Episodes
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In this episode, Peep dives into why niching down is the key to success for early-stage B2B SaaS companies. He explains how focusing on solving a specific problem for a targeted market, rather than competing directly with industry giants, allows startups to gain traction and dominate their niche. Peep emphasizes that niching down isn't about limiting your dreams, but rather a proven strategy to break into a competitive market and lay the foundation for future growth.
Chapters:
[00:00] - Introduction
[00:30] - Why niching down is crucial for early-stage SaaS
[03:30] - Capturing a small market first
[08:39] - The importance of differentiation
[11:59] - Real-world examples of successful niching
[18:03] - Niching is about focus, not limiting dreams
[22:10] - Case study: Lattice's niche in performance management
[25:28] - When to consider an all-in-one solution
[29:44] - Choosing a company name that allows growth
[31:09] - Identifying a profitable niche
[33:30] - Conclusion
My links:X: https://twitter.com/peeplaja
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/peeplaja/
Personal site: https://peeplaja.com/
Wynter: https://wynter.com/
Speero: https://speero.com/
CXL: https://cxl.com/
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In this episode, Peep Laja explores the scientific laws of marketing, focusing on building mental and physical availability for brands. Drawing from the works of Professor Byron Sharpe and the Ehrenberg Bass Institute, Laja emphasizes the importance of being top of mind and easily found when potential customers are ready to make a purchase.
The episode features insights from marketing experts who provide real-world examples. Peep also discusses distinctive brand assets, the limitations of hyper-targeting in B2B marketing, and the duplication of purchase law. He concludes by offering practical advice on increasing brand awareness and making target customers remember the brand when they need its product.
00:00 - Intro
02:00 - Mental and physical availability concepts
04:40 - Brand building with Paul Dorsey
05:45 - Buying triggers
07:05 - HockeyStack's content marketing strategy
11:00 - Physical availability in B2B SaaS
12:00 - Distinctive brand assets
18:45 - SurveyMonkey's rebranding story
20:10 - B2B brands lack distinctive assets
21:00 - Meaningless distinctiveness vs. differentiation
22:20 - Identifying customer values with Wynter
23:00 - Reaching all buyers in a category
24:30 - Limitations of hyper-targeting
26:00 - Category reach and lead generation
27:45 - Ad reach and frequency
28:50 - Duplication of purchase law
30:00 - ConclusionMy links:
X: https://twitter.com/peeplaja
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/peeplaja/
Personal site: https://peeplaja.com/
Wynter: https://wynter.com/
Speero: https://speero.com/
CXL: https://cxl.com/
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Missing episodes?
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This episode explores the critical factors that define market leadership, from being first in a category to leveraging innovation and strategic marketing. Hear from experts like David Aaker, Mark Ritson, and Byron Sharp on how top brands maintain dominance and why small brands face uphill battles. Discover actionable insights on standing out, staying top of mind, and converting prospects into loyal customers.
[00:00:00] Intro: Winning in B2B SaaS
[00:01:23] David Aaker on Market Stability
[00:03:00] Mark Ritson: Challenges for Small Brands
[00:04:08] Byron Sharp's Law of Double Jeopardy
[00:06:30] The Importance of Mental Availability
[00:09:30] Innovation vs. Excess Share of Voice
[00:12:15] Case Study: Monday.com's Marketing Spend
[00:17:08] LG's Failed Market Strategy
[00:19:00] Creating a Unique Market Position
[00:22:00] Staying Top of Mind Strategically
[00:25:39] Creative Low-Cost Marketing Tactics
[00:30:00] Outro: Key Takeaways
My links:
X: https://twitter.com/peeplaja
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/peeplaja/
Personal site: https://peeplaja.com/
Wynter: https://wynter.com/
Speero: https://speero.com/
CXL: https://cxl.com/
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In this new style of "How To Win", Peep Laja discusses the importance of differentiation in today's highly competitive B2B SaaS market. He explores various strategies for standing out, such as focusing on brand, taking a polarizing stance, being radically transparent, and leveraging personal brands. Laja emphasizes that differentiation is a CEO-level problem and that companies must build their vision around being unique rather than simply copying competitors.
Chapter Markers:
00:00:00 - Introduction
00:01:00 - MarTech landscape and sameness
00:02:30 - Differentiating beyond features
00:05:00 - Competing to be unique
00:07:15 - Limited consideration sets
00:09:00 - Commitment to differentiation
00:10:15 - Three types of standout brands
00:13:00 - Eight traits of commodity brands
00:15:00 - Personal brands for differentiation
00:17:30 - Strategies from "Differentiate or Die"
00:20:15 - Jillion down on what works
00:20:45 - Differentiation as a CEO problemMy links:
X: https://twitter.com/peeplaja
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/peeplaja/
Personal site: https://peeplaja.com/
Wynter: https://wynter.com/
Speero: https://speero.com/
CXL: https://cxl.com/
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This week on How To Win: Noah Kagan of AppSumo, a platform for digital marketplace deals focusing on software aimed at entrepreneurs and small businesses. They have bootstrapped to over $80 million in revenue. You’ll hear insights on scaling business by focusing on what works, the importance of staying true to your core values, and the strategy behind AppSumo's success. Discover how AppSumo thrived where others didn't and why focusing on the customer always pays off. Find out how AppSumo navigates competition and continues to grow by doubling down on effective strategies.
Key Points:
[00:03:36] "How does AppSumo compete with lower prices?"[00:08:33] "How did strategic choices evolve with growth?"[00:10:57] "How does focusing on what works help?"[00:14:42] "Do cheaper products lead to higher sales?"[00:15:18] "Why focus on solopreneurs despite challenges?"[00:19:30] "Key to AppSumo's successful marketing strategy?"
Mentioned:Noah Kagan
AppSumo
Noah Kagan's XMy Links:
Twitter / X
LinkedIn
Website
Wynter
Speero
CXL
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This week on How To Win: Bernat Farrero of Factorial HR, sharing insights on revolutionizing HR for SMBs. You’ll hear about the importance of simplifying complex HR processes for small and medium businesses, Factorial HR's strategic approach to scaling internationally while addressing localized needs, and how they navigated the challenges of rapid growth and product development to meet the diverse needs of their global clientele.
Key Points:
[00:01:21] Why start as an all-in-one from day one?[00:02:24] Does diversification improve SMB retention?[00:03:36] Was targeting SMBs your initial customer profile?[00:10:03] Time from 1 million to 10 million in revenue?[00:12:09] How has prioritizing growth changed for you?[00:14:15] How closely do you watch competitors?[00:15:54] Why expand beyond HR into finance?[00:17:24] Do all added products boost revenue and retention?[00:18:00] What are the trade-offs of expanding your product?[00:18:54] Why has Factorial HR succeeded in a competitive market?[00:20:24] Top three lessons for B2B SaaS founders?
Mentioned:Bernat Farrero
Factorial HR
Bernat Farrero's XMy Links:
Twitter / X
LinkedIn
Website
Wynter
Speero
CXL
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This week on How To Win: Todd Olson of Pendo, revealing the secrets behind building a product-led growth company. You’ll hear how Pendo's focus on product experience revolutionized customer interaction, the importance of integrating customer feedback into product development for sustained growth, and the strategic approach to scaling a software company beyond traditional boundaries.
Key Points:
[00:03:15] "What propelled your initial revenue growth?"[00:06:42] "Challenges in transitioning to enterprise clients?"[00:10:58] "Impact of product decisions on company scale?"[00:15:24] "Strategies for expanding product functionality?"[00:18:37] "Approach to building a scalable team?"[00:19:12] "Strategy behind bowling pin model?"[00:22:45] "Insights on maintaining company culture?"
Mentioned:Todd Olson
Pendo
Todd Olson's XMy Links:
Twitter / X
LinkedIn
Website
Wynter
Speero
CXL
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This week on How To Win: Gregory Galant of Muck Rack, discusses the journey of transforming a podcasting venture into a leading software solution for public relations professionals. You’ll hear insights on the importance of building strong journalist relationships, the strategic pivot from service to software, and the value of slow, deliberate growth in the tech industry.
Key Points:
[00:04:21] "Time to first million in revenue?"[00:05:51] "Early days buyer understanding?"[00:07:12] "Shift to sales-led approach?"[00:09:36] "Product and sales balance for growth?"[00:10:12] "Changes post-$10 million revenue?"[00:13:48] "Market size doubt at $10 million?"[00:18:09] "Reasons for outlasting competitors?"[00:20:24] "Top advice for B2B founders?"
Mentioned:Gregory Galant
Muck Rack
Gregory Galant's XMy Links:
Twitter / X
LinkedIn
Website
Wynter
Speero
CXL
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This week on How To Win: Vinay Bhagat of TrustRadius, revolutionizing B2B software buying with in-depth user reviews. You’ll hear how TrustRadius overcame the challenge of creating a trusted review platform in a saturated market, the strategic decisions that led to successful monetization, and the importance of focusing on quality over quantity to cater to both software vendors and buyers.
Key Points:
[00:02:30] - Inspiration behind your business model?
[00:03:15] - Tackling initial cold start problem?
[00:04:00] - Scaling outreach effectively?
[00:05:15] - Competitive landscape at inception?
[00:08:45] - Monetization through content syndication?[00:10:00] - No initial go-to-market strategy?
[00:13:30] - Differentiation strategy in sales?
[00:14:15] - Building a differentiated audience?[00:15:00] - Creating a buyer-centric platform?
[00:18:00] - Strategy for targeting large tech companies?
[00:18:45] - Focus on thought leadership and content?
[00:19:45] - Advice for B2B founders?
[00:20:15] - Balancing bootstrap with funding?[00:24:30] - TrustRadius's keys to winning?
Mentioned:Vinay Bhagat
TrustRadius.com
Vinay Bhagat's XMy Links:
Twitter / X
LinkedIn
Website
Wynter
Speero
CXL
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This week on How To Win: Adam Robinson of Retention.com, an innovative leader in the email marketing space. You’ll hear about the journey of identifying a market gap and creating a differentiated product in a competitive environment, the importance of strategic focus on a specific target market, particularly in e-commerce, and the implementation of focused go-to-market strategies for sustained growth and market penetration.
Key Points:
[01:48] - What was your first market product?
[02:51] - How did it become a standalone product?
[04:12] - Who's the primary buyer for this?
[07:30] - Post-revenue, how did strategy evolve?
[15:00] - How did you achieve business differentiation?
[16:48] - Top three advice for B2B founders?
[18:45] - What's behind Retention.com's winning strategy?Mentioned:
Adam Robinson
Retention.com
Adam Robinson's XMy Links:
Twitter / X
LinkedIn
Website
Wynter
Speero
CXL
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This week on How To Win: Chris Federspiel of Blackthorn.io, a company specializing in Salesforce integration and application development. You’ll hear about Blackthorn's strategic approach to the Salesforce ecosystem, the critical role of customer feedback in shaping their product development, and the journey of focusing their offerings to achieve significant growth in the competitive SaaS market.
Key Points:
00:00:16 How did Blackthorn achieve its growth?
00:01:30 How long to build first product?
00:03:36 Time to hit 1 million ARR?
00:04:21 Target customers for your products?
00:06:09 Explain go-to-market strategy?
00:08:18 Go-to-market for growth acceleration?
00:09:54 Current product lineup?
00:14:10 Target customer segment evolution?
00:16:09 Effective customer acquisition channels?
00:17:42 Monitoring competition?
00:19:12 Unsuccessful strategic bets?
00:21:45 Importance of company focus?
00:22:12 What set Blackthorn apart from others?
00:24:00 Top advice for B2B founders?
00:25:57 How did Blackthorn win?Mentioned:
Chris Federspiel
Blackthorn.io
Chris Federspiel's XMy Links:
Twitter / X
LinkedIn
Website
Wynter
Speero
CXL
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This week on How To Win: Clate Mask of Keap, marketing automation and CRM platform for small businesses. You'll hear how Keap found the right customers, why they combined software with services, and how Keap evolved its marketing over time.
Key Points:
01:15 Building the initial product based on own business needs
03:00 Pivoting to serve small businesses dealing with chaos
04:30 Evolving from just marketing automation to full business automation
07:15 Renaming the company to reflect simplicity and ease of use
09:45 Sticking to core small business customers amid pressure
13:00 Combining software, services, and strategy for customer success
22:30 Embracing partners and gradual upmarket moves for growthMentioned:
Clate Mask's Linkedin
Clate Mask's X
KeapMy Links:
Twitter
LinkedIn
Website
Wynter
Speero
CXL
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This week on How To Win: Vinay Patankar of Process Street, a workflow management software company. You'll hear why they didn't monetize for the first 2 years, how going upmarket increased retention and revenue, and why they focused the product on specific use cases.
Key Points:
01:15 Identifying market need from personal frustration
03:00 Deciding not to monetize for 2 years to optimize fundraising
06:15 Recognizing larger customers have higher retention and expansion
07:00 Transitioning from SMB to mid-market and enterprise
14:30 Having over 50% of revenue from inbound channels
15:00 Needing specialized use cases to differentiate amid competition
19:00 Advising founders to get very clear on product and go-to-market strategyMentioned:
Process Street
https://www.process.st/Vinay Patankar's Linkedin
https://www.linkedin.com/in/vinaypatankarVinay Patankar on X
https://twitter.com/vinayp10?lang=enMy Links:
Twitter
LinkedIn
Website
Wynter
Speero
CXL
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This week on How To Win: Sam Jacobs of Pavilion, who built a $15 million community learning business from scratch. You’ll hear how he leveraged LinkedIn for organic growth, the importance of creating sub-communities, and key mistakes he made after raising VC money that took the focus away from his core customers.
Key moments:
00:50 - Describing what the company does
06:20 - Describing the issues with e-learning
11:30 - Issues with raising money
14:20 - Cutting back
17:40 - Explaining how to grow communities
22:30 - Advice for founders
24:30 - Lessons learnedMentioned:
PavilionSam Jacobs's LinkedIn
Sam Jacobs's XMy Links:
X
LinkedIn
Website
Wynter
Speero
CXL
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This week on How To Win: Gleb Budman of Backblaze, which offers affordable, easy cloud storage. You’ll hear how bootstrapping forced them to make efficient decisions, how focusing on underserved mid-market customers helped them compete with Amazon, and how building their own platform gave them a structural advantage.
Timestamps:
01:45 Focusing on underserved mid-market
02:15 Low pricing from efficient infrastructure
07:45 Content and community marketing
11:30 Bootstrapping forced efficiency
13:20 Building own platform from bootstrapping
16:15 Staying power and not getting ahead -
This week on How To Win: Jess Mah of indinero, a fintech company providing automated bookkeeping and accounting services. You'll hear how she focused on high-paying niche verticals, pivoted to find product-market fit, and how she brought in an experienced CEO.
Key Points:
01:45 Pivoting to a new customer segment willing to pay more
03:00 Combining QuickBooks, Mint.com and luxury concierge service
04:15 Seeing product issues by observing customers use it
08:00 Focusing on customer health and early churn indicators
10:30 Customizing marketing and sales for each vertical
16:15 Replacing yourself earlier as CEO with a more experienced leaderMentioned:
LinkedIn
Twitter
indinero
MahwayMy Links:
Twitter
LinkedIn
Website
Wynter
Speero
CXL
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This week on How To Win: Andrew Lau of Jellyfish, the engineering management platform. You'll hear how they validated the problem space, figured out product-market fit, and used founder-led sales to generate traction.
Key Points:
2:03 - Getting first revenue with founder-led selling4:12 - Seeing massive growth after increasing COVID demand
6:33 - Focusing on customer needs over competitors
8:46 - Timing is everything - being patient
10:58 - Staying focused on your team and customers
12:33 - Acknowledging timing and people are key combinations
14:52 - Funding marketing appropriately at different times
22:41 - Timing is everything as operator, people are everything as investor
Mentioned:
Jellyfish
Andrew LauMy Links:
Twitter
LinkedIn
Website
Wynter
Speero
CXL
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Summary
This week on How To Win: Christian Kletzl of UserGems, champion tracking software for sales. You'll hear the process they went through to find the product their clients were willing to pay for, how they make themselves appear bigger than they are, and more.
Key Points
00:30 - Appearing larger by using ads, content, LinkedIn, conferences01:00 - Pivoting multiple times before finding product-market fit
01:30 - First customer paying $50k, taking 3 months to get second
02:15 - Becoming workflow company based on customer feedback
03:00 - Enabling workflows with routing, notifications, messaging
04:15 - Going sales-led to getting feedback and sales quickly
05:00 - Moving upmarket for better economics
06:30 - Creating more value like selling furniture over lumber
07:30 - Getting Salesforce access to enabling workflows
09:00 - Pushing workflow steps to driving success
12:00 - Workflow products having better retention
13:30 - Hitting $1M revenue in 12-18 months
14:15 - Clipboard Health pivoting successfully
16:00 - Testing crazy versions when growth stalling
19:00 - Appearing bigger through LinkedIn, ads, case studies
22:15 - Focusing on use case despite competitors
23:45 - Building moat with brand recognition and revenue impact
25:15 - Saying no to unfit customers
Mentioned:
Christian Kletzl's LinkedIn
UserGemsMy Links:
Twitter
LinkedIn
Website
Wynter
Speero
CXL
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This week on How To Win: Livestorm's Gilles Bertaux, a meeting and webinar platform. You'll hear how Livestorm succeeded despite many well-known competitors. How they got their first customers. And how they grew past $10 million in revenue.
Key Points
1:00 - How Gilles got the idea for Livestorm and validated it with customers
2:00 - Getting the first set of customers
3:15 - Reaching $1 million ARR in 2-2.5 years
3:45 - Growth during COVID-19 pandemic
4:30 - Differences between Livestorm and virtual event platforms
5:45 - Importance of recurring revenue products
6:00 - Anti-active usage products retention rates
7:00 - Differentiation in the webinar space
8:00 - European privacy laws advantage
9:30 - Messaging differentiation vs. business strategy differentiation
10:00 - Shipping features fast vs. carefully
13:00 - Prioritizing features based on positioning
14:15 - Strategy changes after hitting $10 million revenue
16:00 - Lessons learned over 7 years
17:30 - How Livestorm wonMentioned:
Livestorm
Gilles Bertaux on X
Gilles Bertaux on LinkedInMy Links:
Twitter
LinkedIn
Website
Wynter
Speero
CXL
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This week on How To Win: Guy Cohen, CEO of Wonder an on-demand secondary research platform. They built the company to 8M in revenue, realized their ICP was wrong, tore it down and rebuilt again. That's what we break down in this episode.
Key Points:
00:02:29 Failed many times, learned hard lessons, narrowed target.
00:04:28 Innovative marketing approach convinces lighthouse customers.
00:09:12 Canaries told us we were wrong, now what?
00:11:02 SMB business scaled pre-COVID but had issues.
00:14:54 Friction, pricing, and quality debated; race against time.
00:18:27 AI: Extinction risk or growth accelerator?
00:22:37 Voice to customer, sales, mistakes, choosing, committing.
00:23:40 Closing thoughts.Mentioned:
Guy Cohen's LinkedIn
Wonder
My Links:Twitter
LinkedIn
Website
Wynter
Speero
CXL
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