Episoder
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“We teach people how to think of us.”
Are you ready to steer your reputation? Are you ready to up-level your brand? Are you ready to connect with your audience and show them who you really are? Are you ready to create visual assets that frame the way you are seen and understood? And, most importantly….are you ready to show up on purpose?
My name is Marlana and I am an international photographer and visual strategist. My client base has included athletes, celebrities, WWE Superstars and public figures including Miss North Carolina.
My experience includes storytelling, advertising, location scouting and set styling and design. My work has been featured on magazine covers and in NY Times ads.
I have been hosting Your Iconic Image for 100 episodes now and for episode 100, my first guest, John Dalrymple is going to turn things around and interview me.
www.marlanasemenza.com
IG: marlana.semenza.photo
Transcription : Vision In Word
Marlana
Well, welcome to the 100th episode of Your Iconic Image. And today, you are actually going to get a little insight on me, and what we're going to do is, we're going to bring this whole thing full circle. My very first guest is going to do the interview. If you missed his episode, please go back and watch it. It is called What Makes An Icon? John, the show’s yours.
John
Well, hello, Marlana. How are you?
Marlana
I'm well.
John
Well, it's an honor to talk with you today. You know, you are a genuine and authentic person, incredibly talented. And I would even say gifted in your ability to bring out the best in people. You've reached this milestone 100 podcast. And today, we get the chance to get to know you. Even though you've done 100 podcasts, many people really don't know what you do. So, first question, tell us about what you do.
Marlana
I am a photographer and visual strategist. So, what that means is, I take all the things that make you unique, and I bridge the gap between that and what your audience or clients need to know. I do that in images, and that's in a nutshell, that is that.
John
Okay, you're in a crowded field, as we all are. Tell us what makes you different than other photographers.
Marlana
I think part of it is my background. But also, at its core, I'm really not in the photography business. Photography is the vessel that I used, and the means of communication that I use. But really, I'm in the reputation business. And so, I think that's the biggest difference.
John
Wow, I love that. I absolutely love that. So, tell us a little bit about your creative process. Walk us kind of through that. How do you get to know someone?
Marlana
It's a busy world in my brain, John. When somebody comes to me, and they want to collaborate, because I don't look at it, as you know, I'm doing this for you, I do look at us as a collaboration because I very much go off of their input also, and you know, their suggestions, all that kind of thing. So, it's not just me, it's us. That said, there is a questionnaire that I have people initially fill out and I have worked with somebody who is in the psychology realm to help me word the questions in a way that will make you dig a little deeper. And when I get that back, then what happens from there is we go over it. Often I have found that the answers that people write down really aren't the answer. It's about three answers deeper than that. So usually, that comes from the conversations and evoking those.
John
Nice replies. Yeah, that's absolutely awesome. Now, you know, personal branding is become such a huge, dynamic, fluid issue and an important one. So walk us through how can someone be best prepared to work with you and make the most out of a session with you? Are there some tips and things that you would share with people about how they can work with you or make the most out of their time with you?
Marlana
I will say this, all photographers aren't a one size fits all. So I may or may not be the right fit for you. And that's okay because when we first connect, we're kind of interviewing each other. And I want to make sure that you get the best person, the best photographer, the best storyteller for you, which, like I said, may or may not be me. And if it's not me, I have people that I can refer you to. And it's not that there's anything, you know, quote unquote, wrong with either one of us, it's just that we just may not be a fit. And you want somebody that can fall in love with who you are, what you stand for, and all those kinds of things.
I know for me, that's essential, because if I can't fall in love with you, then I can get other people to fall in love with you. So, I think that's what you have to look for when you research somebody's website. First of all, if you're looking for a brand photographer, it's got to be more than headshots, you need to see storytelling. And aside from that, I want you to also look at their style of photography, because what you see is what you're gonna get. If you like it, then pursue contacting them and having these conversations. By the time I actually get somebody in front of my camera, we've had three or four conversations and we know each other pretty well at that point. Then we can also develop our game plan. We know what's going to happen, we know What needs to, who needs to bring what. All those kinds of things.
John
Oh, that's awesome. Hey, people out there, did you hear that it's more than headshots? Your personal brand is more than headshots and storytelling and people getting to know you is really important to creating that connection, that rapport and really being able to build a relationship that you can work well together. So, let's talk a little bit, you know, you have so many come in, what are some of your goals when you begin that creative process with someone? Can you describe those a little bit?
Marlana
I want to bring out the unique things about you, but also the best things about you, I think everybody deserves to be seen in a unique way for the best of who they are. So, you know, we're building a relationship, this is a partnership. And so I need to get to know you. People have said to me, Well, how much do I really need to share, I don't really want to be the face of my brand, you know, all those kinds of things. And as far as what to share, all's I can say is, especially when it comes to social media, you don't have to tell everybody all your business, I want you to look at it like a rental house, or a rental property where you want people to come in, you want them to be comfortable, you want them to, to, you know, sleep in the comfortable bed and swim in the pool. But there's always an owner's closet, there's always something that's locked in there that they can't have access to. I want you to treat your branding, and your message and all the pieces view the same way. Now the size of that owner's closet and what goes in it is entirely up to you. But always make sure that you have one.
John
All right. sage advice. absolutely outstanding, there seems to be a trend to overshare. And in a lot of cases, less is more. So keep those things in that owners closet people. That's wonderful. Let's talk about you know, some of the things that you've done, maybe describe for us, one of your most memorable shoots, memorable people that you've worked with? And what made that person or that experience memorable, just kind of walk us through some of that,
Marlana
you know, all of them are to me.
John
That's great! And I believe that.
Marlana
I would say, you know, obviously, one of my most memorable things was how I got into photography in the first place. I was a photography major. But my first job was with WWE, well, actually WWF at the time, and I never watched wrestling, I went down to apply for a job in photo editing and I wound up on a tour bus. And the first day, I was told, okay, we'll meet the bus, and it was nighttime and so I get on the bus and the dark. Me and I think six guys I've never met and told you know, here's your bunk, and I got to the arena the next day, I walked backstage and I looked around I'm like, What have I done? But I worked there for three years. It was an amazing experience and a lot of good memories.
John
Wow, that is so cool. And I have to ask a follow up your favorite wrestler did
Marlana
You know, it's really hard I would say from a lot of standpoints. I love Taker, he is sweet baby Taker. You know, he looks like this big imposing thing. That's not the side of him that I remember. He's just a class act and also to my dear friend Joe Laurinaitis, who passed away about a year ago. loved him. Absolutely loved him!
John
That's outstanding! Just great! Wonderful! Let's talk a little bit more if we can, you've recently had an amazing experience with women in rock and roll. Can you talk to us a little bit about that and some of your takeaways from that experience?
Marlana
Yeah. When I was in college, I wanted to work two places. I wanted to work for Rolling Stone and I wanted to work for Vanity Fair.
John
Nice.
Marlana
Yeah. Well, the so when I had the opportunity to go out and photograph these women out in LA, it was a rock and roll fantasy camp. And it was the first ever women's only. Gentleman by the name of David Fishoff runs these camps. And Britt lightning who is the music director is just fabulous. She's been on the show as well. But yes, it was wonderful and amazing to meet and photograph, Melissa Etheridge, Nancy Wilson and Kathy Valentine. However, to me the standouts at that camp were the women that participated, and the camp counselors, oh my goodness! The Janet Robins and the Tasha Jones and the Samantha Maloney's of the world. But these are just Outstanding women, Nikki Stevens. I mean, the list goes on and on.
I'm just so thankful for meeting all of them, because here's the thing, I do not play music, I can't sing, I can't play a note, but I was so inspired by all of these women. Even the women that were campers, Payton Velligan, and Sierra Levesque, Dawn Crans, and on and on and on, they were so inspired by their passion, and their creativity, and you walk away transformed. I think that's the thing when we work in a certain industry, like I work in photography, we often look to other people in our industry for inspiration, things like that. Look outside your industry, because other people are doing such amazing things, and when they have that kind of passion, it rubs off.
John
Fantastic. Were there any particular key learnings or things that you took away from that not only from the inspiration, but just in being there and being a part of it?
Marlana
Seeing these women all come together from all over the country, and even out of the country, and the way they supported one another and cheered for one another and encourage one another, that honestly doesn't always happen. So, to watch it happen, and when it does happen, there is such strength in that.
John
Oh, absolutely. supporting each other and seeing that, that's wonderful. Absolutely love it. Now, let's start, you reached 100 podcasts. Walk us through, as a photographer, why did you start a podcast?
Marlana
I started it honestly, for two reasons. I wanted to give people value aside from, you know, because I stay in my lane when it comes to branding. I'm I do the visuals, I tell the story and images, but I stay in my lane. But there are so many other aspects to it, that I wanted people to have information, inspiration, tips, tools, tricks and all those kinds of things from experts in their fields. So, that was one of the main reasons.
John
I was gonna say it, though, love that.
Marlana
And then the other reason, honestly, was to be able to have conversations with amazing people.
John
Oh, that's so cool. You know, I congratulate you celebrate.
Marlana
Yeah, that is just one of the coolest things that I can think of.
John
That's just awesome. So, let's talk about you a little bit.
Marlana
Okay.
John
So, you know, you live your life in a way that live leaves people better than when you found them. How did that kindness develop within you? How did that come forward? And you know, you use that in your photography, but you inspire people. How did that develop?
Marlana
Well, first of all, that's very kind. But I think for one thing, there are enough things that beat us up in the world. I don't want to be one of them. And, you know, my husband laughs at me, we walk into rooms differently. He said, When you walk into a room, you just walk in, you see the best in everybody, and I said, Well, that's by design. That's my job. And I said, besides, I never have to worry about...
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Model Makers Group
Model Makers Group is not a mother agency or management company, but rather trusted, industry modeling industry consultants. Over the past 13 years they have successfully placed models and actors with top agencies around the country. Together, co-owners Cristina Buehrer and Tara Rasheta have over 50 years of experience in the entertainment industry. They use that knowledge and insight to empower their clients with the practical knowledge and personalized guidance needed to get started in the business.
https://www.modelmakersgroup.com/
https://www.instagram.com/modelmakersgroup/
https://www.facebook.com/modelmakersgroup
our sister non-profit: https://www.amodelpatient.org/
www.marlanasemenza.com
Audio : Ariza Music Productions
Transcription : Vision In Word
Marlana:
Model Maker's Group places models and actors with top agencies around the country. Owners, Christina and Tara have over 50 years of experience in the entertainment industry. They use that knowledge and insight to empower their clients with practical knowledge and personalized guidance needed to get started in the business. Welcome Tara.
Tara:
Hi. Thank you so much for having me.
Marlana:
So, first go into a little bit of detail. What exactly does Model Maker's Group do?
Tara:
Sure. So, our specialty is agency placement. We consult with models and if they're under 18, we're also often working with their parents and we're helping them navigate the industry. Right. We are primarily working with models, hence the name model makers, but we also have clients who are our in entertainment, maybe as a TV host or an actor. So, we also work with other specialties under that entertainment umbrella. But our specialty is helping those clients sign to reputable agencies around the country. And though I am now based in Dallas and my partner Christina is on the East coast, we work with clients every day all across the country. We accomplish a lot of that through Zoom sessions. And of course, we love to work with our clients in person. So, I have a great office here in Dallas where I meet with clients. We also anytime we're traveling, we make an announcement to our clients so that we can hopefully connect face-to-face. Cuz as you know, nothing beats face-to-face, but our success rate is really the same whether we're meeting with our clients in person or online.
Marlana:
So, what is the benefit of having an agency like yours versus trying to go direct to various agencies, modeling agencies?
Tara:
Sure. That's a question that we get a lot. And you know, agencies are flooded with new model, new talent submissions every day and it is the snap of a finger for them to say no. In fact, most of their submissions will instantly go into the no pile. And so, what we found is that, you know, you don't know what you don't know until you figure out you don't know it. And so that's where our models and clients are. They don't know what they don't know, but what we offer is practical guidance to get them where they need to go. So, it often starts with like reviewing imagery and as you know, as a photographer, imagery is so impactful, but a lot of times these models are applying to agencies on their own not knowing what the agents want. So, they're sending in the wrong types of pictures.
Maybe they have incomplete applications. They don't know what a talent resume should look like. They don't know what a slate video should comprise of, they don't have their measurements correct. I mean something so simple as taking your body measurements. I measure models all the time and I usually want to test them like, Hey, take these at home and when we meet in person, if we have the opportunity to, I'm gonna test your measuring skills. And a lot of times those are off and you know, this is an image-based business so a few inches off can make a big difference on an application. And so, we're looking at all those elements start to finish to prepare before we recommend that a client submit to agencies. And we have two different consulting packages. We have one where we are doing all that legwork ahead of time and then we sent a customized list of agencies that we have that we know to be reputable, ethical, and professional in the industry.
And then they are handling the submissions on their own. But we're there every step of the way to answer questions. You know, to review emails that they receive, we're there supporting them through that process, but they're handling the submissions on their own. And then we have like what we call our ultimate consulting package where we personally submit the clients to agencies which is much more full service. It's a very tedious process to submit to agencies but you know, we've done it for so many years, it's really easy for us and it takes that off the plate of the model or the parent. So, really, that's it. It is just, you know, the success rate of getting signed if you've worked with a professional is going to be higher than if you just wing it.
Marlana:
And both you and Christina also come from a place of having been there, done that kind of a thing, which I think is so much better when you have somebody who knows what it's like to be on the other side. I know for me; I know what women like to wanna look like in front of the camera cuz I've been on the other side of the camera, and I just think that little element helps so much. So, talk to us a little bit about what some of the things you and Christina have accomplished.
Tara:
Yeah, so, I mean, when we started our business it was 2009. She and I were both working as professional full-time models in Los Angeles. We met at a casting and instantly had a friendship. We both had the experience of competing at Miss u s a state title holder. So, I was Miss Alabama USA, she was Miss Massachusetts USA. So, when we put that together, we had this instant connection. And as we started talking about our experience in the industry at that point, we'd already been working for many years. We also realized that we were getting fielding a lot of questions maybe from, you know, friends of friends or like my mom's hairdressers daughter, you know, it was all these like degrees of separation. But people would be contacting us either emailing us or calling us independently and saying, Hey, I want to help my daughter get into the business.
Or Hey my friend, I'm with this agency but this something doesn't sound right. Can you help? And so, we realized there was a real need for practical advice and consulting and mentorship. And for us it was just so simple because we were already working in the industry. We'd already reviewed our own agency contracts. We know what needed to be in place. We know what red flags to look for, how to stay safe. We both were very lucky to have positive and safe experiences in the industry, but we also know what to look and listen for. And so, we thought, you know, we've got so much knowledge that we can share. And that's how we started our business. Christina and I both had wonderful careers that allowed us to travel the world. We also did a lot of TV hosting, red carpet hosting, things like that.
So, you know, we've also had not only worked as models but had our hand in broadcasting and a little bit of acting. And so, it really does that knowledge base is so great for our clients and we continue to help facilitate castings and we still continue to work with some of the fashion brands that we modeled for many years ago and help them place models for their campaigns as well. So, we're still involved very much involved in the modeling industry and that definitely translates to helping our clients navigate it. And at the end of the day, just as we had a positive and safe experience, that is the ultimate goal. I mean, we want these girls to have fun and make money and all the other things too, but safety has always been top priority and will always continue to be.
And really signing with a reputable agency adds so many layers of protection to that model and to a parent supporting her child because the agency vets their clients they get to be the bad guys and chased on the money if the invoices are late, they negotiate the contract on behalf of the model and they should always be looking out for the model's best interest. So that's why we've chosen to really focus on agency placement because certainly it, it makes for a, a more healthy place for a new model to start at somewhere nurturing environment to be under the protection of that agency. But also, we know that the best bookings are always going to come through reputable agencies. And in fact, just yesterday I had a client who I'm working with on agency placement, she received an email maybe it was like a cold call through Instagram.
I don't know how this email came to her, but it was a scam email basically claiming you've got a booking in LA, we need you here next week. It's a $4,000 gig. And I just had to tell her there's no way that that company, and I'm not gonna name who they were saying it was, would hire you directly without going through an agency because also agencies have insurance coverage and things like that and in individual models just don't have, you know, there's a lot of legality to that too. But that's why I was like, just politely decline to respond to that email and let's continue working on getting you signed. Cuz that's really where the agent helps lead models to meaningful casting and booking opportunities and we really wanna get them there so they can do more of what they love,
Marlana:
You know, and it's really kind of sad because a lot of new models especially want it so badly. So, you just hit on one. What are some red flags that they can watch out for that, you know, no, this is not something that you wanna respond to or pursue.
Tara:
Sure. I mean I think, you know casting is so important especially for big projects. So, if a model receives a DM on Instagram or an email and it's about a booking and they're direct booked without having to do anything, then you need to have your ears and eyes open because that something doesn't sound or look right to me in that situation. So, you know, there always should be some sort of casting. Now a lot of, a lot of models are able to self-tape, and I think this has really been great for our models that live in more rural markets because I think post covid we found that, you know, the zoom casting process was just easier for casting directors and for fashion professionals. So, a lot of times you'll start with that. You may end up having an in-person like callback but so many things can be booked from afar, but there needs to be some sort of interview slash casting.
So, if you haven't been asked to do that, then chances are that's a scam. Also, you know, the lists of agencies that we're providing to our clients we keep on spreadsheets of all the regions where we have our clients and that's the whole country. And we're very familiar with almost all of the agency contracts on the list that we're providing to our clients. And so, we know that you know, agents do not ask for money for you to be represented. And that's definitely one of the scams. So, we actually wrote a book called Top 10 Modeling Scams and it's on Amazon. And it's just a little guide really, but it's like easy things that you can do, whether you're working with us and you're getting signed to an agency or if you're trying it on your own, just some really practical things that you can do to stay safe and to have a good experience in the industry. But those are two things, just like there should always be a casting and then you do not pay an agency to be represented by them. There are some fees and that's, there are some caveats of course. And we discuss that with our clientele and review that in contract review. But by and large that's the rule.
Marlana:
So, who is a good client for you or what makes a good client for you?
Tara:
You know, a great client for me is someone who's willing to do the work. . So, trust me, you don't wanna just pay me to tell you that you're pretty int talented, but sometimes I think the clients just want me to do that and I'm like, no, I'm actually here to like to push you and get you to the next step. And so, I love my clients who work hard, so every time I meet with a client or Christina meets with a client, whether we're zooming or in person, we always send instantly a follow up email, here are your next tasks and here are ours. Cuz there's a lot of stuff we do behind the scenes reviewing contracts, putting together the agency list, talent, resume, reviewing, you know, their materials model, walking commercials, whatever it is. But they have to be doing the work too.
So, I love when a client is really on top of it and motivated. And that's one thing that we cannot teach . And I've tried for 13 years, I cannot be someone's motivation. They've got to find that motivation within themselves and this industry really requires it. You know, I think that because modeling is an image-based industry and of course that's an important part of it. People just think, oh, well I'm pretty, I'm so pretty so I'll get signed to work. But guess what? And you know this as a photographer, there's so much more to it. You've gotta be professional, you've gotta show up prepared, you need to have a good attitude, you need to work hard and do what is expected of you and go the extra mile and express gratitude. There's just so much that goes to it that really is a part of the equation for the success of the client and for the longevity of that client. So, we love our hardworking, motivated clients because they tend to do really well.
Marlana:
You know, it's funny that you touch on that too because people say, oh, I wanna get into the modeling business and they focus on the modeling and not on the business.
Tara:
. Right!
Marlana:
And there's a reason why it's called the modeling business.
Tara:
Sure. That's right.
Marlana:
So, when somebody comes to you ideally, what would you like to see them come at you with?
Tara:
They just need to be open-minded and willing to work hard. Sometimes a model comes to me, and you know, in the first session it's like, let me get to know your goals. Let me because every client is different. They all have different strengths; they all live in different regions geographically. They all have different goals. So, I need to learn what that is so that we can really personalize the guidance and mentorship we're gonna offer them. And I think that, you know, if a model comes to us and they just have this like super defined, like, I only want to be a runway model or I only want to be an actor, then they could be limiting themselves. Because until you get into the industry, you may not know what's going to be a good fit for you.
So, I really love when the models are open to the different ideas we have. I mean, we can definitely look at a model and get to know her or him. We have male models too. And say, you know what, based on their strengths, this is the path that we think that they need to go within the industry, or this is the path or maybe both. And so, the more open-minded they are to that, the better. Also, you know, process of elimination is powerful, right? It sometimes leads us to where we need to be. And so, I think that if we encourage a model maybe to also look at acting because maybe she lives in a market where there are a lot of acting opportunities, we don't want her to miss out on that. That may not be her first passion, but she could also determine pretty quickly through the casting process after she gets signed, like if that's gonna be a good fit for her or not. But I think just being open to that is really important.
Marlana:
And I would think that being open and flexible makes one model more placeable than another.
Tara:
Sure. And you know, a lot of these agencies that our models are applying to are what we call full service, meaning they have like a fashion division, a commercial division, a theatrical division, and maybe even a voiceover division. And so, if a model can be viewed as marketable between divisions, that could make her more signable. So, allowing her to explore those things and encouraging her to be open-minded to that I think is makes her more desirable from the agent's perspective. And I keep saying her because predominantly our clients are female. If you go to our Instagram...
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Zika Metaxa
writer
Zika Metaxa grew up in an internationally known family spirits business, founded by her ancestors in 1888. As a marketer, she traveled the world promoting the family spirit, as a member of the family business and then, for the multinational company that acquired the Metaxa brand.
After becoming a mom Zika left a career in marketing, advertising, and retail and turned her attention to more intimate, creative pursuits. She first penned a children’s book in her native Greek language. Her new book, an English language memoir, “Metaxa Stars: The Evolution of a Greek Spirit Within Generations,” shares stories and lessons growing up Metaxa. She is currently developing her third book.
Metaxastars.com
https://www.amazon.com/Metaxa-Stars-Evolution-Spirit-Generations-ebook/dp/B0BJCDHCSX
www.marlanasemenza.com
Audio : Ariza Music Productions
Transcription : Vision In Word
Marlana
Metaxa, the name is iconic. Founded in 1888, the spirits brand spanned generations as to the stories and lessons shared. Today, we had the honor of speaking with Zika, daughter, marketer and author, as she says a bit of what it was like growing up as part of the family behind the brand. Welcome, Zika.
Zika
Hello, very nice to see you. Hardly, I'm very happy to be here with you.
Marlana
So, you know, as I read your memoir, I thought there are a lot of different ways we could take this conversation. But what I'd like to do is I'd like to actually start with the women because I feel that in society, and also in certain cultures, that it's very difficult for women to find their way, you know, find their voice, all of these things, but you come from a long line of very strong women. And sometimes that strength was a good thing, and sometimes not such a good thing. But tell us a little bit about your mother and your grandmother, who you are named after.
Zika
Yes, thank you very much indeed. Basically, it all started of the woman of the family, my great grandmother, she was really, really a very dynamic personality. Now we are talking in the 88 is of course, that was a thinkable of woman to have to speak their mind at the time, especially in Greece, which I'll come to that later on. So, she was very dynamic she was working in. It was not a factory yet in the business, whatever business it was, at the time, it was at the very beginning. She raised her children, she had nine children single handedly with her husband, but she was in care of everything. And she even had a say in politics, and was able to issue a law. She was also a great philanthropist. She lived in a house, in the suburbs in Paris, airport, very well-known port in Greece. And every day she would have, she would give up free food in big plates for the people who did not have money to buy food for the poor. And there were queues and queues of people waiting for the food. Despina, that was her name, was giving out. So that was my great grandmother.
Then my grandmother Zika, whom I am named after, because this is the family tradition. We are named after the father's usually parents. She was also extremely dynamic. She had a very, very strong personality. People in at the time we had the factory so she was coming to the factory every day, people the factory, the employees were always almost scared of her because she was always walking around looking around poking her nose, everywhere, literally. And she has a big nose. And obviously she was not working with finances or the marketing's but she was taking care of the other house. Can I say this The other aspect of the business she was going around making sure the gardens work, yay. We had chicken at the time in that factory that Hans had laid the chickens. She was always around, she knew who was working were in one place. She was walking up and down all day. Like a surgeon that would say, so she was very, very dynamic.
Now my mother, Karina, she was less dynamic in the business area. Because she left my father to do that, as it was his parental business. She stepped aside. But she was very dynamic and that she grew up also single handedly without help three children, me and my two brothers. And she had her presence was let's say, low key. But she was dynamic in an invisible way. Always making sure her way, eventually, you know past
Marlana
and sometimes, you know, the quiet strength is usually under rated, and it's seeming like your mother had a lot of quiet strength.
Zika
That's true. I think it's very intelligent to have a quiet strength. I have tried a lot of times to imitate her but I have never succeeded because I'm very spontaneous. And I always speak out the my mind sometimes even faster than I should.
Marlana
But your grandmother and your mother didn't have a great relationship in the beginning.
Zika
Not at all. My grandmother was very, very difficult in her relationships. And the weird thing is that's why the book is about you know, patterns going on again and again through generations. She didn't have a good relationship or either with her in laws, and her husband's siblings. She never approved of my father's marriage, and never, because she wanted my father to marry someone from a wealthy family, which my mother was not. And she never, never accept the fact that he went on and did what his heart told him to do, without taking into consideration her words. So that was very unforgettable in her mind, she felt her son had betrayed her.
And now remember, bear in mind, that was in the 1960s. Still, in those days, and especially in Greece, it was a very big thing, who marries whom the parents had a tremendous say in it. And it was really answered, I'm not comfortable that my father went ahead and did what married the girl he loved, although his parents did not approve. So in that way, they had, they really did not have a very good relationship, not at all. But after the year, many, many years past, we were quite old, all of that. Towards the end, I would say over the life of my grandmother's life, the relationship did finally take a good turn. And at least towards the last, the last years of her life were peaceful in that manner.
Marlana
What was different about what you saw? Growing Up Female versus male in your family?
Zika
Oh, my God, different, like black and white. But not only my family, in Greece, in all families, and can I tell you, even nowadays, it still is the case. Not so prominent as it was those days. But still. So the thing is that in Greece, it's whenever the as soon as the wife becomes pregnant, everybody in the family except herself a praying for a boy, in order to take their families name, and a surname and the last name and to continue the business that was always in the mind all these years in the 1960s, the 70s, the 80s, the 90s onwards, to the point that in the villages in the provinces, this still applies today. Let's say for example, someone has four kids, and he has two boys, two girls, they asked him, someone will ask him how many children who you have, he will say, Oh, I have two children. And two daughters. Like the daughters are not even considered children. And even today, it's, they say, for example, oh, she did very well, for a girl she became a lawyer, or a doctor still may think it's something very major that a girl accomplished, to finish his studies, and to become a doctor or a lawyer or politician.
So, that was very, very much the case in my family. And since I was the first grandchild born into the family, from I mean, the first grandchild to my grandfather and my grandmother, the fact that it was a doctor was very disappointing to them, they will expect to the first grandchild to be a boy. So, it was a quiet event when I was born. When my brother, my first brother, and dress was born four years later, now was a huge event. I mean, they didn't have the time. I think there's fireworks if they would have a little mouth. Yes. And excuse my English again. But it's not my native language. That's why I have to think sometime.
Marlana
Now, you're doing fantastic. And it's actually very engaging to listen to what you know; your book talks a lot about family patterns and things like that. What patterns do you hope to continue, and which ones do you hope to break?
Zika
Now this is very difficult, this is really challenging for me, because the patterns I'm trying to break, I'm being completely honest here. I have to fight to break because subconsciously, I repeat them every day with my exam. And I have to make a very strong fault and like restart and say, now you're being your mother, you're being your grandmother, you're being your father, you're saying exactly the same things. Sometimes I even catch myself doing the same. You know, not remarks, figures and how do you say expressions on my face like my mind, I roll their eyes I got all these things. I hated; I do the more.
When, for example, my son tells me oh my god, you sound like grandma. Yes, I do. And then I try to do restart and talking with friends, I have realized that all of us more or less do the same thing. And this is the balance and the difficulty to try and break this circle because I feel I feel this intuitively and in my heart that if we can break the circle, it will not be repeated also after us.
Marlana
Right? Which patterns do you hope to continue? Because there has to be some wonderful things that you remember as well.
Zika
Yes, I hope to continue being generous in the heart, and kind, and above all, human and decent person with a low profile, not arrogant, or snobbish, or all the opposite.
Marlana
So, what's your favorite family story?
Zika
My favorite family story, let me see, because there was so many, definitely it was from during the World War Two, when the Germans were here, and they were raised in Greece, my grandmother Zika, trying so hard to obtain food for her children, everything about this. And it was so difficult to find a piece of bread. If they found an egg, it was a luxury, they had to exchange things in order to get food. And she was telling me how she was running from one corner to the other, trying to find a piece of bread or some not even vegetables, just like maybe one green leaf or something, while the Germans were raiding the city with bullets, basically, she was running out amongst the bullets, while the food hidden in her coat or in her dress, to go and feed her sons, this will may have stayed, it has stayed with me, whenever I go grocery shopping, or whatever, and I buy something for the house, I always think of this.
I'm always grateful of what we have now, of all the years that we've been through the generations before me for generations to come, take for granted, things like not so I get all the groceries, or having a good life. That's one of those things I really remember. And
Marlana
and, you know, what's so interesting too, is as your grandmother is trying to navigate the streets and go past bullets and things like that, the men in your family, we're actually still making this liquor.
Zika
they were trying to make it not to present it. The liquor it was to, let's say, downsize the whole story, because the Germans at the time knew that this lecture was happening faster, and definitely wanted to obtain the rest of the team. So, my grandfather, at the time, tried very, very hard and he managed not to give the exact recipe because they really pushed him to the rest of the team. They wanted to go and do the identical thing in Germany or whatever. But they manage the men in the family managed to keep it as a secret. One way of cheating the Germans and till the end of their career. This recipe was a secret recipe. Only thing you know, and it went from mouth to mouth from man to man. My grandmother didn't know the secret person, but she was a woman.
Marlana
Yeah. Did you ever kNwo,
Zika
No.
Marlana
That's funny. And I remember reading in the book too. It was actually pretty brilliant, what they did with the brass spec.
Zika
Yes, because at the time they had it was in barrels, it was still in barrels that they didn't have time.
Marlana
Do you have to bottle a lot of bottles?
Zika
Just a few bottles. And mostly it was from barrels and they would open them a little tap, let's say there was a tap around staff and people would either go with empty bottles of their own if for example, water bottles or something else fill it in, because this was the war. All they would the ones who had some money to buy a bottle would buy a bottle. So when the Germans but they knew my ancestors knew that this brown stack was not very good for the product because it sort of ruins the taste and the quality. But at the time, they didn't have either the means or the you know that the people and the time to concentrate and make it as they should, which they did after the war. So when the Germans came demand I'm going to obtain the recipe of the product. Listen, of course, come in, we'll welcome you, we'll give you a drink, try this product before we give you the recipe. And they made sure they gave them the product from the tap the bronze tap, which was not good also in taste.
So, the German method was a color now somebody would start drinking, you spit it out. This is all stuff. Why are people talking about this stuff? This is disgusting. So, he thought that people were just drinking it or buying it, obtaining it because they were desperate. It was the wall. And they thought, you know, it's better than nothing, we can have some alcohol. So, he totally took it out of his mind. And he said to everybody, all his other followers and German friends or whatever soldiers, that this is just a rumor. It's not at all a good product, this product is awful. We don't need to spend another moment on this project. And then as they say, in the book, little did they know that many years later, it was exporting this product from Greece to Germany. And actually Germany was one of the first countries in exports in Metaxa that they drank lots of it, they loved it, they still do.
Marlana
So funny. You talk about that. You know, this was a very male dominated business, this family business. So did you have difficulty carving out a path for yourself within the business?
Zika
Yes, I had a lot of difficult days. And I think it has still stayed with me all these years, I have been always trying to prove that I am good enough, business wise that I can do it like a man. And I think we have this has stayed with me and it's not a good, not something I'm proud of, I'm trying to fix it to make it better. But after all these years struggling to prove that you know, as a girl, as a woman, I can also do it. I can handle the liquor, I can sell the liquor, I can market the liquor. It was quiet, they never took me seriously, especially in the beginning.
Marlana
You know, which is funny to me, because when the business was eventually sold, you are part of the sale. And that was you had to have some work?
Zika
Yes, that was something I chose to be, but they thought, you know, the people who bought the company at the time, okay, they didn't think I would last, let's say, okay, she will stay for a month or two. And they were extra suspicious. They thought I was maybe staying there in order to I don't know, find out their secrets or something which was not at all the case, of course, I decided to stay on because I thought and it was eventually an immense lesson for me to work for a multinational company. It was totally a different approach, an extremely professional approach. Plus, the company had a big brand of products except the brand day they had bought because they had whiskies they had liquors, which was very challenging. They everything all the marketing was restricted from the beginning. So, there were a lot of briefing and advertising agencies, I loved all that. I learned so much in marketing, which was like having a master's degree in marketing. So much. They worked very hard on all hours, not like obviously we were working on so many hours as a family and on a different level. But I think after the first, let's say six, seven months near a year that they realized that I'm okay. Okay, I'm not the enemy.
Marlana
Did you find it difficult when the company was purchased, to kind of climb out from the family name? Because I mean, you still were a Metaxa?
Zika
Yes. Yes, I found it difficult. I think it was more. I understood that completely the reasons the company was sold at the time, the timing, everything. And I think it was more disappointing for my brothers and dress manglers as they were much younger than me they didn't have the opportunity to start working in the company or not, but they were I mean, they were teenagers at the time, almost finishing school, my brother and dress and they always thought, of course, being brought up in this male orientated company that they were the successors that would be one day the continuous I mean, since the day they were born. This was what they were. Everybody was telling them in the family. So, I think for the boys, it was more disappointing. For me as I was a bit l was l Jerell older, I realized the way my ankle my father explained it to me the business aspect of the timing, I realized it's a good time. And of course, it hurts also emotionally.
I thought it was an opportunity for me, again, to prove myself and to work hard. And which you did, it did actually work out like that it didn't turn out like that. In the end, after the years I spent them. It was appreciated. And by that time, and because the people who work for my work were I think only one was great, all the other will burn foreigners. They didn't have...
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Michael (Mike) Hingson. I am president of The Michael Hingson Group, Inc. and the chief vision officer for accessiBe
Blind since birth, Michael Hingson was born to sighted parents who raised him with a can-do attitude. Always a high achiever, Michael learned how to ride a bike, and was able to do advanced math in his head! He received a Master’s Degree in Physics, and a Secondary Teaching Credential.
Michael worked for high-tech companies in management until September 11, 2001 when he and his guide dog Roselle escaped from the 78th floor of Tower One in the WTC. Thrust into the international limelight, Michael began to share lessons of trust, courage, and teamwork based on this experience.
Mike is the author of the #1 NY Times Bestseller “Thunder dog,” selling over 2.5 million copies, and his 2nd book “Running with Roselle, A story for Our Youth.”
An international public speaker, Mike delivers inspiring and thought-provoking messages to the world’s elite, including President George W. Bush, and has appeared on hundreds of TV and Radio programs, including Larry King. Hired by major organizations, Michael speaks on perseverance, the importance of trust and teamwork, and moving from diversity to inclusion.
www.michaelhingson.com
www.marlanasemenza.com
Audio : Ariza Music Productions
Transcription : Vision In Word
Marlana:
Blind since birth, Michael Hingson is a high achiever whose parents raised him with a can-do attitude. He worked for high-tech companies and management until September 11th, 2001, when he and his guide dog Roselle escaped from the 78th floor of Tower one of the World Trade Center thrust into the international limelight, Michael began to share lessons of trust, courage, and teamwork based on his experience. Welcome Michael.
Michael:
Thank you. Good to be here.
Marlana:
So, I know that the events of 9/11 were a little bit ago. However, I know that any one of us that is old enough to remember them, they will be forever etched in our memory. So, walk us through a little bit of what it was like from your perspective.
Michael:
It's really interesting the way you phrased that because one of the things that we have experienced for me is that, as you say, we all remember it. And over the past 10 years especially, I've realized that we now have a whole generation of children now going into young adults who have no personal knowledge of September 11th at all. So, I think that it is absolutely important that we remember it. We still remember Pearl Harbor and rightly so. Some of us remember when JFK was shot, and all the things around that. I think it's important that we remember September 11th because there were a lot of lessons to be taken from that. Again, actually since September 11th, people have asked me if I will come and talk about September 11th, my experience and the lessons that we should learn.
I hope that continues cuz I'm glad to travel and speak and be keynote speakers and all that stuff. So anyway, for me, it was a day of validation because as a person who happens to be blind, the typical response for me and for other blind people who try to get a job is, well, you're blind. How could you do this job? Or you're blind, how could you get to work? I could go to a job interview and clearly get there on my own. And somebody says, well how you gonna get to work? Well, I got here, didn't I? Right. And you said you were interested in my resume. My resume demonstrates that I constantly overachieved goals and so on. What's the issue? The problem is we haven't taught people that blindness isn't the problem. It's our attitudes about blindness.
And the reason I say that is because in reality I was very fortunate in one way because what I was fortunate to be able to do is to get a job out of college and went from one job to another. At one point when I couldn't get a job, when a company was acquired by Xerox and phased all of us out, I had to start my own company just to get a job. Well, I did that and did that for four years and then went back into the workforce and I was able to get a job. And that's a story I'm gonna save for a little bit later. But the, the bottom line is I got a job and eventually that led me to being relocated to New Jersey and working in New York. And eventually that led to opening the office in the World Trade Center.
One of the things that I have always felt in my life is it's all about teamwork. People don't necessarily do things alone. Part of my team always is a guide dog. I've been using a guide dog since 1964. I'm currently on my eighth guide dog (Alamo.) And what I learned, and it took a while, even after September 11th to put it into real words, is it's a team. I am the team leader. It's up to me to give the dog commands. Well, how do you know when to turn? Why is that relevant? How do you know when to turn? You can see, but how do you know you read signs and other things? I have techniques and ways to do the same things that you do as a cited person. And a lot of those techniques are getting better because we now have G P s systems that talk or even using Google Maps, it talks and other kinds of things that give me the information that you get.
It's all about information. But in any case, I can move about from place to place. And working in the World Trade Center, one of the first things that I did was to decide as the team leader, the person who opened an office for a company, I needed to be able to do what anyone else would do to open that office. So I needed to know how to get around the World Trade Center. I didn't get the luxury of looking at signs and so on. So I did what I think everyone should do and most people don't. I learned the center, I learned the emergency evacuation procedures. I learned where the emergency exits were. I learned where a lot of offices were in the World Trade Center. Places that we might go visit, uh, that I might go to with one of my sales employees to sell products.
I learned how to do whatever a leader of an office had to do in order to function appropriately cuz how would it look if we had customers up visiting us and we decided we'd go to lunch, and then I said, well, I don't know how to get anywhere? Someone's gonna have to lead me around two hours later. We're back negotiating contracts. How is it gonna be for me? I'm behind the eight ball. It would be better if I could say, oh, you want to go to lunch? What kind of food do you want? Do you wanna say how much? Great, let's go to Finance Shapiro. It's a deli down in the lobby of the World Trade Center, I'll take you there. I needed to be able to do that stuff as well as anyone else. As I said, that also meant learning emergency evacuation procedures and so on.
And what I realized long after September 11th was by learning all of that, I developed a mindset that said, you know what to do. If there's ever a problem, it'll kick in. And every day I went to the World Trade Center, even before September 11th, I thought regularly about anything else I need to learn today. I met with fire prevention or fire authorities and police and so on so that I knew everything there was to know and so that they knew me. And the mindset kicked in on September 11th, we got to the office about seven 40. We were gonna be doing some sales meetings. When I got there, there was a guy outside with a food cart because we had ordered breakfast for the early arrivals best ham and cheese croissants in New York City. I will point out from the Port Authority cafeteria .
And we took him in and told him where to set things up. And then I went and got a laptop projector that we were gonna use cuz I was gonna do a PowerPoint show. Yes. Blind people can do PowerPoint presentations. You don't have to see to do that stuff. You use slightly different techniques, but you could still do it. And the bottom line is we were all set up. Some people arrived about eight o'clock, including David Frank, who was a colleague from my corporate office. He was there to represent the marketing and sales department that was responsible for pricing for distributors or well, and for resellers. And we were going to be training resellers that day how to sell our products. So, David was there to talk about the pricing. I was going to be their technical and their onsite liaison that is the liaison between the resellers and Quantum, a TL that I worked for.
So, David and some other people arrived and while most of them were having breakfast, David and I completed a final list of all the people who were coming to the seminars that day. Because the only ways to get into the World Trade Center was either you were authorized in advance on a list that was faxed to the Port Authority security desk downstairs, or they would call up every time someone came and said, so-and-so says they're here to come to your seminar. Do we let them up? So, it was important for me to not have to take lots of phone calls. So we created the list and literally at 8 45 in the morning, I was reaching for stationary when suddenly the building lurched. And we heard a kind of a muffled thud and that's all we heard. And then the building started to tip as I'm now tipping my hand toward the camera.
And the reason the building tip was the airplane hit the building. Tall buildings like that are springs. That 110-story building was a big spring. It was made to be able to be buffeted in the breeze or literally hit by an airplane. It was not made however, to be hit by an airplane intentionally. One that had 26,000 pounds of jet fuel on board that exploded on impact. And that's what really took the building down. But nevertheless, the building tipped. I went over and stood in the doorway. I grew up in Southern California and at that time we were living on the San Andreas fault in Southern California. And I learned early on building shakes and moves, ghost stand in doorway. It's a little different now for earthquake stuff. But anyway, I, went and stood in the doorway a lot of good that does your 78 floors up if the building collapses.
But hey, still what you learn, what you know is what you do David. And how would you have known at that point what really happened? Well, it wouldn't have mattered. The building was moving anyway. And there was nothing you could do other than go for me, stand in the doorway. David was holding onto my desk and my guide dog Roselle was asleep under the desk. And the building tip so far that David and I literally said goodbye to each other because we thought we were about to take a 78 floor plunge to the street. Then the building slowed down, it stopped and it started coming back the other way. And it finally became vertical again. As soon as it did, I went into the office, I met Roselle coming out from under the desk. I told Roselle to heal, which meant to come around on my left side and sit.
I mentioned that working with a guy dog is a team. Each of us has a job on the team. And the total job combination of the two of us is to make sure that we walk safely. It is not never should be and never will be the job of the dog to know where I want to go. That's my job. And I give the dog directions as to where I want to go. When we get to a turn, I have to know which way to go. Again, I learned that like you do using different techniques, but I learned to know the buildings. Everyone who was cited looks for signs that works until you're in a smoke fill building, by the way. Now, we didn't have a smoke fill building at the time that we were going down and so on. But, nevertheless, the point still is anyone who really wants to make sure they're gonna stay safe needs to really know in advance what to do. Because that helps develop a mindset that says, I know what to do and it kicks in. And that's what kicked in for me.
So, I told Roselle to sit about the time she sat, the building dropped straight down about six feet. That's because the spring, if you will, went back to its normal configuration. And as soon as it stopped, David looked out the window and started shouting. Oh my God, Mike, there's fire and smoke above us. There are millions of pieces of burning paper falling outside the window. We gotta get outta here right now. And I said, slow down David. No, no, no. We gotta get outta here right now. And I heard noise outside the window. And when he said, there are millions of pieces of burning paper falling outside the window that told me what it was, our guests began to scream.
They started moving toward our exits. And I kept saying, slow down. So, they stopped. They were waiting to see what David and I were gonna do. And then finally David used, as I describe it, the big line, you don't understand, you can't see it. Oh, the problem wasn't what I couldn't see, the problem was what David wasn't seeing, Namely a dog sitting next to me wagging her tail, yawning going, who the heck woke me up and what's going on? I knew what Roselle was like when she was afraid and she wasn't indicating any fear. And her senses are much sharper than mine. And what she told me by her reactions was, okay, right now we can try to evacuate in an orderly way. So, I got David to focus. I said, get our guests to the stairs. You're seeing fire. Don't let them take the elevators because if fire gets into the elevator shafts, which it did, anyone in the cars could be burned and killed.
So, David got our guest to the stairs. I called my wife and told her that something had happened, an explosion or something we didn't know and we're gonna be evacuating. And this was before the news even got the story. So when we hung up and I hung up with her, David returned, we checked the office and then went to the stairs and started down. We smelled an odor. It took me about four floors to realize I was smelling burning jet fuel like you smell whenever you go to an airport. So I observed it to other people around us and they said, yeah, we were trying to figure out what that is. And I didn't figure it out right away cuz who would've thought we would've smelled burning jet fuel in the World Trade Center. But the bottom line is that's what I smelled.
I observed that to others and we all agreed an airplane must have hit the building. But we didn't know. And we didn't know what happened until we were all the way down and out. But we went down the stairs and there were times that people started to panic on the stairs. And several of us worked to keep people calm. We got to the bottom. It was now about 9 35. We went through the complex and finally got outside at 9 45 an hour after the plane hit Tower one. When we got outside, David saw that Tower two was on fire again, we didn't know, we didn't feel anything from Tower two being hit because we were in our own little cave or cocoon, if you will. That is the stairs going down. So, we were told to leave the complex. We went over to Broadway and walked north on Broadway and finally got to Vessy Street.
And David said, I see the fire really clearly up in Tower two. I wanna take some pictures. And you know, for our, for us we thought maybe Well's Tower one, when it was tipping tip toward Tower two, maybe it caught the building on fire. Who knew? So, we stopped. David took pictures. I tried to call my wife. The circuits were busy because as we learned later, people were saying goodbye to loved ones. I had just put my phone away and David was putting his camera away when a police officer yelled, get out of here, it's coming down right now. And suddenly we heard this rumble that became this deafening roar that I describe as kind of a combination of a freight train in a waterfall. You could hear glass breaking and metal clattering and so on. And the bottom line is, what was happening is the tower two was collapsing.
We were like a hundred yards away from it. Everyone turned and ran. David ran, he was gone. I turned Roselle around 180 degrees and we started running back the way we came. Then we got to the next street going now south on Broadway, Fulton Street. I turned right on Fulton, caught up to David. As it turns out he had gone the same way. And it stopped cuz he realized he had just run off and left me. And he was gonna come back and try to find me. And I said, look, when he saw me and all that, I'm sorry. He said, I'm sorry. I said, David, don't worry about it. Let's keep going. It's coming down. Right. So, we kept running. We got in the dust cloud that was so thick that David said he couldn't see his hand six inches in front of his nose.
It was so thick that with every breath I took, I could feel dirt and dust going down my throat into my lungs. We knew we had to get out of that, that wretched cloud. And I kept telling Roselle, go. Right, right, right. I don't know whether she could hear me or see my hand signals since I was just doing hand signals. But obviously she did because suddenly I heard an opening on the right and she obviously saw it cuz she turned right. Took one step and stopped and wouldn't move. Come on Roselle, keep going. She wouldn't move. And I realized, hey, maybe she's doing what she's supposed to do. Why is she stopped? So I stuck a hand out along the wall, felt a stair rail and I stuck a foot out, found the top of a flight of stairs. She did exactly what she was supposed to do.
She stopped at the stairs, and she was waiting for the command. So when I said, good girl, Roselle actually stooped down and gave her a hug and then said forward. And we went down the stairs into the subway system and a person came up the stairs and we were in a little arcade and found David and me and several other people. He introduced himself as Lou, an employee of the subway system. And then he took us down to an employee locker room where we stayed until a police officer came and said, the airs clearer up above, you gotta get outta here now. And we went upstairs and we started walking away from the complex more. And David said, oh my god, Mike, there's no tower too anymore. And I said, what are you seeing? And he said, oh, I see your pillars of smoke, hundreds of feet tall. Who would've thought? Yeah. So we kept walking away, we were going west on Fulton and we walked for a number of minutes, 10, 15 minutes. And then we heard that freight train, waterfall sound again. That's the best way I describe it. Cuz as I said, you hear the glass clattering and metal clashing and crashing. And then this, this white noise sound of the building collapsing. And we figured it was our tower coming down.
And so we, David just looked back and said, it's coming down and there's a dust cloud coming our way. We were able to get behind a, a low wall and hunkered down and waited until everything passed. And it got silent again and then stood up and David said, oh my God, there's no world trade center anymore. And I said, what do you see? And he said, all I see are fingers of fire in flame, hundreds of feet, tall pillars of smoke, hundreds of feet tall. It's gone. And it was only after that that I called my wife again and this time got through, it was now about 10 30, 10 31 in the morning. David and I were just standing there and I got through to her and she's the one who told us that terrorist attacked tower one and then tower two. And then it was those towers that collapsed because of hijacked aircraft.
Marlana:
Did that seem incredible to you?
Michael:
Absolutely,...
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Danny Rosin
Brand Fuel for profit
Band Together nonprofit
Danny Rosin, is co-owner of Brand Fuel, a brand merchandising agency, that is a B Corp. He is also the co-founder of the nonprofits PromoKitchen, PromoCares, Reciprocity Road and Operation Smile’s International Student Groups. He serves on the board of A Place at The Table, Raleigh’s mighty “pay what you can” café.
Rosin is the active co-founder of Band Together, a nonprofit that has donated over $12 million to 31 nonprofits in the Triangle through live concert experiences.
Danny is a tireless community builder who likes starting organizations doing things that matter. He is happiest when there is a mix of philanthropy, music, marketing and “familying.”
He is married to Niccole, and they have two teenage daughters. He has come to grips with the idea that well-behaved women rarely make history.
https://www.brandfuel.com/big-change-were-proud-to-be-a-b-corporation/
www.brandfuel.com
www.bandtogethernc.org
https://www.bcorporation.net/en-us/
www.linkedin.com/in/dannyrosin
www.marlanasemenza.com
Audio : Ariza Music Productions
Transcription : Vision In Word
Marlana:
Danny Rosin is a timeless community builder who likes doing things that matter. He's co-founder of the company, brand Fuel, but also has a hand in promo, kitchen promo cares, reciprocity, road operations, smile, A Place At The Table and Band Together. He's happiest when there is a mix of philanthropy, music, marketing, and family. Inc. As a married father of two teenage daughters, he has come to grips with the idea that will behave, women rarely make history, but they learned that from him, along with how to lead a life of purpose. Welcome, Danny.
Danny:
Oh, thanks for having me. I'm, that's, it's nice to hear that the word, family yang is not a real word, but I want it to be. I want it to be a verb family.
Marlana:
I think you have made it one. I really do. And knowing the things that you have done and put together,
Danny:
That's nice, that's the one thing that I hope. You know, you think about legacy, I think Ban Together, the work that I've been involved in with that organization is definitely the stuff of legacy. But the family, I just hope our kids look back one day and all the trials and tribulations of parenting and being invested in that, shines a light on these girls and they say their dad and mom did a good job. That's all I'm looking for.
Marlana:
Well, it's actually kind of funny to watch you on this journey with them, because I feel like sometimes it's kind of like you've been on a wild bucking horse and you're just trying to hold on and keep the reins in your hand.
Danny:
Yeah, so true. I've got a wild bucking horse as an older daughter and a little bit more calm daughter as a younger daughter. They're 15 and 18, so they're complete opposites. I am more like my oldest daughter, the wild bucking horse. So, I think we relate to each other a lot more, which allows my relationship with my wife to either flourish because I can step in and say, I know what Brooke is going through, or there's just a lot more tension there because, we don't see eye to eye and my wife doesn't understand, because that's not who she ever was. she's got a little wild side, but not like Brooke or me. .
Marlana:
And, you know, it's interesting to me because you have taken that wild side and anybody that reads any of your history or even some of the things that you have real and posts that you do, you've taken it and put the reins on it to a large degree and directed it in ways that matter. So how is that a struggle for you to do, or do you
Danny:
? It's not a struggle for me. It's a struggle for my wife and sometimes my daughters. Just for example, I posted this great video of my youngest daughter. I took her to where I went to college at UNC Chapel Hill. A band we both love was playing. I was involved in helping book the band, and also, I was a big fundraiser, raising money for the Children's Hospital. I was like, you should go. We'll have a good time. And she separated and went to go hang out with her friends on the front row, which is where I would normally be watching the Future Birds. I was kind of to the side of the stage and I could see her and she was living her best life, just dancing, just having so much fun, and the band was engaging with her.
And I got a lump in my throat thinking about it because, you know, these are the special moments in life. Like, it was kind of a dad moment. So, I grabbed my camera, I videotaped it, and I thought it was just so great. I put it out on Instagram, you can still find it on my page. I didn't lose the battle when they're like, you've got to take that down of Brooke really rocking out. I get pushback for, I think from time to time exposing the truth, you know, and being vulnerable and honest about maybe, you know, the Crazy Daughter or, you know, this recent one that I think you may be, you know, talking about is the, getting arrested story. So, just a quick note about that story.
I was recognized by the Triangle Business Journal as this corporate philanthropist, which is a great honor to be recognized in that way. And Hannah from the Ban Together had submitted my name. Just knowing the work that we do together and the work that she does on the front lines every day just gives me a tremendous amount of pride. And a lot of people are reaching out and saying, congratulations. My head is getting bigger, and my wife is rolling her eyes all the while she knows how hard I work. very soon thereafter, I decided to post the story about getting arrested in 1988. I guess the moral of the story in context to what you said is that, you know, idiots, troublemakers, pranksters, people who maybe have a dark pass can shine, can work really hard at trying to recreate their story.
you know, what's important to them, they can find that, and I've been really fortunate to be able to do that. So, this whole story about me getting arrested and apologizing to NC State for painting their bell tower when I was 20 years old, it's kind of my way of saying like, Hey, everybody, I'm not all that it looks like in the newspaper and all these accolades that you read in the beginning. I do all that, but I still make lots of mistakes, still a troublemaker. I feel like I'm a 15 year old kid in a 55 year old body, and finding that balance is really important, but also because I have some reach and I've done a lot of things. I feel like it’s a kind of a moral imperative and a responsibility maybe to, you know, share the ugly stuff and be honest. And I think social media is very best. It's like the stories you tell of people. I mean, it's the very best when it's real and it's honest, and people can relate to that, and it gives permission for others to do the same, I hope.
Marlana:
Yeah. And you know, you talked about striking a balance, and what is interesting to me is, you're a business owner, you understand that you have to make money with your business and provide for your family and all these kinds of things, but you have such a beautiful balance between that and making a difference. You have shown by example that these things do not need to be mutually exclusive. So how do you go about doing that?
Danny:
I always say to anybody that looks at my story and says, gosh, how are you managing the, the balance between purpose and profit? I always say I'm a capitalist and a tweed jacket because I like making money. I like giving it away too. but, I say that, you know, your dreams and your day job can coexist, and they should. and that means finding a job that is something that you really enjoy. If you're not able to do that, then, you know, go outside of your job and get involved in a non-profit or an activity that you really enjoy and find joy in that. Or, you know, if you look at your company that you work for, where it's thank you for working number 4,221 and just a number, maybe you can create something within the company, a wellness committee or something that drives what you're interested in.
And I think companies are looking at initiatives around wellness and employee engagement, and they're looking for people to lead. So, I think that's important. you know, recently my company Brand Fuel just earned its B Corp certification. And so I think anyone who is working in the world of pop profit driven, but they're looking for a way or a path to get to a place of more purpose, meaning and value and being able to stand for things and DEI initiatives, I could go on and on, employee engagement, attracting more customers, attracting better employees and talent. you know, the B Corp world is fascinating to me. Basically, is a people planet profit kind of initiative. When I look at it, it's like fair trade is to coffee, B Corp is to business.
So, if you look at the guiding principles of what a certification looks like, it's about taking care of employees and doing the right thing. It's about thinking about the environment and, you know, your impact to the environment. and then it's also about your supply chain. so thinking about, you know, the things that you bring into the marketplace to make sure that they're safe and that they are produced in safe factories and people are paid a fair wage, and these are important things, like really important things. I don't wanna sell something where there's slave labor behind it. I just don't, I don't think anybody wants to. I also think it's about aligning with nonprofits that maybe are mission driven, and connected to what your corporate or human values are. so if you're a tech company, maybe you want to help, you know, girls in STEM and find a nonprofit and align with them and, you know, turn an internship program into your business to invest in those organizations that are aligned with what you do in business.
So, I'm a libra, that means I've got the balance, the scales, and so maybe there's some of that. But I've worked really hard at trying to find things that, you know, allow me to sleep well at night and to bring good people into my business and to sell to companies that are generous and care. And so, finding like-minded companies. And so we're, you know, some of that's marketing fluff. but marketing is not just about fluff and promotion, it's about participation. It's about doing the work. And so we've done the work and we're continuing to do the work. It's a very hard, I think, but important journey that will allow this company, but also myself and Robert Fash, my business partner, and everybody who works here, you know, to be a part of something that I hope is the stuff of legacy.
Marlana:
Let me ask you this, and it might be a chicken or an egg kind of question. Do you leave that, if you do what you love, the money will come? Or do you believe that once you make your money, that's when you can turn around and go back and do something that matters?
Danny:
Yeah, I mean, that's a good question. I don't have an answer to be honest. I mean, I can riff on it a little bit. I think we realize when we get older is that, you know, money is important, but it can be the root of evil and driver of things that are not important in this life. So, I mean, if I had to pick one, I think you do the thing you love and the money comes, but maybe the money doesn't come, but you do the thing that you love.
Marlana:
Did you seek out a B Corp status, or was that just something that you realized existed and then you worked toward it? How did that come about for you?
Danny:
Yeah, I think the B corporation movement there a little bit over 5,000 companies globally, 2000 companies in the US and Canada that have earned this certification. Companies like Ben and Jerry's and All birds, new Belgium Brewing, there's some really interesting, B2C brands, B2B brands, especially companies like mine that could potentially sell plastic crap from China, you know, with logos on it, which is not what we do, but, you know, our industry has been known for that, that was actually one reason why we did it, was to try and kind of carve out a unique path of differentiation that was important to us. But the movement's been around for probably 15, 16 years, 12 years ago, we heard about it from some people in our area, you know, and, and knew that we were invested in giving back and there was some social entrepreneurialism in what we were doing.
So, we looked into it, and we decided to apply. This was about 12 years ago, and we failed miserably. There's kind of a couple points here if you are interested at all, even though it's a very heavy lift to go through the process, it's free. You go to B Labs, there's a third party organization that helps guide you around these principles of using your business as a force for good. you'll learn a lot about your business and where you have weak points. for us, our weakest point was in sourcing. So, getting products from China, they were cheap plastic crap. We didn't know where they were being made, if they were safe, we had no idea. And years ago, we just didn't have access to that information. So over the past 12 years, we have invested in, one responsible sourcing and two, investing in, you know, being advocates in our industry for transparency.
PAI is a sort of an umbrella nonprofit in our industry that has really worked hard to do that. So I joined the board, I fought the good fight there and now, you have access into, you know, where our products has been made, who's made it, is it safe of the right materials, there's product testing before it makes its way to decorators in the US and ultimately to end users. So, we sought that out. and over the past 10 years before we reapplied, we worked extremely hard at the principles that B corporation and B Labs, feature to really find out what we are made of. And there's certain areas we have got a lot of work to do, and there's certain areas we do great with. but it's a business education that you don't normally get. it's worth kind of trying to go through the motions, in the application process, like I mentioned before, if for no other reason, even if you don't earn the designation of a B certified corporation, even if you don't get it, you will learn things about how you run your business and where the opportunities are to run a stronger, healthier business that will drive not only purpose, but ultimately I think profit.
Marlana:
You grew out in there kind of glazed over it, that you were on the board and it seems like you're on the board or have your hand in so many things. So, what determines for you, project that you are going to get involved in versus not?
Danny:
yeah. I do say no to a lot of things, and I think trying to understand what my strengths are and I've done the strengths finders and I've done all kinds of personality tests, and I know that my strengths are in, philanthropy and marketing and I have a good idea around music and putting on events and things like that, and certainly family. So, I think that those things that are mission driven, they need to align. I need to feel something. even if, you know, the people in the boardroom, I've had some opportunities to be in some really nice high-powered boardrooms with people that I would love to get to know and hang out with, but I didn't feel comfortable. And some of that's, you know, the, the complex that we all get, imposter syndrome, I'm sure I could do fine, but, I'm trying to really stay focused and, you know, I think you and I have talked before, you've asked me to be involved in a lot of things.
I'm always trying to tap the breaks and say no, as much as I can to be really focused. there's so many things in this world that I'm interested in , though, it's hard. and so, I made a commitment not just to myself, but to my family. If I take on another thing, I need to drop something off. And so trying to create, again, going back to balance in my life, I think for other people who are listening to this, you know, make sure that its mission driven. You've got the skills or you want to, you can learn and grow and develop. but I always talk about work, wealth and wisdom or time, treasure and talent in the boardroom. And if you can bring at least two of the three of those things to the boardroom, then sign up.
And if you bring three of the three of those things, then you're a rockstar. But more importantly, if you get busy and you're going through something hard in life, healthcare or, you know, divorce or whatever is hard in your life or work is sucking the life out of you, you can't commit to that nonprofit or be involved in that activity, raise your hand and tap out. That is how you honor the organization, not by sitting and taking a board seat and wasting that seat so that it's not productive. people will respect you more and you'll not feel that consummate guilt that I think so many feel when they're not active, in those situations.
Marlana:
Yeah. And let's talk for a brief moment about two of my favorite projects in which you are involved. We'll take them one by one. talk to us about Ban Together, what that is and how that came about.
Danny:
Yeah. this is a 9/11 story. I was with some friends watching reruns on TV of the Twin Towers going down and people jumping to their deaths. It's funny, I could get choked up like talking about it right now, cuz there's something in this. That moment that, you know, the what's mine to do in that moment, is really important to realize. Like, I think we all have a story. Most of us have a story about where we were when Kennedy was shot, or you know, the Twin Towers came down, whatever it may be. I think we all have to ask ourselves what's ours to do in that moment? And we did not, we did not become what I call slacktivist, you know, which would be someone who just checks a like box on Facebook.
We became activists at that moment, and we decided to do something for these families who had, you know, firefighters had gone in and risked their lives to save these people. people we didn't know, but, you know, just can imagine. And these families now are living in a really tough place with their loved one. And, you know, pensions and things like that aside, we thought we should do something. And so we rallied and grabbed a larger group of business leaders in the triangle area to raise money for those families. And...
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Joe ‘Road Warrior Animal’ Laurinaitis was half of arguably the greatest tag team in wrestling history. Together with Mike ‘Hawk’ Hegstrand, they were the perfect mix of intimidation, artistry and skill. They continue to be legendary and you can search the internet and find countless hours of matches and interviews. But, today we are going to learn about Joe, the man behind the face paint and what life with this icon was like.
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Audio : Ariza Music Productions
Transcription : Vision In Word
Marlana:
Joe Road Warrior Animal Laurinaitis was half of arguably the greatest tag team in wrestling history together with Mike Hawk Hegstrand. They were the perfect mix of intimidation, artistry, and skill. They continued to be legendary and you can search the internet and find countless hours of matches and interviews. But today we're gonna learn about Joe, the man behind the face paint, and what life with this icon was like. Please help me welcome Joe's Other Half the love of his life and my dear friend Kim Laurinaitis.
Kim:
Aw! Thank you. That was so sweet.
Marlana:
. So you know, anybody that saw you and Joe in a later years, would not have guessed that Y'all didn't like each other much at first.
Kim:
No, not at all. , that was the going talk like once we finally reconnected because we did not connect at the beginning at all. A lot of people knew that Hawk and I, Mike and I were much closer friends. He was like a brother to me for many, many years. And I always used to ask him what was wrong with his partner. Like what crawled up his button died basically, because he was always so it came off as rude, but he really wasn't rude. He was more the business guy. He was always taking care of business. You know how it was in the back, you know, when you have things to do, timelines to meet deadlines, that's how he was. Me being 17 , you know, going back there and first getting backstage and around all those guys, you're looking going, God! He's rude because he, compared to Mike, the life of the party, was two totally different people.
And so that's what I was accustomed to, I guess. And then some of the other guys, you got Owen Hart who was the ultimate prankster, you know, and who never had an enemy at all and who was always happy. And you had other people too that were kind of like that. And so, coming across Joe and you know, his exterior, his face, everything kind of come off as very hard when you're like, oh my God, oh, sorry, I walked past you, you know, some days. And one day he asked me, I was outside walking Davies's dog, I think we were in Pensacola or something, . And he was like, what are you doing out here walking the dog? I'm like, because I was told to . Yeah. I was just scared to even answer him. And then I told Mike, I was like, oh my God, can you tell him not to be so mean to me?
He wasn't mean, he just asked me a question, but I took it as being mean. And he has never forgot that. Like he was like, I just thought what mom would let their daughter come and be doing shows and vignettes and stuff like that here by themselves and you're not even 18 and having to get your contract signed, blah, blah, blah. I'm like, oh my God! So that's why you were rude to me, . And so, we talked about it later. He goes, no, I was just worried about you. I was protective of you in a sense, but you just didn't know it. I said, no, I thought you hated me. And he goes, why wasn't a fan ?
Marlana:
So, when did that change? How did he become a fan?
Kim:
When we reconnected, I actually convinced Mike McGuirk, our mutual friend to, she had recently lost her husband a few months prior to us going to WrestleMania or Wrestle Con that event in 2012. And so, I commenced her to go, she needed to get outta the house. We went, and when we went, we went to Miami, Florida that year. Joe was there doing an appearance and I actually ran into him unexpectedly. I knowingly, and like Mike was the one going, oh my God, Kim, look who it is. And I was like, oh, great . And here we go again. He's gonna like ask me, what am I doing now without my mom's permission or something. I'm having flashbacks. And he was like, night and day, I'm telling you. Like, it was a totally different person is all I can tell you. and obviously a lot of things had happened in both of our lives by that time. We had both been, you know, married, he was going through a divorce. I had already been divorced.
I had terminal breast cancer. I had stage four breast cancer. And so, I had already gone through 10 years of being by myself with my daughter. That was my life. I wasn't looking for anybody. I didn't want anybody. I was kinda like that getting back. And I was just there to visit friends, reconnect with people, and then help her through this. And then when we saw him, I mean some of the other ladies we were with, they were like, oh, he's looking good and all this. And I'm like, oh, here's a drink. Are you thirsty ?
And Mike was even like, he looks really good. He's doing really well. After he did his appearance and stuff where Mike was, we ended up being at the same spot. He ran into us afterwards and he was like, Hey, y'all wanna come over here and let's catch up. Okay, well we went to go , we went to go catch up. It's at the Duval Hotel lobby. It's like all open. Everything is all open. I don't get nervous. I don't do any of that cuz those guys are just like anybody else. You know how the fans are and everything. They're like all beside themselves. I look at them, they're just like anybody else. That's just their job. Right? I don't. And also you had had been around these guys since you were literally at Carl's. Little, little, little since.
I used to live in Houston, going to Sam Houston Coliseum like every Friday night with my mom. And so that was from the time I was like 10 years old and growing up. So, none of these guys like it bothered me at all. And so I'm thinking, okay, yeah, we'll go over here for a little bit. But I'm telling her, let's go out, walk to the beach, let's go get you like out. I'm trying to think of her and then what we are gonna do, like afterwards, our dinner plan is kind of arranging that because I know when she and I get together, our plan schedule kind of goes off track. So, we have to keep on track . And having been with both of you Yeah. , you know this personally and so I'm just trying to kind of, okay, so she was worried about seeing Jake Honky tonk man, some of the other ones she had.
She hadn't seen him in many years. And so, they were all excited about seeing her and we went over there. We had our other friend Donna with us. And so she's kind of like our ringleader that keeps everyone in line. . Yeah. She kinda kicks everybody back into play. Yes, she does. She has her whip with her. You know, like get in there . And so we went over there to where this whole open area was and when we went in there, he was there and talking to McGurk and talking to some other people. And then he was like, Hey, how have you been, I haven't seen you like forever. I was like, yeah, I've had a lot going on too. . I was trying to playing it off. Cause I'm thinking he's gonna be a total jerk. So, I'm trying not to like act nice in the least cuz I'm kind of keeping my guard up.
But he's really nice. So, I'm thinking God don't be a . So he's getting beers for other people and then he's handing stuff and as he's doing this, I'm passing stuff down to people cuz we've got a big group. As he does this, I have this beer that he's handing me and I, he tells everybody this. She spilled this whole beer on my brand new Nike shoes. Well, anybody that knows Joe knows he loves his freaking shoes. He's worse than a girl. Like when it comes to his Nikes, any kind of athletic shoes, he loves them. I'm like, oh my God, I just spilled this all over his shoes. And so I'm going, monger, oh my God, I just spill this all over his shoes. And he's like, oh, It's alright. You'll get it up. I'm thinking, oh God, no, he's really gonna, he's really gonna get mad.
And so, I'm like, I’m sorry. Do you need me to buy you a new pair of shoes, ? He's like, no, it's okay. It's good. So, he's like cleaning all this up. We finally went and sat down and I think Diana Hart, and some other people were there that we hadn't seen. And we just all kind of started chit-chatting and catching up. He was very, very kind and open. I don't think, think I've ever seen the man smile until that day . And I was like, who is this person? Well then, we started talking about something like dinner. I told you we were supposed to have dinner plans. He was like all about it. Well, why don't we all go, why don't we all go into this big group? I'm looking at Mike going, what the heck is going on? So, we made plans to go down the street to this restaurant.
He organized it. He took control of everything. I was like, okay, so we all go down here to this restaurant as we're sitting around this huge table. I mean there's probably at least, I don't know, 10, 12 of us around this table. Now granted, McGurk has been drinking wine during the day. So, have I. So, we're like, we're very happy. And for, and around this table, he's sitting clear across the table for me. He's not sitting beside me. McGurk is sitting beside me. I don't even know who's sitting on the other side of me. And then I know Diana hard is one over because we're chatting and we have this great dinner and everything. But as we're sitting at this table, my phone goes off and I'm thinking, who is calling? Nobody's calling me. I'm here in Miami. Everybody that I'm here with is right here at this table.
So I'm looking around kind of looking, I'm looking at my phone, I have this message on my phone and I have no idea who this number is. It says, “I love you.” And I'm going, McGuirk , he's little drunk. Where's your phone? Quit texting me from unknown numbers. And she's laughing hysterically and she's like, I do love you. And she's going along with it. So the whole time I'm thinking it's her and she's come up with some kind of way to text me from an unknown number and I'm like, stop texting me from unknown numbers. That's stupid. You know? And I'm just going back and forth. He's watching the whole time and it's him that sent that message. No idea how he got my phone number. I didn't give it to him. He never asked me for it. And I'm thinking, okay, w this is just awkward.
So, I'm helping her up. We go back and we go back like to the beach front by the Duval Hotel. We were supposed to be going to an event . She did not wanna go to. We kind of got in trouble by our ringleader that night because we were supposed to be going to WrestleMania. She didn't wanna go. She just wanted to sit out on the beach, watch the water, watch the stars and everything, just talk about everything. Joe stepped in and Joe was like, I got these girls. You go to the event, I'm gonna stay here with them. They're gonna be safe, they'll be fine. Don't worry about it. Well, in the meantime, while they're having a conversation, , McGuirk and I are having our own reality show out on the beach. . I mean like we're, I don't know, doing sand Angels. We're running and jumping and then Mike takes a nose dive into the sand a couple times.
We got her up and I mean it was just the first time I had seen her happy in the least, you know, being herself. And we were just talking about the old days, like how things were when you were there, when Mike was there, everything. And it was just like a happy feeling, being able to reconnect. And he came in and he sat down and he started sharing some stuff that he had been through, what he was going through. And then when he found out that I had been sick, he was like, wait, what? You? And I was like, yeah, just don't even, I had been through a terrible divorce, you know, like eight years prior to, and he was like, I had no idea. I said, it's okay. I don't want sympathy. And he goes, oh, what are you turning into me now?
Like this instant, it was like the roles head reverse. And so we started talking, well Mike falls asleep out here. Like, she's like taking us sitting out here. He and I ended up talking for hours and that's where it all started. Like we just reconnected from that night on. And after that, like he got us a ride back to our hotel cuz we were actually staying over where his brother was staying. and he had said, if you don't wanna go back over there, we don't have to stop.
But it was like, he gave us the option, you know, like if you don't wanna go back over there, you don't have to. But I was like, no, we need to. And so, he sent us back. He had us, a driver and everything. He called to make sure we got back there. Okay. Ever since that night he called me every single day for the rest of his life. There was not one day that he did not call. And then he asked me, I think it was like two or three days later, he goes, I don't know what you did to me, but this is not me. I don't normally do this. I don't act like this.
Do you put something in my drink? I was like, no. I was the one that was more standoffish cuz I was like, I don't really want somebody like calling me every day. This is like too much for me. I was very guarded because of my past. And I told him that and I said, you, I know how wrestlers are anyways. I don't want, you know, me, I didn't want to be with a wrestler. I didn't wanna marry a wrestler. That was my whole thing. And he even brought that up, he said, yeah, he used to always say, I'll never marry a wrestler, blah. I said, I won't. And we laughed about it and then later on he was like, I don't know what has happened, but I enjoyed talking to you. I just wanna keep talking to you. Is that okay?
He was very respectful and ever since then, like I said, he continued to call every day. We talked every day for hours. And then he was like, he had another business in Africa, so he was getting ready to go to Africa. And then he said, before I go to Africa, can I fly you to St to St. Louis just to see me before I go, I'd just like to take you out to dinner or whatever. Or I'll fly to Texas, whichever one. And he flew me to St. Louis. And then that's when I met his daughter, my daughter and his grandson. And I was just like, I instantly connected with the baby, like Jacob is my life there too. So, it was so easy. It was just like one of those things that I had never had before, ever. there was no pressure, there was no like, oh, I'm going on a date or anything like that. It was just relaxed.
Marlana:
Well, I know as somebody who knew you both before you were together and then also watching you together, what I used to love is I could watch him go from this big bur tough guy to where he would look at you and melt . And it was that that I used to love to watch.
Kim:
Yes. There were so many people that used to say that, can you go look at him? And I'd be like, what are you talking about? But we had a look that would go and he used to tell me all the time, he said, because we shared a lot of stuff over the period of years, which I do all of his past and everything, everybody has a past. But I learned so much about him and his upbringing and I fell in love with his dad. Oh my gosh, I love his dad. I was like, if I was younger, I'm sorry I would trade you in for your dad because your dad is just m my heart. Like I loved him so much. But you see, you learn a lot of people just see what's on the face value, like what they do. Once you get to know the person, Joe lived a lot like his character in some ways that was very hard.
That was very tough. And you hear some of the stories and things that they did and you're going, oh my god, I don't know, like that's not me that I'm a little country girl. go over here. I never dealt with me going that. But he goes, you used to go and take care of Hawk you and McGuirk would go and save him like wherever he was and get him to the airport. What do you mean? And I'd be like, oh, well that was back when I was stupid and young. Now I hold her and have a daughter , I learned from my mistakes. He was like, okay. But you'd see his toughness, like kind of, it had changed a lot. He had softened up a lot. but that's what he used to always say is like, you're peeling my layers. It's like an onion.
He would say those layers are just like peeling off, but I don't wanna be, I'm not soft. I said, no one ever said you're soft. And he said, but you're the same way. But I never realized that I had built up such these guarded walls. And he said, I don't feel like I can ever get to you because you've got this hard exterior that I can't ever get to that heart that like I knew you used to have because you're like so guarded. You're like one of the guys . I was like, oh my God!
Marlana:
Well, I have to say this, both of you were like Tootsie pops, you had this hard exterior shell, but this little soft middle, and it's just a matter of getting to it.
Kim:
Exactly!
Marlana:
So, what do you think was the biggest misconception about Joe?
Kim:
That he was just this hu like this burly mean guy. Like he was the most softhearted, selfless, caring person I have ever known in my life. Ever. I can like I don't think I've ever seen a man so caring and so giving as anybody as Joe, like ever. Some people would never believe that he cried. I have seen that man cry more times than anybody in my family, that showed me that he had heart. That doesn't mean that he is soft. That doesn't mean that he doesn't care. he had never missed an appearance at all until I got sick and was in the hospital and I was hospitalized for 70 days and he left that appearance and he came right back and I was like, oh my God, he didn't have to leave. You know, cuz I know how important that is to them. No, he always put family first, whether it's his kids, his grandkids, anybody like that. That always came first, and he lived by what he believed. He's not one of those that always just said certain things and just said it like for face value. No, he did exactly what he said.
Marlana:
What's your favorite memory of Joe?
Kim:
Oh gosh! .
Marlana:
And I know there's...
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Molly Harper
Heaton Real Estate/Sales Professional
I have been in sales for over 30 years, working in a variety of industries-Advertising, Pharmaceutical, Technology and Real Estate. I love working with people to find solutions to their problems. I am passionate about family - married with 5 children and two dogs. I am an avid lover of sports-playing and watching and enjoy being outside as often as I can.
Molly is also the wife of Naked & Afraid All-Star, Wes Harper
heatonrealestate.com
wesharper.com
www.marlanasemenza.com
Audio : Ariza Music Productions
Transcription : Vision In Word
Marlana
Molly Harper is a real estate professional who is passionate about her family and enjoys being outside as often as she can, something she shares with her husband, (Naked and Afraid all Star Wes Harper.) We've all seen him on the show, but today we will learn what goes into these experiences that we don't see and what is happening before and after the cameras roll. Welcome, Molly.
Molly
Thank you, happy to be here.
Marlana
So, it's my understanding that Wes's whole start of this experience was you're doing.
Molly
Unfortunately, that is true.
Marlana
So, tell everybody what happened.
Molly
Yeah, so be careful what you sign people up for. Wes and I were avid watchers of the show, we loved it and every week it got more intense with him adding invite and saying gosh, I can't look how dumb they are. They don't know how to start a fire, and there was just one evening, it just got to me and I said you know what you think you could do better. Let's get the laptop and so literally within 15-20 minutes we went through this fun little exercise of signing him. And hit submit and literally the next day middle of the afternoon he calls me and says you're never gonna believe this, but a casting company called me about the show, and I was like, Oh my gosh that's so great and everything was very exciting, and you know it took a little while for him to actually get on the first episode. It was about a year long. Commitment of a lot of different interviews and it was a lot harder than people think to get on that first time. But right then and there I knew that this was going to be pretty consuming in our life and that we were about to really jump into something we really didn't understand until this moment. So, it isn't my fault.
Marlana
The first time this process occurred, what surprised you about it?
Molly
I think what I was surprised about was how much he had to do in order to even get considered. They would send him things like you need 13 short videos. You need it first. There's the application you know. Then there were all these short videos that you'd have to do with regard to being out in the wilderness, and you know Wes is very creative, so he loved that he jumped in that he submits that and then next they would come back and say, OK, we have a 2 hour Zoom call that you have to have like production quality. And that's the next series. So, it literally took about 5 months for him to go through this process and then they fly him out to California for this psychological evaluation. He had never been to California. He was so excited. He never got to leave the room he was in. Sequestered in there. They ran him through a lot of you know, again, you have to go to your doctor. You get healthy all this, so it took about I don't know four or five months for him to even be considered as a participant on the show. I was very surprised. I just figured you signed up. I mean, how many people could be out there that want to do something crazy like this? Is my thought, you know? Just throw them out there and you go with it. But that first one was a very time-consuming experience, and it took quite a while.
Marlana
So, when it got down to it and you knew he was going, he had talked about walking around barefoot and all this kind of thing, what kind of preparation went in on your end?
Molly
I was just trying to maintain a kind of normalcy, you know, I think what a lot of people don't realize, and I would say every person at the level that Wes is at really spends a lot of time preparing for the show. So yes, he walks around barefoot. Of course, all the neighbors are like, why is your husband walking around barefoot. You know, he started to build fires in the back and so for me it was really just trying to keep things normal. We had quite a few kids at home. Still, you know with soccer, and we had homework and not that he was not helpful, he was. But everybody could slowly start to see that he was diving into this full-fledged, and so I felt like I just had to be the constant because none of us really knew what to expect. And you know he was changing a little bit because personally he's trying to get into this game mode and experience mode. I really wasn't sure what to expect. So, I just kept trying to be normal.
Marlana
Yeah, and if I remember correctly the first challenge was three weeks...
Molly
Yeah, to Brazil.
Marlana
So, well, he's gone. What happens on your end?
Molly
It's really hard. You know, it's not like your spouse is going on a business trip, you know? You're gone.
Marlana
Yeah, because you can't be in touch with him or anything.
Molly
No, not at all. So, you know the day before he gives the last phone call, and you know wish him luck and then it's like a game on. And you know, there's not a day that doesn't go by where I'm like, gosh, I wonder what he's doing right now, or I wonder what he's facing, and you know, you really don't know where they're going until like a week before, especially in the early challenges. So again, it was really more just staying with my normal mode of operation going to work every day. At that time, I was not in real estate, I was in IT and then just trying to handle, you know, all of the life things cause life doesn't stop, you know? He's over there and dealing with survival, which don't get me wrong is intense, but you know, your kids still have their little issues and their moments. They challenge you. I felt like they kind of challenged me to see if they could get away with things, and I'm definitely the easier parent. But it was really just staying focused and trying to get through and hoping I didn't get a phone call because I knew if I saw his phone number come through that something was wrong because there was just no way he would tap out. Because he couldn't do it.
Marlana
Now the challenge is over, and he comes home. What happens when he comes home?
Molly
Brazil was a very tough welcome home for him. He had done very well. He really struggled to get back into reality and what I say by that is one he'd lost an immense amount of weight. So, losing all that weight, with so much to your brain functions, so simple conversation. Simple decision making was very challenging, and it didn't take me long and I got kind of upset. Not with him, but that the process was so regimented to get him out there, the psychological evaluation. But as soon as they're done, they feed him a meal, put him on a plane and send them back home. And because this was his first time, it took a lot longer for him to reengage. I can remember him bashing like cell phone use that everybody has to use cell phones. All the time and what a simple life he had in Brazil. And there wasn't this interruption and you're always at somebody else's beckon call and I kind of found that interesting. There were nights that when we were in bed, he didn't know who I was, he thought he was still out there in the jungle, and he admitted that to me later. I mean he didn't do anything, but he was just like he would wake up, and go where am I? He slept in the bathtub, one night he literally slept out on the front lawn. All my neighbors saw him one night, just that disoriented, and you know again, after looking into it a little bit, I really think it's more like a lack of protein and so the brain gets impacted and just his like his desire. He loves his company. He loves our children and our family and there just wasn't that enthusiasm about it. It was very hard, it took a couple months for him to slowly get back into it, into where he was back to what I would say, before he went on the trip. And we talked about it a lot because it was so alarm to me, but you know, it was our first experience, and we didn't know any better. And so that's the stuff they don't really show you. And I have to say, I doubt it's just me that experiences that spouse comes back, just what they put their bodies through all the bites and the possible infections that they have. And it's really daunting when you first see them come back.
Marlana
Yeah, you know, it's funny that you mentioned all that too because I remember in a conversation that I had with him along the way, he said that the first time he came back, sleeping outside felt normal,
Molly
Yeah, just nothing felt normal about our normal life. You know even his look was a very glazed overlook and we went and had lunch with friends like right after he got home, and they were all kind of shocked because he was very distant. He couldn't talk about the show. It was a lot of sleeping, you know, just trying to try to get back into things and I can remember the kid saying to me what's wrong with him, is he OK? Is he gonna get better? And you know, I was like of course, he's just adjusting to life again. We have had a hectic life before. And going there for three weeks and focusing on nothing but survival, you know it's kind of hard to come back and really care about soccer practice and volleyball practice. And who's gonna get who were and put the perspective for him on what was really important.
Marlana
Right? All this happens and you experience all this, and then he wants to do it again. What was that like?
Molly
There were some tough days and months for us as every show that came back, and he wanted to go. Our life was getting less complicated. The kids were going to college, if that makes it less complicated. But I was very much against it. You know, I just was not the loving, supportive wife for many weeks prior to him going. You know, I was angry that this was such an interest to him and that he could go away from our family so easily. You know, that's how I perceived it and go do this. But then as it got closer, we had several conversations. I really realized you know the tough part about is, when you have a spouse that is so passionate something that you're not involved with to that to the degree they are, you can do two things. You can either support it as much as you can, or you can fight it and it can be really brutal because at the end of the day they're going to do that, and so I finally tried to turn the other cheek and be supportive, which was great. It did help out a lot. The problem is when you show that support. It also makes the other person feel like you're really interested, so constant conversations about all the time, all the time, about going. And you know, we really had to find the middle of the road. We had to figure out how he could, you know, be thrilled with what we're doing on a normal day, and then I can show support because the last thing I didn't want him to go on any of these challenges and mentally feel like he was letting me down or the family down. So that was my number one. I just thought there's such a mental part to this. Same as I, I never want him to feel like I don't want him to do this to the point that if he came home, I wasn't gonna be there and that was never ever going to be the case. So, it was a lot of give and take, I think on both sides and every challenge got a little easier. You know, I think we started to set a lot more parameters around things, but it was definitely not. I don't think it was my shining moment on, you know the white supportive of the year, but it was real and that was the hard part.
Marlana
You know, there's your side of it too, where here's this person that you love, comes home and is almost unrecognizable. And all of the things that you see, that have changed physically or mentally, and you don't want to experience that again.
Molly
Absolutely! Now, I think this is a part that I had to really hold myself accountable for. I mean, again, your husband is experiencing something. This group of people that nobody else is going to be able to understand and they formed this really tight knit group. And he always invited me to be part of the show whether it was getting on podcasts and getting on his, you know, Facebook lives and I always refused. Because that wasn't my life. That was his life and so selfishly I was jealous of the fact that he had all these great moments with people who I really didn't know. But it had nothing to do with me, and that's a hard thing. It's a humble thing to face. It just was one of those, again, not necessarily the shining moment for me to understand that. It's OK that they have a separate part of life, you know and that's things you have to work on because marriage is hard and it's you know you gotta work at it every day. Whether you have something like this involved or not, but yeah, I was always worried for him too. I mean because he was so mentally tough. I knew he would not just come out if he wanted to. You know, he would stay till they made him come home, and that was always scary too.
Marlana
Yeah, and you know, it’s things that you just said my brain goes in two different directions. The first one is because I have seen and have friends that their spouses are in the spotlight and in the limelight, and things like that. There's also that part as a spouse that people overstep boundaries. So, have you experienced any of that along the way?
Molly
Yeah, and us live in such a social media time, you know, and that's the other challenge. So, you know it's a fine line. I mean, I've talked to people that I've known forever who said I would never have let my husband or wife go on the show. They're naked with somebody they don't even know. So, you know I got over that part a long time ago because to me it's the show, is about the ultimate vulnerability, right? And that's what they're doing. But once you're on the Facebook stuff, I would say social media was a very hard thing for me to deal with. Obviously had lots of followers, lots of people. Coming in then they wanna invite me to their friends and I don't want to, I don't wanna get in the way of his getting more and more people, but I wasn't really wanting to be a part of what I was reading, what I was seeing. Never when we've been out. Has anybody really overstepped bounds? Please, but social media is a very tough thing when you're married.
Marlana
Well, it's easy to do when it's anonymous, you know?
Molly
Absolutely so then, no, you get a decision. Again, do you not participate? Do you just decline everybody? Who invites you to be friends? Do you not look at the post he's putting? But even that changes you. Know what's before the show? Never went on Facebook. Never really cared about social media after it became part of his life. And you know, it was like every other day doing posts and every morning, waking up and seeing how many people he had. So, it was really the social media aspect that again, I was not prepared for, and I really had to kind of figure out how to move on with what I'm reading with what I'm seeing, you know people would send them packages and you know all that goes back to communicating and you have to be talking to each other all the time, right? Never not a trust factor, but still people out there are. You know they will say what they say and social media gives them that platform.
Marlana
Right! Exactly! And you know the other thing that your last comment made me think of is, so when he comes home and he has burns and he has, you know, frostbite and all these kinds of things, how does that affect you?
Molly
It's heartbreaking. I mean, it's really, you know when he came home from Africa and that was such a tough one because he was in the hospital and I didn't know anything about it until he was back in the hotel and, you know, took him a while to get his system right and again, you're just watching and he has permanent scars. I mean, do you know the burns on his side from the capillaries being burned from laying too close to a fire? I mean, you're just in such shock that this is happening to somebody that you love so much and yet they want to keep doing it over and over again. I mean, these are elements that they can't control once they're out there, so it's very hurtful because there's nothing you can do. There's nothing at all you can do. Is just support and maybe recommend a doctor, once in a while, but he definitely has permanent scars on things that he's endured, especially burns. You know, the burns are those don't go away.
Marlana
Is it hard for you to watch the show?
Molly
It used to be hard for me to watch the show. It's not so hard now. I just think it's been I mean. It's been five years in our life. I mean, it's interesting to watch. He watched the show because he doesn't get to preview it. You all see it. We all see it together and. He does too, and he's super intense and he's all into the TV and you know, he's just like his focus is like crazy on it. But I don't think it's hard for me to watch it anymore. Of course we talk about things, and you know there are things I don't know what they put on there and he doesn't either. But you know, if I know he's made it then of course I know when there's something that says, oh, he may not make it. I'm like, I think. He yeah, I know. He does so he. Might have it, he might have this one in the bag. So, and now I've gotten to know some of the other people, I have gone to a couple of events and they are really great people. There's a personal connection when I watch it now, it does make me really appreciate what they all have the capability of...
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Michelle Kuei
Elevate LifeCoaching
Michelle Kuei is an international speaker, certified visibility coach, content marketing strategist, and author. As the Founder of Elevate LifeCoaching, Michelle mentors women to use the power of storytelling as their secret sauce in attracting clients and turning their passion for coaching into a profitable business.
Clients who work closely with her start their coaching business confidently and courageously through Attract Clients Through Storytelling online course. They get clarity to the message and implement marketing strategies that are profitable and authentic.
In her book, Perfectly Normal: An Immigrant’s Story of Making It In America, Michelle shared her stories of Love, Courage, and Connection to empower her audience to let go of the imposter so they can make a more significant impact.
Michelle was born in Taiwan, Grew up in New York. And today, she lives in Los Angeles, California, with her short-hair orange tabby cat named ‘Toby.’
Website http://elevatelifecoaching.org
Instagram http://www.instagram.com/elevatelifecoach
Linkedin http://linkedin.com/in/michellekuei
Facebook http://www.facebook.com/lifecoachingbyelevate
Youtube https://www.youtube.com/michellekueispeak
Book Website: http://elevatelifecoaching.org/orderbook
a story archetype quiz to find out what story you are telling in your business
http://quiz.attractclientsthroughstorytelling.com
www.marlanasemenza.com
Audio : Ariza Music Productions
Transcription : Vision In Word
Marlana:
Michelle Kuei is an international speaker, certified visibility coach, content marketing strategist and author. As the founder of Elevate Life Coaching, Michelle mentors women to use the power of storytelling as their secret sauce. Welcome, Michelle.
Michelle:
Thank you so much for having me. It's a pleasure to be here.
Marlana:
So why do you think we struggle so much with that, especially as women?
Michelle:
I think number one is there's a lot of limiting belief. As women, we have this idea of there needs to be a perfect image of who we are, and that perfect mi image is oftentimes shaped by, you know, what, what is outside of us and not really what's inside of us, right? So, we grew up watching these beautiful iconic figures on television, in the news magazines, and we started to kind of mimic or, or have a role model of, I don't know who your role model is, but you know, when I was little, I remember there's the singer, and I grew up in Taiwan. So, there's a singer and she's beautiful. She has cute little hair. She's dressed up all the time and she's just like, very, very iconic, very beautiful, right? And so I grew up thinking that is how every woman should be. That's how I shoot. I want to be. And so the ideal image that we ha grew up with really shaped our beliefs in adulthood and moving into a lot of things that we do. So, like for the health and wellness industry, people are jumping onto like juicing all these different diets, you know intermittent diet. Why? Because we're trying to live up to certain expectations that we believe are important to us. And so we really fail to look at what the beauty that we hold inside. If I were to look like I don't know, Kardashian, that's probably a bad example, but if I were to look like Kardashian, you know, the girl next door also want to look like Kardashian.
So, we're walking around looking all like Kardashian. But is that who you truly are? No. And you know, the interesting thing about it too is people don't seem to realize that even the models that we see in magazines don't look like the model that you see in the magazine. A lot goes into it, and I'm not saying that these aren't beautiful women, but a lot goes into it.
Marlana
I think, you know, when we look at pretty pictures or images, we forget that there's more than just a visual, right?
Michelle:
It's the level of confidence, how they stand out in public, the way that they talk. There are certain elements of the quality that we can see through the pictures.
But when you see them on television, where they're talking, when they're speaking, there's personality that shine through that image and that together becomes a package of what you know as the Kardashian. What's her name in Harry Potter? Harry Potter, Heron Harmonic. She's British, and she's beautiful. She's very elegant. Every time she stand on the podium, it is like there's a level of confidence that's coming out from her. So every image that we see of her on media, it's like, okay, I really like this woman. Why? Because you know her as a person, and you know how she speaks. So, there's that personality touch that you don't see. We don't recognize it just from looking at the pictures.
Marlana:
I wanna go back because I read your story about hiking Machu Picchu, and I feel like in that story you took control of your narrative because it could have gone a very different direction. So, tell us a little bit about that story.
Michelle:
Yeah, so the story actually before I talk about the Machu Petri, let's go back to us a little bit maybe too when I was 11 years old. A lot back. So when I was 11, I had a big car accident, and that car accident resulted in permanent damage. So, I am physically disabled. I am fortunately not paralyzed, but I do need to walk with crutches. So my entire adulthood, I've been walking with crutches and I'm only 44 inches tall. My legs are crooked, and every pair of my jeans, I have to bring it to a tailor to get a cin. So, growing up, I was nothing. Compare all the images that we see in the magazine on the television, cuz I don't belong anywhere. And when I was in my 40s it was hard to believe that, how long it takes for someone to, to recognize the beauty that's inside rather than outside.
It took me 40 years, well, 30 something years. So when I was 40, I woke up one day and I'm like, this is not the way I want to live the rest of my life, and I need to make a change. And so, I started into this fitness journey. Next thing you know, I decided to book myself a ticket, flew myself to Cusco, Peru, and I went on a Inga trail hike through 26 miles of Inga Trail to Machu Picchu. I spent four days in the mountain pushing down every step onto my crutches. And it was just a very, very physical endurance journey. It was the second day when I reached to the peak of Machu Picchu in the Inga Trail. It was at the Dead Women's Pass.
Marlana:
I wonder why they called it dead Women's Pass.
Michelle:
Cause by the time you make up there, you like, have gone . So, the debt woman's pass is 14,000 feet above sea level. So there was a lot of pulmonary symptoms, you know, I had trouble with my hip breathing and I kept stopping. So, it was just a very physically enduring experience. But through that journey I started, it was just, cuz there's four days and I was just on that hike and every step, there's nothing else, there's no external noises. I had to really stay focused to make sure that I'm landing on the right steps moving forward. So, it was almost meditating to me. So there was a lot of that noise that was going on in my monkey mind, it started to quiet down. And so that experience was like, oh, I don't have to compare myself to others.
I can totally do this. If someone can hike Machu Picchu, so can I, if someone can go out to the mountain or go swim in the ocean, so can I. And so you started to see the ability of how when you put your mind, there's determination, dedication, the discipline. When you put all three of those elements into believing what you are capable of doing, there's nothing that you cannot accomplish.
Marlana:
It's interesting to me too, because I'm sure, and I believe I read this too that it took you longer to complete this trek. And your guide actually commented on that.
Michelle:
Yeah, he did. So the first day it was typically the iterary involves that any individual who hike it would take you about like roughly eight hours to hike. It's all ascending, all uphill’s going up to the peak. And it takes four days. So typically you spend like eight hours on day one through four. For me, on that first day, I didn't know what to expect. I had this passion, I had this enthusiasm, and there I was on the trail, but it took me a long time to hike. And so the whole entire time we had about 10 people who came from all over the world, complete strangers. And we were all on the same trail. So, there's 10 of us. And the whole entire time I was the last one, and along with me are these donkeys. There's donkeys on these trails carrying supplies and tents, you know, like utensils and there's donkey along this trail. So the whole entire time I'm behind the donkey, you know how donkeys travel already pretty slow. It's taking their time. I'm traveling behind the donkey. And so, the whole entire time I'm behind the donkey having a visual of, you know, the donkey's back.
And so, I know everything about donkeys dropping and, you know, all that stuff. It was pretty, pretty exciting for me from the view behind.
Marlana:
Yeah. And here's the thing, there are people that could have taken that and thought, you know, I'm going slower than everybody, I'm even going slower than the donkey. But the whole point is that here you are on crutches doing this. And what, not just physical strength, but what mental strength that takes to accomplish this. So to me, that's taking a story that could have gone, people could have seen one way and taken it one way and you rewrote it and made it yours into, no, this is how this is going to be seen by my strength and by my fortitude in doing this. So how do we do that in our lives?
Michelle:
So, I think the most important question that anyone can ask themselves is why do you want what you want? Right? And, and most of us go through, oh, I want, I want to have a better career. I want to apply better job. I want to have more money. But we often forget that everything that you want, there's a reason behind the why. Like why do you want it? What does that make you feel when you wanted? And I remember when I was on the trail that very same night, my tool leader sat me down. It is 10 out of the middle of nowhere. And he asked me like, now you have choice because you are walking so slow, you won't be able to catch up, cuz the second day is the harder. So how are you gonna be able to catch up?
So now you have two choices. Here are your two choices. One is you turn around and I can have someone escort you back. You know, you can still make it going back, or you're gonna have to push harder and you're gonna have to walk faster on day two. Because day two, you gotta need to catch up. And I'm sitting there trying to decipher all this. And both my wrists were burning because I just did a pushup for the whole entire day. I'm sitting there and asking the question, why, why do I want to do this? What would that make me feel if I were to able to actually complete this trail? And the first thing that came to my mind was, why I wanted to do this is I don't wanna come home and be laughed at.
I told everybody, I told the whole entire world, I'm going to Machu Picchu. Now, if I were to come back and say, you know what, I didn't make it, you know, I decided to turn back. That's like a big joke, right? Did you make this bar? You bought your ticket and you're not gonna complete the whole trail? So I was sitting there and my question, the answer to my why was that number one, I don't wanna go back. Going back was not a choice anymore. So why do I wanna do this? Because this is important for me. This is the moment where I get to decide how I want to live my life. I get to decide who I want to be, and I get to decide how I'm going to move forward. And I don't wanna come back. I don't want to go back anymore.
Marlana:
Love that. So where in there, because I'm sure along the way too, as we tell these stories to ourselves in our head about ourselves, and I'm sure imposter syndrome comes into play. What are your thoughts on all of that?
Michelle:
So, the imposter syndrome is real. And I do believe it is real. I, I did have this imposter syndrome because, you know, as far as my career achievement, I didn't just stop a high school graduate. I went all the way to get my doctor's degree, right? And I went all the way to live a life as a clinical pharmacist, and I have a roof over me. I have a stable income. You know, it's like a lifestyle that everybody dream of, but I didn't connect to it. And so that imposter syndrome to me was something like, oh, you're not good enough because you would never look the same as the girl next door.
That was my imposter. But you have to remember that an imposter is someone, it's something that we tell ourselves, but it's not, it's an external, it's a different entity. I like to think of it as an entity, right? It's something else. It almost sounds like we're intel. We just had Halloween. It almost sounds creepy. It's a different identity that our minds somehow believed and had identified it to it. So what had worked for me in my journey is that I started to separate out my imposter. So, it no longer becomes my voice of me. It's the voice of my imposter, whoever that looks like, whatever that looks like. And for my imposter, she looks like I call her she, and she is a Barbie doll, and her name is Daisy.
I even gave her a name. Daisies are beautiful. You know, Daisy, the Tipsy, that's how I call her because she has this beautiful Barbie doll. She looks in perfect shape and in every single way she has can, you know, in the driver's seat, they're going on the Mercedes . So, Barbie is living the life of her dream. But Barbie is not me. I am this separate entity and I am fully capable of deciding what I want to do today that will make a difference in the world, the people around me. How I want to show up my imposter, mean my imposter. Daisy didn't just disappear. Daisy is still here. And every once in a while, Daisy is gonna come and check in with me and say, Hey, are you sure this is what you want to do? And what I would tell Daisy is, yeah, absolutely. And do you know what? You're gonna come with me because I need someone to check in with me all the time. So, so your imposter become this instead of an enemy or something that you are afraid of or afraid to have. Your imposter becomes someone who is there to guide you. They're acting as a guidepost so that every step that you go, you know, that you're making the most conscious choice.
Marlana:
So, talk to me too a little bit about because you coach women with power storytelling. How do we know, or how do we find the story within us that will resonate or that we can use as our secret sauce?
Michelle:
So, I love going back to car Ys theory of the brand art type. So people who are familiar with the personality art type, like the bricks and Meyer personality types they're total of 12 different archetype. And each one of us have all these 12 types living within us. But depending on your circumstances and situation, there may be one or couple that pretty dominant in the way that you interact with the world and the way that you see the world and perceive the world. And so, for me, you know,...
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Kevin Cassidy- business is Ninja Nation Charlotte. Book is Falling Down to Find Myself
Bullied kid to Hollywood stuntman to business owner, author and family man
www.kevincass.com
www.marlanasemenza.com
Audio : Ariza Music Productions
Transcription : Vision In Word
Marlana
From Bullied Kid to Hollywood stuntman to business owner, author, and family man; today we learn a few life lessons from Kevin Cassidy. Welcome, Kevin.
Kevin
Thank you, thanks for having me.
Marlana
So, the title of your book is Falling Down to Find Myself. Talk to us about what that title means.
Kevin
Obviously, it's a little bit of a play on words. I was a stuntman for a lot of years, so I quite literally fell down for a living. And then through life going, through failures and falling down figuratively, was very important for me to get to this success and happiness. I had labor in life, so falling down literally and figuratively to kinda making you a whole person. That's kind of where it's going.
Marlana
So, you grew up on Long Island and you said that you became a stunt man. How did you become a stunt man?
Kevin
Crazy long story, but I'll shorten it up for you. So, I moved from Long Island to Charlotte, North Carolina when I was 10 years old, in fifth grade. And I was born in the birth defect in a speech impediment in a heavy long island accent in North Carolina in the late eighties.
Marlana
You had all kinds of things working against you,
Kevin
It was a lot. I remember bringing a bagel to school when the kid thought it was a really bad tasting donut. But anyway, I went to college, and I played baseball, I was an athlete and played minor league baseball, a very low-level minor league. Became a teacher in Baltimore City. My pastor was teaching mentor coaching and that kind of stuff. And there was a sport we used to watch on TV called Slam Ball. It was full contact basketball at trampolines. It was on TV for a couple years. Me and my buddies watched it. It was had a good time. They had a tryout for that in Philadelphia. I was living in Baltimore. One of my good friends is from Philly. Went there for a weekend, kind as a goof. We go this tryout, and I messed around and made it and they shipped me to LA for another round of the tryouts.
And I was a teacher this time just outside of DC in Hyattsville. And I talked to my principal. I said, Hey, here's what's happening. 24, I have a free ride to lab I can get cut tomorrow. I'll be home in two days. I can be there for two weeks, or I could be there for four months. I have no idea. I'm not gonna burn this bridge. I'm not gonna do this unless, and if I lose a job, are you kidding me? You always have a job here. Go have fun. You know, she was awesome, very supportive. Alright! Went to LA and made that sport and lived in LA for about four months. And a guy I met, there was a stuntman who did a lot of sports, movies, football, and baseball movies. And stuck on his couch for a little bit and got a tryout for a movie called The Longest Yard with Adam Sander and Burt Reynolds and all those people. Went to that tryout, made that movie, got into the union learned the whole stunt world and oh, I'll stay here as long as it, you know, until this kiss me back to, you know, Baltimore, to teach and ride this wave. As long as I can do it. And 18 years later I'm looking for an escape from it.
Marlana
I'm gonna show my ignorance a little bit. Is there a school basically that you can go to that will teach you how to fall and all those kinds of things?
Kevin
No, you have to kind of bring that to the interview, for lack of a better word. It's all word of mouth. There's no inter, there's Asians, no managers, no auditions. Every now and then there'll be a big audition, like that football movie. You need a bunch of football players, a very specialty skill. But usually there's none of that. There's no agency managers auditioned this all. You sub immerse yourself in the community. There's a stuntman softball league, a stuntman golf tournament. There's stuntman outings and different guys train at different gyms or different specialties, martial arts or horse riding, or there's Red Bull skydives or searches of people. And there's any, any branch of random athletic endeavor. They're all out there.
So, you get to know these people, you immerse yourself in the community and word of mouth and you get one job, do a good job, get another job, and it takes a long time to build up the reputation where you're working steadily. So, you kind of have to bring enough tools to the table to make you hirable at first, which was football and baseball and all those sports things. I got in and as I was doing those, I was learning how to fight and drive cars and come off buildings and do fire. And you kind of build your repertoire and you know, off you go. So, there's really no school. You just gotta throw yourself in there in the community,
Marlana
Which is kind of crazy to me when you think about it because I mean, these are some serious things if you're falling off buildings and whatnot. So, will somebody else take you under their wing or is it kind of competitive?
Kevin
Mostly under their wing. Everyone is a very cool community. Like I said, because it's word of mouth you only do the job that you're gonna be good at. So, if you're gonna be a person looking for someone to back flip a motorcycle and you call me, Hey Kevin, I need a guy. Your height and weight to do this back flip on a motorcycle. I'm like, I can't do that. I'm not taking that job. I'll give you $10,000. I don't care. I can't do that cuz tomorrow I'm gonna show up and have to do it and if I lie or didn't do it, then I'm never working again. You found it solely your reputation. It was very reputation based. And you take the job that you know you're pretty good at in the beginning, then you build your reputation. So, everyone kind of likes building people up.
And I think back in the day it was more competitive when I started because there weren't as many shows going on. But now at Netflix, Hulu, Apple, and hbo, there's millions of contents, millions of shows going on. So, there's more work than there are people to perform. 20 years ago there was like, there's 10 movies, you may be really good, get on one of them or you gotta go back to bartending or doing something else. So, I think back then it was a little more cutthroat. But as a person who hires all the stunt people, you need to build a good crew around you. So always wanna give someone a shot cuz you always need people of different specialties and everything. So, it's mostly building up and now it's for sure building up
Marlana
What's your best and worst memory?
Kevin
Man, best memory is, it's kind of like locker room, like I was an athlete. So, you have that, that vibe and you're with like-minded people. You're doing physical outlet stuff and you're also creative. You're doing fight choreography; you're doing camera angles. You learn how to train the actors and what this character should do and how he should move. And you have that creative piece and then you have to just get in there and get, ask her at piece, which it really bonds people. So, kind of most of my best memories are their friendships and relationships and all those things that environment gives you and mean some of the injuries and some of the, I should have done this, or I should've start that job or not, nothing terrible, all like kind of, you know, plants on the road ahead. But all is mostly good.
Marlana
What do you take, that you learned during that whole time that you have brought forward with you?
Kevin
Oh, the big thing I learned was like, your show is about branding and everything. I was always the guy that kept my mouth shut and was a good baseball football player. I played and I started, I got a scholarship, and I didn't ever talk much. And then I went out to LA and I'm on the stuntman softball league and I was a pro baseball player. I look really good out there. I'm like, oh, I'm way more than now. These guys, I'll run this whole world pretty soon. Didn't know that that guy's a world class martial artist and that guy was a world-class rodeo guy and that guy was just a bull skydiving and they don't play baseball. So that humility was great in learning that. And then you have to build your own resume, build your own highlight reel, print your own headshot, and you're your own business and you gotta sell yourself to them, to the people.
And I won't sell myself, they'll call me cuz I'm good. No calls. You have to get yourself out there. And we called hustling sets. You just break onto a movie set, find nothing. The stunt coordinator is, but hey, I'm here, here's my information. And you kind of sneak off without getting arrested. So, there's a whole light says boots on the ground sales technique. You are the product, and you are the business owner, and you are the marketing director and you are all that. So that world was different for me, and I probably got, I ramped slower than I would've. Cause there were times I would get a phone call, Hey, can you do this stunt? Yeah, I can do that. No problem. Something I can very easily do. But I just, yeah, I can do that. Sure, okay, well I'll call you back tomorrow.
I will call him back tomorrow. I found this other guy you can do. He was really excited about it. He really saw himself more. I'm like, those guys terrible. I know that guy. I mean, he's a nice guy, but he's not as good as I am. But he got the job. Oh, I gotta get better at that phone call and I can never be fake. I did it in a slow and steady way, which is truer to who I am. But I could have branded myself better. It got out a little earlier, but on any of the days I was very successful. So, I take that with me to this now career of getting out there, building a brand and all that.
Marlana
Yeah. How do you prepare both physically and mentally for stunt work?
Kevin
Physically, like I say, you have to put a lot of tools in your toolbox. So, I learned how to fight and learn how to drive, learn how to fall and all that. And you only take the jobs you know you're gonna be successful at first. And then other times you're like, well, you're the best guy for the job. You gotta give it a shot and you and your boss work about it and like, oh, try, we'll practice or whatever. So physically you just put as many physical tools in a toolbox as you can. Be a good fight guy, be a good car guy, be a good whatever, and, you know, stay in shape and you have to do the stunt. If you fall down the stairs, you gotta do that five, six times in the road. You need a different camera angle.
If you do it one time and break your arm, you're no longer employable. And if you're not working, you're not getting paid. So, you'd be able to do that. Look gnarly but be safe at it. So, practicing falling and crashing out, building those callouses all over your body and your bones so you can kind of do it and do it again. So physically it's pretty easier to kind of do all that is very tangible mentally not getting a job, not working for months at a time. Finding other people who are getting a job that you think you should have got. Not getting too down yourself, finding out who to train, how to do all that. Showing up on set, okay, you're gonna do this really big stunt fall out the window, it's gonna be awesome. And you get there, I'll pump to do it.
To prove yourself. Oh, don't we run outta time. You don't have a budget. We gotta cut that stunt. We're not doing it. And you go home not doing anything like, oh man. So, there's a lot of highs and a lot of lows that mentally you really have to prepare for. And a lot of that is done by talking to the people above you, being in those communities. Hey, here's what's gonna happen. That's part of the job, and kind of building that up if you just get, you know, thrown in the mix and that happens. It's a real mental struggle.
Marlana
How do you handle rejection?
Kevin
I'm very good, I'm very practiced at it. It doesn't really bother me. Sometimes it bothered me more. The rejection part never really bothered me, but the reasons behind it kind of bothered me. Maybe this is my buddies. I'm giving him the job and that you, okay, well that doesn't sit right and that frustrates you and that's, you know, nothing can do about it. But it teaches you to put your best foot forward. And it's a numbers game like any other sales job in the beginning. While you're building that reputation, keep putting yourself out there, keep getting rejected, keep putting yourself out there. And each one has a different scenario of rejection. Sometimes you just don't fit. The actor's too tall, you're too short, not fair enough. It's easy to deal with that one. Other times I don't have the ability, I can't back up a motorcycle.
I mean, I reject that one. But other times when you do feel like you're the right fit and everything's perfect and you don't get it, it's but most of the guys who are doing that are, Hey, here's why build this up. I know this guy. You might be better if I worked with this guy 20 years, so I gotta, fair enough. Stick around and you'll be that guy soon. Then you can deal with that better. But it's how it's delivered and the community you have around you to help, help support you in those times.
Marlana
You had mentioned earlier that you had a facial deformity. So how did that affect your life and your mental fortitude?
Kevin
I think I built it. I speak about, well, it was a very strict cleft pallet. So, when I was born, there was a bubble from bottom of my nose all the way back to mouth. I had no roof in my mouth, no nose, no teeth, no bone up there. So, I had a lot of surgeries to put different things in my mouth. And then in seventh grade I took bone from my hip and created a roof of my mouth and, and this bone here. Before that I was completely flat with no nostrils, and then learning how to talk over and over again. It was very nasal. And then had different contraption in my mouth and a different contraption and another surgery and like, oh, that's like during middle school, which is a kind of tough route to go.
I didn't go to a very great middle school, so it was kind of rough. But I always still had good friends, like good family support. I never internalized it. I don't know if that's, you know, nature nurture. It never really became like who I was or just something that I had a, you know, fight through. And it was never a hundred percent of my day. Like now with social media and everything. And if I were getting bullied now, it would never go away. I would see them my phone, oh man, that would be really hard. But back then, 10, 20 little comics a day, maybe
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Ruby Durham, Miss North Carolina for America 2022
House of Red
Suited X Red
I have a passion for creating aesthetic spaces and dressing women. I started building the foundations for both businesses in 2020 during the beginning of the pandemic. I just recently resigned from my on-air tv news job as a journalist to go full time as an entrepreneur.
https://www.houseofred.co/
https://www.houseofred.co/the-collection
www.marlanasemenza.com
Audio : Ariza Music Productions
Transcription : Vision In Word
Marlana:
miss North Carolina for America 2022 on air TV news, journalist, entrepreneur. These are just some of the accomplishments of today's guest, Ruby Durham, who has recently left her full-time job to pursue her passion for elevating aesthetics. Welcome, Ruby.
Ruby:
Good morning! Thank you for that introduction, I appreciate it.
Marlana:
So first, tell us a little bit, how did you get into being a journalist and on television and all those kinds of things?
Ruby:
Okay, so I went to Coastal Carolina University in Conway, South Carolina, not too far from Myrtle Beach, South Carolina. And I was running track there four years. And I started off thinking that I wanted to do, sports physical therapy because I wanted to remain in the sports background and on my own gym for women, have a fitness clothing line, all the hoo-ha under that sports fitness kind of belt under exercise sports science. That was the degree I was taking at the time.
Marlana:
You had to take electives?
Ruby:
Well, one of the electives, it was, public speaking and I remember after my first class, my professor pulled me to the side and she said, I think you should change your major to broadcast journalism. You did so well and I think you need to change your, your major. And so my mom always said, if it makes sense for you, if you can't stop thinking about it, then pursue it.
I ended up pursuing it and it was kind of crazy because as a full-time student athlete, there was really no room for changes. I was going into my junior year and I wanted to graduate on time, but by changing my major, it was likely that I would have to stay a little bit later. And I did not want that to happen. Well, lo and behold, I just had to clock in a whole bunch of extra study hall hours being a student athlete and I had to take 20 credit hour classes, which was beyond crazy being a full-time athlete cuz you're on the road a lot. And so somehow I just made it happen and it was literally a professor just seeing something in me, believing in me, being confident in me, and me just following her intuition and changing my major. So, I ended up changing it.
I got a hold of a teacher or a professor at the time, Kimberly Schumacher, who is still a mentor and a close friend for me today. She was in the business for 20 years. She retired and became a professor for broadcast journalism at the school that I was at the time. And so I just got under her wing and she just helped me create a resume reel while I was in the class. So basically a resume reel is kind of your resume to get a job on tv, but it's more so you being active, showing how you look, how you talk and your storytelling. Well, in the class we would build them and learn how to write for news and web. But on the side she saw so much potential in me. On the weekends, me and this professor would go out and she would tell me to look at the news and, and watch stories that I like.
And we would try to go find those same locations that the reporters would be at and we would wreck, we would create my reel based on what was timely in the news at that point. So let's say a reporter was at this fire that happened at this local restaurant. Well, she would tell me to watch it. We would go to the local restaurant and I would just remake the broadcast, but it would be me. And that's how I created my reel to get an internship. I couldn't do the internship during college because I was so busy with Trag. So, immediately after I graduated, I got an internship. Did that for about three months and then I got my first job on air. So that's how it kind of let up. Long story short.
Marlana:
So let me ask you this, what was it like the first time you were on air?
Ruby:
It was very nerve wracking because you know, you are practicing for that moment. You are working and interning and shadowing for that moment. I believe it was, if I can remember correctly, it was very nerve wracking, but at the same time I knew I was in the right place.
Marlana:
Yeah, I get that. So what do you think you learned from your years in tv?
Ruby:
Oh, so much. I don't even know where to start. Time management, working on a deadline, getting things done right then and there. Because when you're in TV news, you turn a story every day. So there's no pushing it off or waiting unless it's a longer story, there's no pushing it off or waiting. You have to get it done because you're already in your mind mentally preparing for the next day, which is an entire new story, an entire list of contacts that you're reaching out to get the story done. Because once you turn on the air and you see reporters, you don't want the anchor toss to you when they say, now we're gonna bring in reporter Ruby Durham for this story. You don't want it to go black. You want to have your stuff submitted. You want to time manage to be able to figure out what that story is.
Go find the right people to interview, go get certain shots that help tell the story. So if we're at a restaurant, we're uh, interviewing the restaurant owner, we need to talk to the restaurant owner. And then when you also need to get permission to get video inside the restaurant to see what we're hearing. But you have to do this in a short amount of time to get it on air that same day most times. So that's why I say time management, working on a deadline, communicating, working with different resources and figuring out how to put the entire puzzle piece together. And then storytelling, writing, speaking, figuring out how to take sometimes a complex story and breaking it all the way down so someone be able to understand and learn or it will make an impact or help someone figure out, okay, I needed to learn that.
I need to learn where to go get my taxes done at. Or this is the deadline. Okay, now this is the next question that I have, or this is the next step I need to take. But we have to dumb it down as a way so you can understand and then go do it. And not dumb it down so to speak, but put it in layman's terms, right? So you able to take what you're hearing and then go do it. Because at the end of the day, we're messengers. We're messengers for the public to be able to get something across. I go back to the word impact or let someone know, hey, this person is serving in the community, this is how you can help or this is how you can get involved. There's so many different tiers in the news, but I can go all day on what I learned. But really just sticking with the outline of the day each and every day to get work done. And then being in the community, cuz it's really not all about being a face. It's not all about telling a story. It is, you know, showing people that you're human, this is your job, but you know, you have a smiling face, you have a good heart, and you're just wanting to use their platform to help someone else.
Marlana:
I would think that it also elevated your people skills.
Ruby:
Oh, for sure. Yeah. I remember one time, one of my assignments, I had to go do a door knock. So a door knock is where you literally drive up to someone's home because it's a story that you're trying to get the interview, you're trying to get the interview, that person is the person you need to get an interview, but it's likely they might not answer the phone. So, you have to go do a door knock. And at that moment, I remember Ruby, you have to put all your everything aside and go do it. So I do label myself sometimes as a daredevil, a go-getter because the news just taught me, you gotta go get it. There's no other way you gotta go get it. You gotta come back with something.
Marlana:
Yeah. It seems like you enjoy having multiple things going on at once.
Ruby:
I do. I grew up, my mom, single parent, low income area. We didn't have money. We didn't have money at all, but she had time, time to put into to whatever, whatever I wanted to do. So for example, I remember I was switching school districts from sixth to seventh grade and I remember her telling me, try out for every sport, just try out for every sport to see what you're good at. And so, I still lead with that today. I wanna do everything. I wanna try everything to see what I'm good at because then I can see what I like, what I don't like, what I'm good at, what I'm not good at. So, I think the news was actually such a great fit because it allowed me to do so many different things, meet so many different people, go to so many different places and learn about myself too.
What I can accomplish, what I can, how I can really take myself to the limits, what I may need to back up off on because I know that's really not me. It just taught me so many things. But I go back to just growing up and just putting myself in, in so many spaces, always being active, always just leading with my heart, leading with my mind and going after it. So, I always said I wanted five kids. If the Lord blesses me with five kids, it'll happen. But I say that to say I have patience and I'm very calm when there's a lot of things going around. I'm not calm when there's nothing going on. So, I invest when there is chaos. And because I am the most calm person, I work really well under pressure and I'm pretty sure that came from the news too. But hopefully one day we'll see if, we'll see if my words match , match my match, what I'm dreaming about. But I am definitely the put me in, give me the most task because I can figure it out. I can weave through the mess.
Marlana:
So, things change for you in 2020. Tell us how,
Ruby:
Okay, so 2020, the pandemic things changed and everybody has a story. You know, I decided I wanna work from home. I decided that I wanna quit my job. I decided I wanna spend more time with my kids. A lot of people had different stories and I was able to witness that through being on the news. But it impacted me because at the time at the news station, I was a traffic reporter. So, during the pandemic, during quarantine, we were all sent home. Nobody was frozen. So my time on the news at for a short period of time, thank the Lord, I was still getting paid 40 hours a week. I was still getting paid. So that didn't change. But my time, my workload did change because I wasn't necessarily needed as much, but at the same time, I wasn't needed as much.
My bosses were trying to figure out, okay, what else can we, how else can we use her time? But that wasn't an overnight thing. So I remember working from home and I would turn on my TV and I would put the station logo in the back and I would set up light and I would turn on my phone as if like you're FaceTiming people. But I would FaceTime the station and they would take that live. So I worked from home for about a year, but during the time I was only doing traffic. I would sign in about 4 45 in the morning, cuz the show was from five to seven. I would sign in about 4 45, I would talk about the traffic that was on the roads. It wasn't anything at all. But I was still, you know, I still had a job to do even though things were different until we figured out how to pivot.
So, I would sign out about seven o'clock and that was it. So, from 4:45 AM to seven o'clock, I was on the news. And then I would have the rest of the day because I didn't have another assignment at that time. Eventually I started doing stories that were called Reasons to Smile. So basically bringing stories that are gonna uplift people during these crazy times where we don't know what's gonna happen day after day. But before we got to that segment, I was just at home. So I remember my sister, she is a massage therapist, but at that time she stopped working because at that time you can't, business were closing. That was physical touch. So that was not okay during Covid. So a lot of people around me were either losing their jobs, their jobs were letting them go. And so in the back of my mind I said, okay Ruby, you have all this time at home.
What if you lost your job? What if you know, you get, you have your furlough and you don't go back because of the pandemic. Everything was an unknown. So I said, okay, what can I do to make money? When I started out on the news, I had to transition from being a college athlete to having to dress up every day and be this face. And not saying that it's all glitz and glamor, but it was a transition from wearing tracksuits every day to being on live TV every day. So I remember one day my boss, came in, brought me into the office. She said, Ruby, you have it. You have what we need on tv. You have everything but your look. We need you to, we need brighter colors, we need you to dress it up a little bit more.
You just looking a little plain. And while some people would take offense to that, I actually was like, I thought it was a challenge, like, okay, I'm gonna find the best stuff. Obviously money was not, I didn't have all the money at that time. Cause when you start off in news, you definitely don't make all the money in the world. You have to grow to that. So I was trying to find really nice outfits that would I guess fit my budget at the time. But I couldn't really find anything. I grew up watching the nanny. I love, I would say if I had a celebrity that I would take their wardrobe, it would be Nanny Fine or Olivia Polk. But I couldn't find anything at that time that would fit my budget. So I said, you know what, one day I'm gonna start a clothing line for women and I'm gonna have all everything, just everything.
And so I went back to that thought process during the pandemic, but that didn't make sense because people are working from home. Who's gonna buy a dress to sit in their living room or their kitchen, their makeshift office. Who's gonna buy all these glamorous things or, or just anything right now when it comes to not being just comfortable. So I said, okay, well what can I do to build the business but then also make money to invest in it? So, I love organizing pantries. Just anything of which you can think. I love organizing. I love interior design. I love everything home because at the end of the day, while I can be in the most chaotic spaces, I'm a homebody at heart. So, but I love to be comfortable and relaxed in my home and I like it to have a system. So one of my family members said, Hey, come up to Raleigh and organize my pantry for me.
Just organize the pantry, my whole kitchen actually. So when I did it, I said, Ooh, I love doing this. Maybe I can make money, you know, doing this, you know, as a side hustle and save that money as a way to invest in my clothing line. So when this pandemic is done, I can launch my clothing line. I can still do it cuz it made sense. Like I'm on the news. I always get compliments on what I'm wearing. And so it was just kind of like full circle for me to do it with the platform that I had. It just made so much sense. So long story short and, posting pantries, closets, cabinets, all of the above that I'm reorganizing and a lot of people would give me great feedback. So much feedback to the point where I end up getting a mentor through Score.
Charlotte's for Charlotte is a free business center here in the area and they offer business workshops, mentors, just all types of resources to give you a business outline, figure out how to form A L C, register your business, really go full throttle with learning how to build a brand. And so, I ended up reaching out to score. They paired me with a lady now that I've been working with for a year and a half called Susan Z. Brennan. She was in commercial real estate for a number of years and she is now retired and mentoring people like me who are trying to start businesses. So I ended up taking a small, uh, side hustle and because I started getting people asking me to come to their homes that I, I only would go to people homes that I knew, like word of mouth or referrals.
I still stay true to, I'm a face on the tv, so I'm not trying to do just anything, go into anyone's home. So I still try to remain exclusive in that part, but it started to pick up. So, I ended up creating a business outta that. It's called, my brand is called House of Red, house of Red Tears off now to the Aesthetic by Red. The aesthetic by red is all interior design professional organizing consultations. And then during that time I was just building what would my clothing line look like? Where am I sourcing the, this inventory from? Where am I handpicking the best of the best? So, I was just doing that groundwork while doing projects. My dad is a general contractor here in the Charlotte area. So that was a good, it was a good stepping stone because I already had people that I trusted and he had a team that, Hey, I need this bed put together cause I'm redesigning this kid's room.
Or hey, I need to this paint. I already had a list of contacts for the interior design side. So, it merged very easily. So pandemic, we started to come outta the pandemic. I started to inch closer to moving to how can I really launch this clothing line but also remain doing interior design and professional organizing consultations. Cause I didn't mean to do two businesses. It’s kind of just fell in my lap and I ran with it. And here we are in 2022 and I just launched a month ago, my clothing line for women, the suited by red. And I am just so excited to continue to learn and to continue to dress women and figure out how to go big because it's been inside of me for the longest time. And so now that it's finally here, it's just, okay, I decided to put the news behind and go full 100% entrepreneurship because it needs my time, it needs all of my time so I can build it to the best way it can and be built.
Marlana:
Now first, because I think it's important, explain to everybody what's red.
Ruby:
So Red is actually my family nickname. My full name is Ruby Elizabeth Durham. And I have two Ruby's in my family. My grandmother's name was Ruby. I have an aunt named Ruby. And so I, they just formed this nickname for me when I was younger. And it's always stuck with me. So if I hear somebody say Ruby in my family, that means they're trying to get my attention in a serious way. They all call me red. And it's kind of like my alter ego as well because it just takes me back to my childhood, the things that I had dreams of wanting to do, wanting to be so, and it's a bold color. It's bold, it's sassy, it's fierce, it's confident. If you see a...
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Emily Zimmermann and my business is called Grace Communications
The founder and CEO of Grace Communications, Emily Zimmermann, has over 15 years of experience leading marketing, public relations, event planning, and business development efforts for companies all over the United States. She has a demonstrated history of success with helping develop new companies and departments as well as extensive event planning and social media experience. She also has been responsible for public relations efforts in top markets all over the country such as Chicago, St. Louis, Minneapolis, and Charlotte. Her passion for marketing and helping businesses grow is what led her to form Grace Communications
Emily also has a passion for speaking and educating others in fun, unique ways. Her It's A Match Workshops use the same fundamentals that are successful in dating, to help in the business realm. She has a variety of experience with public speaking including hosting fashion shows, events, live television segments, grand openings, conferences, and virtual training sessions.
www.gracecommunicationsagency.com
www.marlanasemenza.com
Audio : Ariza Music Productions
Transcription : Vision In Word
Marlana
Now founder and CEO of Grace Communications, Emily Zimmerman has over 15 years of experience leading marketing public relations and business development efforts for companies all over the United States. Her It's A Match workshops is the same fundamentals that are successful in dating to help businesses grow. Welcome, Emily.
Emily
I'm so excited to be here. Thank you for having me on.
Marlana
So, I'm really intrigued by this handling business like dating. So first, tell us what you see some of the similarities as being?
Emily
I think there are unlimited similarities, honestly, this all came about because it was a way that I would kind of cope with the hardships of being an entrepreneur, it was how I would laugh about things. And I would find myself thinking like, this is like, when I used to be dating like this, or implying to me of how I felt before I got married, like, you know, and there were a lot of ups and downs, a lot of awkward situations. A lot of just, you know, are you a good fit? Are you not a good fit? Are you a match? Are you not a match. So, it was kind of one of those things where it was like a coping mechanism for me to change my mindset and look at it almost like a game or like something fun, when things would happen that were uncomfortable as a business owner. But some of the similarities, I think, right off the bat that most people are going to be like, Yeah, I can relate to that.
Our rejection is a big one. So, as you know, a female entrepreneur or even just entrepreneur, in general, you don't have to even put gender in there. Rejection is just a constant, you know, you just have to be prepared for that. And I always feel like that if you can change your mind set on how you handle rejection, you can do almost anything, because there's that fear of being rejected that so many people have, it's the same in the dating realm. You feel like, one of the things that holds people back, I think, from putting themselves out there, and finding the one or whatever is, is rejection. And it's so easy to take it personally and to feel like, I'm just never going to find that right match, I'm never going to have never been a boyfriend, I'm never going to get married, or I'm never going to find that client, the clients that I want, you know, it's so similar.
I think for me, you know, I still allow myself to be sad if I get rejected, because I think that you're not a robot. So, you need to be able to let the feelings out. So, I have this role where I can have a day where I can cry, I could be depressed, I can just let it all out for one day. And then I have to, I have to just figure out how to grow from that. And I think it's the same with dating, you know, when you feel like you're all of a sudden rejected. And if it's kind of one sided, especially, it's it can feel just like this huge blow to your ego into your identity. So, I think it's important to change that mindset and be like, Yes, I'm sad about it, but what can I learn from this? How can I grow? And what is this opening up for me?
Marlana
You know, because two things came to mind as you were saying that the first one was just like, you know, in both cases, you don't want to be all things to all people and there are people that you just like you don't want to be married to, you don't want to be in a business relationship with either. And the other thing too is, what I found is when a client eliminates themselves that's actually not a bad thing. Just like when a dating prospect eliminates themselves you could have launched a real bullet
Emily
Oh yeah, definitely. I'm sure you have, and I think that's the healthier way of looking at it. It's not what you lost. It's what's opened up for you now. So I know for me in March of this year, I had a very difficult season in my business life where I had one of my long term clients just very suddenly decided not to work with my agency anymore and you feel rejected, you're like, all the weekends, all that needs other things you've given up to make that relationship work the same way you feel if you're in a long term relationship, and all of a sudden, they break up with you like via text or something, you're like all that time, like, it meant nothing. But that's not the reality of it, the reality of it is, for some reason, you're not aligned with them anymore, it's not working for them, or it's not working for you. So, it's time to break up, and you have to accept that, then think about all the things that are positive about it.
For me with that client it was sad, because I was like, Oh, I'm gonna miss some of these things. But then I was like, I don't have to be on call on weekends anymore. You know, like, I don't have to do this. 20 Extra more hours that I can get, you know, all these other, you know, so you got to think about, like, all the winds of the breakup. And I think that's the same with dating, too. And I wish that I had more of that kind of mindset when I was dating, because I think I would have bounced back a lot quicker. Right. In that season of life.
Marlana
So, we have the rejection piece of it. But what about the people that, let's say, are just bad daters in general, how do you go from being a bad business data to a good business data?
Emily
I think it’s; you have to be painfully self-aware. Because a lot of have similarities between being good at dating or being good at a business dating is about knowing yourself enough to know how, what works for you in relationships. So, like you said, you're not going to be the right fit for everybody. Not everyone's a match for you. But if you know, maybe what triggers you, you know what I mean, like, there might be some personalities that are triggers, I know, I've discovered that. And I can tell pretty much immediately meeting someone, I'm like, this isn't gonna work, we're not going to get, we're not gonna have good chemistry, we're not going to align together. So, knowing that is helpful, but then also knowing what is good for you like, what is a complementary relationship or personality for you. And once you know that I think you can master almost any connection, because you'll know when to walk away, and you'll know when to move forward more. So, I think it's more about that self-awareness. It's not about really everybody else. It's more about you.
Marlana
So, Is it snowing? Kind of, you know, what are our absolute? Yes, it's an absolute nose? Our
Emily
I think so. I mean, one of the things that we do sometimes with It's A Match workshops, as we talked about, like love languages, and kind of personality tests, that sort of thing. And it's funny, because you can take the whole love language thing, and that can be translated into business to
Marlana
do that for us.
Emily
Yeah, yeah. So, you know, what, you know what? Your love language, not yours? Yours is? Yeah, so I'm really into spending time with people, quality time, that's huge for me. So, when you know that it's something that you can use to strengthen relationships. So once someone knows that about me, they're like, Okay, well, then one on one time would be really important, right? Like, not being on your phone, you know, while we're in the middle of a meeting, or giving me that quality time. And that's how I connect with people.
The same thing if I was trying to connect with a potential client. And I mean, I don't know how we'd get that, first of all, before we even work together, but let's just say we somehow discovered that about each other. I think that's where you would know, okay, I'm gonna, I'm gonna go that extra step, and make sure I'm giving them that really personal kind of connection. If they're somebody that maybe likes gifts, you know, like, that's another one. And that doesn't mean you're materialistic. Maybe you just really enjoy giving and receiving gifts. That's a really easily translatable in the business realm. Because, you know, you can kind of personalize that don't just give them the Grace Communications logo pin. Unless they're a writer, then maybe that would make sense like a journal, but figuring out what makes them tick, and how you can kind of go above and beyond to personalize it. So, I think that's the gist of all of that when we talk about personality. tests are love languages are any of that, I think it's going beyond just the surface. And it's trying to connect with people on a level that you're not just a blurry face in the crowd. So, I think that's a huge problem with a lot of the dating and a lot of the business dating in our day and age. Honestly.
Marlana
it's interesting to me, because part of my brain kick into, there must be certain ways, let's say when you take on a client to be able to, without asking them, What are your love languages? To find out things like how they want to be communicated to or various things that you can put into place? I would think so you know, how to handle the relationship better.
Emily
Yeah, I think that's where like onboarding and having kind of, like certain routines in place before and after you sign with a client, whatever makes the most sense with your, your business model. But I think you having like, certain discovery questions, and I know we do that, but like exactly one of them is What's your preferred way of communicating? I think asking people what they don't like, Joe hate to be negative. But it's interesting, when you ask that you can kind of here about what they do like, as well. And some people are, it's easier for them to tell what they don't like.
But I think that that's also showing again, that personal touch, like we care about you, you're not just another number, you're not just another client, we really want to invest in your future. It's the same with dating when you think about people that have charm. So that's one of the topics we talk about this charm. And you think about that, and most people that have charm, you think it's like this undefinable thing, it's not necessarily most of the time they make you feel like the only person in the world, they have that, that capacity, and you're just like, I am so amazing, you feel amazing, after you talk to them, you can do that for people with pay attention to them and learning certain things about them, and making it about them and not about you. That's the biggest thing, even if it's you're faking it, just make them feel like the only person in the world.
Marlana
You know, and that's an interesting point, too, because the about page that everybody has on their webs. And so many times people go on and on and on and on and on about them. But really, you’re about page isn't about you, your business isn't about you, it's about how you can serve other people, and what you can do for them, and how you can make them shine and all those kinds of things. And I think it's kind of if you're having a conversation with somebody, or if you're in a relationship with someone, and all you do is talk about you, where's that gonna go?
Emily
And especially if you're in a business where your client serving, you can't. And that's a huge mistake if you do make it all about you. It's kind of like, well, what are you going to do for me, like this is the Emily show you don't I mean, like it needs to be about the client. So. But that's fine to see these huge parallels with dating because I can think of several dates in the past where I didn't ever want to talk to that guy again. Because it he talked nonstop about himself. I don't even know if they knew my name like. Nobody wants to be around somebody like that. It's just off putting. And I think sometimes we can do that when we're nervous. So, I don't think you're always like a jerk. When you do that. I think sometimes you just come off wrong. And that's where like the first impression thing we talked about that sometimes it's matched as well. They kind of go hand in hand with like charm and chemistry and some of that because sometimes things can happen and you're off, you have an off day or an off moment, and you can make just a terrible first impression.
There was the study, it said it takes like eight positive encounters after one negative first impression to build trust. And I was like, I think it was from Harvard. Don't quote me. But I read that, and I was like, Oh my gosh, that's probably true. Because if you think about it, and you meet someone and they do make a bad first impression, you just kind of like it would take a lot to overcome that. So, it makes it even more important that you do everything you can to make a great impression when you first meet people.
Marlana
What are some tips that you can give us that will help us make a good first impression?
Emily
Move! I think it's kind of like well does should do that, but smiling, you know, being like, positive body
language, don't be like closed off doing some research on who you're meeting with. So, you know, what
they like, what they don't like, don't be fake, like, don't pretend like I'm a marathon runner, just who they are, and then they're gonna find out no, you're lying. So, don't lie to make up a whole story but try to find commonalities with that person so you can bond with them. That's truthful.
I will say that because it's like, we've all been there too, with people we've dated not to go back to that where you're like, so that was not true. They said that just, so smiling, you know, figure out what kind of welcome You know, there's certain cultural barriers to like, do you shake hands like that sort of thing. And also, I think being on time, there's certain things like that making sure you're on time, how you present yourself, not that it's the fashion show, but dress appropriately, if you're going to a very expensive fancy restaurant, don't show up in your athleisure. On the same token, though, if you're doing like a hike, or I don't know, something more informal, don't show up in a business. You know, just try to make sure you're being appropriate for the situation.
I think the other thing with that, the biggest thing is the same thing, as chose we talked about its charm, it's not just about you, you can make a great impression. And honestly, they may want to work with you, and you barely even talked about yourself, I've had that happen, where I'll get off the discovery call with a potential client. And I didn't even get to, like sell myself at all, like, I don't know, if they're even gonna want to work with me. And it's surprising how much it doesn't matter. Those are some of the things you think matter, don't, it's more, you made it about them and they got what they needed from it. Right? So, it's kind of figuring that out beforehand, and not being fake, but also being a little strategic with how you present yourself.
Marlana
Okay, so let's say they've decided they're going to enter into this relationship with us. It also would make sense to me that because when we first enter into a romantic relationship, our best foot forward and yes, we spent a lot of time putting in the effort to date them. And then as the relationship progresses, we put in a little less effort and a little less effort, because it becomes familiar and routine. So, what are your thoughts to on continuing to date your client, so to speak,
Emily
I think that's where relationship routines are important. So, you know, just like you do like a date night or something with your significant other, having maybe like for what we do with our long-term clients, or in long term relationships with, we have set like weekly or monthly, or biweekly meetings, we figure out what works best for them. But we make sure that we have that time set aside. So that we can connect with them. If you can't meet in person, virtual, like doing a zoom call, I think is still better than doing just your phone call at all times. But I do think there's something to be said with in person as well. Especially if there's someone who It sounds weird, but like physical touch is one of the love languages, it's physical touch.
People are not just about hugs and stuff, it's the physical environment. So being in their physical environment might be really important to that person. And I'm sure you know, some people who are really, really into like face-to-face stuff. It would be interesting; that might be one of their top love languages. Where are they, they don't feel connected, and unless they can see you, like, you know, even zoom, it doesn't cut it for them in the long run. So figuring out how to make that space to connect, I think is really, really important so that they're like, Okay, I...
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My name is Haydee Irizarry, lead vocalist of Carnivora, solo artist at Zahra Lux, and designer at Haus of Zahra Lux (custom leather and paintings).
Haydee Irizarry studied jazz, classical and contemporary music at Berklee College of Music where she also became lead singer of the metal band Carnivora. Irizarry composes under the name Zahra Lux, offering the listener a glimpse into her soul/R&B side.
www.haydeeirizarry.com
https://carnivora.bandcamp.com/
https://zahralux.bandcamp.com/
www.marlanasemenza.com
Audio : Ariza Music Productions
Transcription : Vision In Word
Marlana
Haydee Irizarry is a musician and artist. She studied jazz, classical and contemporary music at Berklee College of Music, where she also became the lead singer, the middle band carnivore. Welcome, Haydee!
Haydee
Hi, thank you for having me.
Marlana
So, what brought you into music in the first place?
Haydee
Well, when I was growing up, I went to a Lutheran grade school. And I was surrounded by music and this gorgeous piano that my teachers were using and that connection to reading hands every week and seeing that instrument, just shine, sparks something really special in me. And that's how it began as a three.
Marlana
Okay, which explains a lot knowing and seeing your range. So how did you go from church music to metal band?
Haydee
Well, oddly enough, so yeah, starting from three, you know, for my fourth birthday, I was like, I want a piano. And I spent four years from there working on, you know, the hymns and everything. But I wrote in my journal, at eight years old, I want to be a rock and metal singer. So somewhere along the line, and I remember listening to contemporary music, and be like, what's that? That's really cool. Okay, that's the next thing I want to pursue now. So since then, I searched for avenues that would allow me to pursue contemporary music, like the School of Rock, and just listening to albums that were a little bit heavier than, you know, your average him. My favorite hands were always the one and minor anyways, the darker ones.
Marlana
So, because I've seen you literally within a fraction of a second go from singing, Disney and sounding like a Disney princess to death metal, which was amazing to me, because your range is outstanding, your talents are amazing. When you do that, do you have to shift gears in your head as well? Like, is there a process to that?
Haydee
Absolutely! Those two different vocal tones come from different mechanisms of the voice. And it has been trained to be an immediate switch. You know, when I was starting, you're figuring out where the proper placement is. But you know, over time with the music that I've done over the years, that switch has become effortless, but it's definitely coming from a different place that needs to be supported very well. Or else it's, you know, vulgaris forever
Marlana
Did you have to? Or, what was the process to learn that, to learn where those different sounds came from, and how to make them?
Haydee
The process began actually when I was in college at Berkeley. There are a lot of ensembles that supported metal music there. There's a heavy metal opera, metal ensembles, and that I really wanted to pursue, and I saw that as an opportunity to grow in that sound. So honestly, a lot of YouTube and trial and error. Now, the learning is everywhere. But at that time, it did seem more minimal. Like there's the Zen of screaming and YouTube video. So, it was a lot of trial and error for myself because everyone's body is different, and you literally cannot see what's going on, you can really feel it. So, it was a big learning curve. For me.
Marlana
Were there people that you in particular would try and emulate?
Haydee
Oh, absolutely. At the time I was, I am still a big fan of Elisa Y Plus from Arch Enemy, but she was in the Agonist, and I really loved her range as well. I was just me, how do I get that low full sound? How do I get that high kind of like screechy sound, but with it being still full. And then Tatiana from Ginger was being influenced and an Angela the original singer of Arch Enemy, or the second singer of Arch Enemy. Yeah, big fans.
Marlana
Let's say with bodybuilders, you start off and you can lift a small amount, and then as you keep going and going, you can lift more and those muscles get stronger. Is it the same with singing?
Haydee
Oh, 100%. That's actually how I describe it all the time. But it is like, because these are muscles, and in order to grow more muscle, you need to tear and then repair it and grow upon that. So extremely Yeah, when I was first started doing that death metal style, or when anyone first started, they really should only do what I would say is the equivalent of equivalent of like a five-pound weight. And for a short amount of time, you know, just pure vowels, and then just getting the sound first. And then from there, you can do a single word, and then go from there to two words. So, it definitely is like, very similar progression to I would say, bodybuilding.
Marlana
And you mentioned in there that, you know, it's a tearing down and building up process. And I know with bodybuilding, there is that kind of ripping the muscle, so to speak which frightens me when I think about using that same analogy for muscles in your throat. But, is it the same?
Haydee
I have to be honest, my journey with it did feel kind of similar. It wasn't structured by a professional. At the time a developing professional on I was doing a lot of trial and error, like taking my skill set from standard singing and seeing how it applied. And there are a lot of mistakes that people make along the way. But I learned from that. And with my knowledge, I understood like, oh, I made that mistake here. I'm going to pause, rest. And try it again when it's appropriate. Because you're not going to get it right the first time. So that was something that I was so passionate about doing that I was okay. Going through that trial and error, I really felt in my heart like I wanted to pursue that. And I had a lot to say with that part of me in that voice. So, to me Yeah.
Marlana
You know, here's the interesting thing to me, because I've heard you sing Frank Sinatra. I know you do jazz. What's your favorite?
Haydee
My favorite? Oh, honestly, right now, my favorite is blues, and jazz. I love it. And as I'm getting older, my voice is changing and becoming more mature. And I feel really good singing that style of music and growing it and get it because oddly enough, while I was at Berkeley, you know, they're very contemporary jazz school, I went the opposite route learning something really aggressive. So, I'm kind of circling back to that and finding flavanone What about a dealer? I love how vibrant it is, and colorful and the lyrics are fun. And the music is fun. I like you know, big fan hits and just being a little bit more theatrical in that way. You know, do you think
Marlana
it's important to because you kind of mentioned that your voice is changing, and your kind of leaning into that. Do you think that it's important to recognize that about ourselves? As somebody's voice changes or something to it may lend itself to a different style. Do you think it's important to kind of explore those things and lean into them?
Haydee
Oh, absolutely. I'm doing that currently. So, over the pandemic, I close the chapter and one of the bands that grew my death metal stuff. out averse. And I created what I feel like is a stunning album with them. But I was listening to my heart, I was like, I don't feel like I need to do this particular style anymore. I need to trust myself and see where this new journey is taking me. And making that decision, even though it was bittersweet, it has only been fruitful and brought me joy. You know, the last thing I wanted was to not feel inspired with music. And that is a disservice to the folks that you're sharing those songs with. So, I would say absolutely follow that. And, you know, never burn any bridges. Just follow your heart and trust that it's going to be exactly what you want it to be.
Marlana
You know, and I think a lot of people miss that, in the sense that art in so many things is a journey. If you look at Picasso and where he began versus where he finished, two very different places. So, it's leaning into what we're inspired by and where our accounts take us. Because I know you're up in the Boston area, what's the music scene like in that area?
Haydee
It's a very diverse, especially having a school like Berkeley around. There are venues everywhere. They're scattered about, but the music that's being performed is a high quality. And that's very special for the community of Boston to have a gift like that. There are underground punk and metal and slushy Dumi bands and all sudden, there's more posh jazz trios at the cocktail clubs there. You could just find anything if you really, really look for it. I think it's great. You know, I've been happy with it so far.
Marlana
What's been the best part of the journey and the hardest part of the journey so far for you?
Haydee
Of being a musician? The best part of the journey I would say, have been the people that I've met. You know, I think they're also amazing and talented. Like I'm very grateful to meet so many different types of artists doing what I do. sound engineers, makeup artists, models, photographers, videographers, painters, seamstresses, you know, everything that involves the visual arts that all of it I need in my life, you know, so these folks come into my life and they're just so inspiring. So that has been a blessing. The hardest part is always just keeping the faith knowing that you are doing something beautiful and meaningful. In times of these my cat.
Marlana
I heard those little feet Coco cute!
Haydee
She wants to be in the hardest part. What is the hardest part just for her? It's me being away. But the hardest part is Yeah, keeping them safe and knowing that what you're doing is meaningful and contributing to society and not letting anything get you down. You know, those instances happen in their own ways. But they get easier and easier to just dodge. They really do. When you love something so much, it's just like, oh, it's past. You know? That's my answer.
Marlana
So, when you create a song or anything, even a piece of art, do you create it for you or do you create it for potential commercial gain?
Haydee
Well, I'd definitely start with something that I'm feeling internally even though you know, in school, I studied oh, we need to make Commercial Music for this cat food company. There is that mindset of it, but my songs have always just been about feel and how I feel in the moment and what the song is telling me. And what I like to hear. So that probably leads into the commercial aspect. Like, I listen to what's going on. And I think what I want to hear this is this a melody that, you know, makes me happy perform that someone will be excited about. But as you know, with carnivora my ban now, I am starting to think about that accessibility, but not in an overly I don't know, commercial business. Just this catchiness, you know, fun, what's going to be a hook that's going to make us all excited. And make the listener be like, I love that part of the song. I want to have it in my kitchen while I'm doing the dishes, you know, getting better with that.
Marlana
How do you get eyes on you? How do you promote yourself?
Haydee
As an artist?
Marlana
Yeah w
Haydee
Well, there's so many different avenues and you know, I have my online presence, which is a really big factor for a lot of artists, you know, making video clips, reels, you know, cover videos on YouTube, any way to get your stuff out there. Visually, online has been a big thing for me signing up for opportunities, like modeling for club, my friends clothing company, or, you know, helping out here and there. And playing shows, obviously, you know, really getting out there is the most important part, booking gigs, showing up to support other artists see what's going on is really important. And most recently, I got a job in the Boston Arts community. So that has been huge for me to need a more artists and just being around seeing what's going on. There's so many different ways to approach it, and everyone is different. So, whatever makes you feel the most comfortable, but yourself. Yeah, I would say is how you get yourself out there. Just always create and always be a supporter of the creative arts.
Marlana
I don't think a lot of people get that aspect of it also, because so many people look at things where it's a sense of competition, or a scarcity mentality that if somebody is doing something or even from a sense of comparison, I'm going to compare myself to this one or compare myself to that one, but there's so much to be gained by seeing what other people are doing and supporting other people in what they're doing.
Haydee
Absolutely! Yeah. That was a big lesson for me at Berkeley because there was this overflow kind of, in a way kind of too much. Stimulation overload. There's so many opportunities to support everyone. It was kind of a balance, figuring out that balance for you. But that it's yes, it's extremely important to just show up and not see it as a competition because that's not what it's about, you know, music. That's not what it's about. It's about it in being inclusive. And I think about that very often. Now, how I can be more involved in the in supporting others Yeah,
Haydee
do you believe in the together we rise mentality? That you know, if the community helps one another?
Haydee
Yeah, of course, especially being a woman, metal, and rock, we're rising. Everything I see there's just another badass woman coming out of nowhere and I'm like, Yes, that's great. Wow, that's amazing. I love it, I love to see it. I love to see what they're wearing, you know, like, Oh, that's a great outfit, I love to see, you know, what their voice, their messages, and what they're trying to do with their artistry. I think it's amazing. And I do. Yeah. I love that.
Marlana
Because I feel like the presence of women in rock overall has been minimal, and over the years it's seeming to be shifting. Do you think that was for lack of interest in it by women? Or do you think it was lack of opportunity?
Haydee
I would say definitely not lack of interest. Because women have been doing this for a long time, I would say, you know, lack of opportunity and a way to see for people to see it, you know, in the mainstream and regularly. Because I feel like a lot of new women were underground and trying to find a way to get seen. You know, when people talk to me about being a metal vocalist, they're like, I just haven't seen any of this. And it's because it's not really in the forefront. You know, you have to do a lot of digging, or be at that place at the right time. Which, you know, goes back to showing up. Yeah. Who's on this bill tonight at the bar across the street? You know?
Marlana
Yeah. Nice! I know that you work both with the band, but you also do a lot of solo work. How is it different? What do you gain from one versus the other?
Haydee
So, the band fulfills that dream of mine, that eight-year-old dream, I want to be a rock and metal singer, you know, surrounded by distorted guitars and just delays and grooving drums and you know, low end. I love that. Because that's not something that I'm going to create on my own. I need that community of my guys to combine all of our different influences into something that's unique to us, but in a genre that we all love, extremely. So that is different and unique in itself. And I'm like, extremely blessed to be in that setting. But the solo stuff, is everything around that dream. It's another part. It's the classical music that I grew up loving. It's the jazz music. It's the blues music that I grew up listening to with my mom. It's those inspirations and those dreams that I also want to happen, why to nourish, but are more way more personal. And I believe limitless. So, I'm excited to have created a name called Zahra Lux, which is what I put my solo stuff on her to be that creative person and see where I can go with it. So, it's anything and everything I want.
Marlana
So as a musician, what would you like to be known for other than I have to say, if you ever watch honey perform live any kind of rock or metal or whatever, her hair is a whole thing. She really needs a t shirt that says, you know, stand back six feet or what because it's a weapon.
Haydee
That's...
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Randi Karpinia - Sagacity Legal PLLC
Randi Karpinia, CEO of Sagacity Legal, transforms entrepreneur’s ideas and inventions into intellectual property assets that can lead to huge profits. With over twenty years of legal experience, Ms. Karpinia is a recognized expert in all aspects of business legal management with a focus on intellectual property rights and management. At Sagacity Legal, she guides her clients through the legal risks they’ll face now and in the future, so they can focus their time and efforts on the value, expertise, and experience they bring to their business.
https://sagacitylegal.com/
https://www.linkedin.com/in/randikarpinia
https://www.youtube.com/c/AttorneyRandiKarpinia
https://www.facebook.com/sagacitylegal
Whether just starting out or an established business, I can help turn your ideas and inventions into profits. I offer a free IP consultation which can be scheduled directly at https://bit.ly/MeetWithRandi
www.marlanasemenza.com
Audio : Ariza Music Productions
Transcription : Vision In Word
Marlana
Randy Karpinia transforms entrepreneurs’ ideas inventions into intellectual property assets that can lead to huge profits. With over 20 years of legal experience, she is a recognized expert in all aspects of business legal management, with a focus on intellectual property rights and management. Welcome, Randy.
Randi
Thank you for having me.
Marlana
So first let's just ask, what is intellectual property?
Randi
That's a great question. And for many people it sounds very legal, right? Like, oh, that's not for me. But intellectual property is your intangible assets as a business owner. So, the easy answer is there's kind of four categories patents for inventions, copyrights for content literary, trademarks for brands and trade secrets for the things you just want to keep to yourself. And many business owners are so busy, which is, you know, working on the market, they're developing those things. They're developing their brand, they're developing their content, even developing patentable ideas, and they just don't realize because intellectual property sounds something for big corporations, but in reality, it's something that should be in all of our business plans.
Marlana
So, the last one was interesting to me that it can be trade secrets .
Randi
yes. Good one that as lawyers like to use all the time,
Marlana
sorry. But
Randi
of course, that happens in a podcast. The one everyone always likes to use as an example, because we all know it is the Coca Cola formula. Okay, Coca Cola has been around forever. That company, as many I don't know, 1000s, hundreds of 1000s of employees it's had over the years, has managed to keep the actual formula, a trade secret. So, they never protected. They protected it using a trade secret. And the way you do that is legally very, very detailed. You know, it's almost like putting a safe in and locking it up. There are some very important procedures that need to be put in place. But sometimes that is the right thing to do.
Marlana
Interesting. So, let's say an Emeril Lagasse, who has his spice blends or something like that, can that also fall into that category?
Randi
Absolutely! Because you can't patent recipes, almost impossible. So, you can copyright them, but people can change one thing, and it's done. So yeah. But what's important is, if he's giving each say head chef, in each restaurant the formula, it's no longer a trade secret. So, there would have to be processes like I don't want to miss the, for example, I believe I've researched like Coca Cola, so this would be the kind of things he would have to do. No one would have the full recipe.
Marlana
Got it! So, he could provide them, let's say with the spice blend in a container, not the recipe.
Randi
Yeah. This very few needs to know
Marlana
So, at what point? Does something become not a trade secret? How many people would have to know?
Randi
That's the hard part I actually don't recommend. I know, we've gotten off talking about trade secrets, I don't normally recommend. It's an interesting area because the law is pages and pages, and then there's federal trade secret laws. There's a trade secret laws; each country is different. Oh, well, most entrepreneurs, smaller businesses, big corporations can do it. But most smaller businesses wouldn't have. It would be very difficult and time consuming to really keep it a trade secret. And if someone copied it, and then they want to enforce it gets more difficult, right? Whereas if you have a trademark on your brand, if you have a copyright on your content, a patent on your invention, you take that piece of paper and say you're infringing.
Marlana
So now that you brought up copyrights, let's talk about those, because it's something that as a photographer I'm familiar with. I was always under the impression that once something is created, it is copyrighted. Is that the case? What does register it with the copyright office gain us?
Randi
Absolutely! And as a photographer, I've seen your work. Some of your work ensure that this is something you have all the processes, and you work with all the time. So, you are absolutely right. And many people don't know that, so, I'm glad you said that copyright law, unlike any other intellectual property ownership occurs for the originator immediately upon creation. So, if you take a photo unless you're doing a work for hire, and I won't go into all that, but if you are taking a photo, or if somebody is creating a business, or let's say a training course, a lot of people are doing training courses, now that material is automatically copied, the copyright is owned by the originator. The problem is to enforce.
So, it's great, I own the copyright. When this video is finished with podcasts, you own the copyright to it, that's great. But if you don't want somebody to copy it, or you want to enforce, you need to register. So, what does that mean? Okay, maybe I don't register the copyright, because I have so much content, but now somebody's copying me, and they've made it and it's blatant. And I'm willing to put in the financials to stop them, I want to put a stop to it, then you need to register. Now, where the benefit of registering early versus when you find out about an infringement, which was your question. If you are registered, and somebody copies, there are statutory damages. Each and every instance of the copying, plus attorney’s fees, legal fees. If they haven't been copying, and you hadn't registered, and then you go after them, you've filed the registration and then you sue them or you demand, you have to prove actual damages, you have to prove that 10 customers that would have paid you $1,000 Each, whatever it is for that content went to the other person it very, very difficult to prove actual damages. And then you don't get lawyers’ fees, attorney fees either.
Marlana
Okay, so let's say with a photograph, I can produce a raw file or something like that, to kind of prove that I created it in the first place. But let's say you have a song, or you have, you know, like you said a training course, maybe it's easier with a training course. How do you prove that you are the originator with some of these other contents?
Randi
There's no proof needed unless we start talking litigation. Okay, so when you register, and this goes for copyrights, trademarks, patents, you basically raise your hand or your attorney, if they're filing for you and say, I swear that I am the owner, there are no other claimants and copyright terms they can claimants. So, you're telling the government that you are being truthful. Now, what happens is there are laws, and if you commit fraud on one of these offices, it can be as much as jail time. You know, the penalties are pretty high. So, it's sort of like when you get on the stand and you see on TV, they get on the stand, they raise their hand and say, Yes, I'll tell the truth. That's exactly what you're doing. When you're registering your copyright trademark patent. You're telling the government that yes; I am it and they trust you. Until someone says differently.
Marlana
I was just going to say what if somebody else comes along? Like let's say, I use a song because it seems that in the recesses of my brain this has occurred, where somebody says, I created this piece of music or the song and somebody else comes along and says no, that's mine. So how does one prove that or how does that become litigation?
Randi
It's very expensive. Once again, we're talking about copyrights. The just to move, keep paralleling the other since the questions are great. In the trademark world, the trademark office actually during the process of registering a trademark has a period of time called the opposition period. It's a 30-day period when the trademark has been allowed, the examiner says, Yeah, I'm gonna give you this trademark. And anybody can file what's called an opposition, I always tell my clients, it's a baby litigation, because it happens in the Trademark Trial and Appeal Board, where someone can say this, if you get that registration, it's gonna hurt me because either one, I have something similar or two I've been using, and I just didn't register it. And it happens all the time.
Even that, you know, I've said litigation is hundreds of 1000s of dollars, even TTAD proceedings, if they go there, they're definitely like a bit VB litigation, and they can, you know, run anywhere from if you sell 25,000 up to so the cost just really skyrockets. So, you're, you know, the, it's in your best interest to only register what's yours. Unfortunately, there's many people out there both valid lees, like someone may have just happened to come up with a similar song, you know, maybe not exactly the same, the tune kind of sounds the same. Or, you know, a brand name very likely someone in California, someone New York could come up with the same name and be using it. So, it's something that you'd have to look at, as and I'll call it an IP owner on both sides, protect yourself, have the proof of when you created it, and always have the proof somewhere, you know, and then just make sure that what you're using, you're not copying. And that happens a lot. I have a lot of clients who come to me and say, I've developed this content. And oh, my gosh, I'll just make it up. Tony Robbins has this great, you know, thing that he says, and I can't say it any better, and I'm gonna use it and I can't be creative. I always say try to use your own. Because it's the other side. We're trying to protect what we do. But we also want to keep from, you know, getting a demand letter being sued for infringement ourselves.
Marlana
So, let's say we go to trademark something, and you said that there's a period where somebody can come forward and say that, no, I've been using that or whatever. Let's say I want to register a trademark. But you've been using something, how would you know that I've tried to trademark it?
Randi
So, there's something called a clearance, and I don't want to be mean, but it's a little bit interesting. I won't say funny, but it's interesting for me when say a new business owner or someone has just developed a new program. When you come up with a name or a brand, it's really emotional, means something to you. My firm name suggests the legal, means something to me. And when I do a clearance, if the business owner isn't yet using it, and they come to me ahead of time, I always recommend a clearance and you know, we can do a short one, or we could do very worldwide. I'm doing one right now worldwide for a client to try to find out what is the chance of getting that registration. And there are times where I say to the business owner? Yeah, I don't think you should use it because of this or because of multiple, and it's hard for them, because then they have to go back and think of something else. It happens all the time, but before you get out there. A lot of people come to me for trademark after they're getting big, right? Oh, now I see this, I need to protect this. The problem then is if there is somebody out there, they could have to rebrand late, and we could all rebrand, but it's better upfront.
Marlana
So, what's the difference between a trademark and copyright?
Randi
Yeah, people get that confused a lot. I get people coming, I have this name, I want to copyright it. No, you want to trademark it. So, let's go through the three. Trademarks are for names, phrases, logos, they are things that identify your brand. So, if you have, say a phrase that you just happen to use in your messaging, but it's not branded, it's just something you say that would not be trademarked. But if you have that same phrase, and it's at the top of your website, and it's the name of your courses and you use it in a very distinct branding way and you of course know all about branding that would be a trademark. So just having a name, phrase or logo isn't enough, it has to be identifying your brand. Okay? Copyright is for anything in a tangible medium. So, it used to be with a book, we'd say written materials. Well, now it's video, audio, you know, all anything in a tangible medium, you can do. Now, the key with copyright is, you're, you're protecting exactly what you call it deposit. So, there's different names in the trademark of it's a specimen. In the Copyright Office, the deposit, it's really just to prove in the case of the copyright, so if you like, say you use pretend this was a training video, and you said, Randy, can we copyright it? And a year from now, you make some changes, have to copyright it again? So, the registration is specific to exactly what you do. Right?
Marlana
I know, even with images when I have registered them with the copyright office, it has to be that exact title. And, you know, yeah, there can be no variation.
Randi
So yeah, you have that experience. Copyrights are easier to register, in that there's not this major examination to see if there's something out there confusingly similar. That's what the trademark office would use, the patent office would use. There’s a lot more examination to trademarks and patents. But the value of a copyright is the exact thing that you deposit. Okay. And so, then what's a patent? So, a patent is, is there's two kinds of patents. One, let's kind of flow in from trademarks. And copyrights are called a design patent that is for an ornamental look and feel of a product. Now I say a product, but graphic user interfaces go in their icons. So that's where it overlaps with trademarks, right? You could trademark an icon as a brand. But you could also change trademark, a graphic user interfaces or design. So that's one kind of pattern that, again, they all kind of overlap a little bit. The patterns we're used to talking about are what to call utility patents. And these are new and novel useful functionality.
Marlana
Okay, and what does that mean?
Randi
So that means that you came up with either a product or a software, I do a lot of software patents we in our digital world, that doesn't exist anywhere. And you say, Wow, that's, that's really hard. How could that possibly be like the US alone, we're in the eleven, millions in the pens. But I just yesterday mailed a ribbon copy of a pen to a client. And it's, that's where you work with people like me and my firm and others like us who know. And so again, with patents, so I'm kind of following the process. It's a lot like trademarks. And we always look and see what's out there. First, we do a patent search and a legal opinion. And we say, oh, you know, you develop this product, this little niche piece. This is what's let's get it. Let's. So, it's complicated, but I have first time inventors, I love it. You know, like, I have moms who came up with things. Because, you know, they're just because I can't talk about what Yeah, it's, I have right now that are moms who came up with inventions simply to make their life better with their babies, and patentable invention. Um, during COVID It was funny because when COVID hit, a lot of my colleagues at other law firms were talking about, you know, things kind of, you know, people aren't going to come get a lawyer when they're worried about all these other things going on, or they're not in the office or whatever. My business exploded in that like, right after March 2020. Because people just everyday people were coming up with ways to deal with the pandemic, you know, everything from I can't talk about the inventions, but you know, things that allow them to do their function or their service in person while keeping the other people safe, you know, and things like that. And so, there were a lot of first-time inventors that came out of COVID
Marlana
interesting and it seems like if you have something the best bet is just go to an A tourney like you and say, This is what I have, how do I protect it? Because you'll be able to point them in the correct direction
Randi
I've actually had this debate with other law firms. Bigger law firms will say, okay, yeah, I'll write your patent for you, I actually take a different approach in that, I want to first see what's out there. So, anyone who comes to me, the first thing I'm gonna say is, let's see what exists. If it already exists, we're not going to patent it. And you need to know that because if you develop the product, you don't want to be infringing. Right, it's always those two sides of the equation of you want to protect it. But you also don't want to step on someone else's IP because it can be painful.
Marlana
And I know that you offer free IP consultation, is that...
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Rich Chambers - Songwriter/Producer/Musician/Singer
Does anyone still use the term "rock n' roll" anymore? Rich Chambers certainly does. In fact, he specializes in it, bringing us all the fun, excitement, and energy from the early days of rock n' roll in a uniquely fresh way built specifically for the 2020s.
Starting with the 2019 release of his Christmas album, “Santa’s Rockin’ Band,” Rich has been on a roll. His Christmas album produced one single, “the Snow Miser vs. Heat Miser,” which has been streamed more than one million times on Spotify to date. Following this has been six single releases beginning in January 2021, including his film festival award-winning video for his rock original, "I'm So Tired,” which has received accolades in over 50 film festivals across the globe for its hard-hitting social commentary. His most recent release is his guitar-driven version of the Beatles, “I Saw Her Standing There,” which debuted in March 2022 to high critical acclaim.
Rich’s music videos have received a combined total of well over 500,000 views, and his Spotify streaming is clocking in at approximately 25,000 listeners a month and growing. With more single and album releases planned for 2022, Chambers is making his mark as a rock n’ roll artist to watch for. As one music journalist recently said in the FLEX music blog about Chambers, who hails from Langley, British Columbia: "One of Canada's best-kept secrets, Rich Chambers could easily become a household name in a matter of months!"
With bombastic guitars and a vocal style that oozes rock n’ roll. Rich Chambers is giving us something that rock n’ roll has not seen in quite some time—energy and fun. It’s Rock n’ Roll Reimagined.
https://richchambers.com/
https://www.facebook.com/richchambersrocknroll
https://www.instagram.com/richchambersrocknroll/
https://www.youtube.com/c/RichChambers
www.marlanasemenza.com
Audio : Ariza Music Productions
Transcription : Vision In Word
Marlana
Does anyone still use the term rock and roll anymore, or chamber certainly does. In fact, he specializes in it bringing us all the fun excitement and energy from the early days of rock and roll in a uniquely fresh way built specifically for today, which is a songwriter, producer, musician and singer, whose music videos have received well over half a million views and his Spotify at approximately 25,000 listeners a month and growing with more single and album releases planned for 2022 chambers is making his mark as a rock and roll artist to watch for. Welcome Rich!
Rich
Hey! Thanks for that. That's a cool introduction. I like that. Thank you.
Marlana
What makes your story a bit unique is that you're actually circling back around to a passion that you couldn't let go of. So, talk to us a little bit about that.
Rich
Correct. I mean, I'm a middle-aged rocker. And it's like most musicians, I've been doing this since I was a little kid, I picked up the guitar at 10 and started writing songs of fourteen. And that's where I got absolutely hooked, songwriting was what did it for me. If it weren’t for songwriting, I would just be a hobbyist guitar player and singer, but you put songwriting in the mix, and I went nuts with it. And that's been one of my huge passions is but like many, you know, life journeys, things happen. And when I got out of high school, I was going to be the next rock star. A few cheesy days later, and about a year into that I realize, oh, this is going nowhere. I didn't want the smartest things I could have ever done when I went back to school. And then I pursued went further on as a kid very barely passed high school, I finished a bachelor's degree, a master's degree in it for a while was actually toying with PhD work. And it's pretty good considering I barely finished high school. So, I’m a huge massive advocate of education.
Along the way, I played in bands, I had one band and we together for 15 years, start a family, all that kind of thing. And then I got to that point where most people are starting to ramp up for retirement. You know, I'm looking in the mirror and I'm saying to myself rich, this is your passion and this your entire life. But you've never really gone full bore into it. Why aren't you doing that? And I didn't have an answer for myself. So, at that point, I decided right then and there, I'm going to go full in. I'm going to give it all I've got. So, I often laugh, you know, when people hit their midlife crisis, the stereotypical image is the guy who you know, gets the young girlfriend and the convertible. Well, I bought the guitar and started singing songs. So that's how I sort of come full circle. My big thing, Marlana, is I sort of looked in that proverbial metaphorical mirror, we always look at and say, What am I doing with my life? And I said, I don't want to grow old with regrets, you know, so I figured what am I got to lose chasing my passion? Regrets The only thing I had to lose? Who wants regret anyway?
Marlana
Yeah, let me ask you this, because I was recently having a conversation with a musician who is in her early twenties. And she said that someone had said to her, Well, what's your plan B? And I said to her, tell them that you don't have one, because if you have a plan B in the back of your head, then there's always that default though, there's always that what if I don't make it? But if there is no plan B, and this is all there is, then you have to go forward, and you have to make it work. What are your thoughts on having a plan B or not?
Rich
Alright, it's a great question when I just think every musician has it. Because I was faced with that to an interesting story. I had a high school counselor. Like I said, I barely passed High School. I remember seeing my high school counselor’s mandatory all season. And she said, What do you wanna do with your life? Music? That was my answer. And she said exactly what you just said, Well, what's your backup plan? Music, she said, You have to have a backup plan. And then she went on to explain why you should do this and do that and everything else. And I thought, I don't want to listen to this woman. I was out there. And I thought, so we're seeing a high school counselor could have said, and it's the irony is that later in my working career, I became an academic advisor at University where I advise students on career choices. And one of the things I always said as a go after your passions, and I said, whether it's drama, music, engineering, computer science, chemistry, there will be a job for you. Go after your passions and make your passions define your career by what you want to do. Don't let a career define you.
That's the sort of route everybody gets into. And that's where this plan B comes from. People say all musicians don't make money. Lots don't have lots do and the ones that have a plan to be a musician, make money. There's no two ways about it. I mean, people can say, well, rich, you're sort of a bit of a walking orcs oxymoron because you have a regular job at a university right now and you're pursuing this music thing. But what is my true career? I have a job and I have a passionate career. So that's how I look at it. So, your plan B isn't necessarily a Plan B, a plan your plan A is I want to do music. And what people call Plan B actually is maybe it's in my case, it's a job. It's not a plan B, it's just what I do for a work on a day-to-day basis to pay the bills while I pursue the music. So, you're absolutely right, I totally agree. Because as soon as you put a plan B mindset in your head, it becomes a default becomes easy to fall back on that you're not going for it.
Marlana
And I think sometimes, you know, you do the things that you have to do to do the things that you want to do.
Rich
Absolutely!
Marlana
But also, it's interesting to me, because as somebody who also works in one of the arts, when we talk to people, and they say, oh, I want to be a computer scientist, or I want to be a doctor, or they're never usually asked, What's your plan B, it's the people in the arts that are usually asked What's…
Rich
Your right, you know, it's interesting to be a doctor, I work in education, I know what it takes to be a doctor. Oh, my goodness, you have to be the creme de la creme of your students. To get there. You have to be an amazing student. Most people can't do it. But yet, you're absolutely right. If somebody says I want to be a doctor, they can be a C student, I'll tell you the actual fact of a C student want to be a doctor. Sorry, right now, you're not going to make it. That's the reality. But people don't say that. They say, Oh, good for you go for it. Well, you know, so it, people miss it. And we come I come back to what I say often is, like I said, my years of academic advising, helping students and people figure out career paths. Don't define yourself by your career, you define your career. So, you don't want to be a doctor or a lawyer. You want to do what your passion is. And most people don't know there's so many different careers out what often a bit of a tangent, but it's so important in development and plans and goal making.
There are so many careers out there. For instance, I used to tell students, okay, look at the there's the Bank Tower, and Canada's huge bank is like the RBC or Scotia Bank. These are big banks, I say, look at the Scotiabank tower in Vancouver where I live. And it's you know, twenty stories, and thousands of people work there and say, who works at what careers are there, the students will look at me say banker. So that's one career. You're not looking at the accountant, you're not looking at the ITP you're not looking at the project managers. And Phyllis goes on and on and on. And people don't realize that there are so many different jobs out there. So, the worst thing anybody can do is I want to be this no, do what go after your passion. If your passion happens to be medicine, as a lot more than just doctor you can be if you're passionate actors of your writing, there's a lot more than just a novel writer you can be if your passion happens to be music, there's lots more than just a musician you can be you define it. And that comes back to your plan B thing. There is no plan B, your plan A is I love music. I'm going down music path. I love planning.
Marlana
So how do you manage the two things that you're doing? Because you do work a full-time job right now. And you are following this passion? So how do you? How do you do both?
Rich
Whoa, crazy. Well, that's partly why I'm doing it now. Because if you go back 15 years, when I had toddlers at home, there's no way I could have done it. I mean, and I was also pursuing a master's degree, doing a master's thesis while working full time and two young kids at home. So that was the choices I made at that point in my life. I kept it’s all about choices, career goals and paths in life, things are all about choices. And I chose to do that. And no regrets whatsoever because I raised two wonderful young boys. And you know, I got cheap, the master's degree, which was put on the bucket list. And I'm so happy and proud of that. But now I have more time open and it's time to make a different decision. And you know, I get frustrated with people. And once people do it, I mean, I get it, you get stuck in a rut, you say, Oh, I can't do that. I need that. All you need is a drive determination and a plan. Do it in some ways. It's that simple.
Marlana
Yeah. So how are you getting traction for your music?
Rich
That's the interesting thing. Boy is it takes a lot of work. Wow. It's one of those things where I started. I mean, I started with just a bit somewhat just a pipe dream, my guitar, and some songs. And I always had full belief in my songwriting, not necessarily some of my production levels, and my singing and guitar playing has taken a lot of years to work at it. But when I was a young boy and I first started writing songs at full belief, and I come back to I haven't said this yet, but having belief in yourself is massive, because in any career endeavor, no matter what it is, you're going to come up with roadblocks and you got to have that belief in yourself to get over around those roadblocks. So, when I started this huge music push you know as a hugely, I was definitely a neophyte I'm What am I doing? I went on and checked all the Google boards and Reddit and everything else. What's everybody saying? How do you do this and how do you do that? And I started by basically releasing a Christmas single Christmas song. And part of that and by logic there was Christmas sells itself. So, you know if you do a good version or Frosty the Snowman that helps you right there, which actually ended up being a smart move on my part. So, I've won a Christmas song up to 1.2 million streams and Spotify last three years.
So that's pretty cool. And that's because of Christmas. And people familiar with the song. I didn't write it though. So, I My goal was to be original music. So, I piggyback use Christmas to start, and I love Christmas too. So, it wasn't really that big. So unfortunately.
And so, I started Christmas. And then from there I by pure Fluke Marlana. It was two years ago, January 2020, through the middle of the pandemic. And I'd written a song over the Christmas holidays after I released my Christmas album, called I'm so tired, and all sent January 6 hit and I finished a song two or three days before January 6, and people storming Capitol Hill, I'm sitting watching TV that most people can't believe what I'm seeing is this actually happening in our backyard. And I realized I finished writing, producing a song five days earlier called I'm so tired. And it was it was, and I realized how prophetic And how fitting the song was to what's actually happening. In our culture, there maybe you know, maybe it's tapping in some subconscious thing or something. But at that point, I decided I'm going to release the song, but I want to I want to put my statement and what I feel is going on. So, I made a social video, I went on to social media, when the Facebook, YouTube everywhere else upload these clips from all the unrest and going on the protests and what happened in Portland, all the protests in Washington and people protesting in the streets are so many different protests, and I dove in a company how much stuff was out there. And I made this what I call a social video, called I'm so tired with all these clips.
I'm super proud because in the last two years since at least I've received accolades from over fifty film festivals on this video, because it's so socially cutting and hitting. And the amount of feedback I got when I released that in January of 2020. I was like, Wow, maybe I'm onto something, you know, I plan to release a Christmas album. And my initial plan was a year later releasing another album, and I thought I'm gonna start releasing singles. So that started in like any plant, it's evolved, it's changed as I've gone, it has to because you have to be ready to change on anytime and adapt to the environment that's happening around you. So, I start releasing singles. And I started making contacts and some radio airplay, and it started and I through trial and error, you find who the good promoters or the bad promoters are. And I think a lot of artists, I have promoters that were getting me robot plays on Spotify and YouTube and you trash them, and you go for the ones that get you legitimate place trial and error. And now I have a network of writers that enjoy my music, and they'll write for me, I have a network of promoters that will throw it on Spotify...
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David Baer, The Prepared Group
David is a veteran direct response marketer who started his career selling classical music subscriptions online at the dawn of email marketing. Since then, his copy and strategic guidance have earned his employers and clients millions in sales.
Through his consulting work, David has served clients in industries ranging from Theater & Opera to Wine to Health & Wellness to Professional Services.
David hosts the podcast, More Perfect Marketing, where he discusses the importance of creating marketing systems to achieve consistent and predictable business growth.
David, along with his partner Ken Cook, runs the marketing strategy firm, The Prepared Group, which licenses a marketing strategy consulting process to marketing agencies and service providers.
Together they co-authored the book “Systematic Advisor Marketing: How Financial Advisors Can Strategically Attract, Convert, & Retain More Clients." In addition, David has authored two books on small business email marketing.
moreprefectmarketing.com
thepreparedgroup.com
www.marlanasemenza.com
Audio : Ariza Music Productions
Transcription : Vision In Word
Marlana
David Baer of The Prepared Group is a veteran direct response marketer whose copy and strategic guidance have earned his employers and clients millions in sales. David has served clients in industries ranging from theater and opera to wine to health and wellness to professional services, is also an author and the host of the podcast More Perfect Marketing. Welcome, David!
David
Hello! Thanks so much for having me.
Marlana
So, first of all, define marketing for us, because I know sometimes there's a little confusion for people about what marketing exactly is.
David
Sure! I think there's a lot of definitions, the ones that I tend to gravitate toward. And it really depends on the situation that I'm in, the way that I'll describe it. But it's really the mechanism for helping somebody who needs a solution. It's the mechanism that you use to help them determine whether your solution is the right one for the issue that they're dealing with, the problem that they have, or the desire that they want to fulfill.
Marlana
Love it. Okay, so then how do we make our marketing more effective?
David
Okay, well, that is a big question. And I think part of the ways that I would answer that is really, to go beyond what we mean by more effective, what are we trying to ultimately accomplish in the business, and that might be more revenue, it might be a larger client base, it might be that we want to simplify the business that we have. And depending on the goals that we ultimately have for the business, that's going to define how we make it more effective. And the sad truth is that this is a part of marketing and the professional marketing world that often gets overlooked, even by those who are marketing professionals, and that's the challenge. So, I'm kind of on a mission to undo that and help people think a bit more strategically about what am I actually trying to accomplish with this marketing, so that there's less waste and more effective and efficient marketing?
Marlana
Yeah, because you know, you are the first person I've ever heard, say that to basically start with the end goal in mind, and it will affect everything else that you're doing, which baffles me, because that seems to be the most logical way to start.
David
It ought to be, but you know, we're in a society where we're looking often for quick answers. And I think that we've trained ourselves to look for a simpler solution. And what I've just proposed here, it's more involved, it's more complicated, and a lot of us don't have or don't want to have the bandwidth to do the necessary work to really figure out the types of things that are going to be most effective in their marketing.
Marlana
So, is the approach different if we are a solopreneur versus a small business versus a large company?
David
Oh, yeah, I would say to a certain extent that there's more complexity, the larger the organization, and there are exceptions, there are large organizations that do have a very simple structure, right? They deliver one thing, or there's very consistent process in place. But for the most part, yes, there is going to be more complexity, the larger you get, the more stakeholders that are involved, the wider the range of types of people you can serve.
I'm getting in the weeds here, but let me explain what we mean by this quickly. Most businesses have no business trying to market to everyone. I'm sure this is a concept that most of your listeners have heard at some point, right? If you're marketing to everyone, you're marketing to no one. What I mean by this is ultimately you want to be as specific and directed in the messaging in the specific solution, the specific problem you're trying to address. Let's take an industry, I've worked a lot in financial advisors, okay. You cannot easily speak to a brand-new married couple or a couple that is about to have their first child in the same way that you would speak to someone who is very close to retirement and hasn't made the necessary plans to, you know, live out their years and not have any money worries. And so, what I mean In by more complexity and marketing, it may be a simple business, but you may have more opportunities to speak to all of those different audiences. And because you have to speak to all of them differently, you may choose Okay, well, I'm going to start with one, and I'm going to get that up and running. And then I'm going to move on to the next and move on to the next move on to the next. That's no different, regardless of whether you are a solopreneur, or whether you are a large organization. Most businesses, regardless of size, however, fail at this.
Marlana
So let me ask you this, because it seems easier to carve out a niche or a target audience and things like that, if you are a business, per se, but let's say you are an artist, or something along those lines, where perhaps the problem you solve isn't as clear, or a musician whose and the problem you solve isn't as clear, how do you effectively market that kind of a service?
David
Okay, so if you're an artist, you're very much in the same boat as any business that is really trying to market to someone around fulfilling a desire rather than solving a problem. You might see this in the travel industry. Well, I used to be an arts marketer, right, I used to sell classical music subscriptions as a marketer. And, you know, I wasn't necessarily solving the problem of somebody's lack of access to performance, or to the beauty of the experience, right? What I was really marketing was about fulfilling the desire to improve oneself or to educate oneself or to, to create a new experience, right? So, there's a lot of personal development kind of psychology built into the types of marketing that artists might consider.
Marlana
Interesting!
David
And look, there's also a business involved here. Very often, you have to think about the mechanisms of the business. So is an artist marketing directly to the end consumer, or the marketing to the middleman, you know, in a gallery, for example. And so, there's some positioning that you have to think about as well, because you need to approach it as any other business approaches it, which are what is going to move me closer toward making that sale.
Marlana
Got it? So, I know you talk a because this is a lane that you travel very well. And I know you talk about effective copy in your marketing. So, what role does that play? And how do we make it more effective?
David
Well, I think there's a few things to think about. I was just talking about tapping into the psychology of the person you're trying to get in front of. And remember that at the beginning, you asked me about, you know, what is marketing? I said, it's the mechanism to connect the desire and what you have to offer? Well, we tend as consumers, when we're looking for something or when we know we have a problem, or we know that we have really the problems that we have, from a marketer's perspective. I would say they're more symptoms, right? We don't know that. You know, though, my trouble sleeping, right? isn't really that I can't sleep it's really that I have anxiety or it's, you know, that I drink too much too late in the evening, and I'm getting, you know, waking up all night because of that, right?
As the people who are selling the solution, we might know that, but we can't start there. In our discussion of, hey, I got a solution for you. If you want to, you know, help resolving your sleeping trouble. Well, just drink less take my course on how to you know, that's not what we do. Right? We need to think about where the person’s mind is at, at the moment in time where they're going to be willing to listen to what we have to say. And then we can move them from that point to where we inevitably want to introduce our opportunity or solution or service etc. copywriting is a key part of that and understanding a what they need to be hearing and be what you need to say in order to move them are, you know, mostly carried out through the mechanism of copywriting.
Marlana
Okay, because it seems like we may know what the solution is, but it's not the solution that people may believe that it is. So, you're need to take them on a little bit of a journey to get them to what the solution really is, is that correct?
David
So let me give you an example. In our business, we now train marketers to think differently to think strategically as opposed to tactically, right. So, somebody who might have been in the business of selling Search Engine Optimization, or Facebook advertising services, we now help them approach this by saying, Okay, do you really need to be doing search engine optimization, or Facebook ads, I may not end up serving you. But I'm going to now guide you through the process of thinking through where all the revenue opportunities are in your business, what the right way to connect, etcetera, might be. One of the things that we teach them about is this concept of symptom versus problem that I've just demonstrated a moment ago, but the story that we give them to relate to their clients, and we give them lots of examples, because this is a conversation every business owner needs to hear is okay. Imagine you have a headache. And you have two solutions that are that are, you know, put in front of you by experts, right? One solution is Oh, take this aspirin, it'll, you know, it'll help your headache go away. And the other one is, well, let's crack open your skull and do some brain surgery. Because clearly, you know, there's some problem in there now. One of them is right, one of them is probably wrong, right? But how likely is the person with the headache? To raise their hand, say, Oh, yes, crack my head open, please. Right? That may be the right answer. But it's not presented at the right moment in time for that person to reset receptively say, Yes, I'm ready to move forward with that. We need to inch them along until that presents itself as the right answer logically in their mind.
Marlana
So let me ask you, this is an effective approach to tackle their symptom and then lead them into the root of the problem. Because that, to me, is kind of what you just illustrated, okay, the headache is the symptom of something, but it may not be the root of the problem.
David
Yeah. So, we have another business that we are co-owners in, which is a marriage coaching business. And we do exactly that, in that business. Our partner who runs that really is focused on Well, we know that you're in a situation where you are, you know, a month or less away from divorce. And you really want to find a way to solve and save the marriage. And then what he presents behind the curtain, once they say, Yes, I desperately want to do this is something that is unexpected but makes a lot of sense to them. And it taps into an age-old principle in marketing, that I think is, you know, runs across the board. Again, no matter what size no matter what type of business, whether you are an artist, or whether you are selling widgets, it's that we buy on emotion. And then after we buy on emotion, we justify using logic,
Marlana
right? So, should we be thinking then in terms of funnels, per se, where the first thing that we put out from a marketing standpoint is addressing the symptom, but then we go through to the problem we really solve?
David
Yeah, and you know, you bring up the word funnels, and that's a word that I think has captured people's minds these days in terms of like, you know, going to a website, entering your name to get some free gift, and then you get moved through a process. And while the medium may be new is, that's the process that we've gone through for years, whether it's attracting somebody into a storefront, and then having a conversation that moves them in a certain direction or responding to an ad in a newspaper. That is really what you're describing when you're saying, Well, we start where they are, and then we move them to the next place that that is going to either help them determine Yes, this is for me. No, this isn't for me.
Marlana
I looked at some of your copy and things like that. And I know you talked about that there's three funnels that every business should have, what are those?
David
those are really all about what I was saying earlier, we need to figure out what we want to accomplish with our marketing. And invariably, many businesses are looking to a attract brand new customers into their business. And so that's funnel number one, we have a funnel that is intentionally designed to move somebody who is already a customer into a recurring customer, or some other sort of upgraded customer. And there's lots of different ways that that plays out, depending on the business. And then the third funnel is really about building mechanisms for referral. So, the most expensive investment in acquiring a customer is acquiring a brand-new customer, the least expensive for pretty much any business. The way to acquire customer is to get a referral or get a recommendation or an introduction from somebody who is already a customer of yours, who's a champion of yours. And they simply are asked, Hey, can you go find other people like you? And so those are the three distinct funnels that I think really almost any business could benefit from?
Marlana
Which one do you think is the most overlooked?
David
I think both. The second and the third are incredibly overlooked. The first one is the most obvious, and the one that everybody really focuses on, which is I need new people all the time, where's that, where's the next new person? And to a certain extent, businesses think that they have a process in place to orchestrate referrals to manage that. But in fact, most don't. And here's the evidence on that. Whenever, back in the days, when I was at networking events, you know, we would have lots of people say, Oh, I don't need marketing. And since when I was a marketing service provider, so they wanted an excuse to run away from me. I don't need marketing; my business runs on referrals. And so, my answer would be something along the lines of oh, that's great. So, tell me, how does your referral system work? And they would start telling me and, you know, usually it was something along the lines of Well, I do good work, and people appreciate that, and therefore they refer me. And then I would follow up with oh, so there's some form of, you know, sort of documented process that you and your staff go through to ensure that you get referrals? Is that correct? How does how does that work? No, no, but we're just good at it. And people refer us. Oh, so it's opportunistic. And then it's not consistent is what you're saying? Right. I think, where most businesses lie right now is they think that they have something in place to actually get those referrals, but they lack consistency in that lack process.
Marlana
Let me ask you this, when you are a solopreneur or an independent entrepreneur? How much do you believe should be automated in your process? And how much do you believe should be personal touch? In your process? What do you think either one helps your marketing, or your referrals more?
David
Yeah, I think if your business is built on personal relationship, that the personal relationship should always be at the forefront of the way that you're doing your marketing. However, that doesn't mean that it can't be aided or assisted by automation. Here's what I mean by that. You might have a system or a mechanism to follow up with people on a regular basis based on how long they have been in a relationship with you the first time that they bought from you or, you know, the first who knows if the first encounter that I had an anniversary of their first purchase from you, for example, right. And you're not going to be able to remember all of those things and put them all in a you know, a diary and stay on top of it. So, automation could help simply by having a database that tracks Okay, the first time they bought from me was, you know, November 13. And I want to reach out to them a month later, six months later, a year later. Let's send myself a reminder the day before, or let's put something automatically on my calendar. So, it's an activity that I am then going to absolutely engage in and So its automation supported, but manually fulfilled.
Marlana
Makes sense. Let's say, I am starting out in an industry brand new
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L. Frederick Dudek
Prosperous Ventures, LLC
When Frederick Dudek is not turning ideas into millions of dollars in global sales, the award-winning author, speaker, and top sales executive spends his time inspiring others to achieve their highest business goals. Now you can receive the benefit of Frederick’s mentorship and experience through his book, Business $uperfans.
Born in rural France, Frederick spent summers on his grandfather’s vineyard in France, where he developed a love for French wine. As a youth, he showed a strong aptitude for engineering and competed in drafting and design competitions. After winning numerous engineering awards, he became a draftsman working on numerous automotive projects. He was selected to design the spot weld guns for the 1982 Ford Escort car. That led to Frederick joining the emerging computer-aided design (CAD) and computer-aided manufacturing (CAM) industry, in which he quickly climbed the ranks.
While working for a CAD/CAM company as an application engineer, an opportunity presented itself that enabled Frederick to transition into sales. It was the right decision, and he never looked back. In the thirty-plus years Frederick has been selling, he has earned a reputation as the go-to guy for small companies that want to expand their business domestically or internationally. This role has allowed him to travel to over thirty countries and counting. When abroad, Frederick’s favorite pastime is to go exploring for hours, not to mention enjoying some of the local cuisine and fine wines.
Frederick is a former runner and athlete. Today, you can find him hiking various trails with his significant other, Kiley Kaplan. When not writing, selling, speaking, or exploring, he is cooking or building things. The next thing on Frederick’s bucket list is learning to sail and to continue the exploration of countries and their unique cultures.
https://FrederickDudek.com
https://BusinessSuperfans.com
www.marlanasemenza.com
Audio : Ariza Music Productions
Transcript : Vision In Word
Marlana
Frederick Dudek is not turning ideas into millions of dollars in global sales. The award-winning author, speaker and top sales executive spends his time inspiring others to achieve their highest business goals. Now you can receive the benefit of Frederick's mentorship and experience through his book Business Superfans. Welcome, Frederick.
Frederick
Good morning!
Marlana
So first, explain to us what exactly is a superfan? How would you define that?
Frederick
Let's think of a sports team. So, the best way I can explain that is, we've all watched football or European soccer or baseball and stuff, and we'll see the fan that's in there. And it's got their faces painted. They got the jerseys on they got the hats; they got the banners; they got the bumper stickers on their cars. That's a superfan. And, you know, they're enthralled and just energized, and their energy's contagious, and they're promoting their team? And if you think about it, is the sports team paying them for that? No. So are they making money off for their merchandise? Of course.
So, they're getting free publicity. They're getting somewhere that it's talking about the team and all that PR, they're getting other people sucked into the team to watch the team and everything else. So, the idea came about through my sales experience for many, many years was Why can't a business apply the same methodology to create their own superfans for their business to become promoting them? So, you know, there's people talk about brand advocates? Well, you know, I look at it as Okay, brand advocates cool. But a super fan is super cool. Because it's in my mind is supersedes the advocate, because they're in a sense fanatic of the business, and they're going to be promoting it, talking about it telling all their friends and family and everything else.
Marlana
The term ride or die kind of came to mind. So then how do we create these for our business?
Frederick
Well, that's a really good question. Because a lot of people have written books on client retention, client engagement, and all that aspect. But really, if you think about it, that's a silo. Okay, it's strictly about that. Then there's other people that talk about employees and employee motivation, employee retention, and all that stuff. But really, that's another silo. And then nobody talks about the business, what I call business alliance partners, which are complementary businesses that complement one another. Best example I can say, is a painting person and a flooring person, they kind of go together.
So, what I did is, through a multitude of research was that I combined all three, because at the end of the day, all three are intertwined. And that's really the difference. And so business superfans talks about how to engage those, that group of people, which is really how to handle your customers, how to make sure your employees are engaged, how to make sure your business alliance partners are motivated and everything else. Because if you think about it, let's say I'm a painter, and I'm giving the flooring guy a ton of referrals, but they're not going, they're not reciprocated, and a flooring guy's not giving me anything back. After some point in time, I'm gonna say, You know what, this relationship isn't working. It's one sided.
I talk about that kind of stuff. It's the same thing with the employee. You know, Sir Richard Branson says it the best, you know, if you take care of your employees, they'll take care of your customers. So, if you got an employee that's going to do the flooring, the guy that did referred you, the painter to refer to visit and does a poor job, not only does it reflect negatively on your company, but it also reflects negatively on the painter. And so that's the things I talk about is, you know, things to do to motivate people and to engage them but it's a lot more than that. It's not just that part of it. I'm just keeping it short.
Marlana
Is it a different strategy to create these superfans to depending on the category they fall in, whether their business alliance or an employee or customer?
Frederick
yes or no. Because one of the things I did in the book, and here's the cover of the book. I've got to kind of go through some of the chapters. So, one of the chapters is, it all begins with prospecting. So, if you're a new business, how do you go and find new clients? How do you create those relationships with those clients? So that one is focused on really getting business? Because if you don't have business, well, Russ doesn't matter. Right? Then I get into the follow up, why is it super important. And the follow up is with clients as well as employees. So, if you want to make sure that they're doing the things that they need to be doing, either they're motivated and things like that, follow up with them.
Same thing with the business alliance partner, how did the project go? That kind of stuff. So, then we get into, and this is really what I think is really important. One of them is thank you builds a bond of trust. And a lot of businesses forget to say thank you. And people don't say thank you three employees, enough. People don't say thank you for, you know, to their business partners enough. And it's such overlooked, you know, and one of the things I talked about in the book is especially for like the home improvement industry, you know, they're notorious, I mean, we've all had worked on our houses or places, and we never hear from them again. They're gone. I mean, we had a cleaning person that came in, about three or four months ago, we never heard him again, like, they'd never came back reached out and says, Hey, you know, it's been three months. You know, you're interested in having a house cleaned again, zero, nothing. It's mind boggling. So, thank you to me is paramount.
Marlana
Let me ask you something in that, do you think that gratitude and follow up are the same thing, or they're just kind of two sides of a coin?
Frederick
There are two sides of a coin. And I'll talk about gratitude in a moment. Then the other part is, you know, get personal with birthday greetings. You know, it's amazing, you know, birthdays are someone's very important day. And if you acknowledge something, and I had this happen, you know, to where I sent somebody's birthday card, and it was the only card they received. And they contacted me with such emotion that was it was just a blew me away, that they were so grateful that I actually thought of them and sent them a card.
I'm coaching a company right now. And today, at lunchtime, I'm going there, we're celebrating an employee's birthday. And, you know, the owners asked me, well, we wanted to have a business meeting afterwards. I said, Are you nuts? You know, this is a birthday, it has nothing to do business, keep it light, keep it fun, let’s acknowledge the person because as soon as you switch from birthday, okay, now we're gonna have a meeting, you just negated the whole birthday. And they went like, oh, never looked at it that way.
So, that aspect of the other one is creating an environment of appreciation. One of my personal quotes is that people will crawl through broken glass for appreciation and recognition. Tell me I'm wrong.
Marlana
Yeah, and I don't think we get it nearly enough.
Frederick
No, we don't. And it's the little things you acknowledge somewhere in the little things, and they go, Oh, wow, and they'll do more. It's recognizing your customers. It's recognizing your team. It's recognizing a business partner that they did a great job. And so, you recommended them, they killed it on a project. Hey, you know, you just made me look good by doing a great job because I recommended you thanks in oncome grateful you knocked it out. So that's important. And the next one is given them what they crave, recognition. So, if I turn around and say, “John, thanks a lot for the effort that you put in on that stuff.” All right, that's fine. John feels great. If I turn around and say, “Hey, everybody, I want to take a moment and I want to acknowledge John for doing this particular project.” Now, I've done it from everybody. I've edified John. Everybody realizes that I appreciate, and I recognize John So they're gonna go, oh, man, I'm gonna do more so I can get that exposure.
Marlana
You know, it's interesting too, because recently, I know something that happened that I'm even recognizing what somebody brings to the table, or the talent somebody brings to the table, or the skill set that somebody brings to the table. Acknowledging that and recognizing that, really goes a long way, instead of, if you're a business owner, thinking that you made it all by yourself, because nobody makes it all by themselves,
Frederick
It takes a village. Those are a couple of things, thank you, the appreciation, the recognition, it's easy to do cost nothing. And the return on that investment is unsurmountable. So, you know, the next thing I get into here is retention saves you money. And, you know, it's basically, you know, the cost of onboarding, the new customers, phenomenal, you know, in cost. Same thing with employee, I mean, if you think of the revenue that's lost, by losing an employee, not only the lost revenue, you'd lost revenue of training that employee, but you also lost the revenue and productivity of the other employee that's training the new employee that nobody ever thinks about.
That's monstered, it's the same thing, if you have a business alliance partner, and that relationship goes out the door, you know, your general contractor, as an example, and you lose your electrician, and you need an electrician. So now you gotta find somebody gotta make sure to qualify, and all that stuff. And so, your project falls behind the minutes. So, it's important to do things that are going to retain the team that you've got put together. And then I get down to is, go beyond expectations with unexpected extras. And this is something that blows my mind how people don't take the time to do that little something extra.
I'll share a story that I put into the book. That is when I really realized the power of it. And it happened to me, we ordered some food from a restaurant, we lived in a nice condo area, and right across the street as a whole shopping restaurants place that was pretty close. We sold our car for eight months and walked everywhere. I go there to pick up the food, no food. So, the hostess gets the manager, and this was called blah, blah, blah. And he says, okay, I'll take care of, we'll get it. So, they goes, and they make the food comes back in buys. And it says go set the bar or buy a beer while you're waiting because you know, it's a mess up. So soon, no comes back to food. We'll look at the food. And Murphy's law comes in. Not only did the order wasn't done in the first time, one of the orders is wrong. You know, so it's like it's tumbling. And so, I'm sitting there, and he goes, Oh my god, he goes out personally make sure that it's time, so I sit there he goes and gets the food comes back. And he says Hang on a second, he runs back, and he brings back on dessert, or he goes to desserts on us and says okay, how much sorry for the food. And he goes, nothing was completely screwed it up. Matter of fact, he goes, here's a couple of tickets for five hours, two of you two tickets for five hours off for both of you for your next meal. And it was just like, No, that was, you know, the unexpected extra. And we're super fans of that place. We call her all the time, because the food's phenomenal, but the service and that little extra that he did. That means a customer for life.
Marlana
Yeah. And it also seems that by doing that he also showed appreciation to you. So, in doing all of this, it may be obvious, but it may not be. Let's say we have alliances with various people or businesses. At what point do we cut our losses without creating an issue with that business or company? Let's say if we were working, you know as an Alliance Party.
Frederick
Very good question! At some point in time, I would say that probably the best way to do that is to just say that you're going in a different direction. And so, it's a nice subtle way of just saying, you know, I'm changing my business model a little bit, and someone would be going in another direction. And I appreciate all your efforts.
Again, appreciate you're grateful for the partnership and stuff. But you know, I need to grow, and the growth is taking me to a different direction. And people will appreciate that and...
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Lori Peters
Ocean Studios
Emerald Escape (music)
Previously a member of Multi-Platinum & Gold selling, two-time GRAMMY® Award-nominated artist, Skillet. Performed on several #1 hit singles. Over 30 years of drumming experience including studio recording, live performance, worldwide touring, & drum instruction. My husband, Chris, and I own and operate Ocean Studios. It's here where we have the capability to professionally record & edit my live drum sessions. We use Pro Tools Studio and have mixing capabilities using analog hardware and plugins. We also write, produce, and record our own music available on Spotify under the name Emerald Escape. I also enjoy volunteering for the non-profit organization called Breast Cancer Can Stick It! Foundation. I'm a 4 year breast cancer survivor, drummer, and rocker!
https://soundbetter.com/profiles/69296-lori-peters
https://soundbetter.com/profiles/138884-ocean-studios
https://open.spotify.com/artist/700jGfxWCVeMtJ0yYXX9R8?si=qBOMgt0MTYasQz-seeNqrg
https://www.breastcancercanstickit.org/
https://tiltify.com/@lori-peters/loripeters4yearsurvivor
www.marlanasemenza.com
Audio : Ariza Music Productions
Transcript : Vision In Word
Marlana
Lori Peters is a four-year breast cancer survivor drummer and rocker. previously a member of the multi-platinum and gold selling two-time Grammy Award nominated artists skillet. She has over 30 years of drumming experience, including studio recording live performance, worldwide touring and drum instruction. Now with her husband, Chris, she owns and operates ocean studios, while also volunteering for the nonprofit organization called breast cancer can stick it Foundation. Welcome, Laurie.
Lori
Hi, how are you?
Marlana
I'm doing well. So, tell us how did you get into music in the first place?
Lori
Oh gosh, well, I was my first drum kit was probably age four or five. So, I feel like right out of the gate. I was already into music. And then I really didn't get into like school band and stuff probably until junior high. And so, I begged my parents you know, can I they tried me on you know, piano guitar, everything else. I just really wanted to play drums. So, I just had to beg them for a drum set and finally got into school band probably like ninth grade, which is a little bit later. Just bought my own drum set from a neighbor. You know, I saved up my money. And I think that kind of showed my parents that I was really serious and watch MTV nonstop. But I think that's that was my biggest teacher was just watching videos like seriously. headbangers ball, all that stuff.
Marlana
So, what was it about the drums though?
Lori
I don't know. I think I just have this internal clock. Internal just beat always going at I don't know, I even before MTV was a thing. I'm know I'm kind of dating myself, but I just was interested in so wherever I would see drums no matter what kind of if it was rock music, anything. I was just always glued to it. So that's kind of how I ever since I can remember really. So how were you able to
Marlana
make the leap into doing it as a career? Oh, man. Well,
Lori
it took a lot of work. But I think my story might be a little bit different than maybe the typical stories that you hear. So, I played a lot. In church, I played a lot with a friend of mine, like we'd had local bands probably had two or three local bands and a lot of worship team, you know, playing on Sunday mornings. And then a friend of mine that I grew up with Cory, she started to date this guy. And he was from Memphis. And fast forward. You know, he, he was in a band called skillet, and they got signed really young. And I got to be in their wedding, which is kind of nice. But you know, again, fast forward, they were already two albums into their career. And then Cory they got married, and they and she, you know, join them on the road and eventually join the band. And then I was working one day, and I came across their website. And it just happened to say that Trey McClurkin was leaving the band and I think shout out to Trey because I think people forget about him. He was the original drummer of skillet. It started with three guys. So, and Ken Stuart's and John Cooper, so I, I just couldn't believe that the door was even cracked that much. And not that it was like a gimme, or, like a freebie. Like I had to audition. I did talk to like; I knew John and Cory very well at that at that point. So, I just asked John, you know, what do you think, you know, could you give me a shot? And it's like, well, you know, let's, let's go over buy your drum kit and let's play a little bit. And he was like, well, at the end of it, he's like, Well, I think I think he kind of did better than I thought you would, which was kind of a backhanded compliment, or, you know, it was still a compliment, but I knew
Marlana
somewhere in there. You just had to look for it a little bit. Yeah,
Lori
I knew him well enough that I didn't take offense or anything but, and they said, well, let's fly down to Memphis and you know, have you because this was we were up in Wisconsin at the time was fly down and have you play for our manager and the other member Ever since stuff probably about a week later, he called me he's like, Would you like to be our new drummer? And I was like, Heck yeah.
Marlana
So, what was that, like performing with them?
Lori
Amazing. Again, a lot of a lot of hard work. So, I guess, you know, the easy part was, was kind of over it. Now the hard, the hard practicing, you know, I practiced for a month, straight eight hours a day. And we are hitting the road. It was their second album called invincible. And that tour hadn't even started yet. The album had just released, it was done. So, I was going to do the invincible tour. So, practice by my by myself pretty much every day for a month. And I know, your question was, how was it playing with him, which was amazing. But I, I have to touch on some of the work that went into please do because I
Marlana
don't I don't know that people realize that just because you get the gig doesn't mean that the work stops?
Lori
Oh, yeah, yeah. Um, so a lot. It's not, you know, unknown that a lot of bands play with tracks, and, you know, backing tracks and might have, you know, some strings in there, or background vocals and that kind of thing. But at the time, skillets didn't want to do that. They, they wanted to have the tracks because the invincible album was a lot of electronic key kind of influence. And Korea could only do so much even though she had like a whole city of keyboards and like probably 10 keyboards going on stage. So, he wanted me to learn how to trigger every single like drum loop or whatever was going on. So that meant hitting an electronic trigger, like every measure, literally, literally while I was playing. So, I had like a six pad, Roland active pad on the side, I had multiple triggers throughout my drum kit. So, I'd be playing the regular parts, and the verse, I'd be constantly hitting a trigger on than a, another trigger, I'd have whatever was going on the course. And then to not to not accidentally hit those triggers, or a vibration sometimes from my drum kit would trigger that, especially if I was not on my own drum kit, like, like at a festival or something. If two if two drum stands are touching, it would trigger it. Oh my, well, yeah, it was very nerve racking. So, I had to, I had to learn all the music, and learn how to play on the drums and learn how to trigger all that at the same time. Which was pretty overwhelming for somebody who had been playing for a while but didn't have, you know, quote unquote, professional experience at that point. But that threw me into the deep end. But everything like all those things make you better in the in the end. So
Marlana
do you think you thrive in the deep end?
Lori
I've come to learn. Yeah, I think most people do because that adrenaline and that nervousness, I think it's always healthy to have a little bit of nerves. Because if, if you don't, you might be teetering on the side of overconfidence. And that, I think that's when mistakes can happen. Yeah. You just plow through it. And if you do make a mistake, just act like you didn't.
Marlana
Do you still get nervous? Yeah,
Lori
definitely. I, I had the pleasure the last month or so of sitting in with a band called dig Nissim, which they're from the Chicago area. And they, they were waiting for their full-time drummer to come on. And they had a few festivals booked. And so, they reached out to me and they're like, Well, can you, you know, would you be interested in doing some live shows with me? I'm like, okay, and that threw me right into the deep end because I'd never heard their music. Sorry, guys. Sorry, Jen. But I'm a fan now. But it's very evanescent skillet, that type of genre. So, I think I meshed very well with that. But I had to me had to hit the kid, you know, for a few weeks of pretty good practice just on my own with their tracks. And get that down pat. And that threw me into the deep end because it's a lot of double kick work, which I'm decent at but everybody's got everybody's gotta practice when you go into something new. Yeah, yeah.
Marlana
So, tell us a little bit too about what touring was like.
Lori
Um, you get to see a lot of cool places.
Marlana
The shows
Lori
I guess the shows are kind of like, at the end of the day, that's, that's what you're there to do. So that's kind of, especially on a tour you kind of get an automatic mode a little bit. But then you hit the stage. And it's like, it's all brand new again, like a new city, a new set of fans, you know, new venue. So that's really cool. Some days you don't get to see even where you are, it's, you know, maybe it's been a long drive you get in, especially for the drummer you need, you need to be set up and, on the stage, first, because everything kind of gets built around you on, you know, sometimes it's a smaller stage or whatever. But some that sometimes you have a day off on the road, and you get to see some really cool things like I've been in Australia and New Zealand, and we've toured the UK, I think I've been to every state at least twice, Texas, probably 25 times,
Marlana
does it all blend together after a while, um,
Lori
a little bit, I mean, some of the scenery, as far as like driving down the highway, that all looks the same. But then once you get off and then into the city, you're like, oh, like, Oh, this is cool. You know, I've never seen this right. And then I always like to see the different venues because sometimes you play a high school gym, and those all look the same. But then sometimes you roll into like, you know, a House of Blues. I'm like, oh, you know, this is cool, or some old theater that a town has renovated and it's really, I guess, cool characteristics and unique. So that's pretty cool. I'm always a sucker for like an old, cool, weird theater that you have never seen before.
Marlana
And now I hear you what's taught us a little bit about the difference between the different kind of energy between working in a studio and working on stage. Completely different
Lori
worlds. You get that energy from the fans, and the stage and the lights and the sound is like, you know, bump in. And that's like a whole thing in and of itself. And I love that. And, but then you kind of switch gears when you get into the studio. Because you might have, you know, you have more than more than one take or more than one chance, I guess, to create something. Whereas on stage, it's, this is what we're doing that set, you know it, you're, you know, you're just in that moment of the studio, it's a little bit more creative, and you're coming up with new parts, or you're, you know, hashing things out and, and then you get to go over to the control room and hear it right away. And like, oh, you know, I heard that in my head, and I played it, but now like you hear it coming at you. And it's like, that's a whole nother experience. You're like, wow, I didn't I didn't think that would sound like that. Or, yeah, it's really fun. What is it
Marlana
like to hear something that you have played on? On the radio?
Lori
I remember, I think every musician probably remembers that. That first moment actually, was not with skill it was with one of our local bands. Cory started a band called alchemy, which I think somebody's put the whole album up on YouTube, if you want to look it up. But um, John actually played there dating during that time. So, he actually played guitar in that and he's, he's, uh, he plays every instrument, but he played guitar in that, but we just, it was this was before, you know, social media, any of that stuff. So, we kind of just had to grassroots, you know, play where we could in the area. And I can't even remember how we got on the radio, but somebody grabbed it, and they put it on their show, like, late at night out. I want to say it was 95 will rock which is one of the predominant stations in the Chicago area. But that yeah, so long ago, but I remember it was it was planned, and I turned it up. I didn't have any means to record it or take a picture or like I didn't I just say you didn't think of it you just asked one of the things I think sometimes is missing in in the music industry today. I was just in that moment by myself with the radio on. And that moment is just in my head forever. It's not posted anywhere. It's not there's not a picture of it anywhere. It's just that I experienced that by myself. And I think I think sometimes these days, if you went to a show and nobody had a phone or a camera, it'd be a different experience.
Marlana
Yeah. And you know, I say this as a photographer, I think so much of that is missing to just be present in a moment. And enjoy the moment for the moment. And because if you lose a photo or if you lose your phone or any of those kinds of things You know, you may lose that memory so to speak. But if you sit there and you absorb it and let it in, it's with you forever.
Lori
Yeah. I mean, thank the Lord for photographers who, you know, professional who have captured those moments over the years. I mean, thank God for that. But I have heard stories, like on, you know, late night talk shows where, like Jimmy Fallon has said, you know, I went to such and such concert. And they were they required that everybody leave their phone like, and it was a whole other experience. Yeah.
Marlana
Next, I remember those days going to concerts before phones. Now. I'm dating myself.
Lori
Yeah, me too. I remember. But, well, there's pros and cons.
Marlana
Yeah. You know, I read online that you talked about, saying that when you hear something that you can add value to you can just feel it talk to me about that little bit. Ah,
Lori
I remember writing that. I think it was mainly I was talking in the studio setting. You know, if someone wants me to play drums on their song, I think I could say this about Ignis it when I was practicing their music, I felt like it meshed. correctly, it was the style that I enjoyed the style of my playing, you know, went, what? It's like I was in the pocket. So, some styles of music. I'm just I'm just saying that they're not right for this. Yeah, I could do my best. And I definitely can play something very good. But I don't know if I if I added the value that you were looking for. I think some of it's just my own satisfaction. Like do I feel like I did the best I could I met? So, I'll tell I'll just tell people upfront. I don't think I'm right for this.
Marlana
Yeah. Which I think is huge. Because when it's less about you and more about the outcome for all those involved it because I do the same thing. Yes, I can take photos of someone, but just because I have the ability to doesn't make me the best fit for you and your story.
Lori
Exactly. Yeah.
Marlana
So, tell us a little bit about ocean studios and we'll escape. Well,
Lori
it's kind of me and my husband's baby. It's, we've been married, it'll be 10 years, in a month or so. And so, I feel like it's been a journey through our whole marriage. Because he, he grew up in Seattle, so he's always been interested in music. His name is Chris, by the way. And so, he plays piano guitar. His main instrument is piano, and he taught himself how to play guitar and he sings and so he's always wanted to he's always dabbled in recording. And just over the course of the last decade, you know, it's always about the next piece of gear, or this is going to make me sound better, oh, we need this, or we need that. And, and I went to Columbia College in Chicago for studio recording before I joined skillet, that was what
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Julia Lage
Meet Julia Lage - bassist of Vixen and Smith/Kotzen
Julia is a Brazilian bass player, singer songwriter.
Inspired by bands like, Rush, Aerosmith and Guns N Roses, she began learning the Bass Guitar at the age of thirteen.
At the age of seventeen Julia had become a full time member of the critically acclaimed Latin Grammy nominated Brazilian band Barra Da Saia.
After her thirteen year tenure with the band which included major network television appearances, International festivals and domestic arena tours plus 3 full albums and 1 live DVD, Julia left the band and relocated to Los Angels California.
With a BA in music and arts as well as extensive studio and touring experience, Julia has found herself performing and recording with a vast array of A list artists and musicians such as Pat Travers, Elliot Easton (The Cars), Richie Kotzen, as well as performing along side Pop Star Janelle Monáe and rapper Jidenna at the American Idol Finals.
Julia also worked with Grammy winner iconic Latin artist Alejandra Gusmán, recording a live cd/dvd called 'Live at The Roxy'.
Most recently Julia toured with Smith/Kotzen, a rock blues band formed by Adrian Smith ( Iron Maiden ) and Richie Kotzen ( The Winery Dogs ).
At the same time she was invited to join the all female platinum selling rock band Vixen.
Julia also has her own projects which include her solo music and her band The Sister Knot.
Julia’s prolific nature as a writer has found her compositions and performances featured in various American films and television shows.
She is currently working on finishing her first solo album as well as a Sister Knot album and continues to tour with Vixen as they work on their new music.
My website: https://www.julialage.com
instagram: https://www.instagram.com/julia_lage/
facebook fanpage: https://www.facebook.com/JuliaLageMusic
Here is my latest video for Wake Up
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DsJu0LJ0hzU&list=PLUNkX209tKPGdGCzhSUBJBhvnlIm8lxrZ&index=7
wwww.marlanasemenza.com
Audio : Ariza Music Productions
Transcript : Vision In Word
Marlana
Julia Lage is a Brazilian bass player, singer and songwriter. Inspired by bands like Rush, Aerosmith, and Guns and Roses. She began learning the bass at the age of 13. With a BA in music and arts as well as an extensive studio and touring experience. Julia has found herself performing and recording with a vast array of alias artists and musicians such as Pat travers, Elliot Easton, Richie Kotzen, Adrian Smith, Janelle Monae, and the all-female platinum selling Rock Band vixen. Welcome, Julia.
Julia
Thank you. Thanks for having me here.
Marlana
So, you started off in Brazil, then you had some success in Brazil, and then you came here. Tell us a little bit about that whole,
Julia
you know, there. Oh, well, I played for 13 years in Brazil. And we did have a good heat there for a while. I tour like I used to play like arenas there like rodeos was always on TV, radios and stuff like that. And I learned a lot with that I joined the band, I was 17. So, I was just like a baby. And I remember, you know, it was amazing. But at the same time, I wasn't really playing the kind of music I love. I was playing like what we call Brazilian country music, which is the country music people from the countryside write songs is kind of similar like America, but the rhythm is similar, but has a little different swing here and there. You know, it's Brazil. But um, so yeah, so I started there. And we did all major stuff, like for real, like, we had a boss who their faces on and he was like, a big band for a while. Then he started declining.
In after 13 years, I was like, not seeing myself at all excited anymore, or happy about it or anything. I was like, go play like, whatever, I will come home from the shows, but my base and the side, not even look for my base or my guitar, nothing. I'll try to write anything, nothing. Just live my life. Whenever the next show was gonna happen. I was like, Okay, tell me where and what time I'll be there. You know what I mean? So, I was completely like, I don't know, I lost interest. I don't know, for a bunch of reasons. But so then after 13 years, I decided to finally quit the band. But actually, what helped me with the decision was the fact that I started dating my now husband, but you know, my boyfriend at whatever rate you so that helped me too. And then he was like, so since you're so frustrated with your band, why don't you quit? You know, sell your stuff, move and come to LA? I'm like, why? And then actually, I did it. I'm here.
Marlana
So, we have Ritchie to thing.
Julia
Yes. So yes. I mean, you know, he could say I ruined her life will say no, you actually, you know, made a very exciting because I was in a plateau, I was very unmotivated. I was I didn't know what I was anymore. What I wanted was too many years of the same things. And not really the kind of music I love. So. So yeah, I mean, I thank you for bringing me here because I've been taking my career here.
Marlana
So how is the music scene different here for you?
Julia
Well, first of all, for me, it's very different because nowadays, I'm playing what I like, which is rock and roll. So, since I moved here, I did a few different gigs during the beginning, obviously. But most of the gigs were rock geeks. And I was super surprised. I was like, oh my god, I'm just seeing a rock. I mean, America is way more rock. I mean, if you go to Costco, they're playing me golds, they're playing whatever, rock. And in Brazil, they're playing all kinds of stuff, not rock.
So, like when I got here, I was like, Oh my God, you know, I love all this. So, for me the difference, the biggest differences for sure that I'm playing actually what I like, the most here, so and that's very important for me to do what I love.
Marlana
Yeah. And I know along the way you wrote songs for film and TV. Were you approached to write them, or had you written them? How did that all work?
Julia
Both I mean, I was approached to write a few stuffs. And so, I did. And funny enough was mostly rock stuff, which is good. And yeah, and then there's a few movies and you know, little placements of songs that already exist even with my band. We have a song in the movie that close the movie with our song now. That's my song. Oh, there's another movie that had like an entire song played in the scene. So, they played our entire song, the theme, and we're like, they were cheering and that was so cool. So, like both for sure.
Marlana
So, did you have to, like reinvent anything about yourself when you came here to start to pursue a more of a rock career than what you were doing?
Julia
no, really, I was always a rock chick. In my heart. I as a as you said, I start learning bass because of bands like Rush, Aerosmith, guns, and roses, whatever you name it. But one thing that I had to invent, let me think, I think, because I did join my band in Brazil was very young. And they already have a band that was kind of stablished establishing lists. So, like, I wouldn't, I never, for example, is that's very technical for musicians, but they get it. Like usually, depending on the gig, you bring your own amp, or your own pair of pedals, for sure. But like, we have your microphone, stand your little gear, your PA, I never did that in music, I would get to the gigs, and everything is there. So, I was very spoiled it right in the beginning. And then I never did the hustle the gear, the gear driving far for the gears, for the gigs, because I was just you know, getting in the bus and going out. So that was different. When I moved here, I had two rings in everything. And like, Okay, what am I gonna do, and that was probably the hardest phase in my life, too. So, I even did it like church gigs, which is like, you know, completely different and you have to read, I wasn't reading anything members, you parts, you know, and then or like, carrying gear, like, you know, whatever, say like, oh, like carry gear, like, Please forged our SATs, all this stuff I did here. And I think that's a big, humbling scenario, you know, for anybody.
I was like, Wow. I mean, I was kind of, you know, ready, and motivated in Brazil, but I hadn't good No way, you know, but then coming here, even though it was doing all this, I can Oh, and we drive and so far. And, you know, it's 2am I'm coming back home exhausted, I'm bringing this gear, putting ba together that I was still super happy. Because I was not only playing rock and roll all the songs that I always loved. But I was like reconnecting with myself again, like, oh, that's what I really liked. I liked his music. And I really liked to interact with the public him, you know, be me, I'm out. I'm outgoing. I'm like, I'm like, they like that I am an entertainer. And in Brazil, I was being like, you know, more and more quiet and more and more like, my light was kind of dimming. So that was a good, you know, like a Phenix.
Marlana
How did you know that you were starting to get some traction?
Julia
Well, um, a few things. But like coming here to LA, you probably already heard about that. They just tons of jams everywhere. So, people go out in the jam. Right? It's the good way to meet new people to meet new musicians. And then, you know, we talk to them, you do your network, all that stuff. And I remember, I was obviously dating Richie, my husband, and then one of the gyms wanted my husband to come jam. And he was like, you know, he, he doesn't need to go on a jam, I guess. He has a pretty established career. But he said, well, but I can come do it like a night, like a few songs. And but like, I would like to bring my band. And then he brought me as the bass player.
I wasn't on his band. But he knew that I could perform his songs the way he liked and everything. So, he brought me in. And then that was the first step to get in. And then since then, the people from the gym capacity has come to him. Let's go gym and now go and Did I did I get hired a few times got hired a few times to do the house bands. And so, you know, and then people started knowing who you are and start. Oh, there's that girl. Oh, oh, she also can sing. Oh, she in on me. Oh, she kinda looked good. And blah, blah, whatever. Whatever do you need? Because I learned that in LA. There's a lot of looks involved, too.
So, I think that's how I start, you know, getting my name around, because that's what we have to do. It's not working period.
Marlana
And like you said, Richie had very, you know, established career. Do you think that helped you? Or did it really not matter one way or the other because you didn't go off of him in his connections?
Julia
I don't think it matters that much. He didn't matter that much. He married that day when he brought me in the gym. But that was it. Like after dad, everything started happening on my own, you know, like, he can bring me if I was like, not like professional or if I wasn't, whatever, good enough, right? You could bring me as many times as you want, I will not get anywhere.
I'm very perfectionist, so every time I go places, I like to be prepared. So yeah, I mean, obviously, I guess exposure here and there, you know, people see me, for example, on his Instagram, and they clicked on the check. And then they figured out Oh, my gosh, she plays bass as well. What is that? You know, maybe that but yeah, I mean, we both have different careers, different separate things. So yeah.
Marlana
What's it like to have two musicians in the house?
Julia
It can be difficult, because, like, if I'm recording something, or trying to write something like record vocals, for example, I do here in this room, because I have this little, you know, that's here, everything is here, actually. But I only do this here because he's in the studio on the other side of the house, any lyrics. So, like, if I had a perfect room just for the studio, but then the first time we try to record something that he's on his studio, I'm here, but I'm your drums on like, this is not going to work. So, I had to put together something there's room. But like other than that, I mean, it's pretty, it's pretty chill. I mean, we're not always like playing loud music in the house. I mean, we do that for a living. So, when we come in the house, we might play a radio station of Tom Paley, or like, Holly notes, or you go something chill, you know, cook something, but we don't make too much noise at the same time. We need to balance you know?
Marlana
Do you critique each other?
Julia
yes, but positively, like, you know, good criticism. Like I even asked Ricci sometimes to say, you know, like, singing wise, I love his voice. And then sometimes I record something and clearly, I have Brazilian accent and stuff. So. And then I asked him, like, what do you think? What do you think like this, okay. And I do trust him. Because I tend to think too much. And overthink, I'm a Libra. And I'm like, he's like, good enough. So yeah, I asked for criticism, and he does too. Like sometimes he would talk about of course, yeah. And we know, the best of both. And I know my best I know his best. So, I think is good criticism. Never like, oh my god, you know me?
Marlana
Well, that's good. So, when you write songs, do you have to be in a certain headspace or what is your writing process look like?
Julia
Definitely go to headspace for sure. Usually, when I'm alone, when Richard goes out for touring for, you know goes out, I usually tend to write more. Because then there's less distractions too. And you get in the zone, like you get in a studio, and I'll sit here for hours just to get to eat I have like, coffee. And next day I have reflux and I don't know why.
I have to go to a different place because I like writing and I imagined everything like, you know, the guitars, drums, the beats, the bass, whatever I like, literally arranging stuff to and then I go sing and I need I like to think about maybe, what am I going to sing about? What is this song bringing me you know, because rarely starts with the lyrics for me. So, then I start, you know, I have to just literally, I look outside the window here, I look at all, I start thinking about lyrics and words and what's going to be cool, what's going to make sense.
So, for sure, you have to be in a different mind space. Like, you have to get out of things. For sure. And sometimes it can be like, if I'm upset for something, it's very helpful. You know, if you have like, a heavy energy on you, could be upsetting, could be excitement, could be whatever, that they usually help to, if you sit down and use that energy to put out in wars or whatever, or songs that helps for sure.
Marlana
And that's always been baffling to me that you you can just write something from nothing and put yourself there kind of a thing where instead of oh my gosh, I'm so upset about this. I have to write something.
Julia
Right. I rarely my life, road stuff based on reality or something that happened? Rarely. I get inspirations of course. But yeah, that is interesting. A lot of people use their own personal lives, like Taylor Swift. I know she writes all about her love life or whatever
Marlana
she writes about everybody.
Julia
Okay, yeah, I don't know much about her work. But I know that she writes based on her experiences, and I'm like wow! I like tripping out about possibilities and wards and lakes in there. I don't know. And then I'm about to finish my first solo album. And sometimes it's even like the little what exactly, are you talking about? No nonsense.
But like, I like to be a little too lifted the creativity of people just think about what cannot be, you know, not obvious stuff like that. So, yeah, I do know music is just very interesting. It's creating is, is art. I mean, it's like painting, you just start from nothing.
Marlana
Yeah, that's true. And I wouldn't worry about if people understand it or not, because Queen made a whole career on them on things that you can't necessarily understand.
Julia
Is not even. That's the point of like, some people might get upset or something, oh, my God, I don't get the feedback I want. But like, when I write a song I'm writing first of all for myself, because I have that energy, that creativity. I'm like, oh, and I get excited. I listen to the devil. Yeah, I look at it, and I want to share with my husband or someone. But that's why I'm trying to finish my album, because I've been writing for so long.
And I have a few singles who in their britches, like people have to hear stuff finish. I'm like, Yeah, that's why because I already get excited. myself with my own...
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My name is Payton Rose Velligan, but I go by Payton Rose on stage and on social media/website
(From my website) Payton Rose Velligan is a 21-year-old multi-instrumentalist and performer born and raised just outside of Charlotte, NC. Specializing in vocals, piano, keyboards, guitar, bass guitar, and occasionally a bit of tambourine, she is versatile and happy to fill any position on stage. Recognized at the national level as a high schooler by associations such as the GRAMMY foundation and Honors Performance Series, Payton has had many opportunities to perform on stages across the country, from small town bars to Carnegie Hall.
A public performer since the age of five, Payton took her first professional steps at the age of fifteen as a founding member of the band Irrashional, an original group out of Charlotte which sought to revive the sonic glory of 70s rock-n-roll. The band released two original EPs, Closer Than You Think (2018) and Beyond (2019), which feature Payton on vocals and bass guitar. In 2019, during her first month of college, Payton joined forces with Tommy DeCarlo, the singer of the legendary rock band Boston (since 2007). She has been thrilled to be the keyboardist/guitarist/vocalist of DECARLO for three years.
Payton is currently on tour with Tommy DeCarlo, performing the Music of Boston, and with Rudy Cardenas of American Idol, performing the Music of Journey. She is excited to be sharing some of her favorite music with audiences all over the globe!
Payton is currently a student at the University of North Carolina at Greensboro, majoring in Music (surprise!) and minoring in Arts Administration. She is expanding her study of piano in college and spends her weekends traveling and playing shows.
When not practicing or performing, Payton enjoys spending her time reading anything - from classical literature to sci-fi novels to biographies to Shakespeare’s dramas. She also loves spending time with her family, her dog Cookie, and all the wonderful people she has befriended through music.
paytonrosemusic.com
@paytonrosemusic on Instagram and Facebook
www.marlanasemenza.com
Audio : Ariza Music Productions
Transcription : Vision In Word
Marlana
I just met a star. That's what I thought when I first met Payton Rose Velligan and saw her perform. She sings, plays piano, keyboards, guitar, bass and occasionally a bit of tampering and kills the stage in her red boots of public performance since the age of five, she took her first professional steps at the age of 15. And at 21 is currently on tour with Tommy DeCarlo and Rudy Cardenas while still finishing up her music major at UNC. Believe me when I tell you this girl is the total package and I'm honored to know her. Welcome, Peyton.
Payton
I relate to thank you so much for that. That was so kind.
Marlana
Well, so tell us how did you get into music in the first place?
Payton
Like any little kid, I mean, I love to mess around with the piano. And my parents were very musical. There was always music playing in our house on the stereo. My mom played piano, I mean, just singing, dancing. I had a very musical upbringing. So, I love music since an early age. You know, I started taking piano lessons when I was five or six. And I never wanted to live my life without music in it. So that's kind of how it all started. And it just grew and grew from there. Definitely.
Marlana
So, you play a lot of different instruments. Was that just out of curiosity that you kept picking them up? Or at a necessity? Or what?
Payton
A little bit of both? I guess definitely curiosity is a good way to put it and just in love and wanting to emulate some of my heroes, probably because like I said, I started out with piano. And then I picked up the guitar when I was 13. Because my dad, he played, and I thought that was the coolest thing ever. And you know, I wanted to be like Jimmy Page or John Lennon. And I wanted to play, and I did pick up the bass as a necessity. Ironically, it might be my favorite instrument now. But I was in a four-piece band in high school. And our bass player went off to college. We were all sad. And we needed a bass player. So, I thought I try it. And I ended up absolutely loving it.
So, we became a trio. And singing. I mean, I've just always loved to sing. And I had to find my competence in singing, especially in front of other people. That was not something that came naturally it was playing in front of other people, but I always love to do it. It'd be nice when nobody was listening.
Marlana
So how did you find your confidence? Because believe me when you get on stage now, you own it.
Payton
Oh, thank you!
Marlana
So, where'd that come from?
Payton
It took a while. I actually owe a lot to my amazing, amazing teachers that I've had throughout the years. I would not be on stage, especially if it weren't for my guitar teacher. His name is Carl Gunther. And I started taking lessons from him when I was probably 14 or 15. And he really gave me the push that I needed to go out of my comfort zone. And that was something I struggled with, stepping out of that, my little tiny box that I felt comfortable in. I think I was taking lessons from him for about two weeks only. And he had taught me the guitar solo to purple haze by Jimi Hendrix, which I never even thought I could play guitar solo at that point. And he said, Hey, we're having a little concert at this pizza place nearby and I want you to come out and play and I didn't even know the whole song and you know, he just got me up on stage. And he played drums behind me, and we had a friend jump up on bass and I just did it and I was terrified.
There's a video of me out there somewhere my hair is just completely covering my face intentionally that way. And I did not like it the crowd the whole time. I was so embarrassed. But afterwards, the song ended, and I just felt this amazing. I just felt so good. I loved it. It was like I definitely noticed at that moment that it wasn't as scary as I thought it was. And you know people, I mean I made mistakes; people didn't care. You know, everybody was just there to have fun and it's really that simple. Every time I go up on stage, I think to myself, I'm here to have fun. I always have fun. And the crowd is here to have fun. They don't come to a rock concert, expecting perfection, they just want to have a good time. And that's what we do. We have a good time. And it's always fun, and it's never perfect. And that is totally okay.
Marlana
So now when you get on stage, what does it feel like?
Payton
It feels energizing. And it's always a thrill. Seeing the crowd for the first time, you know, we go out in the soundcheck, and all the seats are empty. You know, there's a lot of reverberation, and nobody's soaking up that sound yet. And then we don't go on stage again until the place is full. And that is always I think I'm immediately struck with just so much gratitude that people are coming to hear us and I maybe a little bit of surprise, sometimes that, you know, people are there to see us and are so excited about it.
But yeah, I'm always very thankful to see a crowd so excited when we walk out on stage, but definitely energizing some days. You know, I can't wait to go out there and I'm just bouncing off the walls and some days. I'm like, I could really use a nap. But as soon as I go out there, it always feels the same. I mean, I feel amazing.
Marlana
You did something that not a lot of people have done. You've actually played at Carnegie Hall. Tell us about that.
Payton
Oh, my goodness. Yeah, I have. I've sang at Carnegie Hall. And that was just one of the amazing experiences I've had. I had as a high schooler actually. I audition for something called The Honors Performance Series. A program for students, and singers to take the trip up to New York and be an acquirer with people from literally around the globe, all across the US. And yeah, other countries as well. And we all came together in New York and rehearsed for a few days. And then we had the big show at Carnegie Hall. And that was one of the most beautiful spaces I have ever been in. I have dreams in Carnegie Hall to this day, like where I'm just walking around. It is so dreamlike. I mean, it's an ethereal, it's really amazing. So yeah, so I keep saying the word amazing a lot because that's kind of how I feel like everything is looking back at it, it's almost hard to believe that it happened and that I was actually there. And it was a great memory, I met a lot of I was in the women's choir. So, a lot of ladies who were just amazing singers and pushed me to be better.
I learned a lot about harmonizing with others. And I was an alto. And you know, that's it's, it was hard for me to be in the middle of all these voices. And definitely helped me train my ear a little bit. And you know, Carnegie Hall is built to be perfect acoustics. So going in there, you know, when you start singing, I tried to soak up every second of hearing, you know, the choir that I was a part of just hearing that sound. It's like nothing you've ever heard until you actually go there. It was really cool.
Marlana
And you know, that's one thing that always strikes me about watching you in any performance I've either seen on tape or live is you soak everything up, which is such a good thing because there's so many people that just aren't present in their life. And to see that you just want to take it all in and love every moment of it. And that's so nice to see. Now, you're only in your first month of college when you joined forces with Tommy DeCarlo. So how did that happen?
Payton
Yeah, that was a crazy time in my life.
Marlana
And also, for anybody who has, you know, kind of been under a rock, tell us who Tommy DeCarlo is.
Payton
Yes, Tommy DeCarlo is the current lead singer of the band Boston. So more than a feeling peace of mind. All those hits came from Boston and yeah, he's, he's currently singing with them. So, I've had the absolute honor of sharing the stage with him for about three years now. And yeah, as you said, I did join the band. Right after I started my freshman year. I met them over the summer after I graduated high school. And, you know, we're all Charlotte. Well, current Charlotte residents. And so of course through the music scene, you know, you meet people, and I always knew Okay, the singer of Boston is here, but like, I've never been able to catch a show. And I've been a huge fan Boston, you know, all throughout high school and everything.
So, I finally got to go to show. And to my surprise, they are looking for a keyboardist and a guitarist. And is the first time I got to talk to Tommy, senior, we call him because there's a Tommy Junior. He pulled me aside at one of their shows, and he was like, how are you on the keyboard? And this was out of the blue, like, he had actually invited me to sing a song with them. I think I did a journey song separate way with them. And so, I was like, Oh, that was so fun. And what a cool experience to sing with them. And, you know, they'll remember this forever, you know, whatever. But I will. The he pulled me aside and carried on keyboards. I mean, I've played for a long time, and I'm studying in college. But in that moment, I had like, no cough. I was like, I don't know, because he's really good on the keyboards anyways. So, they invited me to play, sit in a couple more shows with them. And then I got the big invitation to join their band. And I actually play guitar as well. So, they needed a second guitarist. So, I was able to kind of fill both those roles. And learning all the Boston songs was so much fun. It is such great music. So well written in very genius composer, and all the guitar harmonies and keyboard organ parts are brilliant. So that was a fun project to take on, but a little bit stressful going into college as well as a bunch of new things all at once.,
Marlana
So, what's the road like been like for you at 21 years old?
Payton
It's so much fun. I love it. I love it. I mean, a year ago, two years ago, if you asked me, you know, do you think you'd be on the road? You know, with whoever I would say, You kidding me? Like, that would be amazing. But I mean, I never expected to be here. It's definitely the time of my life. I love it. We have an amazing band and amazing crew. And so, everybody being on the road together is just fun. It is really cool. It's really fulfilling to be able to go out to different cities and see, you know, we're in the a few new places for the first time. And we see crowds coming out and loving the show. And it's just really cool to be able to share this music with so many people and new faces and make new friends.
I try my best to be able to go out and talk to some people after the show and make new friends and I love that part of it so much. And now I have friends across the country and that is definitely the coolest thing to take away from all this, is just meeting new people and, and definitely all the great memories I love. You know, on our days off, we try to go out and see the cities. We're in Dallas right now. So, we did a few historical things yesterday and had some barbecue, which was fantastic. And you know, we just tried to explore it and take it all in. There's so many cool things to see. And all the places we've been, and I love to explore so it's definitely a dream come true for me. And I'm just so insanely grateful to be here definitely.
Marlana
So how do you then juggle Rockstar Peyton and student Peyton?
Payton
Well, I don't know if I think of myself as Rockstar Peyton. I guess I'm just Payton . I think it is. Realistically, it's definitely taking a little bit of hard work and discipline and you know, doing some reading and homework at soundcheck and stuff like that, and, you know, on the bus or van going back and forth on the plane. I mean, it really is just a matter of doing it. But, you know, I'm studying music and school and arts administration. And so, it really kind of ties into exactly what I'm doing right now. And so, you know, I'm grateful to be receiving that education and being able to put it into practice right now with my work. And so, it's, it's not easy, but it's 100% 110% worth it. And so, like on the job training, yeah, I have to give a shout out to my professors to at UNCG I've had so many really great professors and who have been really understanding and supportive of me being in in music and doing this, and I'll tell them the beginning of the semester, hey, I might be missing class sometimes. And I'll do whatever I can to make up the work or whatever. And you know, can you record your lecture or whatever, and they have been so accommodating and just really supportive. So, I owe a lot of them as well.
Marlana
So, you play primarily with an all-male band. But recently, you and I met when you got to play with an all-female band at Rock and Roll fantasy camp. So how was it different playing with all men versus all women?
Payton
I love my guys, I love them. I've played with so many fantastic guys. Throughout my career, so far, I'm playing at the Women's camp, but with our band, hello, cleavage. We were, we had so much fun, it was definitely different. I think, well, first of all, we had all just met each other. So, you know, that was one thing too. And I feel like we kind of created a bond really quickly. And maybe that was because we were all women, and we were all sharing this experience. And I think we just had never had that opportunity we'd all been in bands, but never with women. So, the fact that we were all there, and we could share our experiences and kind of relate over certain things. And we find, you know, somebody would be telling a story, and we don't be like, Oh my gosh, I guess like, you get it, I get it, you know, like, we feel the same way about this.
And it was really cool. You know, we were it was a very supportive environment, everybody was there to kind of lift each other up it, there wasn't a sense of real competition between anybody, it was just, you know, we want to help each other. And we were all there to share this, you know, once in a lifetime experience. And so, you know, everybody was just grateful to be there. So it was great.
Marlana
What do you take away from that experience?
Payton
Wow! Definitely! Well, a lot of things. I feel empowered. I definitely. I mean, I don't know if this sounds cheesy, but like, I feel like I can do anything. And I really do. It was really cool to see women of all ages there at the camp. I'm 21 and there was, I think some ladies in their 70s there who were still totally rocking out and just killing it. Seeing Nancy Wilson, seeing you know, Kathy Valentine, all these women who have been doing it for so long, really gave me competence and empowered me that I feel like I'm on the right path.
Sometimes I feel like, I feel anxious, or I feel this pressure. Because, you know, you got to do everything while you're still young, or oh, now, you know, before you're a certain age, you know, you have to have made it or else it's not going to happen for you. And usually that happens when you're, you know, in your 20s People are kind of, nudging you to make it or find something else to do. Because once you've hit a certain age is if I don't know,
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Tosha Jones, Musician
From playing small, smokey bars in southern Indiana, to touring world wide with national music acts, Los Angeles based heavy hitting drummer, Tosha Jones, quickly made a name for herself throughout the world’s music scene. At just the ripe age of three, Tosha began expressing herself through music, song, and dance. In 1991 as a true drummer at heart, Tosha joined her jr. high school band and eventually begged her parents for a real drum kit instead of playing on various pots and pans and her mother’s Tupperware.
Stemming from numerous garage bands and many Battle of the Band competitions throughout the Midwest, Jones finally jumped ship from working multiple factory jobs in Indiana and saved up enough money to move to Los Angeles, California as she immediately landed the Vans Warped Tour in 2008 with then, all-female punk rockers, The Randies.
Respectfully, after years of rejected auditions and trudging the streets of the Sunset Strip along Hollywood, Jones found herself in various bands on the road opening for national rock acts such as Stone Sour, Halestorm, Seether, & Skid Row, while eventually landing a long tour stint playing drums for Grammy nominated rock band, Saliva in March of 2018. As one of her personal career favorites, Tosha was contacted by American Idol (2015) to play in an all-female drum line for contestant Tyanna Jones, performing the song “Run The World” by Beyoncé.
Fast forward to Covid-19’s protocols and cancellations in 2019/2020, and unfortunately like many other musicians finding themselves away from touring, Jones was part of numerous collaboration videos online which includes Sheltering Sky’s Chuck Wright (Quiet Riot) in their 2021 Björk’s cover “Army of Me”, and most recently “Throwin’ Stones”, which hit on the recent attack of Ukraine. Jones was also featured in artist/singer, Chloe Trujillo’s videos, “Mana” and “The Heaviest Sound is Silence”. You can also find Tosha playing drums online in the star-studded cast for the David Z Foundation covering “Zombie”, by Bad Wolves.
In December 2021, Jones was asked to play drums on a few tour dates for alt rockers Carolina Liar, best known for their hit songs “Show Me What I’m Looking For” and “I’m Not Over”.
In January of 2022, Jones received a last-minute call to bash the skins for the fresh hard rockers, Black Satellite, as they were direct support for Nita Strauss’s (Alice Cooper, The Iron Maidens) 2022 Winter Wonderland Tour.
In Spring of ‘22, Jones was invited to be a camp counselor for the famous Rock n Roll Fantasy Camp where iconic musicians such as Melissa Etheridge, Nancy Wilson (Heart), and Kathy Valentine from The Go-Go’s were the special guests.
Tosha is currently preparing for a summer long tour in the making playing drums for original singers of Josey Scott (Saliva) and Brett Scallions (Fuel) doubling down on the kit for both powerhouses on the Original Madness Tour!
•https://youtu.be/3-G9zkcBQTE
• https://youtu.be/1ZQy3lQF7Mc
https://youtu.be/6UmqG43rSV8
www. marlanasemenza.com
Audio : Ariza Music Productions
Transcript : Vision In Word
Marlana
From playing on various pots and pans on her mother's Tupperware to small smoky bars in southern Indiana to touring worldwide with national music acts Los Angeles based heavy hitting drummer Tasha Jones quickly made a name for herself throughout the world's music scene, opening for acts such as Stone Sour, Halestorm, Seether and Skid Row and eventually landing along tour stint playing drums for the Grammy nominated Rock Band Saliva. Welcome, Tasha.
Tosha
Thank you. It's good to be here.
Marlana
Did you always want to be a musician?
Tosha
Yeah, I always bordered on an athlete and musician, drummer, for sure. It was always something that would pull at my heartstrings. Like I always make time for everything growing up. But I knew that I was gonna have to make a choice. Soon once I got into high school. And when I got into high school, and then went into college, I played basketball in college, and also tried out for the band in college, but I made it, but I decided that I was too busy with basketball. And so, I actually didn't go down the music route until a year later. So, it was interesting that that was how it worked out. But yeah, that's kind of what happened with that situation. And then after basketball, I joined my first like, real GarageBand with three other guys on college campus. And then that was once I got a taste of that.
Marlana
So, why drums? Because I know not a lot of girls play drums.
Tosha
Correct! Yeah. And growing up in the 80s, actually didn't see it hardly ever. I was born and raised in a super small town in southern Indiana, and I got made fun of, told that I was never going to be any good. Bla , bla, bla ! And that finally happened. Even like older people too. I even remember, one of my basketball teammates in college said something like, you're never gonna make it do that. So just a lot of different people have told me that through the years. And I'm sitting here now proving them all wrong, which feels great.
Marlana
and I always believe that you should really never take the advice or opinions of people you wouldn't trade places with.
Tosha
Yeah, yeah. Yeah, that's good. That's true. And I never did really, I was just like, silent bird and walked away.
Marlana
So, tell me then, what does it feel like to sit behind those drums and play for you?
Tosha
Oh, my gosh! Powerful! Humbling as well, but very powerful. Growing up knowing it was a man's world. And now I'm right up there with some of the best of them. So that's empowering.
Marlana
Yeah. Do you think more girls should play drums?
Tosha
Well, it's definitely risen so much since I started. But yeah. Not based on fear. as long as there's no fear involved. If there is fear involved, I guess I should say don't let that stop any girl from doing anything. Whether it's basketball, doctor, drummer, yeah. Don't allow fear to dictate your future.
Marlana
Do you ever get nervous when you play?
Tosha
No, I don't get nervous. I would rather play in front of 10,000 people 20,000 people instead of 10. The only time I remember ever getting nervous was if my parents would ever walk into my room and I was playing. And then in seventh grade, we had a show and tell, and I brought my entire drum kit to the classroom and played that thing, and I was nervous then I remember being nervous then. And then I also played for like at the end of the school year, we could bring in, you know what our talent was like a talent show. And I believe that was in eighth grade. I played in front of the whole school. And I was nervous because I played by myself when I was just up there. I don't even remember, I think I played like In a Gadda DaVita, or something. Not very well, but that I remember being nervous about, but fast forward, my senior year, I played In a Gadda DaVita at my graduation, because I was in tough bands, jazz band, the school band. And I wasn't nervous for that. And that was in front of a whole auditorium arrives the whole gym of community and local, local parents and all my peers, and that was amazing. Like, I remember doing that, but I wasn't nervous.
I get weird, to where my brain doesn't function. Like you can ask me the simplest of questions like, what's your favorite color? And I'll go, I have no idea. That's right before I play, that's like an hour or two, before I hit the stage. And I don't know what's going on, or how that happens into my body. It's something I can't control. And I just almost blackout kind of, it's like, my brain shuts down. And I'm just on, airplane mode, basically. But once those lights go down, or once our walkout music starts playing Oh, yeah. I'm psyched, ready to go. So, like, who's not watching me? Because you should do? I'd like more eyes on me. I love it. So, yeah, no, I don't get nervous.
Marlana
It's interesting that you say it like that too, because that's something that happens with athletes, before they go out and play, they get in the zone, so to speak. And so, it's interesting that you were an athlete, and also had that experience with music.
Tosha
Yeah, that's interesting you say that, because I actually do pull a lot of musicians like as inspirations and influences. But I look a lot more to athletes that I pull from for inspiration. So, I can go out and run, every morning, or get through that strength training in the mornings and stuff like that. So yeah, I kind of pull from athletic side to inspire me and motivate me and stuff like that.
Marlana
So, has this always been an easy journey for you?
Tosha
The opposite. Oh my gosh! It's been the toughest journey ever. Well, maybe not ever, but it's just always full of surprises. And every day, you never know what's gonna happen. a lot of times, people take what they want to do, and you have a routine, and they do the same thing every day, like Groundhog Day, the movie, which is fine. Sometimes that's awesome. sometimes I would like a little bit more stability in life and not having to guess, where my next gig is gonna come from, or how I'm gonna get it or anything like that. But yeah, it definitely hasn't been easy. And being a woman on top of all of that, I think it's way easier now to enter into this field as a as a female woman. And not that it is still easy, but it's way easier than it's ever been. People want to see it. They're kind of sick of seeing men all the time. They want to see chicks rocking out and letting themselves go and being free. And even men like they love it. They love it. Most of them, but yeah, it was tough growing up for sure.
Marlana
And I got the sense to that. Because we met about a month or so ago, at Rock and Roll fantasy camp, and that was the first women's only and I got the distinct sense that the voice of women in rock especially has been underserved and under heard for a really long time. How would you like to see that change?
Tosha
I mean, just more opportunity and do the same. The same across the board. Like, if the men get certain gear, the women should get the same gear, stuff like that just equal opportunity all the time. No one has any excuses with anything and so. But yeah, more opportunity, more airtime more TV time, more rock camps that were only women base. And it's unfortunately still slowly headed in that direction I feel
Marlana
Actually, let me ask you this incident, would you get out of Rock Camp once you get out of that experience?
Tosha
Oh, man! Well, I needed that. More than ever, at that time, as far as not even a musician based feeling it was more of something I was going through in my life at the time. And it was based on trusting women again and having that camaraderie and feeling safe. Then, on top of it, being able to play with all these other amazing women that were there, whether it were or the campers, the counselors, or the headliners. And each of my experience in those three fields was amazing. I was just talking to one of my campers an hour ago, she had wished me a happy birthday. And it's like, gosh! See, that's what I was able to pull out of it was friends, and I needed that more than anything. So, it came at the perfect time for me. And it was the expectations exceeded all of that. From my experienced in those four days that we were all there.
Marlana
Yeah, unfortunately, I don't think the space exists often enough for women to just support other women. But when we have that space, and when it happens, it is an unbelievably powerful thing.
Tosha
Yeah, I have no idea. It would impact me as much as I think I cried a couple times. I cried, excuse me with my tampers in our room. together one day, we all did. And it was lovely. It wasn't a bad cry, you know? So, it was good.
Marlana
So, as you've gone through this journey, how much of it do you think is talent? And how much of that do you think is connections?
Tosha
In my opinion, you need the talent to get connections, but then you need the connections to get, where whatever path you're wanting to go towards. I mean, I don't want to say 5050 Because that's like cliche, but kind of right down the middle, honestly, because you can always build your talent, you can have a little bit of talent. And if you have a huge work ethic, then your talent can expand to a huge degree. So, that's that, but definitely knowing the right people, but keeping it to where it's not fake or phony. That's kind of the trick, honestly.
Marlana
there's a right way to network and there's a wrong way to network. And I don't think people are taught the right way often enough. We'll just leave it at that.
Tosha
Oh, I've done some really stupid things in the past, in my opinion, not even thinking that oh, this might not be the best idea. you get into this like, Oh my God! I want that gig so much. I'll do anything to get it. And you're just thinking that you're not thinking of how this is going to offend whoever or them think that you only want to contact them because of who they know. I'm guilty of those numerous times. I've learned, luckily, a couple people said, don't do that. So, I learned from that.
Marlana
So, how do you make your connections? Or how do you handle your networking?
Tosha
for example, I am best friends with one of the best drummers on television at the moment, and we have an 11- or 12-year relationship. And I started off by sending him an email, just a cold call email, and told him that I really appreciated his drumming, and I thought he was a great talent. And if he ever had time for drum lessons, or any knowledge, he wanted to drop me with that I would be more than grateful. And he responded and was amazing in his response, and now we're best friends who take me to the Lakers games. And if he doesn't take me to the Lakers games, we go watch the Lakers down the street at a bar, or I babysit his kids for him and his wife sometimes, and it's a give and take equally.
So, he gives me knowledge. And I'm like, Dude, do you know and oh, I remember taking his kid to a computer class one summer, but I wanted to because I couldn't repay him financially. And I definitely couldn't repay him drumming because he's a beast, right? So, I tried to find where I could be of service into him and other ways to where he would know that. I'm not just trying to get something out of him. Right. and so we talk almost multiple times a week, during basketball season, almost every day.
Marlana
Do you think appreciation isn't shown enough?
Tosha
Oh, man. Absolutely! That's an interesting question. Because we're all so different. That if I message someone like, happy birthday, they don't respond or anything, like sometimes I'm like, Man, I said Happy birthday, but there wasn't much of a reaction. And maybe their reaction was enough for them, so things get misconstrued. We're humans are wired. So, strangely, and I find it hard not to take offense to some of that, because I'm very sensitive and emotional. And so, I don't know.
Marlana
At the end of the day, one of the things that I've found is that people really just want to be seen and heard. And it doesn't take a whole lot on anybody's part to say, “hey, listen, thank you, “or “I see you” or “I appreciate you” or any of those kinds of things. So, speaking of appreciation, who's been your biggest influence?
Tosha
Well, definitely any member of No Doubt, from when I was, I had just turned 15 When I got turned on to them. So that was in like, 95 or 96, something like that. Let's see, anyway. And they got me through life, basically. Because during that time, there wasn't easy for me, in the household. And at school, so all I had was music and a dream to be like them, and so they were definitely my biggest influence. But as I got older, I mean, I'm a huge Tommy Lee fan. I always loved him, you know.
But as far as non-celebrities, my mom, my auntie, my aunt Vicki, my sister. My family is amazing. They've been my biggest support through all of this and definitely would not be here if it weren't for them. So, I wouldn't say my family just because they're ultimately, nine times out of 10. Everyone has that situation where their family wants the worst for them. But yeah, I would say my biggest influence my mom and my auntie, my sister.
Marlana
I asked this for a reason. Do you think that initially letting...
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