Episodes
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This week, we return from our lengthy and unplanned hiatus with the worldâs! nichest! episode! Thatâs right, weâre talking about Among Others by Jo Walton, Ballad by Maggie Stiefvater, and Tam Lin by Pamela Dean, three fantasy novels set on school campuses that blend faerie folklore and coming-of-age stories. Topics of discussion include how each book puts their own spin on the supernatural and the folkloric, tragically canceled book series, reproductive rights, and where on a college campus youâre most likely to run into a faerie. (And yes, this episode was meant to be released several months ago, as our discussion at the beginning indicates. Oops.)
Other media mentioned
Greta and Valdin by Rebecca K ReillyLa Chimera dir. Alica RohrwacherTinker Tailor Soldier Spy by John le CarreChallengers dir. Luca GuadagninoDead Boy Detectives (Netflix show)You Let Me In by Camilla Bruce (creepy faerie book Lulu couldnât remember the name of)The Wicker King by K. AncrumAye and Gomorrah by Samuel R. DelanyCatwings by Ursula K. Le GuinThe Raven Cycle by Maggie StiefvaterShiver by Maggie StiefvaterThe Scorpio Races by Maggie StiefvaterChime by franny billingsleyThe Hounds of Ulster by Maggie StiefvaterApotheosis (concept, not katabasis)A Song of Ice and Fire by George R.R. MartinStarCrossed by elizabeth bunceThe Oracles of Delphi Keep by Victoria LaurieHow to Train Your Dragon Lord of the Rings (film & books)Fire and Hemlock by Diana Wynne JonesA Court of Thorns and Roses by Sarah J. MaasAn Enchantment of Ravens by Margaret RogersonContent warnings: discussions of sibling death, parental abuse, a car crash, pregnancy and abortion, suicide, and dubious sexual consent
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This week is all about the spooky ancestral homes as we talk about And Donât Look Back by Rebecca Barrow and All the Dead Lie Down by Kyrie McCauley, two young adult novels about family homes and the dark secrets they hide. Topics include what constitutes a haunted house (does there have to be a literal ghost?), twisty mysteries, and the inherent queerness of the gothic genre.
(Also, as you may have guessed, we did NOT release this episode before traveling internationally despite our optimism about doing so in this recording.)
Media Mentioned:
Shogun (2024)Dungeon MeshiThe Jasmine Throne by Tasha SuriOur Hideous Progeny by C.E. McGillBurning Girls and Other Stories by Veronica SchanoesTramps (2016) dir. Adam LeonBad Things Happen Here by Rebecca BarrowEpisode 26: Bad Things at the BeachThe Girls Iâve Been by Tess SharpeThe Turn of the Screw by Henry JamesJane Eyre by Charlotte BrontĂŤFrankenstein by Mary ShelleyEpisode 18: Reduce Reuse ReanimateContent Warnings: Discussions of parental death, animal death, domestic abuse, murder, drowning
As always, you can learn more at our website, neverthetwinsshallmeet.com
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Episodes manquant?
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This week, weâre taking a trip to 1950s Italy as we discuss Patricia Highsmithâs classic thriller The Talented Mr. Ripley and its acclaimed 1999 adaptation directed by Anthony Minghella. Topics of discussion include the novelâs iconic con artist protagonist, the twisty plot, homoerotic subtext, and how Minghella put his own spin on the themes and characters.
Media Mentioned
Scrapper (2023) dir. Charlotte Regan (note: Lulu was wrong, the lead actressâs name is actually Lola Campbell, not Lola Chambers)Aftersun (2022) dir. Charlotte WellsThe Once and Future Witches by Alix E. HarrowDune by Frank HerbertThe Artful Dodger (2023), starring Thomas Brodie-Sangster, David Thewliss, and Maia MitchellOliver Twist by Charles DickensSaltburn (2023) dir. Emerald FennellDo Revenge (2022)These Violent Delights by Micah NemereverThe Haunting of Hill House by Shirley JacksonâPatricia Highsmithâ by Richard Brooks for the GuardianThe Bourne Identity moviesNimona by N.D. StevensonSorry to Bother You (2018) dir. Boots RileyThe Celluloid Closet (1995) dir. Rob Epstein and Jeffrey FriedmanHannibal (2013-2015)King Arthur: Legend of the Sword dir. Guy RitchieRipley (upcoming Netflix show)BBC SherlockAnd Donât Look Back by Rebecca BarrowAll the Dead Lie Down by Kyrie McCauleyContent Warnings: discussions of antisemitism, racism, murder, violence, homophobia, gaslighting, suicide, and classism.
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Weâre back this week to talk about the latest Hunger Games movie, The Ballad of Songbirds and Snakes. Topics include our relationship with the famous dystopian franchise, how the movie compares to the book, why we find prequels and villain protagonists compelling, and a detour through Enlightenment philosophy.
Other Media Mentioned:
Hannibal (2013-2015)The Silence of the Lambs (1991)Gods of the Wyrdwood by R.J. BarkerAnatomy of a Fall dir. Justine TrietA Murder at the End of the World (2023)True Detective: Night CountryWe Could Be So Good by Cat SebastianGregor the Overlander by Suzanne CollinsCoriolanus by William ShakespeareWest Side Story (2021) dir. Steven SpielbergLeviathan by Thomas HobbesSecond Treatise of Government by John LockeThe Social Contract by Jean-Jacques Rousseau Frankenstein by Mary ShelleyâSilver Springsâ by Fleetwood MacWicked (2024) dir. John M. ChuSaltburn (2023) dir. Emerald FennellContent warnings: Discussions of death, violence, hanging, cannibalism and fascism
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Happy belated New Year! We return fashionably late with a behemoth of an episode to discuss each of our top 10 books of 2023, a few extra superlatives (scariest book, anyone?), and some reading goals for 2024. Tune in for fantasy fiction, gothic literature, romance novels, unexpected favorites, and only a little bit of human sacrifice.
(Also, Lulu would like to mention that she forgot to mention Emily Carrollâs works when discussing graphic novels, but theyâre all very creepy and amazing. Additionally, we ran out of time for her to discuss poetry, but Native Guard by Natasha Trethewey, The Renunciations by Donika Kelly, and Water & Salt by Lena Khalaf Tuffaha were her favorite books of poetry read last year.)
Content warnings: discussions of slavery (27:47-31:05), domestic abuse (31:06-33:08), and depression/suicidal ideation (58:18-1:03:18)
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Our podcast is back, and weâre in our hater era! In this episode, we tackle the infamously divisive 2023 film Saltburn, a psychological thriller directed by Emerald Fennell and starring Barry Keoghan as Oliver Quick, an Oxford scholarship student invited to his wealthy friendâs summer estate, Saltburn, for a summer that takes a dark turn. (Spoiler alert: we didn't like it.) Topics discussed include the filmâs muddled class commentary, our hatred of the filmâs ending, and itâs intent to shock and upset the viewer.
Other Media Mentioned:
Blue Eye Samurai (2023-)Starling House by Alix E. HarrowA Narrow Door by Joanne HarrisThe Holdovers (dir. Alexander Payne)Fingersmith by Sarah WatersBellies by Nicola DinanPromising Young Woman (dir. Emerald Fennell)The Eternals (dir. Chloe Zhao)The Banshees of Inisherin (dir. Martin McDonagh)Knives Out (dir. Rian Johnson)Parasite (dir. Bong Joon-ho)Can posh people write good slass satire? By Patrick Sproull for DazedRomeo + Juliet (dir. Baz Luhrmann)Biting the Hand by Julia LeeWuthering Heights by Emily BrontĂŤTripping Arcadia by Kit MayquistThese Violent Delights by Micah NemereverGentlemen and Players by Joanne HarrisTemper by Layne FargoThey Never Learn by Layne FargoInterview With the Vampire (2022â)Content Warnings: Discussions of drug overdose, suicide, murder, classism, racism, manipulation, and sexual assault
Also, not actually related to the content of this episode, but if you are an American listener, we would like to invite you to call your representatives and demand a ceasefire in Israel and Palestine. 5calls.org makes it easy to do.
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Weâre back for our first episode of the summer! In this one, we take a trip to post-Rome Britain to explore our fascination with a time period that is more myth than history. Going full history nerd, we take a look at three books set in Britain after the withdrawal of Roman imperial powers: Dark Earth by Rebecca Stott, Here Lies Arthur by Philip Reeve, and Sistersong by Lucy Holland. We discuss the possible origin of the King Arthur myth, queer medieval narratives, and the cultural diversity of Britain at this timeâas well as wizards, warlords, and murder ballads.
Other Media Mentioned:
Tess of the Road by Rachel HartmanThe Adventures of Amina al-Sirafi by Shannon ChakrabortyDungeons and Dragons: Honor Among ThievesLittle Blue Encyclopedia for Vivian by Hazel Jane PlanteThe Thousand Eyes by A.K. LarkwoodBernard Cornwellâs booksSpear by Nicola GriffithPerceval by Chretien de TroyesThe Two Sisters by Steeleye SpanOn the Ruin and Conquest of Britain by GildasHistory of the Kings of Britain by Geoffrey of MonmouthContent Warnings:
Discussions of war, death, and body horror
Also 1) apologies for the distant car horn in a few moments and 2) our discussion of Here Lies Arthur involves talking about some characters who present as different genders over the course of the story and so has some varying pronoun usage.
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This week, weâve got a guest on our podcast as author M.K. Lobb drops by to answer our questions about her young adult fantasy novel Seven Faceless Saints. Tune in to hear us discuss the real historical inspiration behind her fantasy world, the joys of writing angsty romance, and the importance of angry female characters.
Media mentioned
These Violent Delights by Chloe GongKeep This To Yourself by Tom RyanI Hope Youâre Listening by Tom RyanKaren McManus (YA mystery author)The Queenâs Thief by Megan Whalen TurnerVespertine by Margaret RogersonSix of Crows by Leigh BardugoContent warnings: discussions of war, PTSD, and murder
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In this episode, we take a deep dive into the character of John Constantine, DCâs infamous dirtbag warlock. Beginning with his iconic Hellblazer comic and going on to discuss his many movie and TV appearances, we tackle some of his most iconic storylines, how various adaptations do or donât work, and why we find one British magicianâs poor life choices so compelling.
Media mentioned:
Lockwood & Co. (Netflix show)The Last of Us (HBO show)The Legend of Vox Machina (TV show)Seasparrow by Kristin CashoreThistlefoot by GennaRose NethercottThe Newsreader (TV show)Andor (TV show)The Haunting of Hill House by Shirley JacksonKindred by Octavia ButlerSandman by Neil GaimanDC Pride Anthology (2021)Constantine: The Hellblazer by James Tynion IV and Ming DoyleHellblazer: Original Sins by Jamie DelanoDC Bombshells by Marguerite BennettSwamp Thing by Alan MooreConstantine: All His Engines by Mike CareyThe Girl with all the Gifts by M.R. CareyConstantine: City of DemonsThe Sandman episode 3: âDream a Little Dream of MeâLegends of TomorrowContent warnings: lung cancer, suicide, child abuse, homophobia, biphobia, racism
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This weekâs episode is a blast to the past as we delve into a new genre for this podcast: historical romance novels. Focusing on five novelsâA Caribbean Heiress in Paris by Adriana Herrera, The Siren of Sussex by Mimi Matthews, The Queer Principles of Kit Webb by Cat Sebastian, The Duke Who Didnât by Courtney Milan, and The Ladyâs Guide to Celestial Mechanics by Olivia Waiteâwe delve into how they fit into the overall genre while crafting individual love stories that stand out on their own. We discuss some of our favorite romance tropes and how these books subvert them or play them straight, as well as examining the historical contexts a bit. Plus: seances, heists, and Worcestershire sauce.
Other media mentioned
AMCâs Interview With the VampireA Restless Truth by Freya MarskeHoney and Spice by Bolu BabalolaBlack Panther: Wakanda ForeverWinter Be My Shield by Jo SpurrierThe Kingdoms by Natasha PulleySpinning Silver by Naomi NovikThe Brown Sisters trilogy by Talia HibbertBridgerton (TV show)Belle (2013 movie)âWhy Are So Many Novels Set in the Regency Period?â by Jess Romeo for JSTOR DailyJane AustenGeorgette HeyerSorcerer to the Crown by Zen ChoThe Perfect Crimes of Marian Hayes Cat SebastianContent warnings: discussions of historical racism, sexism, colonialism, homophobia, and slavery, as well as two novels that deal with parental death
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This episode, weâre taking a turn into the classics by reviewing two retellings of Emily BrontĂŤâs gothic novel Wuthering Heights: Black Spring by Alison Croggon and What Souls Are Made Of by Tasha Suri. We indulge our inner English majors by getting very excited about cycles of tragedy, ghosts, and doomed romance while also discussing how the novels put their own spin on a classic work of literature.
Other media mentioned
The Rings of PowerThe Silmarillion by J.R.R. TolkienHouse of the DragonA Song of Ice and Fire by George R.R. MartinSistersong by Lucy HollandOnly a Monster by Vanessa LenA League of Their Own (TV show)House of Hunger by Alexis HendersonSpear by Nicola GriffithAMCâs Interview With the Vampire (TV show)Jane Eyre by Charlotte BrontĂŤSelf-Made Boys by Anna-Marie McLemoreThe Books of Ambha by Tasha SuriThe Jasmine Throne by Tasha SuriWide Sargasso Sea by Jean RhysWuthering Heights by Kate BushContent warnings: discussions of abuse, racism, murder, colonialism, famine, death
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Segueing into Spooky Season, this week weâre bringing a seasonally-appropriate episode on witchy books! Focusing on The Scapegracers by H.A. Clarke and Paybackâs a Witch by Lana Harper, we discuss the different takes on witches in both novels, their representation of magic-wielding lesbian and bisexual women, and how supernatural elements are used to underscore and develop the character relationships. (And also how a drag show act served as the seed of inspiration for this episode.)
Content warnings: car crash, parental death, homophobia
Other media mentioned
The Sandman (comic)Everything Everywhere All at OnceThe Duke Who Didnât by Courtney MilanThe Sandman (Netflix show)Silver Under Nightfall by Rin ChupecoHellblazer by Jamie DelanoThe Scratch Daughter by H.A. Clarke (upcoming)The Lost Coast by A.R. CapettaWitch Week by Diana Wynne JonesAs always, you can learn more about our podcast at our website, neverthetwinsshallmeet.com
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The start of fall may be nearing, but weâre here to prolong summer with an episode on the movie Fire Island! A modern gay adaptation of Jane Austenâs Pride and Prejudice, it follows a group of friends on their annual summer vacation. Topics include how the movie updates the novelâs social commentary and class dynamics, what makes the iconic Elizabeth/Darcy relationship work, and how the film deviates from the source text in fun and interesting ways. Also, a lot of positive yelling about the romance.
Other Media Mentioned:
The Sandman by Neil GaimanThe Immortal Hulk by Al EwingNever Ever Getting Back Together by Sophie GonzalesThe Unbroken by C.L. ClarkWildhood (2021) dir. Bretten HannamLockwood and Co by Jonathan StroudSeeing Ghosts by Kat ChowPride and Prejudice by Jane Austen (many times!)Pride and Prejudice (2005) dir. Joe WrightPride and Prejudice and Zombies (2016) dir. Burr SteersHeartstone by Elle Katharine WhiteThe Lizzie Bennet DiariesPride by Ibi ZoboiThe Murder of Mr. Wickham by Claudia GrayJack of Hearts and Other Parts by Lev A.C. RosenContent Warnings: discussions of classism, anti-Asian racism, and revenge porn.
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Itâs summer, and that means sunny weather, visits to the beachâŚand murder? This weekâs episode is on two seaside mysteries, Bad Things Happen Here by Rebecca Barrow and I Killed Zoe Spanos by Kit Frick. Topics include mental health representation, balancing nuanced characters with twisty plots, and how the setting enhances both books. (Note: we do not spoil the big plot twists in either of these books.)
Media mentioned
The Scapegracers by H.A. ClarkeQueer As All Get Out: 10 People Whoâve Inspired Me by Shelby CriswellThe Heartbreak Baker by A.R. CapettaThe Widow of Rose House by Diana BillerRooks and Ruin trilogy by Melissa CarusoSomething That May Shock and Discredit You by Daniel LaveryLegion (TV show)You Donât Know Me But I Know You by Rebecca BarrowThis Is What It Feels Like by Rebecca BarrowI Kissed Shara Wheeler by Casey McQuistionKnives Out (2019)Content warnings
Murder, drowning, racism, mental health struggles including suicidal ideation and intrusive thoughts
You can learn more about Never the Twins Shall Meet at our website, neverthetwinsshallmeet.com
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Weâre back! This week, weâre discussing A Marvellous Light by Freya Marske and and Sorcerer to the Crown by Zen Cho, two novels that reimagine English history with a magical twist. Topics include wizard bureaucracy, ambitious women, and the way that both novels intertwine fantasy and history.
Other media mentioned:
A River Enchanted by Rebecca RossEverything Everywhere All at Once (2022)Summer Sons by Lee MandeloNimona by N.D. StephensonHeartstopper (TV show)From Dust, a Flame by Rebecca PodosThe Thirty Names of Night by Zeyn JoukhadarJonathan Strange and Mr. Norrell by Susanna ClarkeK.J. Charlesâs booksJupiter AscendingThe Fantasy Inn podcastHowlâs Moving Castle by Diana Wynne JonesBlack Sails (TV show)The Brown Sisters Trilogy by Talia HibbertThe Drowned Country by Emily TeshKnives OutPride and Prejudice by Jane AustenThe True Queen by Zen ChoThe Chosen and the Beautiful by Nghi VoLegally BlondeThe Moonstone by Wilkie CollinsEpisode 21: Murder, Magic, and Making Different HistoriesContent warnings: Discussions of historical homophobia, racism, sexism, slavery, and colonialism.
You can learn more about Never The Twins Shall Meet at our website, neverthetwinsshallmeet.com
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This week, weâre discussing the recent Netflix show Arcane! An animated blend of science fiction, fantasy, and crime drama, itâs also an adaptation of the video game League of Legendsâsomething we know pretty much nothing about. However, we both still adored it. Topics include the showâs careful construction of inevitable tragedies, the complex cast of characters, the gorgeous animation, and one aspect where we think it stumbles.
Other Media Mentioned:
Bad Things Happen Here by Rebecca Barrow (forthcoming June 2022)The Duchess War by Courtney MilanDruids: A Very Short Introduction by Barry CunliffeOnly Murders in the BuildingYuri on IceTo Say Nothing of the Dog by Connie WillisThe Bone Key by Sarah MonetteTurning Red (2022)The Batman (2022)Episode 15: Into the Batman-verseLeague of LegendsCastlevaniaCritical RoleBlack SailsWonder Woman (2017)James BondPhantom of the OperaHow Disfigured Villains Like âWonder Womanâsâ Dr. Poison Perpetuate Stigma by Alaina Leary for Teen VogueContent Warnings: discussions of murder, violence, emotionally abusive relationships, terminal illness, classism, and ableism.
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This week, we take a trip back to 1987 to discuss the horror-comedy movie The Lost Boys. Following a pair of brothers who move to a sunny California town plagued by vampires, the film includes a tangled love triangle, some inventive methods of murder, and a lot of 80s fashion. Topics of discussion include possible gay subtext, the deep-seated appeal of vampires, and why cinema needs more films about vampiric motorcycle gangs.
Other Media Mentioned:
The Legend of Vox MachinaDungeons and DragonsThe Heartbreak Bakery by A.R. CapettaThe Witness for the Dead by Katherine AddisonThe Goblin Emperor by Katherine AddisonSilver in the Wood by Emily TeshArcane (2021-)Wylding Hall by Elizabeth HandLittle Thieves by Margaret OwenWhat We Do in the ShadowsDracula by Bram StokerEpisode 11: An Anthropological Study of Cohabitating VampiresPeter Pan by J.M. BarrieWorn Stories on NetflixSmall Changes Over Long Periods of Time by K.M SzparaDead Collections by Isaac FellanA Dowry of Blood by S.T. GibsonStranger Things (2016-)The Lost Girls by Sonia HartlThe Coldest Girl in Coldtown by Holly BlackBit (2019)Content Warnings: mentions of drug use, murder, a controlling/abusive relationship, all the blood-drinking stuff that comes with vampires.
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Step one: rob the rich. Step two: break a curse. Step three: interrogate your deep-seated childhood trauma. Who could this to-do list belong to? Why, none other than the protagonist of Little Thieves by Margaret Owen! This week, we dive into a delightful young adult fantasy retelling of the fairytale The Goose Girl following a teenage thief whose final heist goes terribly wrong. Topics include the hilarious and cynical protagonist, our love of a good heist story, the excellent romance, and the unexpected emotional depth through an exploration of childhood trauma.
Other Media Mentioned:
BBC StarstruckSh*t Cassandra Saw by Gwen E. KirbyCrying in H Mart by Michelle ZaunerThe Rose Code by Kate QuinnSome By Virtue Fall by Alexandra RowlandThe Liarâs Knot by M.A. CarrickThe Goose Girl by Shannon HaleThe Merciful Crow by Margaret OwenOur Violent Ends by Chloe GongDungeons and DragonsI Know What You Think of Me by Tim Kreider in the New York TimesSaga by Brian K. Vaughan and Fiona StaplesPainted Devils by Margaret Owen (forthcoming)Vespertine by Margaret RogersonThe Mask of Mirrors by M.A. CarrickContent warnings: mentions of child abandonment and child abuse.
You can learn more about Never the Twins Shall Meet at our website, neverthetwinsshallmeet.com
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Happy Black History Month! This week, weâre discussing two historical fantasy novels by Black authors: A Master of Djinn by P. DjèlĂ Clark and The Conductors by Nicole Glover. Join us as we take a trip to nineteenth-century Philadelphia and twentieth-century Cairo and discuss compelling murder mystery plots, well-developed alternate histories featuring magic, and some unexpectedly lovely romances.
Other Media Mentioned:
Our Violent Ends by Chloe GongEpisode 11: Two Gangs, Both Alike in DignityThe Seven Husbands of Taylor Jenkins ReidThe Legend of Vox MachinaCritical RoleNot My Problem by Ciara SmithSort Of (HBO Max)Call Us What We Carry by Amanda GormanA Dead Djinn in Cairo by P. DjèlĂ ClarkThe Haunting of Tram Car 015 by P. DjèlĂ ClarkThe Black Godâs Drums by P. DjèlĂ ClarkRing Shout by P. DjèlĂ ClarkEpisode 17: Sourdough, Cinnamon Rolls, and SorceryThe Vocabulary of Freedom on the Underground Railroad Education Center websiteContent warnings: discussions of murder, colonialism, anti-Black racism, and slavery
You can learn more about Never the Twins Shall Meet at our website neverthetwinsshallmeet.com
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Whatâs more terrifying than a supervillain? A superhero, of course! In our twentieth (!) episode, weâre taking a look at the dark side of superheroes through the novels Hench by Natalie Zina Walschots and The Refrigerator Monologues by Catherynne M. Valente. Topics include descents into villainy, misogyny in comic books, and whether the Joker pays his minions a fair wage.
Other Media Mentioned:
Sword Stone Table edited by Swapna Krishna and Jenn NorthingtonShe Who Became the Sun by Shelley Parker-ChanLittle Thieves by Margaret OwenArcane (2021) on NetflixDie by Kieron Gillen and Stephanie HansA Master of Djinn by P. DjèlĂ ClarkThe Conductors by Nicole GloverWhat We Do in the Shadows (TV show)The Boys (TV show)Watchmen by Alan MooreBatman v Superman: Dawn of Justice dir. Zack SnyderThe Amazing Spider-Man 2 dir. Marc WebbEpisode 10, X-Men X-travaganzaThe Dark Phoenix Saga by Chris ClaremontBatman: The Animated SeriesBirds of Prey (2020) dir. Cathy YanHarley Quinn animated seriesHarleen by Stjepan Ĺ ejiÄNetflixâs Daredevil TV showContent warnings: mentions of violence, murder, medical horror and body horror, an abusive relationship, suicide, death of a child, and drug use.
- Montre plus
