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Doneila McIntosh, M.Div., M.A. is a researcher getting her PhD in Family Social Science from the University of Minnesota. Her work as a therapist focuses on compassionate grief therapy, helping families navigate the intersection of grief and trauma. Her research is focused on disenfranchised grief among African American families particularly in the aftermath of violent death.
It was amazing to talk to someone so knowledgeable about the disproportionate amount of death and loss in Black communities and studies the effects of that on families. Doneila works with families and prefers to think about grief in the context of the family system, rather than looking at each individual. We talked a lot about the difference between childhood and adult grief and how the grief of Black American families is largely disenfranchised, meaning it is often dismissed without being attended to or acknowledged. This is often true of childhood grief so Black children and teens are twice ignored by society and their expressions of grief are often policed and controlled. Because of the prevalence of Black death, Black children are four times more likely to have a major loss in childhood, and many experience multiple losses which can lead to desensitization and disassociation. We talked about the particular challenges that Black children face when it comes to grief and trauma and how adults in their communities can best support them.
We talk about Doneila's appearance on another podcast, "Grief Out Loud," which you can listen to here. This is a great resource about the importance of literacy around the magnitude of Black death and grief.
We also spoke about two books: In the Wake: On Blackness and Being by Christina Sharpe and Passed On by Karla FC Holloway
If you would like to support this show, please subscribe to my Substack where you will receive bi-weekly episodes and occasionally a newsletter in your inbox. You can also support the show monetarily by becoming a paid subscriber there.
Special thanks to Josephine Wiggs for the song "Time Does Not Bring Relief" from her album "We Fall."
Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.
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Gina Troisi's Memoir The Angle of Flickering Light is a beautiful account of her confusing and often scary childhood through the eyes of her younger self. I was immediately drawn in by this book and Gina's ability to write so precisely from the perspective of a child about the complexity of her father's and stepmother's emotional abuse, which led to her having eating disorders at a young age, doing too many drugs, and other self-destructive habits.
What surprised me most about Gina's story was how much I related to it even though our childhoods were radically different. Gina did not have a loss due to death but her parent's divorce and her father's abusive behavior resulted in her having symptoms of PTSD at a young age and receiving very little support. We ended up talking a lot about writing about trauma, but also the way parents in the '70s and '80s expected kids to magically get along in blended families. Without much support, kids were (and still are) often expected to negotiate complex relationships with step-parents and stepsiblings at a young age.
I highly recommend Gina's book which you can find on her website.
If you would like to support this show, please subscribe to my Substack where you will receive bi-weekly episodes and occasionally a newsletter in your inbox. You can also support the show monetarily by becoming a paid subscriber there.
Special thanks to Josephine Wiggs for the song "Time Does Not Bring Relief" from her album "We Fall."
Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.
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Hailey is another amazing young adult who I met through Comfort Zone Camp. Hailey has been through a lot of turmoil in her life and she is just an amazing example of resiliency and learning to cope with the fallout of the losses she has experienced. While Hailey was in high school, two of her siblings died within the span of two years. Life at home was hard and her main sources of support were her best friend and a school psychologist who inspired her to become a school counselor.
Hailey's brother Dillon died by suicide when Hailey was a freshman and he was a senior at the same high school. The school's policies made it harder for her in the aftermath of her brother's death because they didn't want to "glorify" his death and forbid anyone, including teachers, from talking about it. Hailey points out that this policy only magnified the stigma around suicide and encouraged a lot of misinformation and gossip which was hurtful to her and her family. When her brother Sean died of an accidental overdose two years later, Hailey was a senior and Sean was in his twenties so she didn't tell anyone, wanting to avoid the same kind of gossip that the school engaged in previously. Both situations resulted in exacerbating the isolation and alienation that Hailey was already feeling in the wake of her brothers' deaths.
Hailey also talks about how she coped growing up in a household with substance abuse and how those coping mechanisms that helped her survive in childhood, were not healthy for her as she grew up. It took a lot of work for her to unlearn her mind's reflex to disassociate but when she did, her other trauma symptoms of flashbacks and nightmares improved. Hailey shares how she deals with her symptoms and the strategies she has learned to take care of herself and enjoy life.
At the beginning, I mentioned Comfort Zone Camp which I highly recommend for anyone who has dealt with the loss of a parent or other important family member early in life. They have free, weekend-long camps for kids, teens, and young adults. And if you are older and curious about the camp, I recommend looking into volunteering. I have done it three times now and will continue as long as possible.
If you would like to support this show, please subscribe to my Substack where you will receive bi-weekly episodes and a bi-weekly newsletter in your inbox. You can also support the show monetarily by becoming a paid subscriber there.
Special thanks to Josephine Wiggs for the song "Time Does Not Bring Relief" from her album "We Fall."
Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.
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In this episode, we delve deep into the research and practical experience of Dr. Julie Kaplow, PhD, ABPP, a leading psychologist in the field of childhood grief and trauma. It is always gratifying to learn that the research aligns with what I've learned by interviewing people who lost a family member at a young age. Early in her career, she began to differentiate between grief and trauma while also recognizing the ways they overlap, particularly in children. She shares why it's important to understand the difference between PTSD symptoms and grief responses in kids and how she treats them differently. We talked about the important role parents play in the aftermath of a death, as well as the importance of other community members, including teachers, friends, and relatives, to understand the peculiarities of childhood grief. All of this aligns perfectly with the purpose of this show: To help everyone understand what grieving kids need, and the long-term effects of early loss.
If you'd like to learn more about Dr. Kaplow you can find more information here.
I mentioned Comfort Zone Camp which I highly recommend for anyone who has dealt with the loss of a parent or other important family member early in life. They have free, weekend-long camps for kids, teens, and young adults. And if you are older and curious about the camp, I recommend looking into volunteering. I have done it twice and will continue as long as possible because I find volunteering so beneficial.
If you would like to support this show, please subscribe to my Substack where you will receive bi-weekly episodes and a bi-weekly newsletter in your inbox. You can also support the show monetarily by becoming a paid subscriber there.
Special thanks to Josephine Wiggs for the song "Time Does Not Bring Relief" from her album "We Fall."
Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.
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Nora Martinez lost her father Ken to gastrointestinal (GIST) cancer almost twenty years ago when she was just five years old. As someone who has benefited from having support for her grief throughout her childhood and adolescence, Nora provides a fascinating window into childhood grief through her ability to reflect on it with clarity and perspective. I have encountered many people my age who lost a parent or other close family member in childhood who did not get much support and still struggle to talk about the loss or even admit that it has affected their lives.
I love talking to younger people who have grown up in a culture and family that is more open to talking about grief and getting mental health support. Nora started attending Comfort Zone Camp at age nine and credits her ongoing relationship with CZC and the people she met there with her ability to be the loving and compassionate person she has become. I loved her description of her grief as a kind of "golden armor" that gives her strength but also allows her to respond with empathy and wisdom.
We spoke about Comfort Zone Camp which I can't recommend more highly for anyone who has dealt with the loss of a parent or other important family member early in their life. They have free, weekend-long camps for kids, teens, and young adults. And if you are older and curious about the camp, I recommend looking into volunteering. I have done it twice and will continue to do it as long as I can because volunteering is just as beneficial as being a camper.
We also talked about the book, Abuela, Don't Forget Me by Rex Ogle.
If you would like to support this show, please subscribe to my Substack where you will receive bi-weekly episodes and a bi-weekly newsletter in your inbox. You can also support the show monetarily by becoming a paid subscriber there.
Special thanks to Josephine Wiggs for the song "Time Does Not Bring Relief" from her album "We Fall."
Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.
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It was an honor to interview Edwidge Danticat, one of my favorite writers on death, dying, and grief about her early losses and what she is trying to achieve in her work. We spoke about her new book "We're Alone," a collection of essays about her life as a writer straddling her life as a Haitian immigrant with strong ties to her home country. I also asked about some of her earliest books ("Breath, Eyes, Memory," "Brother, I'm Dying," and "Krik? Krak!") because she has written so beautifully about death and loss, both through the eyes of a child but also throughout adulthood. Having been separated from her parents for eight years at the age of four, she has written extensively about the particular experience of loss due to displacement and how that early loss echoes through her later losses of her parents. We discussed the contrast between the ever-changing mourning rituals in Haiti and in the U.S., and how the younger generations are adapting traditional practices to suit their needs. We also talked about Christina Sharpe's amazing book "In the Wake: On Blackness and Being" and how she and Danticat have both tried to address the magnitude of Black grief in their work.
If you would like to support this show, please subscribe to my Substack where you will receive bi-weekly episodes and a bi-weekly newsletter in your inbox. You can also support the show monetarily by becoming a paid subscriber there.
Special thanks to Josephine Wiggs for the song "Time Does Not Bring Relief" from her album "We Fall."
Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.
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In this episode, I interview journalist and author Mona Gable about growing up in the 1950s with her mother who was mentally disabled by brain surgery right after Mona was born. Mona was never told what had happened to her mother which only contributed to her feelings of shame and isolation as a child growing up with a mother who was incapable of caring for her and instead required constant care. Mona says, "My mother was a complete mystery to me." All she knew was that none of her friends had a mother like hers. It's the kind of "ambiguous loss" that no one talked about at the time, and it's incredible to hear how resilient and driven Mona was from a very young age. She managed to leave home, get herself through college, and get the support she needed to pursue a successful career as a writer. Her work has focused on many things including health issues, parenting, travel, and indigenous issues.
We started out talking about her latest book, Searching for Savannah. To find out more about Mona and her work visit her website.
If you would like to support this show, please subscribe to my Substack where you will receive bi-weekly episodes and a bi-weekly newsletter in your inbox. You can also support the show monetarily by becoming a paid subscriber there.
Special thanks to Josephine Wiggs for the song "Time Does Not Bring Relief" from her album "We Fall."
Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.
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This episode is jam-packed with wisdom from Maya Puterbaugh, one of my younger guests, who knows a ton about grief and overcoming the trauma of a fatal car accident. After attending Comfort Zone Camp, Maya became a volunteer Big Buddy and now trains other volunteers for Comfort Zone Camp. She is so knowledgeable and a true leader when it comes to advocating for grieving kids. Maya shares very openly about what she went through when she lost her mother at sixteen. Maya's parents were divorced, so her father regained sole custody which meant moving back to California after living in Las Vegas, changing high schools, and leaving her two-year-old half-brother and stepdad. She had sustained injuries in the accident so there was a lot of change, grief, and recovery happening all at once. Maya credits Comfort Zone, therapy, and both her father and stepfather for understanding the complexity of her situation and knowing how to support her and her siblings.
If you would like to support this show, please subscribe to my Substack where you will receive bi-weekly episodes and a bi-weekly newsletter in your inbox. You can also support the show monetarily by becoming a paid subscriber there.
Special thanks to Josephine Wiggs for the song "Time Does Not Bring Relief" from her album "We Fall."
Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.
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Tim Tattu left a creative career in film production to become a hospice nurse after studying Zen meditation with an instructor who asked him to help set up a place to care for people who are dying in Washington State called Enso House. His whole life story is fascinating and I loved talking with him about grief and dying and his own childhood losses. Tim brings so much presence, wisdom, and compassion to this deep discussion about grief and how it affects us early in life and as we grow older. The most powerful thing he had to share was the idea of staying present to the mystery of death at the end of life and how that can help us be more present in our experiences of death and grief.
If you would like to support this show, please subscribe to my Substack where you will receive bi-weekly episodes and a bi-weekly newsletter in your inbox. You can also support the show monetarily by becoming a paid subscriber there.
Special thanks to Josephine Wiggs for the song "Time Does Not Bring Relief" from her album "We Fall."
Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.
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In this episode, John Biggs takes us through the heartbreaking odyssey of losing his wife Samantha to a sudden mental breakdown. Seemingly overnight, Samantha went from being an incredible mother and artist to someone who could no longer function when their kids were just 12 and 14. John is a very entertaining storyteller so we laughed even more than we cried as he recounted the years when he had to become a full-time dad, caretaker, and breadwinner as Samantha was in and out of institutions. John's honesty, vulnerability, and openness as he described the most challenging moments of his ordeal is deeply moving. Samantha eventually died of her illness in 2022 so his kids are now in their early twenties and beginning to process the trauma of losing their mother to mental illness and then death. John's appreciation of his kids' grief and his instincts to protect them from the hurtful comments of others is a truly inspiring story of a man beautifully parenting his kids through the worst circumstances.
If you would like to support this show, please subscribe to my Substack where you will receive bi-weekly episodes and a bi-weekly newsletter in your inbox. You can also support the show monetarily by becoming a paid subscriber there.
Special thanks to Josephine Wiggs for the song "Time Does Not Bring Relief" from her album "We Fall."
Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.
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In this episode, I speak to the amazing Mackenzie Mazen about being a little buddy and then a big buddy at comfort zone camp after her father died by suicide when she was ten. Once again, I was so impressed by another GenZer who is open to sharing her experience of grief. Mackenzie is very light-hearted and loves to joke and laugh about her childhood trauma which made our conversation fun and engaging. She shared about all the grief support she had growing up and how she continues to engage and participate in multiple grief spaces while pursuing her work in the non-profit sphere. Even though the topic of our discussion is heavy, Mackenzie brings a lightness to everything she does without shying away from the horrors of her father's death.
We talked about The Dinner Party, Comfort Zone Camp, and Amazen Cookies
If you would like to support this show, please subscribe to my Substack where you will receive bi-weekly episodes and a bi-weekly newsletter in your inbox. You can also support the show monetarily by becoming a paid subscriber there.
Special thanks to Josephine Wiggs for the song "Time Does Not Bring Relief" from her album "We Fall."
Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.
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In this episode, I talk to journalist and author Dan Keoppel about how he centered his role as a father when choosing his treatment for bladder cancer. As a science reporter, he approached his diagnosis with curiosity and extensive research to figure out how to manage his cancer while being the Dad he wanted to be. Dan is so knowledgeable about his disease that he has been able to make the most informed decisions possible regarding his treatment. But his goal is not to "beat" cancer. Instead, Dan's aim is to live as well as possible alongside his disease so that he can enjoy the life he has. This is a deeply moving conversation with someone who looks at death squarely while exercising his curiosity and sense of humor, which is a wonderful way to live.
To find out more about Dan, click here.
To read the piece that made me want to talk to him, click here.
If you would like to support this show, please subscribe to my Substack where you will receive bi-weekly episodes and a bi-weekly newsletter in your inbox. You can also support the show monetarily by becoming a paid subscriber there.
Special thanks to Josephine Wiggs for the song "Time Does Not Bring Relief" from her album "We Fall."
Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.
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I had so much fun interviewing Evin Rose Terranova who I met volunteering at Comfort Zone Camp earlier this year. She has been volunteering at the grief camp for kids for several years and has learned a lot from supporting grieving kids. Evin was just eight years old when her father died by suicide and she was lucky enough to have an amazing mother who supported her beautifully with therapy and grief support. But even under those circumstances, grieving the loss of her Dad has been a long journey that challenged her sense of who she was and what she wanted from life. This search landed her in a beautiful career as a self-love and relationship coach. It is clear from listening to Evin that she understands the importance of community and connection when it comes to healing our deepest wounds. What a gift she is to the world and I am so glad to be able to call her my new friend.
You can find Evin on Instagram @EvinRose or her website EvinRoseCoaching.com
If you would like to support this show, please subscribe to my Substack where you will receive bi-weekly episodes and a bi-weekly newsletter in your inbox. You can also support the show monetarily by becoming a paid subscriber there.
Special thanks to Josephine Wiggs for the song "Time Does Not Bring Relief" from her album "We Fall."
Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.
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In this deeply moving episode which is also packed with useful information, Dr. Lucy Hone shares her unique perspective, expertise, and personal knowledge of resilience. Resilience is a tricky word because it sometimes gets used inappropriately with kids as a way to discount their experience. We've all heard the phrase "kids are resilient" which is often true but is not an excuse to assume they don't need support to recover from a trauma and/or loss. As Dr. Hone explains, kids do better with the right support at home, but can also learn to strengthen their resilience given the tools she writes about in her book "Resilient Grieving." Having lived through the devastating earthquakes in New Zealand in 2011 and then losing her young daughter and two friends in a car accident in 2014, Dr. Hone has direct experience testing the theories of resilience she has focused on throughout her career.
For more information on Dr. Hone click above or here. And to find her book "Resilient Grieving" you can go anywhere you order books or find it here.
If you would like to support this show, please subscribe to my Substack where you will receive bi-weekly episodes and a bi-weekly newsletter in your inbox. You can also support the show monetarily by becoming a paid subscriber there.
Special thanks to Josephine Wiggs for the song "Time Does Not Bring Relief" from her album "We Fall."
Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.
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Sarah and Ben Satzman are both in their early twenties and were very close to their grandfather Joel Satzman when he died unexpectedly last year. They were able to be with him at the very end of his life and that experience had a huge impact on them. You can hear in their stories about him how much they adored their grandfather and the unique role he played in their lives. He was a great support and strong presence, calling often and showing up to important events throughout their childhoods and they both depended on his special brand of attention. I loved hearing the differences and the similarities between Ben and Sarah's experiences, and it was beautiful to hear how well they supported each other when he died. In the year since that day, Ben and Sarah have both learned a lot about themselves and their grief. Young adults are often my favorite guests and my best teachers, and Sarah and Ben taught me a lot about how family can sometimes be the best support system after a loss.
If you would like to support this show, please subscribe to my Substack where you will receive bi-weekly episodes and a bi-weekly newsletter in your inbox. You can also support the show monetarily by becoming a paid subscriber there.
Special thanks to Josephine Wiggs for the song "Time Does Not Bring Relief" from her album "We Fall."
Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.
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Terry Chatkupt is a visual artist whose current show at the Armory Center for the Arts in Pasadena, California is about the 2020 lockdown and its effect on his family. This podcast was started, in part, to address some of the reporting on adolescent mental health in the aftermath of the pandemic that was sorely lacking. Stories in mainstream media missed an opportunity to interview young people and instead turned to experts who had little knowledge of childhood grief. So I was excited to do an episode addressing the pandemic from the perspective of one man investigating how it affected his own family while trying to convey his appreciation the privilege of having a safe place to live. Terry is also a teacher, so we talked about what we have observed in our students as well as our families and what it may mean for an entire generation to have missed some crucial parts of their social and emotional development as a result of the isolation we all endured for a time.
https://www.terrychatkupt.com/
If you would like to support this show, please subscribe to my Substack where you will receive bi-weekly episodes and a bi-weekly newsletter in your inbox. You can also support the show monetarily by becoming a paid subscriber there.
Special thanks to Josephine Wiggs for the song "Time Does Not Bring Relief" from her album "We Fall."
Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.
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Acclaimed author Sara Zarr has published ten novels for young readers, as well as two books of non-fiction about creativity. She’s a National Book Award finalist and two-time Utah Book Award winner. Her first book, Story of a Girl, was made into a 2017 television movie directed by Kyra Sedgwick. She also hosts the podcast "This Creative Life," all of which you can find on her website below.
I'm a huge fan of Sara's books because she writes about many different forms of loss and does it beautifully, realistically, and honestly without glossing over her characters' struggles. Her latest book, "Kyra, Just for Today" is a follow-up to her previous book, "A Song Called Home," both of which feature young characters living in alcoholic family systems. I love Sara's writing because she takes on kids' hardships while showing us how her characters learn and grow from them. We talked about why she writes about dysfunctional families and the toughest aspects of growing up and why she often gives her characters creative outlets. I appreciate Sara's thoughtful approach to addressing the economic realities of the worlds she creates, and her sharing her motivation and approach to writing about grief from a young person's perspective.
To find out more about Sara:
https://www.sarazarr.com/books
If you enjoy the show please rate and review! You can also find me here @annbfaison on Instagram, or contact me through my website.
Please subscribe to the podcast on whatever platform you use, or on my substack: I'm Listening
Special thanks to Josephine Wiggs for the song "Time Does Not Bring Relief" from her album "We Fall."
Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.
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I'm excited to kick off the second season with another interview with a young adult. In this episode I talk with Léa Greenberg, a junior in college, about losing her mother and maternal grandmother by age fifteen. Her mother and grandmother were both French so Léa also lost a big piece of her French identity. We could have talked for hours so it took a lot of work to edit our conversation to fifty minutes. Léa articulates why it was hard as a teenager to deal with pity from adults and all the other hard lessons of losing her mother at a young age. As usual, when talking to a GenZ guest, I was filled with hope for her and gratitude for our conversation. Léa is amazingly clear about what is most difficult about not having a mother, and how she uses her experience to help others. For an extra fifteen minutes of our conversation, you can listen to the bonus episode.
You can find me here @annbfaison on Instagram, or on my substack, or contact me through my website.
Please subscribe to the podcast on whatever platform you use, or on my substack: I'm Listening
Special thanks to Josephine Wiggs for the song "Time Does Not Bring Relief" from her album "We Fall."
Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.
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This is an extra fifteen minutes of my conversation with Léa Greenberg. It won't make much sense if you haven't listened to the full episode but we talk about Harry Potter, holding onto her French identity and what she plans to do for her career.
Please consider subscribing to the podcast on whatever platform you use or on my substack: I'm Listening
Special thanks to Josephine Wiggs for the song "Time Does Not Bring Relief" from her album "We Fall."
Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.
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Coming soon! Season two is shaping up nicely and I should be posting the first episode in a couple of weeks. This trailer is about what you can expect from the next season and how my thinking about adolescent grief has expanded and changed.
Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.
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