Episodes
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In this final bonus Walled Culture podcast episode - recorded mid-2022 and kept under wraps as a special 1st anniversary episode, we welcome Fred von Lohmann, former Electronic Frontier Foundation (EFF) and Google copyright counsel. Our conversation starts with recalling how he got intrigued by copyright, crediting John Perry Barlow, and explaining how he was at the right juncture to become a tech enthusiast.
Fred talks about his role at EFF during what was a unique time from a copyright perspective, characterised by pivotal court cases in the 2000s. He looks back at the impact and effects of the rights holdersâ battle against peer-to-peer (P2P) technology. Their fierce resistance against anything related to P2P, in his view, crippled the potential transition towards a decentralised Internet back then. He did see one silver lining from the aftermath: the P2P revolution opened music fansâ eyes to what could be, pressuring the music industry to start meeting consumersâ demand.
Fred highlights the Digital Millennium Copyright Actâs (DMCA) (invisible) role in shaping our daily lives. On the one hand, the DMCA gave a legal justification to rights holdersâ control over technology beyond the copyright realm by providing legal protections for Digital Rights Management (DRM). This has impacted various types of content, be it (now old-school) DVDs, eBooks or games. On the other, the DMCA boosted the Internetâs success through the safe harbour regime, offering a shelter from the âopen seaâ with hurricanes of lawsuits.
The latter troubled rights holders, leading Fred to discuss the emergence of (imperfect) copyright filters. In this context, he touches upon Googleâs Content ID, rights holder abuses, and the EU Copyright Directiveâs questionable filtering obligations. He puts forward a crucial, yet unanswered, question in this debate: âhow do you build filters that are fair to users and also don't constrict creativity too much?â
Finally, Fred briefly shares his insights on how copyright intersects with competition and innovation, especially in the context of software interfaces. In his closing remarks, he echoes some of Cory Doctorowâs wisdom, as he emphasises the need to think about copyrightâs impact on fans and innovators.
đTime Stamp
â˛ď¸[00:00] Intro
â˛ď¸[01:42] The conversion moment: a Stanford Law student triggered by John Perry Barlow
â˛ď¸[05:09] A tech enthusiast: the ARPANET days and tech exposure in the San Francisco Bay area
â˛ď¸[10:16] A unique period from a copyright perspective: joining the Electronic Frontier Foundation (EFF)
â˛ď¸[14:46] Pivotal court cases in the 2000s: from MGM v. Grokster to JibJabâs âThis Land is Your Landâ parody
â˛ď¸[22:34] The knock-on effects of rights holdersâ P2P battle: a missed opportunity for a decentralised Internet
â˛ď¸[29:00] No iTunes without Napster: the music industryâs path to meeting consumersâ demand
â˛ď¸[31:06] The Internetâs âinvisibleâ part shaping our reality: the Digital Millennium Copyright Actâs (DMCA) safe harbour vs. the âopen seaâ with hurricanes of lawsuits
â˛ď¸[34:28] The DMCA & Digital Rights Management (DRM): a legal justification to rights holdersâ control over technology beyond the copyright realm
â˛ď¸[37:00] DRM: rights holders dictating the rules, from (now old-school) DVDs to eBooks and games
â˛ď¸[44:11] The DMCAâs safe harbour: boosting the Internetâs success, while troubling rights holders
â˛ď¸[47:25] (Imperfect) copyright filters: from Googleâs Content ID, rights holder abuses, to the EU Copyright Directiveâs questionable filtering obligations
â˛ď¸[53:12] Filters vs. the remix culture: allow people to engage with culture for the benefit of rights holders
â˛ď¸[57:20] Software interfaces: copyright raising important questions for competition and innovation
â˛ď¸[01:03:11] Echoing Cory Doctorowâs wisdom: think about copyrightâs impact on fans and innovators
â˛ď¸[01:04:26] Wrap-up
đGuest of this Episode
đď¸Fred von Lohmann
former Electronic Frontier Foundation (EFF) and Google copyright counsel
đ https://www.linkedin.com/in/fred-von-lohmann-06b2
đ https://x.com/flohmann
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Glyn Moody has been writing about copyright, digital rights, and the Internet for 30 years. He is the editor of the Walled Culture project and author of Walled Culture - the Book (freely available as ebook). He previously wrote âRebel Code: Linux and the Open Source Revolutionâ. He explains how the Walled Culture project is a reflection on digital copyright going wrong, and how copyright and the Internet have shown to be fundamentally incompatible. Glyn highlights how thereâs no escaping copyright in an online world. He shares some copyright absurdities, with big content fighting the visually impaired and initiatives like Project Gutenberg and Google Books. He talks about how Big Content put on shackles on libraries thanks to Digital Rights Management (DRM), and reflects on the injustice of the Big Publishersâ suing the Internet Archive. Glyn points out how Big Academic Publishers hijacked the shift towards open access to benefit their bottom line, while pointing out that diamond open access shows that we can move away from the academic publishing business. He recalls how Big Record Labels went on a rampage, suing grandmothers and children, neglecting the opportunity to give consumers what they wanted. Glyn describes Big Contentâs push for copyright enforcement, from the French three strikes mechanism to the SOPA and ACTA battles, while emphasising how copyright laws got skewed towards Big Content. He talks about the failures surrounding the EU Copyright Directive and the looming dangers of upload filters. He further highlights how copyright no longer promotes culture but harms it, and how itâs about protecting Big Content, not creators. Glyn concludes by reflecting on a possible way forward: building on creatorsâ true fans.
đTime Stampâ˛ď¸[00:00] Introâ˛ď¸[01:05] Walled Culture: Digital copyright going wrongâ˛ď¸[03:51] Copyright vs. the Internet: Fundamentally incompatibleâ˛ď¸[06:44] Who gives a toss about copyright: In an online world you shouldâ˛ď¸[08:27] Copyright absurdities - Part 1: Big Content vs the visually impairedâ˛ď¸[10:26] Copyright absurdities - Part 2: Big Content vs Project Gutenberg & Google Booksâ˛ď¸[13:31] Digital Rights Management (DRM): Big content putting the shackles on librariesâ˛ď¸[15:33] Big Publishers suing the Internet Archiveâ˛ď¸[17:58] Big Academic Publishers & open access: One step forward, two steps backâ˛ď¸[21:55] Diamond open access: Moving away from the academic publishing businessâ˛ď¸[24:55] Preprints: More eyeballs scrutinising academic researchâ˛ď¸[26:40] Big Record Labels on a rampage: Suing grandmothers & childrenâ˛ď¸[30:52] People pay: If you offer them what they want on fair termsâ˛ď¸[34:24] Big Contentâs push for Copyright enforcement: From three strikes to SOPA and ACTAâ˛ď¸[39:06] The impact of copyright on our digital livesâ˛ď¸[40:05] Copyright laws: Skewed towards Big Contentâ˛ď¸[44:17] The EU Copyright Directive: How not to bring copyright into the digital ageâ˛ď¸[45:12] The EU Copyright Directive: No freedom of panoramaâ˛ď¸[46:58] The EU Copyright Directive upload filters: Itâs going to be badâ˛ď¸[52:00] Stopping preservation: Copyright no longer promotes culture but harms itâ˛ď¸[55:35] Busting copyrightâs creator myth: Itâs about protecting Big Contentâ˛ď¸[57:51] The power of true fans
đGuest of this Episodeđď¸ Glyn MoodyEditor of the Walled Culture project and author of Walled Culture - the Bookđ Book: https://walledculture.org/the-book/đŚ Twitter: https://twitter.com/glynmoodyđ Diaspora: https://joindiaspora.com/people/4cfe755c2c1743364f000890đ Mastodon: https://mastodon.social/@glynmoody
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Episodes manquant?
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Mike Masnick explores the intersection of technology, innovation, policy, law, civil liberties, and economics, being the founder & editor of the popular Techdirt blog, as well as the founder of the Silicon Valley think tank, the Copia Institute.
He notably talks about Techdirtâs creation, how copyright puts up barriers to information flows and hinders economic growth, the concepts of abundance and scarcity in a digital world, and how copyrightâs original intent got lost to the detriment of the public domain. Mike looks at how opportunities for new business models arose that helped create a âflywheel of supportâ for creators, whilst observing that copyright made creators vulnerable to exploitation by big content. He looks back at the impact the SOPA/PIPA fight made, and the powerful Internet blackout linked to the protests against these Bills. Mike explains his thinking behind the âProtocols, Not Platforms: A Technological Approach to Free Speechâ essay he wrote for the Knight First Amendment Institute. He also briefly talks about the EUâs new digital rulebook. Finally, he reflects on the idea that the NFT space, once the hype, nonsense and craziness have moved away, could help stimulate the thinking about how to actually support artists in creative and clever ways that make sense for everybody and that align the incentives much better.
đTime Stampâ˛ď¸[00:00] Introâ˛ď¸[01:47] Techdirtâs creation: copyright putting up barriers to information flowsâ˛ď¸[05:07] From Thomas Jeffersonâs thinking to copyright hindering economic growthâ˛ď¸[11:10] Copyrightâs original intent got lost to the detriment of the public domainâ˛ď¸[15:47] Abundance and scarcity in a digital worldâ˛ď¸[19:55] Creating a âflywheel of supportâ for creators: opportunities for new business modelsâ˛ď¸[24:14] Copyright made creators vulnerable to exploitation by big contentâ˛ď¸[26:54] The SOPA/PIPA battle put the breaks on the âclockwork-like expansionâ of copyright lawâ˛ď¸[32:33] How activism drove the Internet blackout in protest of SOPA/PIPAâ˛ď¸[37:02] The SOPA fight put the breaks on term extensionsâ˛ď¸[40:55] The thinking behind the âProtocols, Not Platforms: A Technological Approach to Free Speechâ essayâ˛ď¸[49:27] The EUâs new digital rulebook: portability vs interoperabilityâ˛ď¸[52:30] Reflecting on the NFT spaceâs potential value for creators
đGuest of this Episodeđď¸Mike MasnickFounder & Editor of Techdirt (https://www.techdirt.com)đ https://www.techdirt.com/user/mmasnick | https://www.linkedin.com/in/mmasnick đŚ https://twitter.com/mmasnick | https://twitter.com/techdirtđ Check Mike's essay âProtocols, Not Platforms: A Technological Approach to Free Speechâ :https://knightcolumbia.org/content/protocols-not-platforms-a-technological-approach-to-free-speech
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James âJamieâ Love is Director of Knowledge Ecology International. His training is in economics and finance, and work focuses on the production, management and access to knowledge resources, as well as aspects of competition policy. The current focus is on the financing of research and development, intellectual property rights, prices for and access to new drugs, vaccines and other medical technologies, as well as related topics for other knowledge goods, including data, software, other information protected by copyright or related rights, and proposals to expand the production of knowledge as a public good. James advises UN agencies, national governments, international and regional intergovernmental organisations and public health NGOs, and is the author of a number of articles and monographs on innovation and intellectual property rights.
He talks about access to information being one of the emerging issues of his generation, and how he got wrapped-up in the idea of making access to information more equal and less expensive for everyone. James recalls the failed push for a database Treaty at the World Intellectual Property Organization (WIPO), and the EUâs stubbornness by adopting the Database Directive, and how this, and term extensions, are textbook examples of the âcopyright ratchet.â He highlights the dangers of things creeping into international trade agreements, which can tie up politicians' hands to change course. James touches on the WTO debates on vaccines in relation to the pandemic. He shares first-hand insights on the WIPO Marrakesh Treaty on access to published works for blind and visually impaired persons, including the many attempts to push back against it. James warns of the continuous push for a WIPO Broadcasting Treaty, and the pressure exerted by rights holders on policymakers. Finally, he concludes by observing how the lengthy negotiations on a Broadcasting Treaty, now ongoing for 25 years, has worn out the opposition against it, as priorities shift to other things.
đTime Stampâ˛ď¸[00:00] Introâ˛ď¸[01:55] How a growing interest in data-related issues let to a broader focus on IPRsâ˛ď¸[11:55] The failed push for a WIPO Database Treatyâ˛ď¸[19:18] The EUâs stubbornness by adopting the Database Directiveâ˛ď¸[20:30] The âcopyright ratchetââ˛ď¸[21:03] The dangers of things creeping into international trade agreementsâ˛ď¸[26:23] The WTO debates on vaccines in relation to the pandemicâ˛ď¸[32:50] The road towards the WIPO Marrakesh Treatyâ˛ď¸[41:36] The strong opposition against the WIPO Marrakesh Treatyâ˛ď¸[48:32] Lobbyists scaring the âbejesusâ out of corporate clientsâ˛ď¸[51:04] The broad ratification of the WIPO Marrakesh Treatyâ˛ď¸[52:21] Pushing back against a WIPO Broadcasting Treaty for 25 yearsâ˛ď¸[01:00:38] Final thoughts
đGuest of this Episodeđď¸James LoveDirector of Knowledge Ecology International (https://www.keionline.org)đ https://www.keionline.org/jamieđŚ https://twitter.com/jamie_love
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Jean-SĂŠbastien Caux is Professor in theoretical condensed matter physics at the University of Amsterdam. A Canadian citizen, he obtained his PhD in Oxford, was postdoctoral Fellow in All Souls, and moved to the Netherlands in 2003. Besides his research activities, he is actively involved in the reform of scientific publishing. He is the founder, implementer and current chairman of open access publication portal SciPost. Jean-SĂŠbastien reflects on the current state of play of the scientific publishing landscape and copyrightâs role. He talks about the open access movement and the major hurdles or speed bumps ahead. Jean-SĂŠbastien unravels how his personal frustrations led to the creation of SciPost and discusses the effortâs long term sustainability. He makes a plea to change the institutional mindset and move towards Diamond Open Access. Jean-SĂŠbastien calls for academic rebellion and gives a word of warning about the next can of worms: publishersâ surveillance operations. Finally, he concludes by encouraging his fellow academics to educate themselves about copyright and the academic publishing machine.
đTime Stampâ˛ď¸[00:00] Introâ˛ď¸[01:39] The current state of play of the scientific publishing landscape and copyrightâs roleâ˛ď¸[06:18] The open access movement and the major hurdles or speed bumps aheadâ˛ď¸[13:05] The story behind the SciPost publishing infrastructureâ˛ď¸[20:10] Ensuring SciPostâs long term sustainabilityâ˛ď¸[26:56] A plea to change the institutional mindset and move towards Diamond Open Accessâ˛ď¸[32:50] Calling for academic rebellion and a word of warning about the next can of worms: publishersâ surveillance operationsâ˛ď¸[38:47] Hitting the âWallââ˛ď¸[41:15] Final thoughts
đGuest of this Episodeđď¸Jean-SĂŠbastien CauxProfessor in theoretical condensed matter physics at the University of AmsterdamFounder of SciPostđhttps://jscaux.orgđŚhttps://twitter.com/jscaux
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Catherine Stihler OBE was appointed CEO of Creative Commons, in August 2020, a non-profit organisation that helps overcome legal obstacles to advance better sharing of knowledge and creativity to address the worldâs pressing challenges. She has been an international champion for openness as a legislator and practitioner for over 20 years. She was a member of the European Parliament for Scotland representing the Labour Party. At the European Parliament, she became one of Scotlandâs longest-serving and most respected legislators. Prior to joining Creative Commons, she served as the CEO of the Open Knowledge Foundation. Catherine reflects on this trajectory that led her to Creative Commons and the lessons learned from the EU Copyright Directive adoption. She talks about the growing importance of Creative Commons licences and the importance of various ongoing legislative developments (e.g. AI, disinformation). She highlights the value of Creative Commons for creativity and knowledge sharing. Finally, throughout the episode she emphasises the need for the community, from libraries to civil society organisations, that are seeking a progressive copyright reform to unite and stand together in order to ensure their voice is heard by policymakers.
đTime Stampâ˛ď¸[00:00] Introâ˛ď¸[01:46] The road to joining Creative Commonsâ˛ď¸[09:54] Lessons learned from the EU Copyright Directive adoptionâ˛ď¸[16:26] The growing importance of Creative Commons licencesâ˛ď¸[22:14] Ongoing legislative developments and their importanceâ˛ď¸[27:51] The value of Creative Commons for creativity and knowledge sharingâ˛ď¸[34:45] Hitting the âWallââ˛ď¸[38:47] Final thoughts
đGuest of this Episodeđď¸Catherine Stihler CEO of Creative Commons and former CEO of the Open Knowledge Foundation. She represented Scotland in the European Parliament for 20 yearshttps://creativecommons.org/author/catherinehttps://uk.linkedin.com/in/catherine-stihler-a7b83711https://twitter.com/c_stihler
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Marc Rees est journaliste et rĂŠdacteur en chef de Next INpact, le site français traitant de tout ce qui est numĂŠrique, y compris les commentaires sur les questions actuelles de droit d'auteur. Il se spĂŠcialise en droit des nouvelles technologies, dont communication, LCEN, surveillance, donnĂŠes personnelles, et droit dâauteur. Marc est connu comme lâun des meilleurs commentateurs du droit d'auteur, dans le monde francophone. Sur notre podcast, il explique la stratĂŠgie de la France de mettre les droits d'auteur au premier plan. Il couvre le rĂ´le de la PrĂŠsidence Français dans les nĂŠgociations du Digital Service Act (DSA). Marc rĂŠflĂŠchit sur la crĂŠation de lâHadopi. Il parle passionnĂŠment Ă propos de la redevance copie privĂŠe et les aberrations qu'elle crĂŠe. Finalement, Marc souligne l'importance des utilisateurs dans les dĂŠbats numĂŠriques et discute la responsabilitĂŠ des intermĂŠdiaires techniques.
đTime Stamp
â˛ď¸[00:00] Introâ˛ď¸[02:15] La stratĂŠgie de la France de mettre les droits d'auteur au premier planâ˛ď¸[06:26] Le rĂ´le de la PrĂŠsidence Français dans les nĂŠgociations du Digital Service Act (DSA)â˛ď¸[11:47] De la conception de lâHadopi au nouveau super rĂŠgulateur ARCOMâ˛ď¸[19:25] La redevance copie privĂŠe est devenu une aberration ĂŠconomique, environnementale et socialeâ˛ď¸[33:15] RĂŠconcilier le droits dâauteur avec lâère numĂŠrique: tenir comptes des utilisateursâ˛ď¸[36:36] La responsabilitĂŠ des intermĂŠdiaires techniques: lâArticle 17 de la Directive du droit dâauteur et le blocage de Russia Today et Spoutnik
đInvitĂŠ dans cet ĂŠpisodeđď¸Marc Rees | RĂŠdacteur en chef chez Next INpact.com
https://twitter.com/reesmarc
https://twitter.com/nextinpact
https://www.nextinpact.com/
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Katharine Trendacosta is Associate Director of Policy and Activism at the Electronic Frontier Foundation (EFF). Her areas of expertise are competition, broadband access, intellectual property, net neutrality, fair use, free speech online, and intermediary liability. She is the former managing editor of science fiction and science website io9, and spent many years writing about technology policy and pop culture for various publications. Katharine notably talks about the good and the bad of the DMCA and the issues surrounding upload filters. She reflects on why the SOPA-PIPA debate mattered and how the underlying issues still linger. Katharine recalls how fanfiction sparked her interest in copyright and shares her hopes to see more smaller platforms pop-up as alternative avenues for creators and users.
đTime Stampâ˛ď¸[00:00] Introâ˛ď¸[02:14] Revisiting the US DMCA after 20 years, looking at Sections 512 and 1201 on limited liability and anti-circumventionâ˛ď¸[10:17] The detrimental impact of upload filtersâ˛ď¸[19:27] Upload filtersâ anti-competitive natureâ˛ď¸[23:39] Big Content & Big Techâ˛ď¸[28:45] Reminding politicians of the SOPA/PIPA debacleâ˛ď¸[37:40] Hitting the âWallââ˛ď¸[40:47] Final thoughts
đ Relevant Linksâď¸Unfiltered: How YouTubeâs âContent IDâ Helps Shape What We See Online (https://www.eff.org/wp/unfiltered-how-youtubes-content-id-discourages-fair-use-and-dictates-what-we-see-online)âď¸Robots Have No Place Filtering Creative Content, EFF Tells U.S. Copyright Office (https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2022/02/robots-have-no-place-filtering-creative-content-eff-tells-us-copyright-office)âď¸Itâs Copyright Week 2022: Ten Years Later, How Has SOPA/PIPA Shaped Online Copyright Enforcement? (https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2022/01/its-copyright-week-2022-ten-years-later-how-has-sopapipa-shaped-online-copyright)âď¸When It Comes to Antitrust, Itâs All Connected (https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2021/08/when-it-comes-antitrust-its-all-connected)
đGuest of this Episodeđď¸Katharine TrendacostaAssociate Director of Policy and Activism at Electronic Frontier Foundationhttps://twitter.com/k_trendacostahttps://www.eff.org
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Dr Andres Guadamuz is a Reader in Intellectual Property Law at the University of Sussex and the Editor in Chief of the Journal of World Intellectual Property. His main research areas are on artificial intelligence (AI) and copyright, open licensing, cryptocurrencies, and smart contracts. Andres has published two books, the most recent one of which is "Networks, Complexity and Internet Regulation", and he regularly blogs at Technollama.co.uk. He has acted as an international consultant for the World Intellectual Property Organization (WIPO), and has done activist work with Creative Commons. Andres notably talks about the EU Copyright Directive, addressing how the more controversial elements were pushed through and, on a positive note, how it enables text and data mining. He reflects on the interplay between copyright and new hypes like Web3, the Metaverse and NFTs. Andres further shares some thoughts on how copyright and digital policy is being shaped in general and on the copyright implications of Brexit.
đTime Stampâ˛ď¸[00:00] Introâ˛ď¸[00:41] Guest introductionâ˛ď¸[01:39] Reflecting on the EU Copyright Directiveâ˛ď¸[08:06] The EU Copyright Directiveâs upside: Enabling text & data miningâ˛ď¸[12:38] A closer look at Web3 & the Metaverseâ˛ď¸[18:54] Web3âs looming danger for the public domainâ˛ď¸[20:23] Debunking the NFT hypeâ˛ď¸[27:45] Hitting the âWallââ˛ď¸[29:23] The disconnect in shaping copyright & digital policyâ˛ď¸[31:44] Copyright implications of Brexitâ˛ď¸[34:03] Final thoughts
đSpeakers of this Episodeđď¸Dr Andres Guadamuz | Reader in Intellectual Property Law at the University of Sussex and the Editor in Chief of the Journal of World Intellectual Propertyhttps://twitter.com/technollamahttps://www.technollama.co.uk
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Jennie Rose Halperin, is a facilitator, digital strategist, writer, and editor, who currently serves as the Executive Director of Library Futures: a nonprofit organization that champions equitable access to knowledge. Trained as a librarian, she has worked in content, web development, and digital services of all types, including at the Harvard Law Library, Creative Commons, Safari Books Online/O'Reilly Media, and Mozilla. Jennie notably talks about promoting a technology positive future for libraries. She reflects on the bad and overly complex licensing deals libraries are presented with and looks at the dangers of the US Case Act for librarians. Jennie further explains the concept of controlled digital lending, and discusses the recent US eBook bills.
đTime Stampâ˛ď¸[00:00] Introductionâ˛ď¸[02:08] Copyright issues encounteredâ˛ď¸[07:17] Ebooks & Controlled Digital Lendingâ˛ď¸[10:50] Audiobooks vs Ebooksâ˛ď¸[16:22] Digital ownershipâ˛ď¸[23:07] Defects in the systemâ˛ď¸[27:34] Recommendations from our guestâ˛ď¸[33:39] Conclusion
đPeople Mentioned in The Episodeâď¸Kathleen deLaurentiâď¸Rich Prelingerâď¸Courtney Cookâď¸Chris Paulson
đSpecial Terms Mentioned in The Episodeâď¸Ebooks - an electronic version of a printed book that can be read on a computer or handheld device designed specifically for this purpose.âď¸Audiobooks - an audiocassette or CD recording of a reading of a book, typically a novel.âď¸Control Digital Lending - (CDL) is a model by which libraries digitize materials in their collection and make them available for lending. It is based on interpretations of the United States copyright principles of fair use and copyright exhaustion.âď¸Copyright - is a statute that grants you ownership of the work you produce.
đGuest of this Episodeđď¸Jennie Rose Halperin | Executive Director of Library Futureshttps://www.libraryfutures.nethttps://twitter.com/library_futureshttps://twitter.com/little_wow
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Katherine Maher, advocate for free and open societies, is the former CEO and Executive Director of the Wikimedia Foundation. Her background is in the field of information and communications technology, and she works at non-profits in the international sector, focusing on the use of technology enabling human rights and international developments. She reflects on the âmonkey selfieâ and its role to help educate people on the public domain, as well as on the complexity to push issues such as freedom of panorama. Katherine looks at how the EU copyright Directive played out, her early encounter with remix culture, and the difficulty of unlocking contemporary art and the 20th century black hole. She closes off by emphasising the need to make the legalistic copyright debate less daunting for citizens to grasp.
Key Takeaways:00:00 Intro01:42 Katherine talks about Wikimediaâs stance on the âmonkey selfieâ controversy from a copyright perspective and questions if there wasnât more behind the photographerâs initial story04:08 Katherine explains how Wikimedia approach the case from a US perspective, being a US based entity that hosts its content under US jurisdiction07:08 Katherine reflects on how the âmonkey selfieâ became an avenue to educate people on the public domain and to move away from the dominant perspective of copyright and IP rights11:30 Katherine explains the issue of freedom of panorama, with the Eiffel Towerâs light show and the Brussels Atomium as examples, and observes that the EU copyright Directive didnât turn out as hoped 16:58 Katherine talks about remix culture and shares a particular moment when she felt she hit the copyright wall and realised that something needed to change21:52 Katherine notes that the opportunities to shape the copyright framework are rare, such as the EU copyright Directive debate, and have a long lasting impact. She is however hopeful to see the free knowledge movement thrive in the decade ahead26:46 Katherine explains how creators can put their work in the public domain through the use of Creative Commons licences28:30 Katherine emphasises the important values of sharing and crediting that shape the Creative Commons model30:51 Katherine highlights how copyright can feel daunting for people due to the overly legalistic nature of the discourse that surrounds it
Shows Mentioned:
https://wikimediafoundation.org/news/2017/12/22/monkey-selfie/https://www.copyright.gov/title17/https://wikimediafoundation.org/news/2019/02/11/a-bunch-of-media-just-entered-the-public-domain-heres-why-that-matters/https://whc.unesco.org/http://www.nasa.gov/https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Commons:Freedom_of_panoramahttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Grey_Albumhttp://www.livrustkammaren.se/
Guests Social Media Links:
Website: https://wikimediafoundation.org/LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/krmaher/Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/katherine.maher3Twitter: https://twitter.com/krmaher
Picture of Katherine Maher by VGrigas (WMF) â Own work, CC BY-SA 3.0, Link
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Alex Sayf Cummings is a historian of law, technology, labor, public policy, and American cities. A leading voice on pop culture and public history, she has published on a variety of topics, from music history to the information economy. Her teaching focuses on the history of media industries (such as music, publishing, broadcasting) and American legal and political institutions (such as copyright). She covers the music industryâs role in pushing for IP rights, talks about music piracy and how Napster pushed rightholders into the streaming model, and explores how alternative remuneration models are far more beneficial for creators. Alex also talks about the Blurred Lines case, the revolt against SOPA, how copyright terms and penalties have been out of control and why we should resist extending these protection terms. Finally, she calls out music companiesâ bluff that they fight on behalf of artists.
Key Takeaways:0:00 Intro1:12 Alex shares her efforts to backtrack the origins of music piracy and bootlegging, and how this led to her book: âDemocracy of soundâ4:27 Alex explores the music industryâs role in pushing for IP rights11:06 Alex reflects on how we went from bootlegging in the 1960s to Napster pushing the music industry into streaming, and how streaming continues to keep artists locked into in the same battles as before16:40 Alex explains why alternative models, such as Bandcamp or Patreon, are better for artists by cutting out the record labels as middleman20:03 Alex discusses the lawsuit around the Blurred Lines song, and how this is a problematic case that could harm creation22:45 Alex pinpoints the US Stop Online Piracy Act (SOPA) as a tipping point against rightholders' continued demands for more stringent copyright rules26:42 Alex goes deeper into the revolt there was against SOPA from both citizens and tech30:56 Alex talks about the shift that there has been towards targeting the wires and circuits of the Internet and why this is bad33:18 Alex reflects on a particular moment that she experienced and where she felt that she hit a wall, as she talks about information scarcity 37:35 Alex brings up the âMickey Mouse Protection Actâ, pointing out that copyright protection terms and penalties have spiralled out of control46:08 Alex highlights how there is no need for the current conflictual copyright environment that is putting fans and artists, consumers and producers against each other. She also calls out music companiesâ bluff that they fight on behalf of artists
Books Mentioned:https://www.amazon.com/Democracy-Sound-Remaking-Copyright-Twentieth/dp/0199858225/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1344622653&sr=1-1
Shows Mentioned:https://www.deezer.com/us/?autoplay=true http://www.spotify.com/ https://us.napster.com/ http://www.ascap.com/ https://www.bmi.com/ http://bandcamp.com/ http://www.patreon.com/ https://www.pandora.com/ https://www.congress.gov/bill/112th-congress/house-bill/3261/text?q=hr3261
Guests Social Media Links:Website: https://tropicsofmeta.com/ Portfolio website: http://alexsayfcummings.com/ LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/alexcummings/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/akbarjenkins
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Salvador AlcĂĄntar MorĂĄn is a lawyer, focused on digital copyright, educational technology and digital communications. He is the co-founder of Wikimedia Mexico and of Creative Commons Mexico. He was also manager of the General Direction of Digital Communications of the Mexico City Government. He talks about how the Mexican copyright framework is not adapted to the digital age and shaped mainly by the creative industries, the copyright industryâs scaremongering tactics. He also explains how the fact that Mexico has the lengthiest copyright term (100 years after the author's death) negatively impacts the countryâs collective memory and the public domain. In his view, the public domain should be considered as a human right. He further emphasises the need for normal citizens and other stakeholders, that are currently neglected, to be more involved in shaping a copyright framework that works for the digital age based on a true multistakeholder approach. He also talks about the need for a more global perspective on copyright in general.
Key Takeaways:
0:00 Intro
2:15 Salvador talks about how copyright is locking up culture, especially in South America, and highlights the strong influence of the entertainment industry in shaping copyright laws
7:36 Salvador shares the most important lessons that he learned representing Creative Commons Mexico, including the lack of a multistakeholder perspective in the creation of copyright laws and the ignorance of the Internet by policymakers
13:14 Salvador explains how the copyright industry's campaigns induced copyright anxiety among Mexicans when sharing content online
19:12 Salvador talks about the public domain, its importance, and how Mexico fails when it comes to protecting and feeding it by having the lengthiest copyright term (100 years after the author's death)
25:24 Salvador reflects on a particular moment that he experienced and where he felt that he hit a wall and that something was wrong, and which sparked his interested in copyright reform and activism
32:22 Salvador shares what he feels need to change and needs to be done to make it work in the online world and how all this should look like in 2030: calling for the need for 'public hearings' on how copyright legislation is shaped, not only in Mexico but across the world
38:58 Salvador closes off by emphasising the need for a global perspective on copyright. and the need for people to join forces to counter attempts to push through problematic copyright legislation
Shows Mentioned:
http://www.amazon.com/
Public Domain
https://iclg.com/practice-areas/copyright-laws-and-regulations/mexico
Guests Social Media Links:
Website: https://wikimediafoundation.org/
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/salvadoralcantarmoran/?locale=en_US
Twitter: https://twitter.com/salvador_alc
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/salvador.alcantar
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Brewster Kahle is founder and Digital Librarian of the Internet Archive, one of the largest libraries in the world. Next to his mission to provide universal access to all knowledge, he is a passionate advocate for public Internet access, as well as a successful entrepreneur (Thinking Machines, Wide Area Information Server and Alexa Internet) and a member of the Board of Directors of the Electronic Frontier Foundation (EFF). The Internet Archive, which he founded in 1996, preserves petabytes of data - the books, Web pages, music, television, and software of our cultural heritage, working with hundreds of library and university partners to create a digital library, accessible to all. More than 1 million people use the Internet Archive every day. Most of them seek out the Wayback Machine, making 25+ years of web history accessible. He talks about the role of libraries, the Internet battles weâve faced and are facing, licensing pains, the National Emergency Library, and how the Internet Archiveâs efforts to make culture and knowledge accessible through controlled digital lending are threatened by the publishersâ lawsuit against the Archive.
Key Takeaways:00:00 Intro02:38 Brewster shares a little background on the technologies he developed, what inspired him to develop them, and what is happening with them04:38 Brewster talks about the Internet Archives and the Wayback Machine and what inspired their developments07:13 Brewster talks about link rot, what it is, how it impacts Internet Archive and other issues that they have also faced11:42 Brewster talks about copyright and how they are approaching the controversial issue of copyright as the Internet Archive16:32 Brewster reflects on how link rot affects the law field18:52 Brewster shares the problem with industries understanding the concept of a digital library as opposed to a brick and mortar library and the role those libraries have with print materials21:38 Brewster explains how new users of Internet Archive can easily use it and how the pandemic has affected it28:37 Brewster talks about the evolution of the Internet, the three key battles it faced and what he learned from it33:51 Brewster talks about how he would like to see copyright evolve to make knowledge, storage, and sharing easier and more widespread37:19 Brewster suggests the way forward and why thereâs still hope to turn the tide40:26 Brewster expresses his hopes for the next 25 years for the Internet Archive
Books Mentioned: https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/7624.Lord_of_the_Flies Harry Potter
Shows Mentioned:https://www.alexa.com/ https://archive.org/details/opencontentalliance https://www.internethalloffame.org/ https://www.wsj.com/ http://www.amazon.com/ https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Link_rot https://knightfoundation.org/
Guests Social Media Links:Website: https://archive.org/ LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/brewster-kahle-2a647652/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/brewster_kahle Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/brewster.kahle
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Professor Lessig is the Roy L. Furman Professor of Law and Leadership at Harvard Law School and notably a founding board member of Creative Commons. The New Yorker has called him the most important thinker on intellectual property in the Internet era. In this podcast episode, he shares his reflections on the interplay between copyright and Internetâs architecture, remix culture, the Creative Commons movement, the rise and benefits of NFTs, the work of Aaron Swartz and the attack on the Internet Archive.
Key Takeaways:0:00 Intro2:10 Lawrence talks about where his passion for copyright issues and their impacts came from and talks about architecture of the Internet with regards to intellectual properties 4:57 Lawrence also talks about some of the ways in which copyright walls in culture and shares an example 9:08 Lawrence talks about remixes, what they are and how they are impacting people, especially young people who have their whole lives online 12:21 Lawrence talks about the Creative Commons license, what it is and what pushed him to its creation 16:42 Lawrence talks about how the ecosystem is doing now that things are evolving and what could be improved about Creative Commons 21:26 Lawrence talks about the NFTs within Creative Commons, what they are and his view on them25:17 Lawrence talks about his book called Code, why he revised it to Code v2.0 in 2006, if he is going to revise it again and what he would change 29:13 Lawrence also talks about his other books, Remix and Free Culture and why he decided to move on33:13 Lawrence explains if he would argue differently the case he did 20 years ago with regards to changing the copyright laws 36:22 Lawrence also shares his journey of running for presidency in the year 2015 and what he was pushing for 40:58 Lawrence also talks about Aaron Swartz and the work that he was doing before committing suicide and if there are other people trying to push on with his work 43:34 Lawrence also talks about where we are today in the state of copyright today, if things have improved 46:57 Lawrence talks about what he would recommend others do to improve the copyright situation and access to knowledge
Books Mentioned: Code v2.0: https://lessig.org/product/codev2 Remix: https://lessig.org/product/remix Free Culture: https://lessig.org/product/free-culture Guerilla Open Access Manifesto: https://www.goodreads.com/en/book/show/22890903
Shows Mentioned:Equal Citizens: https://equalcitizens.us/ Creative Commons: http://www.creativecommons.org/ AXA Research Fund: https://www.axa-research.org/ Eyes on the prize: https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0092999/ CBS News: https://www.cbsnews.com/ Wall Street Journal: https://www.wsj.com/
Guests Social Media Links:Website: https://lessig.org/ LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lessig/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/lessig Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/lessig.org/ Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/lawlessig/?hl=en Email: [email protected]
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Fight for the Futureâs Director, Evan Greer, and Campaigns and Communications Director, Lia Holland, are both digital rights activists who have been active in the music industry. Based on their experience they talk about the need to rethink how artists can be fairly remunerated and the disconnect between the interest of big corporate entities, claiming to speak on behalf of artists, versus the actual needs of creators, especially those that have been marginalized by the music industry. They warn against the excesses from corporations and governments in trying to enforce copyright through massive and automated Internet censorship.
Key Takeaways:0:00 Intro2:20 Evan talks about their background as a traveling musician, and how a show in Prague brought them to where they are today with Fight For the Future7:23 Lia goes into her life as a writer, and the struggle her family faced when the 2008 financial crisis and how she had to change her career mindset14:09 Evan talks about Fight for the Future and the background of the organization and what exactly they fight for17:41 Lia talks about some of the campaigns that Fight For the Future is currently working on and being recognized for24:14 Lia describes content monopolies and the major companies and streaming services and the deep flaws they possess26:51 Evan describes the changes in copyright over the years as we move into a more analog world rather than burning CD's and copying tapes28:52 Evan talks about how artists truly aren't getting revenue from streaming, but instead the record labels31:25 Lia describes how the focus in the industry is mostly all geared towards back catalogs now38:01 Evan dives into the concept of centralization and how it's the main root of the harm in the industry45:11 Lia goes more into current campaigns and what they are doing to truly fight back to save our future 49:15 Evan explains how people need to get behind this movement of fighting for the future of the internet as much as they do for other social causes
Resources Mentioned:
Spotify - Spotify is a Swedish audio streaming and media services provider founded on 23 April 2006 by Daniel Ek and Martin Lorentzon. It is the world's largest music streaming service providers, with over 365 million monthly active users, including 165 million paying subscribers, as of June 2021.
Apple Music - Apple Music is a music and video streaming service developed by Apple Inc. Users select music to stream to their device on-demand, or they can listen to existing playlists.
Amazon Music - Amazon Music is a music streaming platform and online music store operated by Amazon. Launched in public beta on September 25, 2007, in January 2008 it became the first music store to sell music without digital rights management from the four major music labels, as well as many independents.
Myspace - Myspace is an American social networking service. From 2005 to early 2009, it was the largest social networking site in the world. Myspace was acquired by News Corporation in July 2005 for $580 million, and in June 2006 surpassed Yahoo! and Google to become the most visited website in the United States.
Napster - Napster is a set of three music-focused online services. It was founded in 1999 as a pioneering peer-to-peer file sharing Internet software that emphasized sharing digital audio files, typically audio songs, encoded in MP3 format.
RIAA - The Recording Industry Association of America is a trade organization that represents the recording industry in the United States. Its members consist of record labels and distributors, which RIAA says "create, manufacture, and/or distribute approximately 85% of all legally sold recorded music in the United States"
Guests Social Media Links: Website: fightforthefuture.orgWebsite: endcreativemonopolies.orgEvan Twitter: https://twitter.com/evan_greerLia Twitter: https://twitter.com/liahollandFFTF Twitter: https://twitter.com/FightForTheFtr
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Dr. Eoin O'Dell, Associate Professor of Law at Trinity College Dublin (Dublin University), explains some copyright fundamentals: its origins and basic premises, the creation myth, the shift to a permission-based society, and the differences between the EU and US approaches
Key Takeaways:0:00 Intro1:39 Eoin explains the basics of copyright and the lasting rights you have as an author after death4:24 Eoin explains the origins of copyright in the US and UK dating back to the 1700's8:01 Eoin starts to talk about how copyright has changed in the modern era with technology rapidly growing11:33 Eoin gives examples of special protection in copyright including Mickey Mouse in the US14:13 Eoin explains how the copyright industries created a self-sustaining system to their benefit17:55 Eoin explains how copyright created a 'permission society' to consume content22:32 Eoin talks about fair use and difference in it between countries25:57 Eoin talks about how outdated laws put users in breach for day-to-day activities29:28 Eoin explains how EU Member States' selective implementation of exceptions created a patchwork for users31:35 Eoin explains the difference in fair use in the copyright industry vs user perspective35:20 Eoin talks about Irelands long wait and delay to implement a parody exception43:27 Eoin talks about the importance of intermediary liability to safeguard the Internet ecosystem47:29 Eoin explains the future and what he'd like to see come from the European Union Directive
Resources Mentioned:
US Supreme Court: The Supreme Court of the United States is the highest court in the federal judiciary of the United States of America.
Sonny Bono: Salvatore Phillip "Sonny" Bono was an American singer-songwriter, producer, actor, and politician who came to fame in partnership with his second wife Cher as the popular singing duo Sonny & Cher.
Mickey Mouse: Mickey Mouse is a cartoon character created in 1928 by The Walt Disney Company, who also serves as the brand's mascot. An anthropomorphic mouse who typically wears red shorts, large yellow shoes, and white gloves, Mickey is one of the world's most recognizable fictional characters.
Digital Millennium Copyright Act: The Digital Millennium Copyright Act is a 1998 United States copyright law that implements two 1996 treaties of the World Intellectual Property Organization. It criminalizes production and dissemination of technology, devices, or services intended to circumvent measures that control access to copyrighted works.
General Data Protection Regulation: The General Data Protection Regulation 2016/679 is a regulation in EU law on data protection and privacy in the European Union and the European Economic Area. It also addresses the transfer of personal data outside the EU and EEA areas.
Guests Social Media Links: Website: https://www.tcd.ie/research/profiles/?profile=odelleDRI: https://www.dri.ie/dri-team/eoin-odell Twitter: https://twitter.com/cearta
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ARC Future Fellow and Associate Professor within the Melbourne Law School, an expert on e-lending, and co-author of "What if we could reimagine copyright?", Rebecca Giblin talks about the crucial but little-known area of reversion rights, how to rescue out-of-print books, and fixing some of the worst problems of copyright by making sure that creators are treated more fairly than they are currently.
Key Takeaways:0:00 Intro2:02 Rebecca talks about what made her focus on making copyright work better both for the users and for the creators when doing her research3:26 Rebecca also talks about reversion rights, what they are and why they are important to her and what creators can do with the rights and other types of rights 11:04 Rebecca talks about more opportunities that come with being granted the reversion rights and in other spaces that they are applicable 16:53 Rebecca also talks about two important cultural pieces to digitizing some of the books that were lost 20:30 Rebecca talks about her book and if you had to reimagine or reinvent copyright from the start, what would be in it, what would not be in it and the book they have written with Cory Doctorow and when itâs coming out 24:20 Rebecca shares her real-life experiences where she realized that she hit a wall and that there was something wrong and what she did to overcome that27:12 Rebecca talks about things that she would love to see happen by 2030 in regards to copyrights
Books Mentioned: What if we could reimagine copyright? https://press.anu.edu.au/publications/what-if-we-could-reimagine-copyright
Shows Mentioned:Kobo: https://www.kobo.com/ Kindle: https://www.amazon.com/Kindle-eBooks/b?ie=UTF8&node=154606011 Overdrive: http://www.overdrive.com/ The National edeposit service: https://ned.gov.au/ Australian Literary Heritage Project: https://untapped.org.au/ Spotify: https://www.spotify.com/us/ Australian Research Council: https://www.arc.gov.au/
Guests Social Media Links: Website: https://www.unimelb.edu.au/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/rgibli Email: [email protected]
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Scholar, writer, editor, content developer, and publishing and library consultant, Mirela Roncevic talks about the long journey of open access and open science, how to pay for scholarly monographs, and the complex challenges of e-book lending.
Key Takeaways:0:00 Intro1:54 Mirela talks about the open science movement, paywalls, and how researchers and their funders are trying to get around it 6:17 Mirela talks about what she feels is special about scholarly monographs and books and business models such as crowdfunding 10:42 Mirela talks about other interesting business models that have also emerged in this industry 15:24 Mirela talks about the digitization of books and making them accessible to people at home and if digitizing books can pose new copyright challenges and lawsuits that have been there 20:53 Mirela talks about e-book lending, what it is, how it works and how publishers not only use paywalls to restrict access, but also how they erect physical walls to block the access26:35 Mirela explains if roles of libraries in the digital world are not only facilitating or making sure that users have a proper nice experience but also encouraging new business models and experimenting30:04 Mirela talks about the particular moment when she hit the wall and knew that something was wrong and how she went around it 34:26 Mirela talks about digital rights management of the book publishing industry, what it is, how it works, when it works and when it doesnât 40:34 Mirela talks about what she envisions the industry will look like in the next 10 years
Shows Mentioned:Opening the Future: https://www.openingthefuture.net/ Knowledge Unlatched: http://knowledgeunlatched.org/ Subscribe to Open: https://subscribetoopencommunity.org/ Creative Commons licenses: https://creativecommons.org/licenses/ Amazon: http://www.amazon.com/
Guests Social Media Links: Website: https://www.mirelaroncevic.com/ Companyâs Website: http://www.noshelfrequired.com/ LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/mirelaroncevic/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/noshelfrequiredFacebook: https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100011368773357
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Author, journalist, and activist Cory Doctorow talks about the new publishing models available to creators, the consolidation of the publishing and distribution markets, the emergence of Amazon as a frenemy to publishers and the misunderstandings that led to the Internet Archive court case.
Highlights with timestamps:1:26 Cory talks about the new publishing models for books, the Creative Commons license, and how other people can also make money even after putting their content online for free 15:20 Cory also explains the reasons why his publishers asked him to stop using the Creative Commons licenses 18:34 Cory talks about the Internet Archive, what it is, what it does, and why it was under attack by the publishers as an act of piracy claiming that they were acting as a library 22:50 Cory talks about the Horthy Trust, what it is and what it does 26:38 Cory talks about the particular moment when he hit the wall and now thought that there was something wrong there 31:26 Cory talks about the things that he would like to see happen in the next five to 10 years so as to break the walls and move forward
Shows Mentioned:Open Rights Group: https://www.openrightsgroup.org/ Craigslist: http://www.craigslist.org/ Google: http://www.google.com/ Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/ Apple: https://www.apple.com/ Safari: http://www.apple.com/safari Nasdaq: https://www.nasdaq.com/ Google Book Search: https://books.google.com/books?uid=117522004192189783614 AltaVista: http://www.altavista.com/ Yahoo: https://www.yahoo.com/ Digital Millennium Copyright Act: https://www.copyright.gov/dmca/ Barnes & Noble: http://www.barnesandnoble.com/ Macmillan: https://macmillanlibrary.com/ Amazon: http://www.amazon.com/
Quotes Mentioned:âWe should acknowledge that the press is in trouble financially.ââIf you don't know what's causing the problem, then simply doing something won't necessarily fix it.ââA tractor without its software is just an inanimate lump of metal.ââIf you're not paying for the product, you're the product.ââPublishing is connecting an audience with a work.ââAll the e-books are priced the same, thanks to various most favored nation deals between Amazon and the publishers and the other ebook stores.ââOne of the reasons e-book sales went down would probably be because people got tired of reading off of screens.â
Guests Social Media Links:Guests Social Media Links: LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/cory-doctorow-a96558195/ Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/cory.doctorow.75 Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/cory_doctorow/ Website: https://www.eff.org/ Personal website: https://craphound.com/ Email: [email protected] Twitter: https://twitter.com/doctorow
Call to Action Links:website: www.walledculture.orgpodcast: tbd
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