Episodes
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The final episode for Season 2 featuring Andrew "Tokes" Tokeley in conversation with Fran and Lauchlan. Enjoy our take aways and final thoughts from the 10 episodes in Season Two.
Thank you to all our guests and listeners!
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We are Fran and Lauchlan, both Product Managers, and we are discovering the diverse skills and experience that are out there in the product world. We aim to inspire product people on their journeys. Opinions expressed are solely our own and do not express the views of our employers.
Get in touch: [email protected]
Presenters: Fran Gleisner, Lauchlan Robertson
Music Credit: Harry Charles - Deer Park RemixSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
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In today's episode with Elizabeth Griffiths, CEO of NFT.Storage, we dive into web3 and how product management can be applied to a emerging space.
Elizabeth explains the evolution of the internet to Web3, emphasizing the significance of owning digital assets and the decentralized ledger system of blockchain. The discussion also touches upon the potential societal benefits of these technologies, such as improving voting systems and medical records management.
The episode highlights the challenges and the excitement of working with cutting-edge technology and emphasizes the importance of following one's passion, exploring new opportunities, and continuous learning. Elizabeth shares her experiences and insights, offering valuable advice for those interested in Web3 and the broader tech landscape.
Key points:
Introduction to Web3 and the evolution of the internet.
The problems digital ownership and decentralization through blockchain technology can solve and how it might just change the world we know.
The value of taking risks and seizing opportunities in one’s career.
Complexities and learning curve associated with working in the new industries
Read: Read, Write, Own by Chris Dixon Listen: Bankless, Overprice Jpegs with Carly Riley and Green Pill------------------------------------------------------------------
We are Fran and Lauchlan, both Product Managers, and we are discovering the diverse skills and experience that are out there in the product world. We aim to inspire product people on their journeys. Opinions expressed are solely our own and do not express the views of our employers.
Get in touch: [email protected]
Presenters: Fran Gleisner, Lauchlan Robertson
Music Credit: Harry Charles - Deer Park RemixSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
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Missing episodes?
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In this episode we chat to Ross Howard, CPO at Tradify.
Ross brings his graphic design and creative director background as a lens to Product Management. He talks about his experience with products that fail and when you know to pull the plug. We focus mostly on innovation and why it's so important to design processes that are specific to your company, your culture and your product.
Some things to put on your read and listen list:
Read: The Mac is Not a Typewriter by Robin P. Williams Listen: Lenny's podcast Listen: Sharp Tech and Stratechery by Ben ThompsonEnjoy this episode and get in touch with any questions or comments!
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We are Fran and Lauchlan, both Product Managers, and we are discovering the diverse skills and experience that are out there in the product world. We aim to inspire product people on their journeys. Opinions expressed are solely our own and do not express the views of our employers.
Get in touch: [email protected]
Presenters: Fran Gleisner, Lauchlan Robertson
Music Credit: Harry Charles - Deer Park RemixSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
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I'm sure we've all read these great product books and thought I wish that's how my company operated. In today's episode with Bridget Cowie we explore how leaning into the messy and fast paced aspects of a job could be exactly how bringing 'ideal product management' to life feels.
We explore how being pragmatic with your approach and being okay to iterate and make changes over time is key to building trust and helping a growing business achieve it's goals!
Some key points:
Good product isn't alway good product Doing things by the book isn't always the best and a slow iteration to meet the needs you have and solve problems is important Change only moves at the speed of trust. Build empathy with your founders and leaders and then work to share that trust and context with the great people on your team Read: John Cutler's The beautiful mess Listen: Product thinking with Melissa Perri------------------------------------------------------------------
We are Fran and Lauchlan, both Product Managers, and we are discovering the diverse skills and experience that are out there in the product world. We aim to inspire product people on their journeys. Opinions expressed are solely our own and do not express the views of our employers.
Get in touch: [email protected]
Presenters: Fran Gleisner, Lauchlan Robertson
Music Credit: Harry Charles - Deer Park RemixSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
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Listen to our episode with Para Muraleedharan, who currently leads two product companies under the Evercommerce portfolio: Timely in ANZ and SalonBiz in the US.
Para walks through the product ladder from PO to PM to GM to CPO. Her insights are invaluable as she describes the changes she experienced at each step, with the biggest being GM to CPO level. This is a great round-up to previous episodes in the season, bringing back similar themes of the differences between the C-suite and working within a specific area.
Some things to put on your read and listen list:
Read: Playing to win by A.G. Lafley, and Roger L. Martin Read: Turn the ship around! by L. David Marquet Listen: Diary of a CEO and Lenny's podcastEnjoy this episode and get in touch with any questions or comments!
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We are Fran and Lauchlan, both Product Managers, and we are discovering the diverse skills and experience that are out there in the product world. We aim to inspire product people on their journeys. Opinions expressed are solely our own and do not express the views of our employers.
Get in touch: [email protected]
Presenters: Fran Gleisner, Lauchlan Robertson
Music Credit: Harry Charles - Deer Park RemixSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
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Today we're talking with Bec Sweeney, an amazing product leader about how curiosity can be an incredible tool for you to focus on.
"That feeling of being in the grey is a good thing, and the more we can try and navigate it through kind of solid curiosity, and again, harnessing that curiosity, I think is where the magic lies"
Some key points:
We'll explore how deliberate curiosity plays are role in a product leaders success. We discuss when going deep on a topic is useful and when to bring yourself back up again. How your approach needs to change as you level up and move into management positions. The benefits of being genuinely interested the problems you're solving and how you can add value to your business. How following curiosity and seeking to disrupt the 'typical' career path can yield great results Read: Escaping the build trap by Melissa Perri------------------------------------------------------------------
We are Fran and Lauchlan, both Product Managers, and we are discovering the diverse skills and experience that are out there in the product world. We aim to inspire product people on their journeys. Opinions expressed are solely our own and do not express the views of our employers.
Get in touch: [email protected]
Presenters: Fran Gleisner, Lauchlan Robertson
Music Credit: Harry Charles - Deer Park RemixSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
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Today we have the pleasure of sharing with you our conversation with Product Leadership Coach Andrew Tokeley, known by everyone as "Tokes".
Tokes is well known in the Aotearoa Product Community. He launched ProductTank Wellington and is chair of Product Aotearoa. His claim to fame is being the first Product Manager at Xero back in the day. He is currently focusing on Product Leaders in Aotearoa and developing a network of CPOs across the country. We dig into this and more in the episode!
Some things to put on your read and listen list:
Read: The VP Product Role (M. Cagan) Listen: Unconformable Conversations with Josh Szeps Listen: Left, Right & Center Listen: Diary of a CEOWe hope you enjoy!
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We are Fran and Lauchlan, both Product Managers, and we are discovering the diverse skills and experience that are out there in the product world. We aim to inspire product people on their journeys. Opinions expressed are solely our own and do not express the views of our employers.
Get in touch: [email protected]
Presenters: Fran Gleisner, Lauchlan Robertson
Music Credit: Harry Charles - Deer Park RemixSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
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In this episode we welcome Corinna Stukan to talk about the topic of data! Corinna is the author of The Insights Driven Product Manager: Master Product Metrics And Uncover True Data Insights.
Gumroad - ebook
Amazon - paperback or KindleWe have an amazing conversation that explore some of the many complexities around making great decisions as a product person using data.
Some key areas we explore are:
Understanding the value your products are delivering and how you can prove that through data. How data can help you make good decisions as a PM. What are the ways you should approach setting up a data culture. What are some common pitfalls and how can you avoid vanity metrics. The key metrics you should pay attention to for your business Read: Zero to One by Peter Thiel Listen: ReThinking with Adam GrantWe hope you enjoy!
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We are Fran and Lauchlan, both Product Managers, and we are discovering the diverse skills and experience that are out there in the product world. We aim to inspire product people on their journeys. Opinions expressed are solely our own and do not express the views of our employers.
Get in touch: [email protected]
Presenters: Fran Gleisner, Lauchlan Robertson
Music Credit: Harry Charles - Deer Park RemixSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
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In this episode of Product Journeys, we speak to Product Leader and Consultant Anthony Marter. on the topic of business acumen and his work to bring Product Leaders in Aotearoa together.
Anthony is chair of Product Aotearoa and co-founder of ProductTank Auckland. Anthony spoke at ProductTank Auckland with Melissa Firth, who we interviewed in Season 1, Episode 42. Listen to their talk: World Product Day - Getting real on commercial acumen.
Some of the key takeaways from this conversation:
How to start thinking about business acumen and some small steps to begin learning and flexing that muscle Bridging the gap between Product Leaders and the Exec Table Why solving organisational problems is key for Product to thrive Read: Turn the Ship Around by L. David Marquet Listen: One Knight in Product PodcastWe hope you enjoy!
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We are Fran and Lauchlan, both Product Managers, and we are discovering the diverse skills and experience that are out there in the product world. We aim to inspire product people on their journeys. Opinions expressed are solely our own and do not express the views of our employers.
Get in touch: [email protected]
Presenters: Fran Gleisner, Lauchlan Robertson
Music Credit: Harry Charles - Deer Park RemixSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
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In this episode of Product Journeys, hosts Fran Gleisner and Lauchlan Robertson go on a journey with Andy Hovey, from Xero to Xerra (but not yet Xerox), and dipping into the Andes on the back of a bike.
Andy has worked on websites, apps and software for over two decades. He’s currently the Chief Product Officer at Starboard, a ~25 person company making geospatial maritime software that governments buy to tackle issues like illegal fishing, biosecurity risks and smuggling at sea. Previously he’s led teams designing software that’s used by millions of people around the globe at technology companies like Xero and Amazon. He’s an enthusiastic but slow cyclist that likes long cycle touring trips and exploring the limits of what’s possible in ultra-endurance bikepacking races.
In this episode we dig into how to think about high performing teams (described as dots), how to think about impact that doesn't involve just shipping a feature, and how great features take many many many many small changes.
What you'll learn:
Why it's worth potentially expanding beyond your Job Description (JD) Using OKRs to drive collaboration in a company How feedback and collaboration can be combined Giggly demos and why it's important to just play with your productRead & listen:
Creative Selection by Ken Kocienda Creativity, Inc. by Ed Catmull The mom test Gibson Biddle on Medium Sam Harris and Lex Fridman podcastsWe hope you enjoy!
Please follow us and share with your colleagues and network. We've got an exciting season ahead so make sure you subscribe on your platform of choice!
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We are Fran and Lauchlan, both Product Managers, and we are discovering the diverse skills and experience that are out there in the product world. We aim to inspire product people on their journeys. Opinions expressed are solely our own and do not express the views of our employers.
Get in touch: [email protected]
Presenters: Fran Gleisner, Lauchlan Robertson
Music Credit: Harry Charles - Deer Park RemixSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
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Welcome to the first episode of Season 2!
In this episode of Product Journeys, hosts Fran Gleisner and Lauchlan Robertson kick off the second season with an engaging conversation with Ben Pujji, the Chief Product Officer at atomic.io. We talk about influence and how important it is for building to build credibility and keep showing up. Ben brings a wealth of knowledge from his extensive career in Product management and other fields and we talk about the role influence plays in creating successful products.What you'll learn:
The difference between influence and influencing How to build influence (and why you would want to do that). The importance of credibility How your seniority impacts what type of influence you might need.It's a great episode! Please follow us for me and share with your colleagues and network. We've got an exciting season ahead so make sure you subscribe on your platform of choice!
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We are Fran and Lauchlan, both Product Managers, and we are discovering the diverse skills and experience that are out there in the product world. We aim to inspire product people on their journeys. Opinions expressed are solely our own and do not express the views of our employers.
Get in touch: [email protected]
Presenters: Fran Gleisner, Lauchlan Robertson
Music Credit: Harry Charles - Deer Park RemixSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
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This episode is an intro to our season two!
We are Fran and Lauchlan, both Product Managers, and we are discovering the diverse skills and experience that are out there in the product world. We aim to inspire product people on their journeys. Opinions expressed are solely our own and do not express the views of our employers.
Get in touch: [email protected]
Presenters: Fran Gleisner, Lauchlan Robertson
Music Credit: Harry Charles - Deer Park RemixSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
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Here is a rerun of an episode with Elina. We had a lot of fun chatting to her, so we hope you enjoy this throwback.
Elina is a co-founder of Storyo, a platform that shares the journeys of women and gender diverse people in Aotearoa. With 170+ stories in the bag, Elina does a lot of advocacy work around diversity, equity, inclusion and storytelling. She works as an Experience Designer in the health sector, with a background in product and strategy. Combining her experience in the tech sector and passion for equity work, she recently launched an Equitable Product cohort course, alongside 4 other kick-ass facilitators.
We talked through lots of interesting things including:
Ethics and equity in product management Read: Design Justice by Sasha Costanza-Chock Listen: Asian in Aotearoa------------------------------------------------------------------
We are Fran and Lauchlan, both Product Managers, and we are discovering the diverse skills and experience that are out there in the product world. We aim to inspire product people on their journeys. Opinions expressed are solely our own and do not express the views of our employers.
Get in touch: [email protected]
Presenters: Fran Gleisner, Lauchlan Robertson
Music Credit: Harry Charles - Deer Park RemixSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
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Today we have a rerun of an early episode talking to Ramanan Moorthy.
Ramanan is a Product Manager at Xero and has been with the company nearly 4 years. Ramanan is a pragmatic product leader who subscribes to modern product management practices. In the recent past, he contributed to the product community via Product Tank Auckland; by connecting NZ product people with international product thought- leaders. His career goal is to help demystify product management and help create good product leaders. His proudest achievement outside work is climbing Everest Base Camp which is about 5400m height in Himalayas.
Ramanan shared some awesome links, and we hope you enjoy them too:
Motivational mapping & Developmental plan https://miro.com/app/board/uXjVPfuGJ-g=/ Success triangle http://cohenbrown.com/performance-grapevine/5-behaviors-that-effect-change-my-personal-journey/ Transformational listening https://productmasterynow.com/blog/384-why-listening-is-the-next-product-management-superpower-with-christine-miles/ 1 Hour 1 Page https://medium.com/on-human-centric-systems/one-page-one-hour-c064e27009ee Getting stakeholder buy-in https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t7MWiLvMXXQ------------------------------------------------------------------
We are Fran and Lauchlan, both Product Managers, and we are discovering the diverse skills and experience that are out there in the product world. We aim to inspire product people on their journeys. Opinions expressed are solely our own and do not express the views of our employers.
Get in touch: [email protected]
Presenters: Fran Gleisner, Lauchlan Robertson
Music Credit: Harry Charles - Deer Park RemixSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
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Here is a re-run of Season 1 Episode 30. We hope you enjoy this episode with Tanya Johnson.
Tanya has worked in product teams for 20+ years, with leadership roles spanning across strategy, product management, design, and software development. Specialising in high growth fast-scaling technology and SaaS companies, Tanya strives to create diverse team environments - championing the development of innovative products that reflect our communities.
Tanya leads multiple product and engineering teams in her role as Chief Product Officer at Auror, and is responsible for its ethical product development focus. Tanya understands the pivotal role software plays in minimising the harm to marginalised communities, and draws on her significant experience in tech and SaaS to navigate this path.
A champion of women's and LGBTQ+ voices, Tanya is the founder of the well-known organisation NZTech WomeNB (formerly Women in Tech), advocating for greater visibility, voices, and roles for women and non-binary people in the wider tech industry.
In this episode we talked about many things including:
How having 1-1s fills Tanya's cup and how she worked out what brings her joy at work Executive coaches and mentoring new PMs How diverse teams help solve problems The secret sauce: what Tanya looks for in a Product Manager AI: global responsibility and government legislation Negative roadmaps (what's not on the roadmap) Read: Intelligent Disobedience by Ira Chaleff and Shouting Zeros and Ones by Andrew Chen Listen: We F*@kin Love Startups hosted by Troy Hammond------------------------------------------------------------------
We are Fran and Lauchlan, both Product Managers, and we are discovering the diverse skills and experience that are out there in the product world. We aim to inspire product people on their journeys. Opinions expressed are solely our own and do not express the views of our employers.
Get in touch: [email protected]
Presenters: Fran Gleisner, Lauchlan Robertson
Music Credit: Harry Charles - Deer Park RemixSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
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We are back with a rerun of our conversation with Chloe Leon.
Chloe is an empathetic product leader with a passion for creating elegant solutions that solve real-world problems. Her background is in technology consulting which led to her to the world of Product Management. Chloe prides herself in continuous learning and building structures that lead to high performing, empowered product teams.
Here are some of the things we discussed during our conversation:
Learn customer empathy with Teresa Torres and Continuous Discovery Habits and the opportunity solution tree Instrumentation and metrics - cost to serve and cost of acquisition Read: Gifts of Imperfection by Brene Brown Listen: Freakonomics Radio------------------------------------------------------------------
We are Fran and Lauchlan, both Product Managers, and we are discovering the diverse skills and experience that are out there in the product world. We aim to inspire product people on their journeys. Opinions expressed are solely our own and do not express the views of our employers.
Get in touch: [email protected]
Presenters: Fran Gleisner, Lauchlan Robertson
Music Credit: Harry Charles - Deer Park RemixSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
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In this Episode, Fran and Lauchlan reflect upon season one. They focus on the things that surprised them, the learnings they took away and some of the key points that resonated.
They would love to know what surprised you, what you learnt and what has resonated for you. And if you could choose one episode to re-run which episode would that be?
Our rapid fires:
Do you have any books or articles you would recommend? Do you listen to any good podcasts? What are you grateful for? What is your call to action?------------------------------------------------------------------
We are Fran and Lauchlan, both Product Managers, and we are discovering the diverse skills and experience that are out there in the product world. We aim to inspire product people on their journeys. Opinions expressed are solely our own and do not express the views of our employers.
Get in touch: [email protected]
Presenters: Fran Gleisner, Lauchlan Robertson
Music Credit: Harry Charles - Deer Park RemixSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
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In this Episode, the final episode of Season 1, we talk to Melissa Firth.
Melissa Firth is an experienced software executive and product & CX leader with 25+ years in digital media, product development & innovation in B2C, B2B, SaaS and public sector. She’s currently working as a “fractional executive” helping kiwi tech companies realise their growth goals.
Experimenting to learn is key when you're on leading edge of technology Creating space for innovation is important and safe to fail spaces are a must You need to understand the Profit and Loss (P&L) of products, go make friends with your finance department You need to link value creation to value capture, the dollars are a direct connection to success of a product. The missing 33% by Susan Colantuono 3 Horizons by Mckinsey Running Lean by Ash Maurya Hard fork with Kevin Roose and Casey Newton Lenny's podcast
Here are some of the key points we talked about:------------------------------------------------------------------
We are Fran and Lauchlan, both Product Managers, and we are discovering the diverse skills and experience that are out there in the product world. We aim to inspire product people on their journeys. Opinions expressed are solely our own and do not express the views of our employers.
Get in touch: [email protected]
Presenters: Fran Gleisner, Lauchlan Robertson
Music Credit: Harry Charles - Deer Park RemixSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
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In this Episode we talk to Penny Wildash.
In March 2008, as an accountant and mum looking to return to work, Penny sought a role that provided flexibility and, unwittingly joined a very hectic early stage Xero as part of customer team. 5 years later she moved into the product team as a BA, following into PO, PM & finally the Snr Group Product Manager role. She describes it as a very personal journey of growth, and baptism of fire with her first solo product lead role. Her current role is the dream job she had never dreamt of, collaborating with other product teams, sharing knowledge & experiences, creating a product strategy that changes SBs & ABs lives for the better, doing more with less and helping BAs & product leaders grow and develop. Penny is under no illusion that her growth journey will ever be done.
What it's like being a shy, less confident product leader Methods to help get better at presenting and public speaking (including a session with kiwi icon Jason Gunn) Story mapping by Jeff Patton - a tool for your toolbox! Read: Atomic Habits - by James Clear Read: The Cold Start Problem - Andrew Chen Listen/Read: Radical Candor - Kim Scott Listen: We F*kin Love Startups
Here are some of the key points we talked about:------------------------------------------------------------------
We are Fran and Lauchlan, both Product Managers, and we are discovering the diverse skills and experience that are out there in the product world. We aim to inspire product people on their journeys. Opinions expressed are solely our own and do not express the views of our employers.
Get in touch: [email protected]
Presenters: Fran Gleisner, Lauchlan Robertson
Music Credit: Harry Charles - Deer Park RemixSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
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In this Episode we talk to Adam Wright. This is part 2 of 2:
Deciding what your next role should be and factors to consider How to interview for a product role Mentors, coaches and sparring partners Building a product toolkit Read: Loom driving people back to their product - the curiosity gap Read: Measure what matters - John Doerr Listen: Product School podcast
Adam began his product journey as a leap from QA, and gained experience at Flux federation building energy management software, before heading to Xero, a stint at a digital conferencing startup, before returning to Xero and now at Kiwi edtech Education Perfect. Adam has learned a tonne along the way and seen the good bad and the ugly and learned a lot about operating in each of these environments.
Here are some of the key points we talked about:------------------------------------------------------------------
We are Fran and Lauchlan, both Product Managers, and we are discovering the diverse skills and experience that are out there in the product world. We aim to inspire product people on their journeys. Opinions expressed are solely our own and do not express the views of our employers.
Get in touch: [email protected]
Presenters: Fran Gleisner, Lauchlan Robertson
Music Credit: Harry Charles - Deer Park RemixSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
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