Episodes
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How do you take a challenger brand from number two and make it number one?
And how do you do that with a relentless focus on positive behavior change?
Those are the kinds of challenges that Mark DiMassimo and Lesley Bielby love to tackle at DiGo Brands, and over the past twenty years, they have elevated and re-energized numerous better-for-you brands, including Weight Watchers, Crunch Fitness, The Partnership to End Addiction, The Bronx Zoo, and Better Help, just to name a few.
Whether they're making award-winning ads or redesigning a brand's identity from top to bottom, their work combines the latest findings from behavioral science with a unique blend of humanity, humility, and just the right amount of absurdist humor.
Our conversation takes some wonderfully unexpected twists and turns as we try to decipher the motivating emotions surrounding embarrassment and the importance of teamwork when it comes to new business pitches.
Some of my favorite aha moments talking with Mark and Lesley include:
Their “go-for-the-jugular” approach when it comes to customer researchHow they turned HelloFresh from a challenger brand into the undisputed category leaderThe key research findings and creative executions that allowed Better Help to connect with a wider audience The insightful and entertaining ways they transformed Crunch Fitness into a national brandHow Mark’s experience in his grandparents’ hair salon and Lesley’s experience as a hypnotherapist have shaped their approach to strategy and creativityShow Notes:
Below are links to campaigns and other inspiring ideas that came up during our conversation.
Campaigns
Visit Oslo
Movies
“Easy A” Trailer
“The Secret Life of Walter Mitty” Trailer
“The Holdovers” Trailer
PodcastsAny Insights Yet? Episode 10: Andy Pearson at Liquid Death
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What is risk?
For most people, a risky situation is one where you’re exposed to danger.
Put another way, it’s the possibility of something bad happening.
But for Andy Pearson, VP of Creative at Liquid Death, the definition of risk takes an interesting detour. For Andy, the real danger is not that something bad will happen, but that nothing will happen at all.
No reaction. No learning. No breakthroughs.
Just a boring piece of creative, dead on arrival, completely ignored.
That’s why, over the course of his career, Andy has developed a habit of pushing himself into uncomfortable situations and doing “scary stuff” so that he can explore ideas that most people won’t even consider.
But scary stuff isn’t the same as doing anything.
There is always a Liquid Death Logic underneath every idea that helps the team connect the dots between dumb ideas and smart ideas in unexpected ways.
Some of my favorite aha moments talking with Andy include:
Andy’s favorite activations at Liquid Death and why he loves themOne of the scariest things Andy did early on in his career before Liquid Death that has shaped his outlook on risks and creativityThe questions Andy likes to ask in brainstorms to push ideas even furtherHow Liquid Death manages controversy and consistently transforms hate into something greatThe intriguing parallels between one of Andy’s hobbies (ultramarathons) and building a brandShow Notes:
Below are links to campaigns and other inspiring ideas that came up during our conversation.
Campaigns
Mike Cessario getting a fan’s face tattooed on his body
Limited edition corpse paint with e.l.f. beauty
The Yeti Casket Cooler
The “Freeze to Death” Cold Plunge Tank
Limited edition Hot Fudge Sundae flavor with Van Leewan Ice Cream
A partnership with Burton to create an unrideable snowboard called the Death Trap.
A contest where you could win a free L-39 Aero jet called The Dehydrator.
Cards Against Humanity Saves America
Movies
The Voyage Out by Barlow Jacobs (Coming Soon)
BooksBorn to Run by Christopher McDougall
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Episodes manquant?
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Why should strategists do focus groups with real humans if AI-enabled synthetic focus groups can yield an equally powerful aha moment at a fraction of the cost?
That’s one of several challenging questions I explore with Ed Cotton, brand consultant and former chief strategy officer from Butler, Shine, Stern & Partners (BSSP).
For the past 25 years, Ed has been at the helm of strategic planning in NYC, leading strategy for a wide variety of brands, including Amazon, Apple, BMW-MINI, Chipotle, EA, LG, Nestle, Nike-Converse, Unilever, and Wal-Mart.
In today’s fast-moving marketing environments, where CMO tenures are shorter than ever, Ed sees a multitude of opportunities that AI can offer - speed, cost reduction, and more ways to connect the dots.
But at the same time, he worries that the combined pressure of smaller budgets and tighter deadlines are creating situations where strategists are afraid to get out of the office or out of their comfort zone.
Some of my favorite aha moments talking with Ed include:
How to overcome insecurity as a junior strategistWhy big data can sometimes be misleading and doesn’t necessarily lead to more insightsWhich categories are most toxic for focus groups and what to do if you’re doing research in one of those categoriesHow one of Ed's favorite hobbies helps him see the world with fresh eyesA valuable life lesson that Ed learned from a creative director when he was just starting out as a strategist
Show Notes:Below are links to inspiring ideas that came up during our conversation.
Films (and books):Ed’s favorite recent book: The Anomaly by Hervé Le Tellier
Annihilation - Movie Trailer (Here's the book)
Zone of Interest - Movie Trailer (Here's the book)
CampaignsAirBnB Original Belong Anywhere Campaign Spot
AirBnB 1/2 Billion Guest Arrival Campaign Spot
Other Miscellaneous MusingsEd’s Substack - Provoke
Ed's Podcast - Inspiring Futures -
Tim Malefyt has an amazing ability to make the familiar strange.
He does this by doing deep, ethnographic research, helping brands uncover hidden consumer truths through a combination of carefully constructed activities and thoughtful conversation.
As a business anthropologist, Tim’s research methodologies and key findings have helped re-energize a number of big name brands across multiple categories, including Campbell’s, Gillette, FedEx, HBO, Revlon, PepsiCo, Cadillac, Crayola, and New Balance.
For Tim, context is everything.
If you want to understand a person’s behavior, you have to talk to them in the right context. That means getting them out of the focus group room, putting away the interrogation pad of paper, and talking with people in the environment where the behavior in question naturally takes place.
Because as Tim puts it, “It is in the doing, in the action, that the ‘knowledge of the body’ starts to come through.”
Some of my favorite aha moments talking with Tim include:
Reframing Campbell’s “dinner dilemma” into something more creative and communalThe surprisingly social nature of driving and the challenge that poses for self-driving carsDifferent metaphors one can use during interviews for more meaningful truthsHow to check for and overcome gender bias in research projects The way Tim’s experience as a ballet dancer has influenced his approach to research
Show Notes:Below are links to books, and other inspiring ideas that came up during our conversation.
Tim’s favorite recent book: The Overstory by Richard Powers
Another great book: Metaphors We Live By by George Lakoff and Mark Johnson
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Dan Cohen loves a good challenge.
Tell him he can’t say something in a campaign headline and he’ll find a creative way around it, to the delight of clients and customers alike.
Over the past thirty years, Dan’s creative, collaborative approach has helped a wide variety of brands in commoditized categories, including Bounty (paper towels), Charmin (toilet paper), Pampers (diapers), Pepto-Bismol (digestion), and Puffs (facial tissue).
He’s also worked on the other side of the advertising spectrum, re-energizing luxury brands like Rolex, DeBeers, and Bentley.
No matter what he’s working on though, Dan always manages to find those aha moments hiding in plain sight - in data points, personal experiences, and in casual conversations with his creative teams.
Some of my favorite aha moments talking with Dan include:
The data point that became a powerful springboard for Bounty’s latest campaign How to build awareness for brands in commoditized categoriesCharmin’s creative activations in unexpected places like Pottypalooza and Times SquareHow Gen-Z has upended the traditional approach to linear storytellingThe summer job Dan had in college that taught him a valuable lesson
Show Notes:Below are links to campaigns, books, and other inspiring ideas that came up during our conversation.
Wingmen Gronk & Julian Edelman Spill the Sauce on Their Patriot Days
Lions - Bounty Wingtracker Campaign | The Work
Charmin Restroom Activation in Times Square
Charmin Rollbot at the Consumer Electronics Show
Charmin Toilet Tunes - TikTok
Charmin Toilet Tunes - Spotify
Heinz Tilted Ketchup Label
Dan’s Favorite Recent Book - James by Percival Everett
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A great magic trick, like a great creative briefing, begins long before everyone gathers in a room.
To the general public, Mike Jacobson may be best known for his magic show performance on America’s Got Talent in 2023, but for the past decade in the business and advertising world, Mike has brought his unique methods to strategic briefings and creative campaigns for a wide range of clients, including Oreo, Subway, Comedy Central, Paramount, and other MTV Networks.
Some of my favorite aha moments talking with Mike include:
The surprising overlaps between magic, mentalism, and marketingHow to take a simple card trick (and a creative briefing) to a level 10 engagementMike’s terrible interview at 72andSunny and how he turned it around to get his first job in advertisingThe secret to priming your audience to be more receptive to your messageHow to get and hold people’s attention in an era of shrinking attention spansThe importance of confidence and mystery in modern marketing
Show Notes:Below are links to campaigns, books, and other inspiring ideas that came up during our conversation.
Mike’s performance on America’s Got Talent
The Last Barf Bag - Dramamine
Steve Martin Documentary Trailer on Apple+
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Sascha Mayer knows what it’s like to be invisible.
Like so many new moms nursing their children, if she wanted to nurse or pump when she was away from home, her options were often limited to a bathroom stall, an unattended room, or a parked car.
But it was around Labor Day weekend in 2006 that an article in the New York Times and a confluence of other events inspired a question that would change her life’s trajectory.
“Why are these women who are so visible to me so invisible to everyone else?”
That question - and the answers that followed - led Sascha and her co-founder Christine Dodson on a seven year journey to create Mamava, a revolutionary lactation pod for on-the-go moms (and dads) who need a clean, comfortable space for nursing, pumping, or bottle feeding.
From the first location in 2013 at the Burlington International Airport to more than 5,000 Mamava locations today, Sascha has channeled her bodacious optimism for mission-driven brands into the Mamava ecosystem, transforming a topic that was once invisible into something that is now highly visible, approachable, and welcoming.
Some of my favorite aha moments from our conversation include:
The process of coming up with a memorable name and provocative logo for MamavaBreaking down barriers and raising awareness around the topic of lactivism Finding key partners and “pollinators” to help carry the message and mission of Mamava Sascha’s favorite Mamava pod location and why it’s special to herThe importance of expanding the Mamava ecosystem from physical pods to a user-friendly appThe critical branding and ethnographic research lessons Sascha learned while working for Bernie Sanders and brands like Seventh Generation and Burton SnowboardsShow Notes:
Below are links to campaigns, shows, and other inspiring ideas that came up during our conversation.
Swehl Campaign in Times Square featuring Molly Baz
The Rehearsal - Trailer
Frida - The Motherload of Labor and Recovery Must Haves
The Bodacious Optimist Podcast
Heavyweight Podcast - Episode 24 - Jimmy and Mark
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There are a lot of strategy documents in the world. Briefs. Decks. White papers. Books. According to Alex M H Smith, most of them are full of shit. Impenetrable, calcified, piled-high bullsh*t.
That’s because, despite all their words and charts and graphs, these so-called strategies fail to inspire action.
And that’s what Alex wants to change in the world of strategy. With his book (No Bullsh*t Strategy) and his consultancy (BasicArts.org), Alex is on a mission to help brands differentiate themselves through bold, decisive action.
Some of my favorite aha moments talking with Alex include:
The difference between a bullshit strategy and a no bullshit strategyHow to redefine your competitive set to create a category of oneThe surprising lies that most marketers believe when it comes to targeting How to maintain differentiation when when copycats come in with commoditized claims How to reduce your strategy down to just one word
Show Notes:Below are links to campaigns, books, and other inspiring ideas that came up during our conversation.
No Bullsh*t Strategy - Alex M H Smith
Atomic Habits - James Clear
Grenade Protein Bars - UK
Alex’s favorite recent good book - The Matter with Things by Iain McGilchrist
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For over two decades, Shobha Sairam has worked on a wide variety of brands at a number of agencies around the world, including Leo Burnett, Mother, Deutsch, and The Community among others.
Most recently, Shobha has led strategy at 22 Squared Inc, based out of New York, where she and her team have breathed new life into brands like Baskin Robbins, Party City, Publix, and Toyota.
Over the years, Shobha’s research for different brands has exposed her to a variety of sensitive and challenging subjects, including sexual wellness, banking, and the American Dream, and her process for getting to the heart of people's feelings around such complicated subjects is inspiring.
Some of my favorite aha moments talking with Shobha include:
The surprisingly complex reasons people have sex and how those reasons led to the evolution of the K-Y brandMoving beyond the classic problem-solution formula that most brands adhere to The impact Gen Z has had on brands and storytelling across multiple categories Re-framing the banking industry away from the standard idea of “financial freedom” toward something more poignant and provocativeTransforming “What is” to “What If” in creative briefings and client work sessions to consistently get to more effective, engaging workShow Notes:
Below are links to campaigns and other inspiring ideas that came up during our conversation.
Oatly - Forced Perspective Campaign
Shobha’s most recent favorite book - The Sword and The Scimitar
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Most ad agencies have clients. That’s not exactly the case with Bullish Inc.
Started in 2015 by Michael Duda and Brent Vartan, the co-founders of Bullish asked a provocative “what if” question that re-envisioned what an agency could be to help maximize a new brand’s success.
Their question: “What if we invested in early stage brands by providing actual money along with world-class strategic and creative services?”
That question and their counterintuitive approach to brand-building has led to some impressive results for brands like Warby Parker, Harry’s, Casper, Peloton, Hu, Care/of, Nom Nom, and many more.
Some of my favorite aha moments talking with Brent include:
Exploring immutable human desires like family, honor, idealism as key starting points for brand-building.The role of vengeance as a rallying cry for brands and consumers How chasing after the lowest cost per acquisition is not always the best way to grow a brand The evolution of ecommerce to consultative commerce Brent’s secrets for getting consumers let down their guard during researchShow Notes:
Below are links to campaigns, books, and other inspiring ideas that came up during our conversation.
Jolly Rancher and the Jolly Rancher
Sunday Lawns - The Old Way Campaign Spot
The Psychology of Columbo
Brent’s favorite recent book - Never Split the Difference by Chris Voss
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Curiosity, conviction, and a desire to get out of one’s comfort zone - these are just a few of the characteristics that Seth Gaffney and Marika Wiggan look for in strategic candidates at Preacher, and it’s this non-traditional approach to finding talent and building campaigns that has led to Preacher’s continued success, winning them Small Agency of the Year for four of the last five years.
Some of my favorite aha moments from our conversation include:
Discovering the very different ways Seth and Marika broke into the world of advertisingScrappy techniques for learning about customer pain points and mapping out the customer journey The way Preacher is leveraging AI in their strategic work Funny and insightful stories from their work on Tommy John, Tecovas, Favor, WeTransfer, Sport Clips, and Foot Locker The personal advice from parents that have shaped their approach to the work they do every day
Show Notes:Below are links to campaigns, books, and other inspiring ideas that came up during our conversation.
Clipper Confessions - Tashanee Williams and Zachary Stubblefield understand from first hand experience with focus groups that bad research environments lead to bad answers which result in bad learnings and bad representation. So they took focus groups out of the focus group facility and into the Barbershop with Rich “Smash” Payne. Questions include: “What’s the dopest thing about black culture?” and “If a CEO was sitting in the shop right now, what advice would you give them to better support black people?” The answers are nuanced, rich, and revealing.
A few campaigns from Preacher:
Tommy John Campaign - No Adjustment Needed
Vital Farms Campaign - Bullsh*t Free Eggs
Tecovas Campaign - Don’t Go Gently
Favor Campaign - How Texas Orders In
Foot Locker - The Heart of Sneakers
A few campaigns that Seth and Marika admire:
IKEA - Proudly Second Best
Amazon - Spend Less on Your Kids
Capri Sun - Wireless Kid-Noise Canceling Technology
Favorite Books
Marika’s favorite recent book - Big Swiss
Seth’s favorite recent book - Go Ahead in the Rain: Notes to a Tribe Called Quest
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Introducing Any Insights Yet? with Chris Kocek.
