Episodes
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Mark introduces the topics of solitude and oneās persona
Jim jumps in to help contextualize this discussion
Mark reads the definitions of āPersonaā and āSolitudeā
Mark asks Jim about his trip
Jim separates being alone for a few minutes from the very different version of a 7 day solo trip
Jim has chosen solo trips in the last few years
He reflects on how his roles and personas have changed as heās aged
He talks about not caring what others think and how freeing that is
Mark reflects on the solitude that can from his divorce. He didnāt choose that but did choose how to respond to it
He says he really enjoyed being alone for 10 years. He defines what he meansā¦no committed relationship for 10 years. He talks about what solitude provided for him. Thoughts, ideas, gratitude, etcā¦
Jim says heās the best version of himself when heās alone
Heās grateful that his wife is supportive of these solo trips. She is encouraging now after understanding the value of solitude for her husband
Jim feels that women donāt like to be alone and men are more likely to enjoy solitude
Mark suggests that solitude brings out our human nature. Our true nature
Jim shares the recognition of getting older. How we donāt look or feel the same as we used to
He goes on to share details of his social interaction on one particular evening on the road
Jim says there are many different movies going on at the same time
Mark talks about looks and how young women donāt notice him any moreā¦and itās OK. Actually laughable
Jim talks about being in the same locale at three different agesā¦young, a bit older and middle aged
Both guys reflect on how young they feel versus how they look. Itās a wake up call every time he looks in a mirror. He talks about how he moves from one persona to the next (dad, son, pro, brotherā¦)
Jim talks about intentionally changing and updating our personal personas to remain authentic
Jim thinks we hold a lot in and donāt always feel comfortable being realā¦vulnerable. We donāt want to offend
Caring less about what other people think is critical to happiness. Moving on
Jim brings up the value and contribution of giving off positive vibes
Mark agrees but cautions about feeling responsible for otherās people happiness and then talks about his dad and the value of ignoring. The ability to ignore people and circumstances
Mark asks Jim about turning 60
Jim reflects on some of his experiences going back to places he went to as an older man. People are in a different place, different thoughts, different worldview
He shares another story on another evening on the road
Mark talks about how freeing it is to be around strangers. He feels braver. Less concerned about how strangers might feel about him
Jim thinks most people want to engage, but many donāt
Jim shares one of his stops at a property his dad left him. How different the place and people are now versus when he was young. How different he may have been had his family stayed and not moved to CA
Mark thinks turning 60 has had a big impact on both guys. 60 triggers different roles and different views, different friendships
Jim reflects on how industry and society have changed. The geeks arenāt running things anymore. Domain experts and solutions are more relevant than tech skills. Tech is tools. Problem solvers are in demand
Jim talks about the evolving definition of what a man is. That became confusing and we stuck with our guns. Men were men and still are
Weāre proud that we didnāt cave in to the woke mob
Mark share his process and how he begins every consultation with self reflection and he thinks people avoid self reflection because itās hard/difficult
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Mark introduces the topic of the power of the mind and self-talk
The idea that we now have science and data to support the value of positive talk, visualization and vibration in influencing our happiness and peace of mind
Jim got the idea from Billy Carsonās appearance on Lewis Howeās Greatness podcast
Jim shares the story of how we met. He was struggling mentally and emotionally and had some evidence that concussions might be part of his challenge. In his research, he found me. He flew out to Orlando and we met. Jim tells his concussion story and the details of his journey toward a solution
Jim sought a mixture of traditional medicine and alternative approaches (me)
When Jim got to a point of resolution, he thought his journey was over
It wasnāt. He then continued investigating. This podcast was part of it. He then share his take aways from the episode
Mark ties himself in by sharing his own routine. Mark brings out the wheel and points to the self, self-awareness and self-reflection
Mark shares his memory of sports psychology all the way back to little league and high school
Jim talks about thisā¦the āzoneā and how Michael Jordan functioned at a different frequency than everyone else. He played in the zone
Jim goes deeper into the science. Frequency and vibration
Mark shares his routine, which includes, breath, visualization, meditation and pryer
Small progress daily over time
Jim talks about hi being an inventor. How no-one actually invents anything newā¦they pull stuff from the universe and calibrate and align it to make it unique and novel
Mark jokes about how he used to doubt this stuff and how this stuff is mainstream now - external influences
He now exercises his mind with routines daily. He is excited about having control over his own well being
Jim gives an example of how our vibrations can be felt by others. We can vibrate to get others to shine
Jim brings politics He shares what the leader of Iran said about Israelā¦itās a mindsetā¦an ideology and mindset
He transitions into how these things come from past trauma unresolved
Einstein - Life is an illusion
Mark goes back to Jimās statement about control. We can control our thoughts by doing the work. Self awareness and overcoming/surrendering our limiting beliefs
Jim share his podcast guests reflection on how he changed his own life with affirmations and overcoming his own limiting beliefs
Mark brings up Sam Harris - If we talked to others like we talk to ourselves, weād get into a lot of fights. Because we are so mean to ourselves
Jim brings in the power of self forgiveness thru affirmations
Mark thinks history shows this work being done as far back as history is written
Mark talks about the notion of control and how he didnāt feel he had control over his thoughts for most of his young life
Jim feels like we are held back until we resolve these past traumas.
Mark talks about how his kids started holding him accountable to his unconscious behaviors and limiting beliefs
Jim also feels that objective 3rd parties are also very helpful with this stuff
Jim shares the connection between stress and physical illness
Mark talks about his dadās health and emotional balance based on his faith and the absence of stress in his life based on a Higher Power
Jim is somewhat envious of people that have true faith and he appreciates it more now
Mark shares how important it has been for him to maintain his mental/emotional routine
Mark shares his Oh God movie story
Mark reminds us that we now have science to back all this stuff up
Jim concludes with how our brains develop as kids through our 20ās. The guys joke about the stupidity of young men whose brains arenāt yet fully developed
The clean slate of young mens brains
Mark suggests that because there are so many credible sources of info on this, that we should all investigate this stuff more
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Episodes manquant?
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We just started talking. No Intro!
Mark brings up human nature. He suggests that men and women have unique natures as well
He says recognizing and acknowledging human nature is necessary as part of any discussion of behavior
Jim asks Mark his opinion about homosexuality
Mark shares his ignorance and his opinion as well as his curiosity
Mark brings up the Catholic Church
Jim shares his significant skepticism about the Catholic church, but he doesnāt want to go any deeper
So Mark shifts the topic to āstandingā. Who has it, how we give it to people and how it impedes our progress
He say weāre all judgmental and that itās also part of human nature
He brings up toxic bosses and personal accountability
Jim brings up unconscious bias and the evolution of the podcast from a point of self awareness
Jim shares his recent experience at a āGreen buildā event
How did we all become āactivistsā?
Mark says he thinks it comes from a need to belong and how human nature produces this need to belong to something
Jim brings back up agency and specifically writing a book. He thinks all men have a story/book in them. Jim thinks this ācontributionā need is also part of our nature
Jim thinks itās more a male than female need
Mark thinks this is an interesting conversation
Jim thinks men do things āin silenceā and he ties that into one of the purposes of the Imperfect Mens Club
Mark reflects on his own sensitivity. The disadvantages and the advantages. Jim looks for clarity about his sensitivity and Mark shares how his sensitivity has been a double edged sword
Jim identifies what he thinks is the important part of being sensitive. Itās good, unless it keeps you from being functional
Sensitivity and weakness are NOT the same
Jim shares a story - about conversation with a woman, ādonāt take it so personalāā¦āI take everything personalā
Jim challenged her and she got a bit defensive and awkward
Jim says he thinks we get softer as we age and Mark suggests some people do and some donāt
You get bitter or you get better
Mark loves the topic of sensitivity
Jim says to be good at something you have to be sensitive to feedback
Jim quotes about being respected versus liked
Mark shares his experience seeing a quote from Al Capone about weakness
Mark goes back to Jimās point about being functional. Weakness is a problem when it keeps you from functioning
Jim calls this āhypersensitivityā
Mark shares his perspective on the different āstagesā or āchaptersā in his life and how he needed to adjust as life evolved
He moved around a bit confused about his sensitivity
Mark observes how heās seen Jim evolve too
āA good human is going to evolveā
The other choice is misery. Bitter and better
Jim. āWe are all actors in the theater of lifeā
Jim agrees - different roles at different stages
Mark shifts to his recent āOut of body experience with a sound healing sessionā
Both guys appreciate the topic and share their respective opinions about it
Mark had 4 out of body experiences at 4 different ages of his life. He likens it to dreaming
Mark was inclined to share his experience with certain friends, including Jim
Mark talks about how this kind of event can be really greatā¦or much less so
Jim talks about Steve Jobās experience with meditative reflection and success
Mark talks about his different reflections on different protocols of self reflection, like his breath work. He reflects on the time he went looking for a church and a yoga studio and the importance of resonating with instructors
Jim shares more quotes
Fast - alone. Far - go together
āDonāt become addicted to your own strugglesā
āEverything is hard. If itās not hard, youāre not trying hard enough
Mark - āItās the Cool thing about wisdomā. Anyone can be wise and say wise things in different ways
Mark talks about getting advice from friends. Nice versus kind
Jim cautions about getting advice from friends and familyā¦āsome of the worst advice you can getā
Mark agrees but takes a slightly different approach. His fatherās opinion about starting his own company
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Mark introduces the topic of agency. Jim thinks Mark is a great example of what an agent is
He reads a definition and adds some context to what an agent is and how he may, in fact, be one
The value of having an objective third party negotiating on your behalf
Jim thinks AI will make being an agent much more valuable
He discusses the agents he uses. His patent agent, for example. Agents are not as close as we are to our capabilities and competencies
Agents can be particularly helpful negotiating your price. What youāre worth
He talks about his most recent projects to operate as an agent
Jim shares his story about a meeting he had recently and how heās being told he should write a book
The value of having your own book
He shares his āGreenbuildā story. What itās like in the San Francisco Bay Area regarding diversity, womenās groups and other woke topics
Jim thinks it would be great if we just got back to building things. Diversity on itās own is a silly topic
Jim shares his conversation with a grant writerā¦the importance of human interaction and how we are disconnecting from it
She brought up the book writing topic
Mark says he has also been told to write a book. He reflects on a couple of recent conversations. Both became about human interaction and the value of having an agent to move the professional ball forward. Objectivity alone can be very helpful. How powerful it is to have a 3rd party voice
Mark talks about the value of authority/credibility that a book brings
Jim asks Mark about how he works. He pokes at the details of how Mark chooses and helps people. He thinks we all underestimate our capability and willingness to help
Our value goes well beyond our direct skill. Trust opens up those doors
Mark shares how he has access to market data that might be worth even more than his coaching
Jim cautions Mark that this knowledge is NOT FREE
Second, he talks about IP and how valuable it is
Jim puts on his agent cap and shares with Mark how he might be his agent
Jim then goes into his opinion on AI and the creation contentā¦podcasts, books, articlesā¦everything
Jim thinks AI create content āequalityā
Mark loves the contrarian approach to rules and ways of doing things
Mark asks, āwhat am I worth?ā
Mark is convinced that Jim would ask for more than Mark would for himself
Jim gives examples of agents we all work with
Real estate agents, sports agents, career agentsā¦
He shares his pro baseball story about his friend the pro coach
The $40 million dollar negotiation and the value of an agent in that negotiation
Mark shares his perspective on the value of agency. He shares how helpful he can be to IT people who are mostly introverted
Mark shares how candid and authentic approaches are so much more influential
He shares his perspective on salespeople too
Mark brings up helping friends and family and Jim cautions that they might be a little too close to help objectively
Jim talks about being āunemployableā
Mark shares the importance of messaging and how your ābrandā fits in
Jim gives us a bit more detail about his 3 recent requests for speaking/advice gigs
Jim is wary of ābig consulting firmsā and Mark shares his perspective on this
He talks about competing against big brands/logos/t-shits/reputations by being authentic and practical and trustworthy. Different ulterior motives
Jim brings in the political agents who got it all wrong and are now wondering what to do next
Mark shares his confusion about how these people/agents keep getting hired
He also clarifies how powerful brand is and how clients without confidence hire brand simply to protect themselves. Momma duck and her ducklings
Jim says the big ad agencies do the same thing
Are the industries going away?
If you canāt measure it, you canāt determine efficacy. Jim says AI will change this
Mark - why do they hire the big known brand?
Itās all changing
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Mark leads with the definition of āfortitudeā and āself fortitudeā
He suggests the one is more internal and the other more external
Jim shares his recent difficult week due to 4 or 5 people he is close to are experiencing hardship. From illness to the loss of a young man to suicide
Jim puts his experiences in the context of our āFlywheel of Lifeā
āWhen youāre healthy you have hundreds of things on your mind. When youāre ill, you have oneā
Jim shares some of the challenges his friends have. His mom is in pain, his cousin has cancer and another has upcoming surgery. Finally his colleague who just lost a son to suicide
Upon hearing the news, Jim thought he was seeing/hearing thingsā¦hoping it wasnāt true
He shares how he responded āforgive me for what I sayāā¦Heās in a better placeā¦itās difficult to be a man todayā¦ā
Jim has 3 friends who have lost sons
Mental illness becomes a topic of discussion
Mark agrees how difficult it is to respond to such a tragedy
Apologizing for the cliche, Mark reminds us that life is about how you respondā¦not what happens to you
Jim - this is where fortitude comes inā¦you gotta reach deep Jim seems to feel he was helpful based on his friends response
The guys discuss suicide. Is it selfish or unselfish? Mark talks a bit about his momās suicide. He tries to put it in perspective. How the emotional experience evolved from anger to relief to sadness to loss
Jim chimes in about Markās story and gets perspective from it
Then Mark talks about settling his momās estate. Prolonging the lossā¦
Jim expounds on his comment - āItās difficult to be a maleā
Mark agrees that society has challenged the notion of masculinity
Mark shares that he has 4 generations to sample experience from
He condemns the phrase ātoxic masculinity. He talks about human nature and his experience as a man. Itās harder to be a man than itās ever been
Jim asks Mark to share some suicide stats. Biggest killer of men under 45
60 men every minute of every day 365 days a year
He quotes Gabor Mate and suffering
He mentions the Harvard study of men
Jim brings up depression as a root cause of suffering and suicide
Jim shares his own experience with depression
Mark says his experience with mental illness is mostly second hand. His experience in context. How his position on mental illness has evolved and how he thinks we need to bring it more out into the open
Jim says we have also lost our sense of humor and that doesnāt help. How being around people who can laugh at life is so important
Mark and Jim laugh about Jim just turning 60. He says heās thinking about doing a roast and both guys have fun with that. We can laugh at life
Mark - the funeral is not for the dead. Itās for the people left behindā¦he attaches that to the young mans suicide. Celebrating their life and not living in sadness about the loss of
Fortitude can get your through and past tragedy
Mark applauds Jimās choice of words. āPlease forgive me for what Iām about to sayā. How hard it is to express your sadness
āhe didnāt want to be here. heās in a better placeā
Mark shares some perspective on how the living need to be considered. Also how sad people to present as sad
Nobody
Mark hopes people can take away something helpful
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Mark introduces the topic of serving others and connects it to the flywheel of life in the category of relationships/others.
Jim brings up the wheel and discusses each of the 5 areas - Money, worldview, relationships, health and career/profession
This episode is about others. Men and women
He says there are two types of service and then shares his recent event KBIS in Las Vegas. He was selected as #1 membership chair in the country
Two types of service are paid and unpaid
He talks about the unpaid type - how different it is to serve for pay and to serve simply to serve
āUnconditionalā service. Helping others with no expectation of anything in return
Politics comes up
Service isnāt for everyone
Mark shares his view of service. He distinguishes between help and service. Purpose comes with more responsibility
Mark and Jim disagree about the line between paid and unpaid
Jim feels like one is a transaction and one is just service. Mark thinks its more nuanced than that
The disagreement between the guys is interesting
Jim brings up the local church and Mark laughs. Mark feels that there is a muddled definition of service in the church
Mark shares his challenge with the Catholic Church and this exact confusion with service versus transactions. They agree to disagree
Jim shares a story about his trip to Vegas and the call he got from a former player. The kid is in trouble and needs Jimās helpā¦in the form of money
Jim explains his thought process as he determines whether to help the kid - the kid needs money. He misbehaved in an airport and he now has a court date
Jim walks us through the conversation he has with the kid and his suggested resolution
āI donāt loan moneyā
He deftly walks the kid through the reality of his situation and he agrees to āgiveā him $1400
āI donāt want you to pay me back the moneyā
As things develop, it becomes clear that this kids future is on the line
He asks the kid to call him back tomorrow so he can reflect on it. Jim concludes that without his help, the kid is fucked
Jim recognizes he may never see this kid again and he may never know if his help was effective, but decides to go all in Money, help, advice, paperwork, alcohol treatment, etcā¦
Unconditional serviceā¦or conditional?
Mark shares his opinion on why he supports Jimās process for determining whether to help. Mark supports the kids personal accountability. He agrees itās just a bad decision and the kid deserves a break
Jim goes into more detail about the circumstances. Part of which is that he is a very big and dark man. He scared peopleā¦unintentionally. His encounter with cops was verbal, not physical. He swore at the cop and got cuffed
Jim sees the opportunity to get off is realā¦no physical confrontation
Mark summarizes his assessment of Jimās process in determining whether to help the kid or not
Jim - āYou can pay me back in other ways. I want your wordā
Mark shares the importance of wanting to be helped. This kid was ready to be helped
Mark readdresses the distinction between helping and charging for help. How he struggles with this
Jim asks Mark about entitlement and then wants Marks opinion on the word āpetulantā
Mark pulled petulant out of political behavior.
Petulant, entitled people donāt take responsibility and they play victim
They have a laugh about their disagreement
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Jim - the most important conversation youāll ever have is with yourselfā¦and that person is a crazy person
Jim frames service in the context of bringing a product or service to the market to help people in some ways
He frames this in the context of his most recent project that he asked Mark for help with - his talk about the kitchen and bath industry
Jim asks. If itās not just money, why do we seek to serve. Whatās the bigger picture
Both guys feel strongly that they have something to offer the world and the world has things to offer them
Our experience leaves us with knowledge and wisdom that come from that unique experience
Mark brings up his faith. āGod, help me out. What do you want me to be doing again?ā
Jim brings up his summary doc (which he creates for each episode) on which mentions Godās greater design
Are you going to die with your art in you or are you committed to putting it out in the world
What have you overcome and how can you share that to help others
Mark talks about obstacles and how we all find ourselves in a particular seat at a particular time for some reason
Mark shares his journey into the recruiting world and how he evolved into an expert in that specific space - career development
Jim shares how important he thinks Markās work is
Mark says itās top 5 for people. He takes that responsibility very seriously
Mark shares his story about helping his friend with confidence
Jim says confidence is everything and itās hard to maintain over the course of a lifetime
Mark mentions his divorce in the context of confidence and how he lost it and the trip to get it back. Validation from the outside
Jim āYou are most able to help the person you once wereā
He talks about resistance - fear is self centered
Why wouldnāt you share? Because youāre scared
Mark shares a few stories about helping a few people overcome their fears
Enough confidence to overcome his fear - to take action
Mark shares how fear is now a trigger for him to keep going. It doesnāt stop him, it encourages him
Jim talks about the value of solving one specific problem. What is it and why is it a problem
Mark says do we help them rid themselves of the fear or do we simply help them push past it
Jim reads a few more quotes. Solutions versus problems
Mark asks, āif my deliverable is confidence, what does that look like?ā
Messaging in a noisy world
What specific problem are we solving?
You have to frame the problem well. Specifically and powerfully
Without the problemā¦what does life look likeā¦specifically. Pain and pleasure
Mark shares his opinion of the SNL auditions he watched during the 50th anniversary celebration - vulnerability, fear, riskā¦with everything on the line
Jim talks about the value of a third party testimonial/referral/recommendation
Mark laughs about the irony for me teaching about this and yet having a hard time doing it himself
JImās three āEāsā
Educate, Entertain and Encourage
Mark says heās going to steal the 3 Eās
Markās tip from a coach ātell them something theyāve never heard before that they know to be trueā
Jim - āEnter the conversation theyāre already having with themselvesā
Mark shares some takeaways - specifically about asking for help
Mark commits to delivering confidence
Jims speaks about being known and being clear
Mark agrees that most people are unclear
Mark wraps up with how happy he was to help Jim
āStick your neck out there manā
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Mark introduces the topic and both guys have personal accounts of dealing with making themselves vulnerable
Jim thinks that most of us donāt put ourselves out there
Jim brings in our flywheel and the 5 areas of life and then uses his 5 Wās approach (Why, who, when, where and what)
Mark reads the definition of self-vulnerability that Jim provides from his online searches about the topic
Jim says acknowledging your strengths is easy, but sharing your weaknesses is much harder
Jim shares his fear he experienced getting ready for a recent webinar presentation. He wonders why he put himself out there and pushed himself like he did. He felt humiliated and uncomfortable
Mark appreciates the vulnerability and shares his perspective from the outside looking in. He shared what he thought was his role in helping Jim
Jim shares Marks comments after the recording about the difference between team and individual sports
Mark shares a tennis story and how it became more than tennis. It became a mental and emotional exercise. He reflects on the pride of the win
Jim shares his opinion on how new things are met with resistance and growth is on the other side of the resistance
Mark suggests that Jim will be happy he did it and not whether it was good or not
Mark shares his vulnerable experience writing his most recent workbook. How challenging it has been to send it out and await feedback. What if they say it sucks?
The voices in your head
Jim shares 5 examples of self vulnerability
1. Embracing your imperfections. Itās hard to be kind to yourself. How ironic that our podcast is all about imperfection
2. Admitting your mistakes instead of denying them or blaming others. Jim has grown to appreciate people that own their own shit. Mark asksā¦if you donāt own it, how do you get better
3. Accepting your emotions. Process instead deny. Mark shares his daughters experience with embracing fear
4. Acknowledge your limitations (Clint Eastwood quote). Jim shares a text from his future daughter in law and expands on how aging has changed his view of his own limitations and who he surrounds himself with. Mark shares the difference between physical and emotional āfinish linesā. Jim goes further into his inner voice and self reflection as a dyslexic - embarrasment. Both guys share perspectives on criticism. Mark talks about his fear of apathy versus hate. Markās two voices - imposter and expert. The crazy inner voice
5. Being honest about your needs. Saying no to other people and projects. You need others help with almost everything
Jim talks about the effort and energy he put into his talkā¦and he still wasnāt satisfied. He shares his friendās opinion on his webinarā¦āI know why you think it suckedā¦theyāre fuckin hardā
Mark gives both guys creditā¦most people wonāt take the risk
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Today Jim and I welcome a special guest. Paul Carroll was my mentor in the start-up staffing space at the beginning of my career and he joins us today to talk about his latest work volunteering with young men in the foster care system
We started recording before my introduction:). It sounded good so we decided to keep rolling. Sorry for any confusion
Pauls shares his sense of urgency and the āsignsā that showed up for him that got him interested in this work initially
He shares how the work went from theoretical to practical
Jim asks Paul if this is similar to the problem/solution approach heās taken in business. Paul says yes, but he brought some other experiential nuance to bear
Jim asks why heās doing it. Paul explains how his life has evolved to make this available to him. Itās time and he feels he can make an impact
Jim mentions how being independent allows us to do this ānon-profitā work. An dhow important it is for kids to have a purpose
Paul shares his sonās squash career and how he brought in his foster kids to the program and how those cultures mixed and mingled
Heās found that other similar organizations have been interested in him sharing his approach as well
Paul shares some details of his upbringing. How he was raised by a āvillageā along with his mom
Jim reflects on the multicultural nature of Paulās group of kids and how what they look like just doesnāt matter. Paul shares how diverse his hiring always was, because it was about results, not appearances. He emphasizes the importance of peopleās childhoods in determining how to motivate and challenge them
Jim brings Mark into the discussion. Mark shares his relationship with Paul and how theyāve reconnected. He talks about mentorship and reads a definition
Mark reflects on the similarities of what Paul is doing now to what heās always done
Mark met Paul when he was 26. He shares how they met and started working together
The guys joke about Paul being āniceā or ākindā and the simplicity of his approach
Then Jim asks Paul about Mark. Paul shares his opinion of Markās strengths and contextualizes their beginning in the early 90ās in Orlando, FL
Jim asks Paul if his eye for talent transfers into his assessment of his current group of foster kids. Paul says yes it does. A little direction and hand holding. Some kindness, patience and mentorship coupled with some activities is sometimes all these kids need
Jim asks Mark to read the definition of wisdom and then asks Paul what he thinks. He sees wisdom as life experience and travel experience. Been there, done that. I see the fork and if you go that way, itās not going to be pretty
Paul putās life in perspective and reflects on his motherās advice. No regrets. He learned that early. Pauls says he has things he still wants to do, but he has no regrets
Mark shares Pauls testimonial about the podcast and his sonās enjoyment of it
Mark reflects on Paulās influence and in particular how to be in a moment. Paying attention and recognizing when youāre in a moment and how simplicity plays a role in success
Jim shares our wheel and then lists some of our āselfā lists. He teaches his boys self respect and feels strongly that this is the key. Everything is temporary and life is a series of choices. If you maintain your self respect, everything else will come to you. Look at life through your own eyes
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Episode 3 Bygone Era
Mark introduces the topic for this episode. The notion of there being a bygone era. Jim suggested the topic given the current political landscape and the guys explore other applications of the notion in life
Mark reads the Google definition
Jim comes in and suggests that we have entered a new era. He brings of his 5 W framework and the concept of self awareness (Who,what,when,where and why)
Jim cites The Biden administration and his cronies being part of this ābygone eraā
He claims everyone wants to remain relevant
Mark recalls his start in recruiting and how technology and communication has evolved since then. How important self awareness is to stay current
Jim brings up sports - coaches are aging out. Specifically Andy Reid of the Chiefs and Bill Belichick as examples
JIm reflects on Joe Bidenās legacy is sad
Mark mentions his brotherās retirement and says Biden is retiring. Jim says noā¦he got fired
Weāre all gonna retire someday. Jim says at some point itās time to pull back. He reminds us of how our adult children keep us honest and current
Mark reflects on his appreciation for Jimās candor in disagreeing with him
The value of hanging out with people who are kind, not nice. Jim agrees and shares his opinion as to why this is
Jimās quote - āYou canāt kill a thought. It has to die of old age or natural causesā
He cites the military as an example and then brings up all the āthoughtsā that have recently died of natural causes DEI, etcā¦
Mark reminds us of Vince Lombardi type coaching as well as old leadership styles involving giving orders
Jim shares his personal coaching experiences with WWII trained coaches. Football and the military. Then he shares how heās seen the new coaching style emerged starting with Bill Walsh. His approach was more intellectual
Mark brings up the current concussion protocol and how it used to be getting your bell rung and smelling salts
Jim talks about rising to the top and how that exposes you to criticism. Some people can handle this and most canāt. Biden couldnāt
Mark shares his daughterās experience reaching the top of her profession and the pressure. The price you pay for being on top
What chapters have closed? Itās time to move on and many wonāt want to. Theyāll cling to the bygone era as if itās not yet bygone
Jim brings up Hollywood as an example of a group who wonāt likely move on
Mark clarifies that just because youāre good at one thing doesnāt meant mean you are good at anything else. Jim and Mark reflect on Hollywood in the 40ās and 50ās versus today. Old stars went to war. Athletes went to war. Today the stars are pampered and can hide from their lack of credibility
The guys get deeper into how things used to be. Patriotism and serviceā¦is this a bygone era?
Jim shares his story about the Japanese soldier (Hiro Anoda) who fought for 30 years after the war was over because he couldnāt believe it was over. Are we fighting wars that donāt exist
Mark shares how he fought his divorce battle far past when he should have stopped
āDoesnāt it take two people to fight?ā What if you just stopped?
Jim shares a similar story about a good friend of his. āYou need to create your own rules. Create a whole new gameā
Sometimes we stop being served by our old rules and we need to change
Jim shares another story about his current high schoolās football team and how dramatically some rules have changedā¦the world has changedā¦itās a bygone era
Mark ends with his stubborn Starbucks policy story:)
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Mark introduces the episode about belief systems in the context of the fires in Southern California
Rememberā¦Jim is a California native still living in the Bay Area and Mark has lived in Florida since 1990
Two very different perspectives and responses to natural disasters!
Jim says itās personal because he has friends and family in the fire zone
He brings in our tag line and framework. He says weāll try and find some good in all of it. He cites our 5 areas with focus on worldview
Jim share some of his preparation for the episode. He asks Mark to read the definition of ābelief systemsā
Then Jim goes into his 5 Wās (Why,what,who,when,where)
The power of self awareness and where all this is going politically, nationally and locally
Mark suggests that he sees two things. The national presence and the local presence. Nationally we are tiring of a lack of leadership. Locally we are still flexing against our national leadership. One side is focused on resolution and prevention, the other side is focused on climate change. Mark thinks itās absurd and Jim agrees. Heās confused about how different people can see different things. Heās disgusted with the climate change narrative and Governor Newsome. He asks, āwhat is the governmentās role?ā Jim shares how CA used to be the best in the world at innovation and irrigation. The Central Valley back to the Gold Rush
āCal doesnāt have a water problem, we have a water management problemā
He asks how this is happening? The environmentalists have positioned animals as more important than human
Mark says itās delusional. Jim says itās the whole Democrat party belief system
JIm says the spin is comingā¦this is a climate crisis and we need to double down. He believes the opposite is true
Mark shares how personal involvement can change how we feel about tragedy. He thinks the fact that rich celebrities are touched by this might shift peopleās belief systems away from climate change
Jim cites the homelessness these fires have created - how crazy it is that we give free shit to illegals and now these Americans wonāt get free assistance of any kindā¦$$millions$$
Mark brings it back to belief systems. He brings up the 3 top leaders in the discussion - they all sought blame as an initial response. Personal accountability versus blame
Jim asksā¦can you change your belief system? Mark says yesā¦if you have a story of change that makes sense
Jim shares the perspective of his childhood and how unique those belief systems wereā¦and why. Mark agrees itās generational
Mark reflects on his childhood and accountability. Both guys agree. Jim shifts to how our professions affect us and the media as well
Mark shares his story about not watching the news. Jim challenges Markās position and adds his two cents
Mark and Jim share dad storiesā¦the newspaper
Today we have info overload assaulting our belief systems
Jim mentions Notre Dame and Mark sheds his light on how ND has mishandled woke
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Mark introduces Episode 1 of Season 4 with the topic of a paradigm shift. A shift in the way the country is moving with the election of Donald Trump and the push back against āwokeā
Jim introduces the wheel and worldview as a likely connection to the topic. He believes the shift is well on itās way and we can see and hear evidence of it as more people open up post election
Jim has some examples and topics he wants to discuss
The first one is COVID
What did covid change - communication
Second is BLM/DEI. Neither were sustainable
Third is The 2024 election
4th is Artificial Intelligence
Mark grabs on to Covid and tells his COVID story. He then acknowledges that the government has been misleading us for years
He reflects on āknowingā early and has some other covid insights
He starts to love to DEI and Jim steps in with some more Covid
āIt wasnāt Covid, it was the governmentās response to Covidā. Now we have data. It canāt be political anymore. We have data. He gives the politicians some credit, but says it quickly evolved into an abuse of power. He cites some Blue governors that developed into this grander mistrust of government
Next Mark goes hard at BLM/DEI. He shares his inside insights from inside talent acquisition and his disdain for DEI. Mark gets a little hot
Jim says itās become math. A paradigm shift and more loss of trust
Jim says itās way beyond government. CEOās sucked up to them
Markās insulted with the hypocrisy
Jim cites the Harvard president and other academics who got booted
Mark thinks it was like dominoes. Maybe Covid was the first dominoā¦but once it fellā¦. Mark goes off again on how people who were silent are now talking. Itās both frustrating and liberating. He thinks itās progress
Jim talks about collusion with the tech companies. Information/disinformation. He cites Matt Taibi and some other brave souls who spoke out. Mark says theyāre heroes. It was like the Salem Witch Hunt
Jim shares some of the other major issues we were lied to about
Jim gives Mark credit for āItās always about politicsā and then gets deeper into the lying
Mark wants to know when things begin to unravel, how people explain themselves. Jim says itās happening already. Canada, Germany and Italy
Mark says everyone was waiting for the US to move first. Now we haveā¦and the dominoes are falling. Markās a bit confused. New info, new dataā¦whereās it all going? Itās crazy
Jim brings up the fire in CA - itās personal because Jim has relatives living there and he had other family lose property in the Oakland fire. Mark acknowledges his daughters experience in Asheville
Jimās relatives are safe. Jim says we donāt know yet. The trickle downā¦homes, schools, futures??
Mark wants to blame Newsome, but says we donāt know enough yet
Mark thinks maybe we should question everything more. More rigorous challenges of statements
Jim thinks the amount of information we receive now changes the demands on our thinking and how we process information
Mark agrees but says we still need the rigorā¦itās just harder
Jim says we wonāt ever trust the media and the politicians again
Mark observes the behavior of the Left. Those who want to get in Trumpsā way or become his best friend. Watching people become who they really areā¦fascinating
Jim shares his opinion about people in power who jump to a new team just to survive
Mark distinguishes between those who change with reason and those who simply shift with the windā¦fuck those people
Jim brings Mark Zuckerberg back into the discussion to observe how people can change. More experience as a human and as an owner
Mark talks about his experience with technologists - pretentious and a bit better than thouā¦holier than thou
Laws for you and not for me
Mark ends with āIām thoroughly confused but optimisticā
Happy New Year!!
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We recorded this Dec 23, 2024. We decided to sneak one in during Christmas week and when we connected for the pre game, neither of us had any ideas about what might make a good topic
Then we shared a couple of real "what just happened" stories and AI was a common theme. So we decided to share our genius
I didn't edit or listen to this episode for the first time in 3 years. I think it'll be good
Learn how to make fun of yourself and recognize how little you know
Mark & Jim
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Hey all. We began with a New Years, year-end, goal setting theme within the context of some JIm Rohn quotes
What we ended up with is an in depth reflection on Jim Rohn's wisdom and how much of it might be very helpful as we plan for what's next
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Mark leads with year-end, new year and goal setting as topics. The context is the wisdom of Jim Rohn.
Our Jim loves Rohn and brought some quotes as foundations for our episode
Jim says itās the past, present and future approach
He reflects on being in sales and the goal setting and metrics of sales
Jim shares his opinion of Jim Rohn and how timeless his wisdom is
Jim says 2024 was a year of real change and events that will shape us forever. Decisive
AI, new administration, mainstream news failingā¦
Two Rohn quotesā¦
āDonāt wish it was easier, wish you were betterā
āTo get what you want, you give others what they wantā
Mark says wisdom is wisdom and if itās helpful, youāll find it in all works (Twain, Stoics, Bibleā¦)
Jim brings up Rohnās optimism and patriotism. The value of hard work and possibilities
Mark brings up that hope, optimism and wisdom are choices. You seek them or you donāt
Mark readās Jim Gās Rohn quotes
Formal education and self education. Jim describes his own self education journey. Mark reflects on his experience with education and quotes Twain. Education became indoctrination
Control - āEither you run the day or the day runs youā. Jim brings in our wheel framework and the self (awareness and control). Mark shares how all the āSelfsā work together
Discipline - āSuccess is nothing more than a few disciplines practiced every dayā. Mark frames this as āshowing upā
Prepared, on time, with a good attitude. Mark reflects that all the good stuff is hard, but itās simple. Jim brings up sports and how critical showing up is, not just talent. He then cites the high cost of being the best. Mark brings up his father and brother being pilots
The Pain Of Discipline - Choosing discipline or choosing regret. Jim shares āIād rather die in my world than live in someone elseās with regretā. Better or bitter. Mark talks about his regrets in terms of how he processes his regrets. Jim - Life is hard and if itās not, youāre not trying hard enoughā
Mark tells his āGet A Helmetā story
Jim says it dangerous to tell kids that things should be easy. Mark reflects on ārub some dirt on itā and āNo pain no gainā. The Vince Lombardi era
Mark asks about the happy medium between pain and fortitude
Walls - The walls we build around us to keep sadness out, also keep the joy out
Jim has one moreā¦
If you donāt design your own planā¦
Peoples problems are always more important than yours
Mark recommends Jim Rohn, Mark Twain and the Stoics
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Mark introduces the topic of self awareness. He shares that their āpregameā discussion was very self reflective. He suggests that the time of year, as well as some other personal events from Jimās life and Markās have the guys a bit mired in self reflection and self awareness
Mark reads a couple of quotes Jim brought to the recording. One secular (Stoic) and one Biblical (Thomas)
Jim shares some context for his quotes and shares his position on self awareness and whatās going on in his life
Jim reflects on yesterday being the 5 year anniversary of his fatherās death. He says to really understand yourself, you have to go back in time. Family history and stories. Jim came across some photos of his dad heād never seen before. Then he reflects a bit on his grandparents (4 grandparents/four quadrants - that shape you)
Jim asks about Markās conversation with his dad and comments about āpeeling back Jimās onionā
He talks about piling multiple issues all on top at once and how that makes tough stuff even tougher
Are we getting more āImperfectā or more self aware
Mark shares his mom and dadās influence and then describes his memories of his grandfathersā¦not from memory but from stories
Jim returns to our fathers and specifically his relationship with his father. How he has gained appreciation and gratitude for his dad since his death. Jim also suggests that heās grown too
Mark gives Jim kudos for being personally accountable with all these things for being responsible for his response to hardship and challenge. Learning from his experiences
Mark shares that his dad also had 10 brothers and sisters too. Both guys are also middle children
Mark shares his self image
Jim shares another saying/quote about virtues and vices
They discuss both. Jim thinks we all strive to be the best versions of ourselves
Mark reflects on being fathers of young adult kids and what fathers face as their kids get older - more people more problems How to navigate these additional relationships. They joke about the meaning of love and different types of love
Intimacy, jealousy, all the emotions
Mark says itās also a function of the time of year
Jim shares his experience going through the photos of his dad. He got them touched up - colorized and they came to life. He reflects about how his father tried to discuss these things with Jim when he was younger
Mark brings up his momās suicide and how his feelings have evolved as time has gone by. For his kids too
Mark says self awareness enables us to address and feel these things
Jim asks Mark to speak more about his mom. Mark talks about his younger brother and how he feels like he inherited his troubles from his mother
Mark goes deep on his momās suicide story. How he went from anger to sadness to forgiveness and empathy/love
Mark is grateful for her now. He sees her asa troubled soul
Jim says weāre all troubled souls
Mark thinks there are two types of people. Melancholy and not melancholy
Jim asks about Markās father. Mark says his dad was the exact opposite. He shares his parents divorce and some of the details
Jim asks more about Markās mom. Did he recognize his momās condition when he was young
Mark oversimplifies the impact his parents had on his 3 siblings and himself. He shares some suicide and addiction reflections
Jim begins to wrap up and Mark adds a takeaway
We are all going through stuff. Weāre not alone
Mark loves the 4 quadrant approach of your 4 grandparents
Jim reflects on how this episode relates to our flywheel
Relationships and worldview
As our family members get olderā¦more episode material:)
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Mark introduces the episode and frames it around the holidays, the challenges therein and the notion that āthe more people the more problemsā
Jim says the topic is timely and he connects it to our flywheel of lifeā¦all starting with the self. He shares his opinion on the more people topic and heightened emotions
Mark adds New Years and all the prep before the holidays. He cites the pressure the woman are under
Jim laughs about being through 50 of these. He says it means more, the younger you areā¦weāve seen this movie
Mark talks about the evolution from childhood to present holiday state. The expectations are so different. Mark says, as a guy, he doesnāt really care about the details
Jim brings up the idea of more than one familyā¦more chaotic
Jim goes around the wheel, starting with money. Mark tells some stories about traveling versus staying at home
Jim mentions health. Physical and mental. Everybody gets a little crazy. Mark cites anxiety. You donāt know what might happen. Alcohol comes outā¦
Mark jokes about dietary restrictions. He tells about the football game we played and how snow and alcohol changed it and then it stopped
Mark talks about being the boss versus being on holiday. No rules or systems
Jim talks about gifts he gave his clients for the holidays
Mark brings us back to today. This past holiday and how fragmented the family unit is now
Jim shifts to relationships and the difference between men and women during the holidays
Next is worldview. Politics and childhood
Red team and blue team
Religion and nationality
Mark goes back to the men and women thing. Parade versus the football game. How it was when he was a child
Back to worldview. Mark thinks people canāt avoid these topics. Jim says itās why he went to Mexico:). 85 and sunnyā¦no political drama
30 days later we have Christmas coming up. Jim says Xmass is better. More festive. Both guys share Christmas stories. Comparison. Who has what and who makes whatā¦
Mark talks about forming new traditions as his family evolved and changed
Mark shares his holiday ZOOM call with his kids and more traditions and stories
Jim shares his Santa suit tradition and some related stories
Then Mark shares his āSantaās comingā bells
Manipulative and fun at the same time. The guys talk about when the kids figure out Santa
Mark brings up religion as things evolved and how different faiths come in
Jim brings up midnight Mass and hook ups. Catching up and reconnectingā¦and more fights
Mark brings up the anticipation of the New Year. A new start. New Years resolutions
All the emotions. Guilt, anxiety, disappointment. The New Year adds to the emotional whirlwind
Mark ends with how important being in the moment is during all the holiday chaos
Jim ends with gratitude
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Mark introduces the episode with some context about where today's topic came from
Jim had a speech to give last week and on the drive he teed up our last episode about writng a letter to your 21 year old self
In that episode we mentioned the 80/20 rule, aka, The Pareto Principle
He talked about how he wove it into his speech and how it resonate with the audience
Then the guys broke down the history of the rule and how universal it's application became over time
Both guys gave examples of it in their lives with an emphasis on work/business/productivity
Then Jim went over the multitude of other applications in life where the principle also applied
Virtually anywhere you could apply metrics/data and/or percentages...the 80/20 rule applies
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Mark introduces the episode and reflects on the āpregameā discussion with Jim. Jim is giving a speech in a few days to a group or around 60 to 80 college students at San Jose State in the dept of Design and construction and he wants to give them career advice and life advice to help them with the transition from school to life
Jim brings the wheel into play and shares some context for his upcoming talk. Who the audience is and the topics to be discussed
Jim expands upon the idea of the letter he recommends students write or could write to be read later in life
Jim starts to talk about the types of advice that might be helpful to this audience
His first tip is mentorship. One of Markās favorite topics
90% of life is jus showing up - Jim goes into great detail about what showing up means. On time, all the time and prepared with a great attitude. That is hard to do
Mark loves the simplicity of it. He asks Jim to clarify who is writing the letter to whom. Two audiences. The elder to the 21 year old and the 21 year old to himself
Jim likes the question. He thinks itās both too
Jim says itās both what you āshouldā do, but also what you āshould notā do. He wants to be cautious with giving advice. Sending kids down the wrong pathā¦so he chooses to give wisdom instead of advice
Mark chimes in in agreement. He says advice is more likely to be presumptuous and wisdom is timeless. He cites how effective experience and stories are more so than advice. He specifically speaks to people about crafting their own stories before engaging the market
Jim shares his opinion about preparing kids for socialism and then releasing them in to capitalismā¦and wonder why they fail
He then brings up being American first. He says anything is possible if you show up as a working American. America is a meritocracy, not a bunch of identity groups. Just be good at something
Mark wishes he could attend Jimās an event as a fly on the wall
Mark reflects on a do-over. Find out how to work hard and then spend the rest of your life learning how to work smarter. More efficiently and delegation of things you donāt like and don āt do well
Jim brings in some quotes
āSuccess is a combo of hard work, showing up and luckā
If you donāt show upā¦nothing will happen
People like to help people, but you need to be āreferableā
Mark shares how he found his mentorā¦by being referable
What is referable - dependable, punctual, productive, trustworthyā¦
Jim says at 21 all you have is your potential. Markās mentor saw his potential and Mark was willing to follow his mentorās adviceā
Jim clarifies that Marks mentorship was a win for all parties. Mark learned and progressed and his mentor made a lot of money
Ark says, no one is entitled to anything
āIm says, give yourself permission
Jimās quote - āThe harder I work, the luckier I getā
Mark loves the simplicity
Einstein - Life is an illusion. Itās all perspective
Mark says you can create your own luckā¦by responding well to what happens to you
Donāt blame. Get better
Mark loves the quotes. He brings in the notion of time and how we have no notion of time when he was young. Now time is a an extremely valuable asset. Hindsight is 20-20
Jim says we had time in our youthā¦and now weāre running out of time
Life is a marathon. Small incremental change over time
Jim speaks of self awareness. You donāt know everythingā¦you donāt know much. āWe are all actors in this movie called lifeā¦)
Mark jokes about Candid Camera. Jim thinks we all have a default movie genre. Romance, comedy, thriller, etcā¦
Mark says his is comedy, but comedy is not always appropriate.
Jm talks about being identified as from the Northeast because of what he looks like. Mark says he is also direct unlike most Californians
Jim talks about the influence that āRockyā had on him as a kid
Jim says in life itās often not what you doā¦itās what you donāt do He talks about working things out as a kid with his fists and how that does nāt serve you as you age
āNever accept criticism from anyone from whom you would not seek adviceā
Mark says not to allow strangers to get under your skin. āWhat the fuck do I care what you think of me?ā
Jim wants his audience to Get at least one good takeaway
Be careful with the advice you give out to young people
Be the best version of yourself
All comparison leads to misery
Mark agrees and has fallen back on observations and reflections and telling stories instead of telling people what to do. Stories prompt reflection and critical thought
The power of a third party story
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Mark starts off introducing the topic which revolves around the presidential election of 2024. What do we do now?
Jim and Mark are more interested in addresing what actually happened, why it may have happened and what we might expect to happen next
What do we do now?
We went back and forth about the blue team and red team. No judgement
It's not what happens to you, it's how you respond...
We talked about elitism and messaging. How the blue team continued the division and condescension
We discussed how diverse the turnout was from the red team (ironically)
We left on an optimistic note. The system worked and now we have much work to do
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Due to a technical glitch (my fault most likely), I lost my show notes to the ether. The summary above should capture the essence of my notes
This is the best that my memeory will allow:)
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Mark introduces the topic of communication and within that general topic, the subtopic of persuasion. He then emphasizes the value of having a framework. He puts our framework in perspective
Jim chimes in about the idea of having a framework and emphasizes the IMC framework
Jim shares his 5 Wās framework and how helpful it has been for him in a variety of projects. How it adds perspective for both parties
He shares the value of effective people being clear
Jim asks Mark about his framework
Mark shares his childhood influences around communication and then his framework
What do you say?
How do you say it?
To whom do you say it?
When do you say it?
Both guys agree they made their frameworks theirsā¦no matter where it came from
Mark brings up the image Jim shared and begins to share the examples of lazy responses versus helpful responses
The guys dig into examples of how powerful specific words are and how changing a word can change the tone of the whole conversation
Problem versus āopportunityā or āchallengeā
All the specific examples from Jimās image become the conversations
Each example uncovers how simple shifts, different words change the whole tone and emotion of the conversation
Both guys share their experience with each example and how they have both made the mistake of using the lazy language and relearned the helpful response
They both emphasize the importance of not apologizing. Never apologize unless youāve done real wrong
Mark shares - donāt say, āto be honest with youā. āFrankā or Jimās option ātransparentā
They discuss transparency as a double edged sword
āIām too busyā means Iām too busy for you
They both have a laugh about ātoo busyā
āThatās not myā job versus, ālet me get you to the right personā
Mark shares his mentorās story about personal accountability
āIāll tryā versus āIāll take care of itā. Jim has a different angle on this one
Mark frames it as personal accountability. I wonāt dismiss you, weāll get it taken care of
Apologizing comes up again and both guys reiterate the problem with saying youāre sorry
Jim uses āI own that oneā. āThat oneās on meā. Take ownership
Mark - āsorry never works for me unless you really fucked something upā
Mark shares some media examples of how apologies become bigger problems
Jim says behaviors are more important than words - Mark agrees
The next example is disagreement - āYouāre wrongā versus āI have a different perspective on this than you and Iād like to share it with youā
Jim cites people who actually enjoy conflict to garner attention
āThis might sound stupid butā¦ā versus āLetās try this.ā Naysayers are everywhere
Jim agrees as an inventor he always shares new ideasā¦the value of reframing ideas until consensus is established
Mark brings up Jordan Peterson talking about Elon Musk and comparison (Elonās roommate story)
Jim - All comparison leads to misery
Jim shares āI have an hypothesisā versus a theory. An hypothesis is designed to be challengedā¦designed to be criticized
He shares the difference between an hypothesis and a theory
A theory has been proven. An hypothesis has not yet been proven
āNo worriesāā¦ āIām happy to helpā
Both guys discuss the nuance of this one
Mark feels like āno worriesā is kind of a throw away
They conclude that this whole exercise is an exercise in self awareness
The final example is recommending something to someone
āI think maybe we shouldā versus āI recommend we do thisā¦ā
Jim says āI thinkā makes him feel like āWhy should I listen to youā
Mark finishes with his 4 pronged framework
He confirms that listening and asking questions before speaking is almost always the best strategy
Jim finishes with the value of clarifying assumptions, discussing desired outcomes, āwho, not howā and what are the necessary resources?
Mark shares his support of this as authenticā¦for both parties
- Montre plus
