockstar says he's going to "try to sneak into heaven." Then June 2022 happened—a homophobic slur went viral, Roughhouse evacuated, Live Nation grabbed the hard drives, and MY NAME IS KID became a film that will never see daylight.
We get into the art of directing real people through fake scenarios with BOOGER RED, Berndt's CLOSE-UP-inspired hybrid adaptation of Mike Hall's Texas Monthly exposé of the Mineola case, and how that story got a second life as the HBO docuseries HOW TO CREATE A SEX SCANDAL. Plus Werner Herzog impressions, the Pete Best of The Bear, a Richard Linklater dream collaboration, and the thesis statement for episode 50: "We follow the heartbreak."
DISCUSSION LINKS:
GEORGE WASHINGTON (2000) | BOOGER RED (2015) | HOW TO CREATE A SEX SCANDAL (2023) | CHOP & STEELE (2022) | CLOSE-UP (1990) | THE THIN BLUE LINE (1988) | COCKSUCKER BLUES (1972) | SUPERSTAR: THE KAREN CARPENTER STORY (1987) | A POEM IS A NAKED PERSON (1974) | WERNER HERZOG EATS HIS SHOE (1988) | APOCALYPSE NOW (1979) | 2001: A SPACE ODYSSEY (1968) | MAKING A MURDERER (2015) | EASTBOUND & DOWN (2009) | THE RIGHTEOUS GEMSTONES (2019)
TIMESTAMPS:
00:00 50 episodes deep with Berndt Mader 02:00 Naming The Bear (before the TV show) 05:00 19 years of the production company 06:00 Richardson origins and the George Washington swing grip 10:00 UT Austin RTF and the accidental production company 15:00 The movie about the Kid Rock doc 17:00 $2M Live Nation budget, Roughhouse, Danny McBride 20:00 First impressions of Bob Ritchie 24:00 Filming during COVID with Katie's handmade mask 30:00 Co-directing divisions and the General Lee 34:00 Super Bowl scene and the Biden victory apology 39:00 Sundance dreams and the homophobic slur 43:00 Live Nation takes the hard drives 47:00 Booger Red and Kiarostami's Close-Up 52:00 The HBO docuseries How to Create a Sex Scandal 58:00 Lightning round: Thin Blue Line, Apocalypse Now, 2001 61:00 Werner Herzog impression and initiative makes films 63:00 Richard Linklater dream collab and signing off
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Kansas City here we come! Well, just Ben this time, revisiting old haunts along the Tomahawk Creek trail with Sharon Liese—Emmy-winning director of THE FLAGMAKERS and TRANSHOOD. Sharon proves you don't need an LA zip code to premiere at Sundance—her new feature SEIZED—a nuanced, complicated portrait of what happened when police raided a small-town Kansas newspaper—was a must-see at Park City this January. A film about justice and freedom of expression is a pressing tale today and Sharon walks us through the messy reality of telling a story where nobody's quite the hero you expect. We dig into the two-and-a-half year journey of making the film, the year it took to get suspicious small-towners to open up, and the 98-year-old newspaper co-owner whose defiant attitude captured on police body cam footage will absolutely wreck you.
The serendipity is real: mid-walk, we stumble onto gnome houses on the trail—a callback to Sharon's gorgeous short THE GNOMIST, which was filmed on this very path. We trace her origin story from a Kansas marketing gig to following 12 girls through high school for HIGH SCHOOL CONFIDENTIAL, getting an agent by name-dropping an RJ Cutler meeting, and the fateful Facebook message that led to Ben & Sharon working together on PINK COLLAR CRIMES. Sharon opens up about TRANSHOOD, following four trans kids for five years on HBO, and the devastating new Kansas legislation that just dropped overnight.
The conversation turns to the state of an industry where good storytelling is getting squeezed from every direction and Ben gets real about his eight-year Onion documentary saga. But the vibe stays warm—Sharon's grandkids just moved to KC, the crowded table she always dreamed of is full, and MAD HOT BALLROOM is confirmed as a gateway drug film that changed Sharon's life. Plus: the parents who thought they'd get a VHS tape and ended up on national TV.
DISCUSSION LINKS:
SEIZED (2026) | THE GNOMIST (2015) | TRANSHOOD (2020) | THE FLAGMAKERS (2022) | HIGH SCHOOL CONFIDENTIAL (2008) | PINK COLLAR CRIMES (2018) | MAD HOT BALLROOM (2005) | WINNEBAGO MAN (2009) | COME SEE ME IN THE GOOD LIGHT (2025)
TIMESTAMPS:
00:00 Introduction and Kansas City arrival 01:00 Meeting Sharon Liese and SEIZED at Sundance 03:00 The Marion, Kansas newspaper raid 05:00 The other side of the story 08:00 Gaining trust in a small town 10:00 Paul and the family filmmaking team 11:00 Walking Tomahawk Creek in Leawood 12:00 Making films where you live 15:00 Driving to Marion the day Joanne died 17:00 Navigating high-profile partnerships 18:00 How we met on PINK COLLAR CRIMES 20:00 Stumbling onto gnome houses and THE GNOMIST 22:00 TRANSHOOD and following four kids for five years 24:00 Kansas trans legislation 25:00 Sharon's origin story and HIGH SCHOOL CONFIDENTIAL 28:00 Getting an agent and the RJ Cutler name-drop 29:00 Ben's Onion documentary white whale 34:00 Grandkids, the crowded table, and family 36:00 THE FLAGMAKERS and the road to an Oscar shortlist 40:00 Documentary curiosity and the trust fall 41:00 The state of the industry 44:00 Lightning round and MAD HOT BALLROOM 47:00 What Sharon can't stop thinking about 49:00 Where to find Sharon and upcoming festivals
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Let's talk about MANHOOD—specifically, Daniel Lombroso's startling new doc about the growing world (haha) of penis girth enhancement. You heard that right. This is the penis injection movie that SXSW audiences (& DocWalks guests) won't stop talking about. At 33 years old, the Brooklyn-based Lombroso considers himself to be "criminally open minded" (his words, then immediately walked back), and the kind of filmmaker who waits seven months in a D.C. parking lot to get one lunch meeting. He's done it before. With WHITE NOISE, his 2020 alt-right portrait, he embedded with Lauren Southern, Mike Cernovich, and Richard Spencer for years, as a Jewish grandson of two Holocaust survivors. With NINA & IRENA, his New Yorker short, he hovered around Errol Morris until Errol called him back: "Daniel, your grandmother's a fucking incredible character."
We dig into MANHOOD start to finish: the Dallas entrepreneur trying to make girth injections as common as Botox, the OnlyFans model who got botched and bared everything anyway, and the standup-dad of five whose reckless choices break our hearts. Daniel maps the access game—turns out women and queer execs got the pitch instantly, while straight guys at the top kept killing the deals—his journalism roots at The Atlantic and The New Yorker, the Sheila Nevins stamp of approval at 87, and how Penny Lane and World of Wonder rallied around him when he was unemployed, depressed, and flying Spirit Airlines back to Dallas to film alone.
He's funny about his Republican father calling MANHOOD "a beautiful commentary on modern America." But he's serious about the male loneliness epidemic, the manosphere, and the smartphone-induced inadequacy that pushes men to spend their savings on the one thing they don't need more of.
Plus: how to bother Errol Morris in a parking lot, the lightning-round answer that made us laugh—"give yourself reps"—and a brief detour through 2 Girls 1 Cup we did not see coming.
Discussion LinksMANHOOD (2026) | WHITE NOISE (2020) | NINA & IRENA (2023) | HAIL SATAN? (2019) | LISTENING TO KENNY G (2021) | CONFESSIONS OF A GOOD SAMARITAN (2023) | THE FOG OF WAR (2003) | GATES OF HEAVEN (1978) | RAISING ARIZONA (1987) | WINNEBAGO MAN (2009)
Timestamps00:00 Two girls, one cup, and a high five 02:31 Meet Daniel and MANHOOD 03:34 Inside the girth enhancement boom 06:36 Daniel's Republican dad weighs in 10:12 Why straight execs kept killing the deal 11:19 33 and prolific 12:00 WHITE NOISE and the alt-right embed 13:02 Self-taught from age 14 14:10 Bothering Errol Morris in a parking lot 17:12 Meeting Penny Lane at Big Sky 20:19 From journalism to documentary in Istanbul 24:28 The access question 25:44 "Criminally open minded" 26:21 Lauren Southern's seven-month chase 30:23 Cernovich, Spencer, and the contradictions 32:33 The Kid Rock movie that fell apart 34:37 Meeting Bill, David, and Ruben 38:50 The throuple twist 40:30 David's reconstructive journey 42:11 World of Wonder breaks David open 44:13 The smartphone inadequacy machine 47:51 Ruben and the male loneliness epidemic 52:53 Lightning round 53:38 How Sheila Nevins came aboard 57:39 Give yourself reps 58:53 What keeps Daniel up at night 01:01:34 Where to find MANHOOD 01:02:27 The state of documentary 01:04:10 Sharon Liese is up next
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This is one packed parking lot full of filmmakers! Why? Because it's SXSW—and time once again for Austin Film Society's annual party. And we're throwing you right into the thick of it, to connect with both visiting and local doc-makers making the scene, We kick it all off with the cutest damn Willie Nelson cameo you can imagine… no not the nonagenarian multi-hyphenate hero, but a baby goat named for the GOAT. Follow that with a controversial AI take from our old pal Bart Weiss, and this hometown shindig is off to a typically "weird" Austin start.
Inside the party, we link up with Bianca Giaever and Ora de Kornfeld, the directors behind STALIN BOYS—a comedy doc about middle school boys in Marathon, TX who are deeply, unapologetically obsessed with Joseph Stalin. Their short took two awards at the fest and is heating up the circuit on its way to NY Times Op-Docs. We connect with Dallas drone-ster Monika Watkins, an alum of the AFS Doc Intensive. She has a lot to say about overcoming grief through vulnerability and making art—with updates on her animated short DABNEY, and intro'ing a new project: LOVE MO'. We finally meet Bradley Jackson, whose narrative feature STAGES is premiering here with Austin musician David Ramirez in the lead. Then our intrepid co-producer Dayton Thompson makes his on-camera debut and bumps into Bev Chukwu, who drops the line of the night—"Life is one big circle."
Quick shots of Sarah-Ann Mockbee, Amy Bench, Chelsea Hernandez, and a dog named Buster—plus conversations with Jonathan Green, Riley Engemoen, and Samuel Diaz Fernandez round out the episode. And we close out with Sarah Kuck who offers insight into the Austin Doc Makers Club and kicking off a new chapter with the Video Consortium (so much to discuss here and a signal that we need to book Sarah for her own episode). Goats, drones, dictators, and community. SXSW at AFS… one big circle it is.
Discussion LinksSTALIN BOYS (2026) | THE GRANDFATHER PUZZLE (2026) | SOCIAL ANIMALS (2018) | DICK WEED (2024) | I GOT BOMBED AT HARVEY'S (2026) | THE LEGEND OF COCAINE ISLAND (2018) | THE PEZ OUTLAW (2022) | STAGES (2026) | DABNEY | A FRAGILE VESSEL (2026) | FORCE FIELD OF LOVE (2026) | THELMA SAVE MY LIFE | TOWER (2016)
Timestamps00:00 Introduction - It's South by Southwest time 01:00 The lady with the baby goat named Willie Nelson 02:30 Bart Weiss on AI film festivals and writing a book about the festival circuit 06:00 Entering the AFS parking lot party 08:00 Meeting Bianca and Ora, directors of STALIN BOYS 11:00 Marathon, Texas: the smallest school you've never seen 14:00 Comedy docs and middle school obsessions with dictators 19:00 Ora's other film THE GRANDFATHER PUZZLE 21:00 Jonathan Green on SOCIAL ANIMALS, DICK WEED, and Bryan Storkel 26:00 Bryan Storkel's Hulk Hogan Netflix doc 28:00 Monika Watkins on drones, DABNEY, and AI as a creative tool 34:00 Keith and Ben on the AI delineation: tools vs. generative 35:00 Monika on losing her mom and the Love Mo series 38:00 Drone photo session with the crew 42:00 Bradley Jackson - STAGES premieres at SXSW with David Ramirez 46:00 Bradley on why South by Southwest hits different 48:00 Bradley is moving back to Austin 49:00 Samuel on A FRAGILE VESSEL - heat, love, and sci-fi horror 51:00 Party B-roll, Chelsea, and Buster the dog 53:00 Riley on FORCE FIELD OF LOVE - South Austin's dancing legends 55:00 Dayton's on-camera debut 57:00 Bev Chukwu on THELMA SAVE MY LIFE - "Life is one big circle" 59:00 Sarah Kuck on Austin Doc Makers Club and Video Consortium 01:04:00 Closing thoughts and Dayton appreciation 01:07:00 Rambler sponsor read and next episode tease
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This one is scientific! We're thrilled to take a walk on Austin's wildside with one of the hardest working Executive Producers in the doc game today. Meet Jess Harrop, executive director of Sandbox Films—the science-meets-cinema studio behind FATHOM, FIRE OF LOVE, ANDRÉ IS AN IDIOT, and a jaw-dropping slate of genre-bending docs. Jess takes a break from her SXSW responsibilities to share her journey from a biology degree and a theater background (and zero film school) to a gig associate producing NOVA and eventually launching and running one of the most exciting studios in documentary. We dig into Sandbox's origin story as a subsidiary of the Simons Foundation, the philosophy of making science films that feel like romances and thrillers and comedies, and even what it's like to give notes to Werner Herzog.
When our walk strays from the relative safety of the hike & bike trail, into a decidedly more "stabby" unexplored corner of downtown, Ben gets a little jumpy but Jess goes with the flow, an unflappable NY'er in action. We have lots of questions about her experience working with so many great directors, including the aforementioned Herzog… and she shares the Bavarian rogue's all-time great filmmaking note—"You've got to get the cowboys on the horses"—in other words: just get the story going. Jess details how Sara Dosa's FIRE OF LOVE was born from an archival gold mine and a COVID pivot. And we dig into this year's ANDRÉ IS AN IDIOT (in theaters now) and the Sundance 2026 award-winner, THE LAKE. Plus insight into: the world of mushrooms via DAUGHTERS OF THE FOREST; Jess's newest hobby (bejeweling costumes); her dream of talking to animals (not unlike the plot of Sandbox's FATHOM); and a brief mention of time spent working with Bill Nye the Science Guy.
Discussion Links:
ENCOUNTERS AT THE END OF THE WORLD (2007) | HUMAN NATURE (2020) | FIREBALL: VISITORS FROM DARKER WORLDS (2020) | FATHOM (2021) | ALL LIGHT, EVERYWHERE (2021) | FIRE OF LOVE (2022) | ANDRÉ IS AN IDIOT (2025) | THE LAKE (2026) | DAUGHTERS OF THE FOREST (2026) | TIME AND WATER (2026) | PHENOMENA (2026)
Timestamps:
00:00 Poolside escape and trail introductions 01:30 Meet Jess Harrop and the Sandbox Films slate 03:00 Dan Deacon, Drinking Out of Cups, and the Sandbox scoring pipeline 05:30 From biology degree to science TV producer 07:30 Nova, Discovery Channel, and Bill Nye Saves the World 08:30 Learning filmmaking on the job—and the science-to-film pipeline 10:00 Camp Sandbox: where scientists and filmmakers become the same people 11:30 Walking like New Yorkers and the South by Southwest bait-and-switch 15:00 From show-running Netflix to building a studio at the Simons Foundation 17:30 Comedy docs and the Trojan Horse for science communication 19:30 ANDRÉ IS AN IDIOT: the film everyone needs to see immediately 21:00 Genre docs as a philosophy—comedy, romance, eco-horror 22:00 Werner Herzog on the advisory board and giving notes to a legend 25:00 Sandbox origins: FATHOM, ALL LIGHT EVERYWHERE, and early development 29:00 The stabby Amtrak detour and "get the cowboys on the horses" 33:00 THE LAKE: Great Salt Lake collapse, praying for rain, and the governor at Sundance 40:00 Tardigrades, the library rooftop, and things Keith loves 41:30 DAUGHTERS OF THE FOREST: indigenous mycologists and sci-fi docs 42:30 Cyber trucks, Waymos, and the autonomous future arrives in Austin 46:00 Time and Water: Sara Dosa's glacier elegy and the FIRE OF LOVE reunion 48:00 How FIRE OF LOVE was born from COVID, an archive, and one bold vision 52:30 The Wes Anderson–Jacques Cousteau connection 53:00 Lightning round: gateway drug doc, dream collaborators, and what's on Jess's mind 56:00 Advice for emerging filmmakers: find what makes you unique 58:00 PHENOMENA: the IMAX-ready, no-VFX science spectacle 1:00:00 Costume design side hustles and talking to animals 1:02:00 Dog Walks: the spinoff nobody asked for 1:04:00 Outro and Rambler Sparkling Water
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Holly Herrick is all about the film-life—as the Head of Film for Austin Film Society and Doc Days festival founder / programmer, she's at the center of Austin's film community, but this SXSW finds Holly wearing a new hat: first-time documentary producer.
FIRST THEY CAME FOR MY COLLEGE, directed by Patrick Bresnan, chronicles the 2023 "hostile takeover"—their words—of New College of Florida by Ron DeSantis and his Christo-fascist cronies. Holly's a New College alum. She saw the press getting the story wrong and did what any reasonable person in her position would do: panicked. But a call to Margaret Brown gave her some confidence, and together with fellow alum Harry Hanbury, decided to make a movie.
No big deal… hahaha… just squeeze-in a first feature with a full-time job running a non-profit and two-screen cinema, overseeing awards shows and grants, & two invite-only artists' labs (scripted & doc), all while raising two small kids. Holly Herrick is living proof: with enough caffeine, anything's possible….
We love this walk, because we never get enough time with Holly (busy busy lady), but today she's all ours as we stroll through the flowering native plants of Mueller Lake Park taking inspiration from this powerhouse of gettin' shit done—psychosis, be damned.
Plus: Dave Hickey on art and laziness, Jean Luc Godard on women, and Holly on: knowing your why.
DISCUSSION LINKSFIRST THEY CAME FOR MY COLLEGE (2026) | A WOMAN IS A WOMAN (1961) | BREATHLESS (1960) | WINNEBAGO MAN (2009) | TOWER (2016) | JOIN OR DIE (2023)
TIMESTAMPS00:00 Caffeine-induced psychosis as a lifestyle philosophy 00:49 Introducing Holly Herrick and Austin Film Society 03:30 AFS origin story—Linklater, the old airport, and Mueller 08:30 AFS Cinema as Austin's repertory art house 11:30 Doc Lab and Doc Days—what they are and how they work 17:30 "Community"—the most used word on Doc Walks 21:30 Austin Public—public access TV as democratic infrastructure 26:00 Programming as art, not science—Holly's philosophy for Doc Days 33:00 How Holly got into film: New College, Sarasota, and the accidental programmer 38:30 Dave Hickey, Air Guitar, and why art can't afford to be lazy 41:00 JOIN OR DIE, Bowling Alone, and democracy through community 45:00 FIRST THEY CAME FROM MY COLLEGE—origin of the project 49:00 The hostile takeover of New College of Florida 55:00 Patrick Preston as director and the Food Forest gardening club 1:01:00 Hopes for the film—what Holly wants audiences to understand 1:04:00 Festival run: True/False, SXSW, and beyond 1:08:00 Lightning round—Godard, knowing your why, and Wendell Berry
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If you ever wanted to get into the head of a premier festival programmer, this is your chance! Meet SXSW VP of Film & TV, Claudette Godfrey, a self-described Chaos Coordinator and all-around boss. Keith's flyin' solo while Ben's off shooting commercials (allegedly) and you won't want to miss the chance to walk & doc with Claudette today, on the 40th anniversary SXSW kickoff. An ADHD/OCD whirlwind of ideas and observations, Claudette is a trip—and she's ready to talk all things SXSW and highlight this year's best of the fest…
But first we'll check-in on Claudette's origin story: native Austinite, UT film student, SX intern in the Matt Dentler days, shorts programmer-extraordinaire under Janet Pierson, and now ascendant head of all things film & television at Austin's far-reaching culture fest. She's got intel to share—everything that's different now that the fest is 7 days instead of 10. She breaks down what actually gets a short film into a festival (pro tip: make an animated or a doc short—there's just a 0.4% acceptance rate for narrative), why docs are getting "more samey by the day," and why the overnight success myth is a comfortable lie filmmakers have been telling themselves since the early days of Quentin Tarantino. All that in preparation for the main event as Claudette rapid-fires through the 2026 doc slate with obvious glee: Sea Monkeys, classified Bigfoot footage, penis injections, NDA whistleblowers, the world's first extinct glacier, and a film about Kentucky weed farmers. Keith confesses he's in development on seven projects and none of them are close to done, so it'll be a few years before he's submitting to the fest. But Claudette supports his idea of making a short…
Plus: thoughts on Ben's role as Claudette's film prof; shout out to Trey Edward Schults' KRISHA and Jeremy Workman's SECRET MALL APARTMENT; Johnny Cash & Beck & Janis Joplin all at Keith's first SX (class of '94); and cameos from future DocWalks guest Sarah Kuck and Pickles the dog!
This episode was sponsored by our good friends at Rambler Sparkling Water. A tasty limestone mineral blend with the perfect level of tight, crispy bubbles. Made in America and proudly supporting American Rivers. Ramble on.
DISCUSSION LINKSPULP FICTION (1994) | TOMMY BOY (1995) | E.T. THE EXTRA-TERRESTRIAL (1982) | KRISHA (2015) | JANIS JOPLIN SLEPT HERE (1994) | EVERYTHING EVERYWHERE ALL AT ONCE (2022) | NAVALNY (2022) | DEAR MR. BRODY (2022) | SECRET MALL APARTMENT (2024) | MY BROTHER'S KILLER (2026) | AMAZING LIVE SEA MONKEYS (2026) | CAPTURING BIGFOOT (2026) | DRIFT (2026) | MANHOOD (2026) | MY NDA (2026) | SUMMER OF '94 (2026) | TIME AND WATER (2026) | SUMMER 2000 (2026) | THE LIFE WE LEAVE (2026) | THE DADS (2026) | THE LAST CRITIC (2026) | CORNBREAD MAFIA (2026)
TIMESTAMPS00:00 Introduction and circle of confusion 00:49 Meet Claudette Godfrey, VP of Film and TV at SXSW 02:42 Ben was Claudette's TA in college 04:13 Why Claudette went producing track instead of directing 06:00 Pulp Fiction, Tarantino, and the dream of being discovered 08:00 Festival producer vs. film producer 09:30 SXSW 40th anniversary and what's different this year 12:00 Seven days instead of ten, new badge structure 13:30 Claudette's first SXSW memory: Janice Joplin and Emo's, 1994 16:30 How SXSW has grown since the shed-in-a-backyard days 19:30 Keith's mushroom Easter egg and the intern connection 22:00 Shorts programming: what actually gets in 28:00 Animated shorts, acceptance rates, and premiere strategy 30:00 What makes a great short film 33:00 Watch the films at the festivals you want to attend 35:00 Trey Edward Shults and the moment Claudette was bowled over 37:00 Features: docs are getting more samey 40:00 The myth of the overnight success (the Daniels) 43:00 The 2026 SXSW doc slate begins 44:00 SECRET MALL APARTMENT and patience in documentary filmmaking 45:00 MY BROTHER'S KILLER, AMAZING LIVE SEA MONKEYS, CAPTURING BIGFOOT 47:00 CORNBREAD MAFIA, DRIFT, MANHOOD, MY NDA 48:00 SUMMER OF '94 and the AI DOC 50:00 TIME AND WATER, Sarah Dosa, and the survival of humanity 53:00 SUMMER 2000, THE LIFE WE LEAVE, THE DADS, THE LAST CRITIC 55:00 50% first-time filmmakers, the submission process myths 57:00 Film festival fit: not every great film belongs at every fest 58:00 Lightning round: gateway drug films 59:00 Francis, Pickles, and Keith's seven projects in development 01:02:00 Outro and teaser for Holly Herrick episode
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We're takin' it to the streets, sure—but this week we're also takin' it to the list: the Nonfiction Hotlist, with producer Anna Rau. Anna's got the scoop on this new endeavor to connect nonfic producers with money and distribution, and she's here to share just what the Nonfiction Hotlist is and where it's going. It started when former ESPN producer Adam Neuhaus made a viral LinkedIn post that inspired a community initiative championing unreleased nonfiction storytelling. And it's growing quickly. Anna explains their brand new Yahoo partnership that's creating a real home for short films that deserve more than a life relegated to the purgatory of the filmmaker's hard drive.
Anna has a lot going on right now! She's been producing commercials and doc-series for years, with her husband Corbett and their company The Range, but she realized there was a language on the finance side of this industry that she still needed to learn. So she enrolled in an MBA program to decode the business, and to find some creative ways to grow… and that growth has yielded big ideas in the form of westward expansion. Anna reveals that she is turning a grad-school assignment into an active business plan by putting an offer in on the legendary Palace Theater in Marfa, TX—the single-screen showroom where GIANT premiered, in the town where Anna and Corbett got married, and where they've got big plans to build a cinema-slash-production-hub from the ground up. Producer, MBA grad, entrepreneur, and Media Mogul—now that's a hot list.
Plus: a ufo-shaped gazebo on the shores of Lady Bird Lake; we eye a colorful ceramic cow; talk abundance over scarcity; and walk away feeling like the future of nonfiction is in very good hands.
***Also deadline for the Yahoo initiative is this Friday if folks want to get something in under the wire, there's an info Q+A happening tomorrow on instagram live over @nonfictionhotlist
Discussion Links: GIANT (1956) | JAWS (1975) | CALIFORNIA'S GOLD (1991–2012) | ARTBOUND (2012–Present) | ALL WE NEED IS ANOTHER CHANCE (2017) | TENDING NATURE (2018–2021) | EVERYTHING EVERYWHERE ALL AT ONCE (2022) | THE YOGURT SHOP MURDERS (2025) | GOOD MOMENT (in post-production)
00:00 Welcome to Doc Walks: Banter About Banter 02:42 Introducing Anna Rau: Old Friends, New Walks 03:00 The Marfa Wedding Suit Disaster 05:00 Anna's Career: The Range, PBS, and Beyond 06:30 Enter the Nonfiction Hotlist 08:30 What Is the Hotlist? Origin Story and Mission 10:00 The Blacklist Comparison: Nonfiction's Turn 12:00 Human-Centered Curation and Painting the Back of the Fence 15:00 Anna's MBA Journey: Understanding the Money Side 17:48 The Business of Docs: Tangibles, Intangibles, and Impact 20:30 The Yahoo Shorts Partnership: Finding a Home for Short Films 22:00 Why Shorts Are Harder Than Features 25:00 Ben's Short Film Life and the Distribution Dead End 27:00 Submission Details: Who Should Apply 29:00 The Gazebo Detour: Women Voters and Homeless Photographers 31:00 How the Curation Actually Works 33:30 Anna and Corbett's Body of Work 36:00 The Huel Howser Tangent We Needed 40:00 Crisis as Opportunity: Abundance Over Scarcity 41:00 The Palace Theater in Marfa: A Big Announcement 44:00 Pivots, Blind Leaps, and Never Having a Real Job 48:00 Community Over Competition 50:30 MBA Takeaways and the Finance of Filmmaking 54:30 Gateway Drug Film: GIANT 56:00 Advice for Young Filmmakers: Curiosity and Joy 58:30 Closing Thoughts and South by Southwest Preview
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Park City, 2026 — we showed up without films, without press credentials, but still… ready to make our DocWalk dreams a reality. Welcome to the last of 4 episodes at Sundance: a walk down Main Street, where we hobnob with the best of the fest, greet the people, and do everything we can to stay warm in sub-freezing temps without a single movie ticket in sight.
This year at Sundance everyone was looking back (at the legacy of Robert Redford and what the fest has been) while still looking forward (to where we'll be in a year… Boulder, Colorado). We catch-up on the festival BizBuzz™: it's all M&A! Mergers and acquisitions (netflix/paramount/warners, oh my) and whether the indie spirit is actually back (Ben says it is). As men of the people, we focus on the men (& women) on the street. And they have a lot to say. Entertainment lawyer Ben Moskowitz breaks down what not to do when you're pitching, first-time producer Will Butler shares the innovations of JOYBUBBLES—the first film at Sundance to screen with open audio description for blind audiences, and Tribeca programmer Jarod Neece offers insight into the numbers game that you've gotta overcome when applying to a premier fest. We meet David Fortune, who turned a million-dollar grant into his debut feature COLOR BOOK, Jamaican producer/lawyer Rob Maylor who's about to make Delroy Lindo a first-time director, and filmmaker Dana Reilly fresh off her OUR BODY ELECTRIC premiere. Austin-based producers Russell Groves and Jessica Wolfson make brief cameos and former-Austinite Heather Courtney joins us to talk about the film she's producing with Christina Ibarra, and the one she's directing (thx to a Chicken & Egg research grant).
Plus: surprise run-ins with editor Josh Ethier, publicist David Magdael and doc-superstar Ondi Timoner; Aaaand an owl that's been in 150 movies; a meteorologist and horses; and insight into a Park City real estate deal that proves that karma is real, but the best deals are behind us. Thanks to the Austin Film Society and The Long Time for sponsoring our trip! This one is a super-sized DocWalks with 50% more runtime, and a whole lot of fun!
DISCUSSION LINKS:
JOYBUBBLES (2026) | COLOR BOOK (2024) | OUR BODY ELECTRIC (2026) | BUDDY (2026) | AMERICAN DOCTOR (2026) | THE OLDEST PERSON IN THE WORLD (2026) | THE HISTORY OF CONCRETE (2026) | ALL THE WALLS CAME DOWN (2025) | BREAKING THROUGH ROCKS (2025) | COME SEE ME IN THE GOOD LIGHT (2025) | HOT WATER (2026) | LITTLE MISS SUNSHINE (2006) | SEX, LIES, AND VIDEOTAPE (1989) | SLACKER (1990) | CLERKS (1994) | SEIZED (2026) | NUTS (2016) | TOO MANY COOKS (2014) | CARTS OF DARKNESS (2008) | MARCH OF THE PENGUINS (2005) | WINNEBAGO MAN (2009) | TOWER (2016) | CHOP & STEELE (2022) | DEAR MR. BRODY (2021)
TIMESTAMPS:
00:00 Ben is cold — arrival in Park City 03:58 Main Street dispatch — the last Sundance in Park City 07:00 First-timers and the indie spirit question 08:00 Jordan Tracy — ABC4 live weather with horses 11:50 Russell Groves and Jessica Wolfson 17:50 Ben Moskowitz on how new filmmakers find a lawyer 21:00 Good ideas, bad ideas — don't promise access you don't have 25:15 Will Butler and JOYBUBBLES — open audio description at Sundance 29:00 Jarod Neece — Tribeca at 25 and the 14,000-film funnel 37:10 Kino Lorber re-releasing Tower — breaking news 41:00 Bill and Robin — Park City locals since the sixties 44:30 Night falls — BizBuzz™ on Main Street 48:00 Dana Reilly — OUR BODY ELECTRIC premieres at Dances With Films 52:30 TOWER superfan and the sorority screening 55:00 David Fortune — COLOR BOOK and the AT&T Untold Stories million 58:30 Dapper dressed rule of thumb 1:01:30 Rob Maylor — producing Delroy Lindo's directorial debut 1:05:00 Josh Ethier — editing BUDDY from TOO MANY COOKS director Casper Kelly 1:09:30 Eagle and Spencer — skiing, Fugazi, and CARTS OF DARKNESS 1:14:00 Day three — Heather Courtney and Chicken & Egg research grant 1:19:00 David Magdael — publicist, Oscar campaigns, and changing the world through cinema and Ondi(!) Timoner 1:22:30 Heather's final thoughts — call your representatives 1:29:30 Driving away from Sundance — reflections on community and the grind 1:36:00 Sponsor messages and next episode preview — Anna Rau and the Nonfiction Hot List
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It's time for some JOYBUBBLES! That's what first-time doc director Rachael J. Morrison believes—and she's brought her feature doc to Sundance to share the power of JOYBUBBLES with the world. Rachael's film introduces the world to Joe Engressia, a blind kid who discovered he could whistle a magic tone and hack the analog telephone system—becoming a pioneer in the world of "phone phreaking." Joe's story twists and turns as freaking leads to joy… and he inspires generations of outsiders to find their own unique paths through this life.
Rachael comes from years of experience as an archival producer, so it's no surprise that her first directing effort relies heavily on the use of "emotional archival," playing at the intersection of audio and visual communication techniques. We'll learn how she stumbled onto Joe's story and how four cassette tapes of him narrating his own life completely transformed the film. Those tapes are right up Ben's alley, and he shares his experience making a cassette-inspired short doc about telephone pranksters, and Keith confesses to benefitting from a college friend who knew how to hack payphones for free long distance back in the 1990s. Anyone who spent time on twentieth-century party lines, or making 3-way calls with friends will be transported into those landline days when the telephone was a great connector. Rachael spent ten years meeting phone phreaks and making this film, and she shares her affinity for jamband bootleg trading, mixtape culture, and the beauty of sitting by the radio with your finger on the record button. Plus: kids sledding in Park City, shout-out to an Errol Morris deep cut, finding inspiration via the obituary page, and appreciation for Joybubbles' words of ultimate wisdom: if you love something enough, it loves you back.
Discussion Links:
JOYBUBBLES (2026) | GATES OF HEAVEN (1978) | WINNEBAGO MAN (2009) | READING RAINBOW (2024)
Timestamps:
00:00 Arrival in Park City — crisp is the word of the day 00:49 Meet Rachael J. Morrison (and immediately regret going uphill) 02:00 The JOYBUBBLES pitch — on a steep incline 04:00 Born blind, born to hack: Joe Engressia's story 05:00 Keith's college payphone hack and red boxes vs. blue boxes 07:00 Finding the story through a New York Times obituary 09:00 Emotional archival vs. see-and-say archival 13:00 Four cassette tapes in a closet change everything 15:00 Joe as proto-podcaster: answering machine radio in the '80s 17:00 What is a phone phreak? 19:00 Keith's son gets a landline for Christmas 22:00 Sundance premiere jitters and what audiences might grab onto 23:00 Phone phreaks meet Phish bootleg tape traders 25:00 Mixtape culture and the lost art of analog intention 28:00 Angry Kickstarter backers who turned out to be the biggest fans 30:00 "If you love it enough, it'll love you back" 32:00 The director-editor relationship: finding your band 37:00 From Bard art school to MoMA library to archival producing 40:00 Fair use and why indie docs depend on it 42:00 Lightning Round: GATES OF HEAVEN, Matt Wolf, and what's next 46:00 Where to find JOYBUBBLES
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When we find Julie Goldman and Chris Clements of Motto Pictures in a Sundance hotel lobby, they're doing what they do—sharing hugs and encouragement with the Oscar-nominated team from THE PERFECT NEIGHBOR. They're the kind of producers who root hard for everybody in the field while juggling 8-10 projects of their own.
Julie and Chris know everyone—and they champion longtime friends and newcomers to docmaking alike. When we asked Julie to walk with us last year at SXSW, she was a quick and easy "YES," but it took til Sundance for us all to be in the same place at the same time. And here we are. Keith knows the Motto Pictures folks from the 2016-2017 awards campaign when they were shepherding both LIFE, ANIMATED and WEINER. Ben's lucky enough to be in business with Motto on his upcoming DR. DANTE project. So we've all spent time together, and this time we're bringing you along for a winding view into Chris & Julie's work philosophies and partnership—they're married business partners who each offer different aspects to the films they produce.
We're away from the hubbub of Main Street and onto the nature trail spotting birds, murals, tunnels, and trees, all while digging into the Motto approach: how they financed their first feature on maxed-out credit cards at Brooklyn College, why they Zoom into shoots they can't attend, and how they handle story development and adaptation, including seeing a doc become a scripted comedy in partnership with Mike Schur and Ted Danson. Hear how Julie went from memorizing international phone prefixes at First Run Features to spotting potential in filmmakers before they see it themselves; and Chris drops a theory on why AI will never replace human storytelling—"it doesn't understand doubt." Join us as we stumble into a public art garden where we can't resist trying our hand at live-scoring the walk with some sculptural instruments. And we land on a question that these walks keep coming back to: where does documentary go from here?
Plus: love for Errol Morris and Barbara Kopple, Owen Suskind's flawless post-screening routine, the beauty of sad bells echoing through a Park City tunnel, and the tuxedo pigeon is back (still a magpie).
Discussion Links: BUCK (2011) | LIFE, ANIMATED (2016) | WEINER (2016) | CHICKEN PEOPLE (2016) | THE MOLE AGENT (2020) | MAN ON THE INSIDE (2024) | THE PERFECT NEIGHBOR (2025) | GATES OF HEAVEN (1978) | HARLAN COUNTY, USA (1976) | ABACUS: SMALL ENOUGH TO JAIL (2016) | WALTZ WITH BASHIR (2008) | CAPTURING THE FRIEDMANS (2003) | AN AMERICAN FAMILY (1973)
Timestamps: 00:00 Sundance lobby: hugging THE PERFECT NEIGHBOR crew goodbye 02:42 Meet Julie Goldman & Chris Clements of Motto Pictures 04:13 Motto origin story and the greatest hits 07:07 The tuxedo pigeon returns (still a magpie, Keith) 08:04 Married and making movies: how they navigate both 09:12 Eight to ten projects at once—parallel action as philosophy 11:17 Creative producing: Zoom-ing into shoots, feeding notes live 15:28 Julie's sales brain meets Chris's creative obsession 17:35 The credit card feature: Brooklyn College's worst financial advice 19:01 Why producing called louder than directing 21:02 Owen Suskind wants a cheeseburger and three movies 22:08 Motto's unofficial motto: dragging filmmakers kicking and screaming 25:02 The light at the end of the tunnel for doc filmmaking 29:15 Documentary is defense—and championships are won reacting 31:19 The pivot moment every good doc goes through 36:08 "AI doesn't understand doubt" 39:03 The sculpture garden jam session 40:27 What Motto looks for: a new way to see the world 46:03 YouTube, platforms, and where distribution is headed 50:12 The Motto farm system: interns to A24 51:14 Advice for first-time feature filmmakers 55:04 Gateway docs: GATES OF HEAVEN and HARLAN COUNTY, USA 57:08 What they can't stop thinking about 59:32 The short: FOR SOME KIND OF REFUGE 01:01:12 Sponsors: Austin Film Society & The Long Time
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