Episodes
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Dennis McKenna sits down with his old friend Dr. Cedric Baker, an ethnopharmacologist and medical herbalist who studies the ethnobotany of food across more than thirty countries. Together they take apart one of modern medicine's most stubborn assumptions: that food and medicine are separate things. From Thai kitchens where every dish is therapeutic, to the world's longevity hotspots, to the ethics of who owns a plant, it's a conversation that will leave you looking at your own plate a little differently.
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Cedric Barrett Baker is an ethnopharmacologist, food
ethnopharmacognoist, medicinal food ethnobotanist, integrative oncology
medical herbalist, pharmaconutrition research scientist, & medical
botany, pharmacognosy and pharmacy historian. He is also a licensed
Rph.
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As the psychedelic renaissance surges, wild sources are collapsing under
demand—peyote takes decades to grow, safrole extraction is destroying
Southeast Asian forests, and Sonoran Desert toads are being overharvested.
In his book Bioengineering Enlightenment, Prof. Jeffrey Gerst proposes a radical solution: engineer yeast or fast-growing plants to produce psychedelic compounds sustainably. But at what cost? Dennis McKenna warns this could strip these substances from their cultural and ecological roots, veering into biopiracy.
Together, they debate biotech vs. tradition, exploring alternatives like
community-led agroforestry, symbiotic rights, and the “Om Fund” to
return profits to Indigenous stewards. They also revisit Terence McKenna’s “Stoned Ape” hypothesis, asking whether paleogenomics could experimentally probe the evolution of human consciousness.
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Jeffrey Gerst, born and raised in New York, is a Professor of Biology with over three decades of academic experience. He began his career at the Mount Sinai School of Medicine and has since held a long-standing position at the Weizmann Institute of Science in Israel, where he serves as the Besen-Brender Chair of Microbiology and Parasitology. His research focuses on how proteins are correctly localized within cells, particularly through the trafficking of messenger RNA (mRNA), a process essential for normal cellular function and disease prevention.
Among his key contributions, Gerst’s work has demonstrated that mammalian cells can transfer mRNA between one another, revealing a novel form of intercellular communication. His lab is now exploring this mechanism as a potential gene therapy approach to treat rare genetic disorders such as Tay-Sachs, cystic fibrosis, and Gaucher’s disease by enabling targeted RNA delivery within the body.
In addition to his biomedical research, Gerst advocates for the sustainable production of psychedelic compounds using genetic engineering. He is the author of Bioengineering Enlightenment and has presented this work at major scientific conferences.
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Missing episodes?
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Dennis McKenna sits down with journalist Mattha Busby to discuss the evolving world of psychedelics, including ayahuasca, ibogaine, 5-MeO-DMT, coca policy, drug reform, and the risks and realities behind psychedelic retreats and clinics. Mattha shares stories from the front lines of psychedelic journalism and reflects on the cultural, scientific, and political forces shaping the future of consciousness research.
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Mattha Busby is a freelance journalist who has covered drug policy, psychedelics, culture and society for VICE, WIRED, Rolling Stone, The Guardian, LA Times and Esquire. He is the author of two slim volume books, Should All Drugs Be Legalized? (Thames & Hudson, 2022) and Psychedelics: A Pocket Primer (Hoxton Mini Press, 2025). He is represented by literary agents Aevitas Creative and is currently working on his first novel. He has also given keynotes on psychedelic culture on both sides of the Atlantic.
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In this rich and thought-provoking conversation, Dennis McKenna speaks with philosopher Mandi Astola about Terence McKenna, psychedelics, epistemology, shamanism, and the nature of knowledge. Together they explore how psychedelic experiences can produce both genuine insight and dangerous overconfidence, why intellectual humility matters, and how science and shamanic ways of knowing can complement each other. The discussion also touches on the “Stoned Ape” theory, the Timewave, the trickster archetype, and the role of psychedelics as tools for understanding reality, consciousness, and human evolution. A fascinating dialogue for anyone interested in philosophy, altered states, ethics, and the limits of what we know.
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Mandi Astola is a philosopher specializing in epistemology, ethics and ethics of technology. She is assistant professor at Delft University of Technology's philosophy section.
In particular, Mandi's work focuses on character and what features of character make someone a good person, or a good thinker. She is also part of a project, involving multiple universities, that investigates the contribution that various disciplines in the arts can make to ethical reflection on new technologies.
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Join Dennis McKenna and Viktor Wynd for a fascinating conversation on dark fairy tales, strange museum curiosities, Papua New Guinea, storytelling, collecting, and the hidden intelligence of nature.
Viktor Wynd, writer, artist, and founder of the Museum of Curiosities, shares stories from his travels, his love of folklore, and his perspective on art, books, and the living world.
For viewers interested in folklore, ethnobotany, consciousness, rare books, oddities, and the intersection of science, spirit, and wonder.
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Viktor Wynd is a writer, artist, and the proprietor of the eponymous
Museum of Curiosities, Fine Art and UnNatural History in London. He
regularly leads expeditions to Papua New Guinea, the Congo and beyond,
taking small groups with him via his boutique travel agency Gone with
the Wynd. He is the author of Viktor Wynd's Cabinet of Wonders and The
UnNatural History Museum, both published by Prestel.
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Legal Disclaimer: The following content explores the chemistry and history of psychoactive plants for educational research.
No Medical Claims: The Brainforest Café Podcast and
Dennis McKenna do not make any claims regarding the health benefits or
safety of the substances discussed. Any statements made by the guest
regarding physical effects or health outcomes are personal anecdotes and
should not be interpreted as medical advice.
Safety & Legality: This conversation includes
theoretical discussions on chemical synthesis. We do not encourage
illegal activities or the handling of potentially toxic compounds (such
as Ergot fungi). Please adhere to all local laws and regulations.
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Chemist Matthew Stahl shares with Dennis McKenna his discovery that ancient Eleusinian kykeon likely used barley infected with a safe fungus, mixed with young barley's natural plant compounds under mild acid to transform a mild substance into a powerful, LSD-like visionary brew with no nausea.
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Matthew Stahl learned Lab chemistry while attending Texas A&M
University and Texas Lutheran University for 4 years at Texas A&M
University and 2 years at Texas Lutheran University.
He has worked in the Automotive production industry for 32 years, in the
quality department, with chemistry, to achieve enhanced safety and
better performance.
Matthew Stahl has read at least 200 books on psychedelics, numerous
papers, and studied psychedelics for around 24 years.
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Join Dennis McKenna in this insightful conversation with Rebecca Lazarou as they explore the urgent need to preserve ancestral medicinal plant knowledge, the role of ethnopharmacology, and how traditional herbal wisdom can be protected for future generations. Rebecca shares the story behind her PhD research on Cypriot medicinal plants and her mission to document at-risk ethnobotanical knowledge before it disappears. They also discuss citizen science, cultural heritage, biodiversity, and the connection between science and traditional healing.
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IMPORTANT NOTICE:
Due to unforeseen circumstances the activities for Rebecca's event in
London has now shifted. The date and location will be the same, and it
will still be a highly educational event but it will now be a more
intimate home herbalism medicine making workshop.
Participants will learn all about medicinal plants, the medical system,
and will be making their own teas to take home with herbs focused on
mental health and stress. Rebecca will also talk about ethnobotany, have a
herbal tea bar, and all proceeds still go towards supporting her
research.
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Rebecca Lazarou’s work is an ecology of different disciplines spanning across medical science, ethnopharmacology, herbalism, holistic healthcare, cannabis and psychedelics. She is also an activist, writer, speaker and herbal formulator.
She is currently a PhD candidate at Kew Gardens and UCL School of Pharmacy with a focus on ethnopharmacology and herbal medicines. She was the science and managing editor for the ESPD55 volume, is currently co-editor for education charity Herbal Reality and founded Laz The Plant Scientist to bring quality, sustainably sourced herbal medicines and education to people.
She is passionate about democratizing knowledge, and rekindling ethnobotany and herbalism from being marginalised disciplines to part of common knowledge again.
Ultimately her aim is to help nurture our relationship with nature through natural medicines, and support our species return back to Earth centred living. She is devoted to science to demystify these topics, but equally I am committed to rekindling the magic, awe and healing we find on our precious Earth.
You can read more about her work at rebeccalazarou.com
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In this episode of Brainforest Café, Dennis McKenna sits down with
award-winning filmmaker Greg Hemmings to discuss the transformative
power of storytelling and its ability to catalyze social and
environmental change. Greg reveals his personal battle with long COVID
and how it led to his Rewiring the Muse project, which uses
neuroscience and EEG data to track his recovery.
The conversation also explores Greg’s diverse film projects, including
the sci-fi series Revival, the scripted feature on homelessness What
We Dreamed of Then, and the climate documentary The Berg. It further
delves into his profound experience using Wachuma in Peru to reorganize
his brainwaves and restore the creative energy lost during his struggle
with long COVID.
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Greg Hemmings is an award-winning Canadian filmmaker whose work examines how storytelling can catalyze positive social and environmental change. He is the founder of Hemmings House Pictures, a certified B Corporation that produces documentary, factual, and scripted works for international audiences.
Greg’s recent projects explore the intersections of neuroscience, creativity, ecology, and consciousness, with particular interest in how human relationships to nature, including traditional and contemporary research into plant-based knowledge systems, can inform wellbeing and collective resilience. In 2023, he received an honorary doctorate for contributions to the arts and social change. Greg is also a mentor, speaker, musician, and lifelong student of what helps humans—and the planet—thrive.
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Dennis McKenna and OpticMystic explore humble, a graphic meditation on openness, self-questioning, books, technology, AI, love, and the ongoing mystery of what it means to be human.
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OpticMystic a.k.a Hugo Amadeu is just a human fascinated by being alive.
He intended to be an astrophysicist or an oceanographer but ended up
studying graphic design and becoming a freelancer. He worked on DMT: The
Spirit Molecule documentary film by Mitch Schultz, ESPD 50 book and
later at the McKenna Academy. Currently, he is working with Namae Ntumae
at CWays Home performing all sorts of media wizardry. He is also a
sandwriter, musician, writer and terrific dishwasher.
A bookworm from early age, his curiosity and passion for reading has
made him a sort of accidental philosopher. A trance festival, more than
20 years ago, altered profoundly the course of his life and his hopes
for the future. A few, yet, intense psychedelic experiences assured him
that there is certainly more to the world than the eyes can see. Devout
atheist with a profound feeling for the sacred, he will ignore the gods
but embrace the spirits. There is something punk in his approach, an
itchiness for authority and a refusal to compromise that arises from
earnest questioning.
He has written a graphic meditation called “Humble”. An exploration of
ideas that reflect on openness, relativity and love as forms of
approaching the self and the other(s).
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In this special crossover episode of Plants of the Gods and Brainforest Café, Dennis McKenna and Mark Plotkin explore sacred plant medicines, psychedelic science, and indigenous wisdom, moving from DMT and ayahuasca to virola snuffs, salvia, ibogaine, and beyond. Originally recorded for Mark´s Podcast “Plants of the Gods”, this rich conversation on ethnobotany, shamanic healing, and the future of psychedelic medicine is now being released as a special crossover on both shows.
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Dr. Mark Plotkin is a renowned ethnobotanist who has spent more than four decades working alongside Indigenous communities of the Amazon to document and protect traditional plant knowledge. He is President and co-founder of the Amazon Conservation Team (ACT), a nonprofit he launched in 1996 with fellow conservationist and his wife, Liliana Madrigal, to support Indigenous stewardship of tropical forests and biocultural knowledge.
Dr. Plotkin is also the host of Plants of the Gods, a popular podcast exploring hallucinogenic plants and fungi and their powerful influence on world culture, religion, and healing. He is the author of several widely read books on ethnobotany and conservation and has shared his work through a TED Talk and lectures around the world. Dr. Plotkin was educated at Harvard, Yale, and Tufts University.
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Ethnobiologist Michael Coe returns to Brainforest Café with a special
mission: to turn the spotlight onto Dennis McKenna’s lifelong dedication
to ayahuasca, visionary plants, and ethnopharmacology. In this intimate
conversation, Michael honors Dennis’ 54 years in the psychedelic space,
from early fieldwork in the Amazon to pioneering biochemical and
pharmacological research on plant medicines.
The discussion explores the importance of mentorship, with Dennis now
seeing his primary role as supporting a new generation of
ethnobiologists like Michael and their work with indigenous communities
and threatened medicinal plant traditions. Together, they discuss
standing on the shoulders of giants, the challenges of academia and
funding, and why following what “puts fire in your belly” matters more
than chasing titles.
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Michael Coe is an ethnobiologist and applied ecologist with a Ph.D. in
Evolution, Ecology, and Conservation Biology. As an Assistant Professor
at Tarleton State University, his teaching and research focuses on the
relationships between humans, ecosystems, and traditional knowledge
systems. Passionate about biodiversity and the sustainable management of natural resources, Michael brings a dynamic interdisciplinary perspective, helping to integrate contemporary ethnobiology and ecology with traditional ecological practices to inform sustainable use
strategies, conservation priorities, and global medicine security.
Michael is the principal investigator (PI) for the COE LAB where they
are conducting hypothesis driven research in ethnobiology and harvest
impact assessments on medicinal plants that serve as a primary source of
healthcare for over 80% of the world's population. Michael is also the
Director for Research and Education for the Pacha Nishi project, a
Shipibo-Konibo led effort in the Peruvian Amazon basin seeking to
restore 20ha. of degraded land in an agroforestry setting with a primary
goal to inform sustainable ayahuasca production in the area as locally
sourced sustainably grown medicine.
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Discover Una Meistere’s journey from Soviet-era Latvia to becoming a
bridge between indigenous plant medicines, psychedelic science, art, and
Baltic traditions in this in-depth conversation with ethnobotanist
Dennis McKenna. They explore ayahuasca, psilocybin mushrooms in Latvia, Amanita muscaria, and ancient sauna rituals as a kind of “Latvian
ayahuasca,” touching on symbiosis with nature and how psychedelic
experiences can help heal our disconnection from the natural world.
Una shares how synchronicities led her from journalism to co-founding
Arterritory, Spiriterritory, and the NGO Veseliba Latvija, and to
organizing the first psychedelic science conferences in Latvia together
with the University of Latvia. The discussion dives into stigma, legal
grey zones, human rights to psychedelic-assisted therapies, and the
Baltic region’s emerging role in the global psychedelic renaissance.
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Michael Coe is an ethnobiologist and applied ecologist with a Ph.D. in Evolution, Ecology, and Conservation Biology. As an Assistant Professor at Tarleton State University, his teaching and research focuses on the relationships between humans, ecosystems, and traditional knowledge systems. Passionate about biodiversity and the sustainable management of natural resources, Michael brings a dynamic interdisciplinary perspective, helping to integrate contemporary ethnobiology and ecology with traditional ecological practices to inform sustainable use strategies, conservation priorities, and global medicine security. Michael is the principal investigator (PI) for the COE LAB where they are conducting hypothesis driven research in ethnobiology and harvest impact assessments on medicinal plants that serve as a primary source of healthcare for over 80% of the world's population. Michael is also the Director for Research and Education for the Pacha Nishi project, a Shipibo-Konibo led effort in the Peruvian Amazon basin seeking to restore 20ha. of degraded land in an agroforestry setting with a primary goal to inform sustainable ayahuasca production in the area as locally sourced sustainably grown medicine.
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Terence McKenna was the stand‑up philosopher of the apocalypse. A cognitive libertarian. The anti‑guru who rejected authority—even his own. Twenty‑five years after his passing, the “Tryptamine Elf King” still haunts the present, reverberating through the sensorium of a new generation.
Inspired by Graham St John’s definitive magnum opus, Strange Attractor: The Hallucinatory Life of Terence McKenna, the inner circle—the family, the friends, and the co‑conspirators who knew the man behind the myth—came together for an extraordinary online conversation.
PANELISTS BIOGRAPHIES:
Dennis McKenna and his brother Terence first came to S. America in 1971. Their unexpected adventures in pursuit of exotic psychedelics led to some surprising discoveries recounted in Terence’s book, True Hallucinations, and Dennis’ 2012 memoir, The Brotherhood of the Screaming Abyss. In 1981, Dennis returned to Peru, this time as a graduate student, and began his scientific investigations of ayahuasca. In 2019 he founded the McKenna Academy of Natural Philosophy.
Graham St John, PhD, is a cultural anthropologist and historian of transformational events, movements, and figures. His new book Strange Attractor: The Hallucinatory Life of Terence McKenna (MIT Press, Oct 7, 2025) is the latest among his ten books, which also include Mystery School in Hyperspace: A Cultural History of DMT (North Atlantic Books 2015). Graham is Senior Research Fellow in the Department of Media, Humanities and the Arts at the University of Huddersfield, UK.
Tama Starr is an acclaimed author and former president of Artkraft Strauss, the historic company behind Times Square's iconic signs and the New Year’s Eve Ball. A pioneering psychedelic yogi, she is connected to Terence McKenna’s circle and recorded one of his earliest talks. Starr’s work spans literature, business, and psychedelic culture.
R.U. Sirius is a cultural icon best known as founder and editor-in-chief of the influential 1990s cyberdelic magazine Mondo 2000. He authored multiple books including collaborations with Timothy Leary and is also a lyricist and vocalist, currently active with the album The Smarter Kings of Deliria by R.U. Sirius & Phriendz.
Dr. Bruce Damer is an astrobiologist and Chief Scientist at the BIOTA Institute, UC Santa Cruz, known for co-authoring a leading origin-of-life hypothesis. He also pioneers psychedelic insight research through the Center for MINDS and has designed innovative spacecraft concepts for NASA. Damer collaborated with Terence McKenna on early virtual worlds and explores humanity’s cosmic future.
Dan Levy, New York-based since 1988, edited Terence McKenna’s key books: The Archaic Revival, True Hallucinations, and The Invisible Landscape (2nd ed.). An early WELL member, he built pioneering websites for McKenna, Bob Dylan, Patti Smith, and more. He taught programming to kids and serves on The Jazz Gallery board.
Lorenzo Hagerty is a former Navy officer turned cyber-lawyer and storyteller, known for founding the Psychedelic Salon podcast. With decades at the crossroads of technology, culture, and consciousness, he explores AI's connection to Terence McKenna’s TimeWave theory through his fiction and public talks.
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Sharon McKenna is the director and producer of the forthcoming feature documentary, “It’s Going to Get Weirder: The Terence McKenna Story.”
Sharon is a writer, film director, and journalist whose work has appeared in a range of outlets, from several alternative weeklies to MSNBC digital, among others. Her career spans three-plus decades of network news production, investigative reporting, corporate creative work and screenwriting. Her screenplays have been optioned and won numerous awards, and she has worked as a script reader and consultant for several film production companies.
She is a member of the International Documentary Association, Film Independent, Women in Film, the Electronic Frontier Foundation and several other organizations dedicated to filmmaking, the arts, and freedom of speech. Sharon has various projects in the works; to learn more about her, visit her creative hub: seanchaistudio.com and you can learn more about the Terence McKenna documentary project at goingtogetweirder.com
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Nissan started his career as a medical doctor and began his work as a general practitioner in an urban community clinic system. He then specialized in ophthalmology and practiced in a small town for 36 years. He became dissatisfied working strictly on the physical level and received training in Gestalt psychotherapy and had a small private practice. He became interested in the field of Natural Vision Improvement which combined his interest in vision with present moment, embodied presence. A reading from a tarot card reading psychic suggested the need for working in and with the spiritual realm to facilitate the Natural Vision work and suggested there were some gifts for him in shamanism. His wife had had a powerful experience in a ceremony with Don José Campos and encouraged him to explore Ayahuasca as a method to open himself spiritually. He had two very different , but powerful experiences with Don José and participated in a plant dieta in the Amazon in 2005 with Don José. He received what he interpreted as an initiatory experience and felt called to be trained as a vegetalista. He embarked on the training under Don José and Don Lucho’s guidance and began leading ceremonies in the US in 2009 and in 2011 began leading plant dietas in the Amazon. He continues to lead ceremonies in various locations in the US and occasionally Canada and leads dietas in the Amazon twice a year.
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Zina Brown is the writer and director of The Faerie Rings, an upcoming narrative feature filmabout the promise of visionary plant medicines, and the cruelty of those who would outlawthem.Zina’s unique visual and narrative style has been awarded in film festivals across the world,including the Barcelona International Environmental Film Festival, Kyiv Film Festival inUkraine, Mexico City International Film Festival, Amsterdam International Film Festival, SanAntonio Film Festival, and the Woods Hole Film Festival.He has over 25 years of writing and directing experience, including numerous music videosand festival favorite short films. His short film, Dreams of the Last Butterflies, was screenedat 50 Film Festivals in 13 countries, as well as winning many awards.
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Kevin Reed, founder and president of the Entheogen Stewardship Project, a vital new nonprofit organization dedicated to protecting culturally significant plant and animal species sacred to indigenous communities worldwide.Kevin brings a remarkable 45-year journey as a student of psychedelic science and culture to this crucial conservation work. His path began in 1984 under the mentorship of legendary researchers Sasha and Anne Shulgin, followed by profound connections with iconic figures including Wavy Gravy, Jack Herer, Timothy Leary, Rick Strassman, and many others who have shaped the modern psychedelic renaissance.Kevin's hands-on expertise spans an impressive range of fields: from teaching cannabis extraction in the mountains of Jamaica in 1985, to large-scale indoor cultivation in the Netherlands, to designing and successfully opening a state-of-the-art Type 7 cannabis manufacturing facility in California. His diverse interests encompass mycology, conservation biology, indigenous traditions, accelerated learning, transpersonal psychology, and ethical wildcrafting—principles that now support his conservation philosophy.The Entheogen Stewardship Project represents the culmination of Kevin's decades-long commitment to both psychedelic wisdom, indigenous rights and environmental protection. The organization combats illegal trafficking and exploitation of endangered entheogenic species while fostering respectful collaboration with all indigenous communities whose ancestral knowledge have safeguarded these sacred plant and animal spirits for millennia.Kevin's work addresses one of the most pressing issues facing our community today: how do we honor and protect the plant and animal teachers that have guided human consciousness for thousands of years, while ensuring their survival for future generations?
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Graham St John, PhD, is a cultural anthropologist and historian of transformational events, movements, and figures. His forthcoming book Strange Attractor: The Hallucinatory Life of Terence McKenna (MIT Press, Oct 7, 2025) is the latest among his ten books, which also include Mystery School in Hyperspace: A Cultural History of DMT (North Atlantic Books 2015). Graham is Senior Research Fellow in the Department of Media, Humanities and the Arts at the University of Huddersfield, UK.
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Graham St John, PhD, is a cultural anthropologist and historian of transformational events, movements, and figures. His forthcoming book Strange Attractor: The Hallucinatory Life of Terence McKenna (MIT Press, Sep 30, 2025) is the latest among his ten books, which also include Mystery School in Hyperspace: A Cultural History of DMT (North Atlantic Books 2015). Graham is Senior Research Fellow in the Department of Media, Humanities and the Arts at the University of Huddersfield, UK.
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