Episódios
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In this episode of the Last Service Podcast, Matt welcomes Sam Rainer, pastor, church consultant, and president of Church Answers, for a candid discussion about the state of the American church. Together, they explore the challenges facing congregations today, from declining membership to generational shifts in engagement. Sam shares actionable insights on how churches can revitalize, stay relevant, and impact their local communities. Whether you're a pastor, church leader, or member, this episode is packed with wisdom to inspire and guide your ministry.
Key Takeaways:
Community-Centered Ministry: Churches thrive when they shift focus from attracting crowds to deeply engaging their local neighborhoods.Opportunities for Mid-Sized Churches: With the decline of the mega-church movement, mid-sized churches hold untapped potential for growth and generational outreach.Breaking the Decline Cycle: Strategic reinvention, mergers, and prioritizing multi-ethnic ministry can help churches overcome decline and build a sustainable future.Topics Discussed:
Sam’s personal journey from business to ministryThe purpose and tools offered by Church AnswersKey challenges facing American evangelical churches todayThe rise of Gen Z’s religious commitment and its implications for church leadershipThe importance of multi-ethnic ministry in a changing demographic landscapeStrategies for mid-sized churches to grow and serve their communitiesHow to navigate the end of a church lifecycle with grace and kingdom purposeQuotes from the Episode:
“The church is not a destination for crowds; it’s a vehicle to go to your neighborhood and the nations.” – Sam Rainer“You can grow a church so inward that it dies. The Great Commission must always be at the forefront.”“Breaking the church lifecycle requires intentional renewal and reinvention, one step at a time.”Resources Mentioned:
Church Answers – Tools, coaching, and resources for church revitalization and growthGraphs About Religion by Ryan Burge – WebsiteThe Surprising Return of the Neighborhood Church by Sam RainerConnect with Us:
Visit our website for more episodes and resources: lastservicepodcast.comRate & Review:If you enjoyed this episode, please leave a review on Apple Podcasts or your favorite podcast platform. Your feedback helps us reach more listeners!
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🎙️ Episode HighlightsIn this special recap episode, host [Matt] reflects on the journey through Season 1 of The Last Service Podcast. Joined by his wife, Maureen, they dive into the heart of the podcast’s mission—exploring church closures, transitions, and the faithful endings that can lead to new beginnings.
✨ Key Topics Covered:
Season Favorites:
Episode 5: The heartfelt story of Rehoboth Presbyterian in Atlanta.Conversations with churchrealty.com's John Muzyka on the pastoral care side of realty.Insights from Bob Smeitana and Mark Elsdon on church decline in America.Legal knowledge from Erika Cole and the Good Friday Collaborative episodes.Lessons Learned:
The role of pastoral care in closures.How demographic and cultural shifts impact churches.The importance of self-awareness and community support in navigating change.Personal Reflections:
Matt shares insights from guiding a non-profit closure and the power of intentional endings.Key takeaways: "Thank you, I love you, I’m sorry, I forgive you."💡 Why ListenWhether you’re navigating a church transition, a non-profit leader, or simply curious about the dynamics of faithful endings, this recap offers wisdom, encouragement, and practical advice.
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In this powerful season finale, Matt sits down with the legendary religion news reporter and author Bob Smietana to explore the pressing realities facing churches today. From demographic shifts to the challenges of revitalization, Bob shares insights from his acclaimed book, Reorganized Religion, and personal experiences with church closures. This episode is packed with heartfelt stories, actionable insights, and a message of hope for communities navigating change.
Key Topics Covered:
The decline of church attendance: What's driving the numbers?Demographic and cultural changes impacting church vitality.Stories of resilience: Churches finding new purposes through partnerships and creativity.When it's time to close: The emotional and practical realities.Bob’s personal reflections on his own church's closure.Highlights You Won’t Want to Miss:
[5:15] Why the American church boom of the mid-20th century is over.[15:50] The “Walmart effect” of church consolidation and its impact on smaller congregations.[28:30] What makes a “good ending” for a church, and how planning ahead can make all the difference.[35:40] Heartwarming stories of community and music from Bob’s former church.[46:10] How one pastor helped his congregation embrace closure with dignity.3 Key Takeaways:
1. churches are closing mainly due to changes in demographics and society. What worked to grow churches in prior decades no longer works, and it is often difficult for churches with older buildings to adapt to a new environment.
2. It's better when a church's building, property, and assets stay connected to the mission when transferring ownership.
3. Bob reports on and has written about many churches that have closed. When he and his wife experienced a closing with the congregation they cared about, they experienced a sense of loss and grief. But they also felt sent forth by a community that helped shape their lives. Maybe a church can still be about sending long after it has stopped being able to bring people into a building.
Resources Mentioned:
Reorganized Religion: The Reshaping of the American Church and Why it Matters by Bob SmietanaThe Great Dechurching: Who’s Leaving, Why Are They Going, and What Will It Take to Bring Them Back? by Jim DavisThe Good Friday Collabrative's 5 Stages of Church ClosureShare this episode with friends and fellow churchgoers to spark meaningful conversations about the future of faith communities.
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In this episode of The Last Service Podcast, Matt dives into a conversation with Reverend Dr. Katie Nix and Reverend Dr. Phil Blackwell, pastors who led two congregations through a unique journey of merger and renewal. They share the incredible challenges and blessings of bringing together two legacy churches into a unified, mission-focused community. This merger took place amidst the complexities of the pandemic, highlighting the resilience, adaptability, and faith that fueled their journey.
Dr. Nix and Dr. Blackwell explore what they learned in this process, from honoring each congregation's history to forging a shared vision for the future. They discuss practical insights into measuring success beyond traditional metrics, fostering a welcoming environment, and asking questions that prompt creative, forward-thinking ministry. Their story offers inspiring takeaways for church leaders, members, and anyone invested in the future of faith communities.
Key Takeaways:Embrace Legacy with Purpose – The success of University and Grace UMC's merger hinged on respecting the legacies of each congregation while building a unified identity that serves both past and future communities.
Measure Success Beyond Numbers – Traditional metrics like attendance are important but don't paint the whole picture; focus also on creating spaces for spiritual growth, and meaningful community impact.
Ask Courageous Questions for Renewal – Continuously revisit your church's mission and ask, "What is God calling us to do next?" Embracing imagination and openness can reveal new paths for ministry and outreach.
Listen to The Doctors are In and the story of Grace UMC's merger with University UMC here:
https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-doctors-are-in/id1706168185
https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/kathryn-nix/episodes/The-Doctors-Are-In--S3-E2-A-Pastors-Perspective-on-Our-Church-Merger-e2q3mt6
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In this episode of The Last Service Podcast, we dive into the profound journey of pastoral transitions with Matt Davis, host of the Life After Ministry Podcast. Matt shares his personal experiences of stepping away from ministry after a moral failure and navigating life outside the church. This episode explores the emotional and logistical challenges pastors face when leaving a church and provides guidance on managing these transitions with grace and support. Davis's story is a testament to resilience and purpose, reminding us that even in difficult seasons, there is potential for growth and reorientation.
Key Takeaways:
Creating Compassionate Exits – Matt emphasizes that churches must prioritize compassion and dignity during pastoral exits, advocating for "kingdom outplacement." By offering structured support like coaching, counseling, and resume assistance, churches can model Christ-like love and compassion in difficult seasons.Provide Financial and Emotional Support – Financial insecurity frequently accompanies pastoral exits, leaving pastors in challenging positions when they are let go or the church closes. Be generous with severance and communicate with compassion.
The value of third party help - Difficult transitions for pastors or congregations at the end of their life can benefit from third party wisdom and guidance. Bringing in a third party, like Pastoral Transitions, demonstrates a commitment to all people involved and a determination to end well.
Additional Topics Covered:The spiritual struggle pastors face in redefining their sense of callingHow structured transitions can contribute to healthier, more unified churchesInsights on how churches can foster transparency and support during challenging pastoral changesResources:www.pastoraltransitions.com
Life After Ministry Podcast
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In this powerful episode of The Last Service Podcast, Matt continues his conversation with Reverend Lorrin Radzik as they explore the complexities of church closures. Lorrin shares her personal journey of closing multiple churches and the unique challenges faced when congregations are forced to confront their own mortality. Together, they dive into how pastors can lead through difficult decisions, the role of a daycare ministry, and the emotional toll of these transitions. Yet amidst the grief, Lorrin uncovers the hopeful message of resurrection within the church’s final days.
Listeners will be inspired by the candid discussion of what it means to lead faithfully, even when the end is near, and how to embrace new beginnings in unexpected places.
Key Takeaways:
Resurrection Beyond Closure: Lorrin explains that even when churches close, their ministry can live on through community connections, spiritual legacies, and even new congregations inhabiting former spaces.The Emotional Toll of Church Decline: The episode explores the grief and anger that often accompany church closures, highlighting the resilience required of pastors to navigate these emotional waters with compassion and courage.Reframing Success: Church closure doesn’t mean failure. Matt and Lorrin discuss how honoring a church’s history and legacy can help members find peace in knowing they fulfilled their mission. -
In this raw and insightful episode, Matt sits down with Rev. Lorrin Radzik, a United Methodist pastor with a powerful story of navigating the complexities of ministry, church closure, and personal growth. Lorrin shares her experience leading a struggling congregation in Wisconsin, where she guided the church through the challenging decision to close after decades of decline. Her journey, filled with difficult conversations, resilience, and ultimate closure, offers deep insights into the reality of pastoral leadership and church vitality.
Key Takeaways:
The Impact on PastorsLorrin was placed in an impossible situation with unrealistic expectations at an early and critical time in her career. At times, she questioned her calling and ability. Young pastors rarely reverse the outcome of a dying church. Search committees and denominational officials must consider the long-term impact on a young minister's career when placed in a declining church, or at least be straightforward about the church's history and stage of life.
Leading with Transparency and CourageThroughout the process, Lorrin demonstrated the importance of being honest with congregants about the church's future, even when it was difficult. Her story highlights the necessity of courageous leadership, especially in times of crisis. Lorrin confronted denial and anger in her congregation while still recognizing their faithfulness.
Closure as a Faithful DecisionWhile closing a church might seem like a failure, Lorrin reframes it as an act of faithfulness. She emphasizes that sometimes, the most faithful thing a church can do is to close, passing its legacy and resources on to a new community for future ministry.
Resources:
http://www.revlorrinradzik.com/
https://www.goodfridaycollaborative.com/
https://nationalhmongcaucusumc.weebly.com/
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In this compelling episode of The Last Service Podcast, host Matt interviews Dave Meserve, an experienced transitional pastor who has guided multiple churches through the difficult process of closing. Dave shares powerful stories and invaluable insights on how to approach church closures with compassion, wisdom, and a focus on spiritual health.
Key Points:
Dave's unique journey from traditional ministry to becoming a "pastor at large" and transitional leaderThe importance of addressing "faith ceilings" and allowing for spiritual growth in church leadershipDetailed accounts of two non-denominational church closures Dave facilitatedThe critical role of trust-building and transparent communication during church transitionsHow to create meaningful closing ceremonies that honor a church's history and provide closureThe significance of "staying for the benediction" - finding blessing in the ending processInsights on matching pastoral leadership styles to church size and growth goalsThe value of diverse leadership teams, including both men and womenUnderstanding churches as relationships with natural lifespansQuotes: "Don't leave before the benediction - there's a blessing if you stay to the end." - Dave Meserve "Churches have lifespans. They have beginnings, long middles we hope, and ends." - Dave Meserve
Keywords: church closure, transitional pastor, faith ceiling, non-denominational churches, church leadership, pastoral care, church ceremonies, spiritual health, church size dynamics, diverse leadership, church lifespan
This episode offers essential guidance for church leaders, pastors, and congregants facing potential church closures or significant transitions. Dave Meserve's experiences provide a roadmap for approaching these challenging situations with grace, intentionality, and a focus on long-term spiritual wellbeing.
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In this episode, host Matt interviews Gail Cafferata, author of "The Last Pastor" and a retired Episcopal priest who closed a church. Gail shares her personal experience closing a congregation and insights from her research surveying over 100 pastors who have gone through church closures.
Key topics discussed:- Gail's background as a medical sociologist and Episcopal priest- The emotional and career toll of closing a church on pastors- How sailing metaphors can help understand church leadership - The importance of "differentiation" for pastors leading dying churches- Ways congregations and denominations can support pastors through closure- What constitutes a "good death" for a congregation
3 Key Takeaways:
1. Closing a church takes a significant emotional and career toll on pastors, with many experiencing stress, isolation, and difficulty finding new positions afterward.
2. "Differentiation" - maintaining healthy boundaries between oneself and the congregation - is crucial for pastors leading churches through closure.
3. A "good death" for a church involves celebrating its legacy, providing pastoral care, and empowering members to continue ministry elsewhere.
This episode provides valuable insights for pastors, church leaders, and anyone interested in the challenges facing declining congregations in America today.
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In this episode, we sit down with Mike Sares, director of Urban Skye, to discuss their unique approach to ministry outside traditional church structures. Mike shares insights from his extensive experience, including pastoring Scum of the Earth Church and working with various faith entrepreneurs.
Key points covered:
• Urban Skye acts as an umbrella organization for freelance pastors, providing administrative support and spiritual community• Their model draws inspiration from St. Patrick's missionary approach of engaging culture• Mike discusses the importance of relationship-building and entering people's worlds rather than expecting them to enter the church's world• Urban Skye supports a wide variety of ministries, from prison outreach to counseling for missionaries to creative arts programs• The organization emphasizes experimentation and allows for failure as part of the growth process• Mike shares thoughts on how declining churches can learn from Urban Skye's flexible, relationship-focused approach
Mike provides a refreshing perspective on doing ministry in today's cultural landscape, emphasizing authenticity, humility, and a willingness to color outside the lines of traditional church structures. His insights are valuable for pastors, church leaders, and anyone interested in innovative approaches to faith and community.
3 Key Takeaways:
1. Effective ministry often happens outside church walls, meeting people where they are culturally and spiritually.2. Embracing failure and experimentation is crucial for spiritual growth and innovative ministry.3. Declining churches can benefit from focusing on relationships and being willing to change their approaches drastically.
Resources:
https://www.urbanskye.org/
https://www.mikesares.com/
Pure Scum by Mike Sares
https://scumoftheearth.net/
https://www.fiveironfrenzy.com/
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In this episode of The Last Service Podcast, host Matt interviews Bart McDonald from the Southern Baptist of Texas Foundation about their innovative Jubilee Program. This program helps struggling churches preserve their assets and legacy while transitioning to new ministries or congregations.
Key Points:
The Jubilee Program is based on biblical principles from Leviticus and DeuteronomyIt allows dying churches to transfer their property to the foundation, which then renovates and transfers it to new ministriesThe program has rescued millions of dollars in church assets that may have otherwise been lostIt provides financial stability and guidance to both struggling churches and new church plantsThe foundation takes a pastoral approach, encouraging churches that God is not disappointed in themQuotes: "We don't want to hold a Jubilee property in our possession any longer than it takes to get it back into the hands of the local New Testament church." - Bart McDonald
"If God's people will get together and prayerfully seek the face of God, it's been my experience that God's people will almost always do the right thing." - Bart McDonald
Key Takeaways:
The Jubilee program applies real estate principles in a non-profit framework to give dying churches better options.Partnering with other ministries to use empty church space is not always good stewardship - financial viability must be considered.Churches often wait too late to ask for help. Declining churches should seek guidance early from denominational resources.Call-to-Action: If you've been part of a church closing or merger, share your story by emailing [email protected]
Related Topics: Church revitalization, Church planting, Baptist churches, Church property management, Legacy giving
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In this episode of The Last Service Podcast, host Matt McGee interviews Dr. Myles Werntz, Associate Professor of Theology at Abilene Christian University. They discuss the concept of scarcity in churches and how it's affecting congregations across denominations. Dr. Werntz shares insights from his recent Christianity Today article "Scarcity's Strange Gifts" and explores the challenges and opportunities presented by resource constraints in modern church settings.
Key topics covered:
The psychological effects of scarcity on decision-makingHistorical and biblical perspectives on church scarcityStrategies for churches facing declining resourcesThe potential benefits and virtues developed through scarcityThe future of church staffing and ministry modelsThree Key Takeaways:
Scarcity is becoming a widespread issue for churches across denominations, affecting resources, attendance, and staffing. This trend is likely to continue and requires new approaches to ministry.While challenging, scarcity can provide unexpected benefits such as increased focus, empathy, and creativity in problem-solving. It may also foster the development of important virtues like courage and patience.Churches may need to consider new models of ministry, including bi-vocational pastors, increased lay leadership, and resource sharing between congregations, to effectively navigate scarce conditions.Keywords: church scarcity, declining resources, ministry challenges, church leadership, bi-vocational ministry, church attendance trends, Christian ethics, theology, church growth
Resources:
Scarcity's Strange Gifts by Myles Werntz
Myles Werntz's Substack
Howard Thurman
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In this episode of The Last Service Podcast, host Matt interviews Dr. Stanley Granberg, founder of Heritage 21, an organization dedicated to helping declining churches make critical decisions about their future. Dr. Granberg shares his extensive experience in church planting, missions, and organizational leadership, offering valuable insights into the challenges facing aging congregations.
Key topics discussed:
The Quick 50 Assessment: A simple tool to determine if a church needs to consider its existential future, based on three factors: church age, average member age, and attendance.The threshold for church survivability: Why 60 in attendance is a crucial number for church sustainability and the shift from public to private spheres.The concept of "stewarding God's mission" and how it applies to churches in various stages of life, including decline.The five systems that impact church health: theological, missional, leadership, relational, and physical.The importance of perspective and making proactive decisions before reaching a stage of "leadership dementia."A case study of a church closure that resulted in positive outcomes and the continuation of God's mission through new church plants.The challenges of conflict resolution in declining churches and the impact on closure decisions.The inevitability of system failures in churches and the opportunity for renewal.Dr. Granberg emphasizes the importance of courage, facing reality, and putting plans on paper to gain perspective when dealing with church decline. He encourages church leaders to view their situation objectively and make informed decisions about their future.
3 Key Takeaways:
The Quick 50 Assessment (50 years old, 50 average age, 50 or fewer in attendance) is a useful tool for identifying churches that may need to consider their long-term viability.Church planters consider 60 in regular attendance to be an indicator of viability. 60 feels like a crowd and has adequate energy to do ministry.Addressing church decline requires a systems-thinking approach. Churches are a network of systems. Like organs in a body, the systems will eventually fail.Resources:
Empty Church: Why People Don't Come and What to Do About It by Dr. Stanley Granberg
Heritage 21
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In this special "Potluck" episode of The Last Service Podcast, host Matt McGee catches up with his old friend, Dr. Jim Trammell, Associate Professor of Communication at High Point University, a frequent contributor to Baptist News Global, and deacon at Emerywood Baptist Church, to discuss the evolving role of media in modern church worship. They explore how technology and media shape congregations, online church services' pros and cons, and the challenges facing traditional and contemporary worship styles.
Key Topics Discussed:
The impact of media and technology on church servicesDifferences between traditional and contemporary worship spacesThe rise of online church and its effects on communityBalancing evangelism and discipleship in media-driven churchesThe inevitability of church closures and how to approach themThe "coolness factor" in modern worship and its implicationsNotable Quotes: "In a lot of contemporary media-centric churches, media is so important to how they do worship that if you eliminate all the electronic media, you no longer have a service." - Dr. Jim Trammell
Keyword Tags:church media, worship technology, online church, church closures, contemporary worship, traditional worship, evangelism, discipleship, church community
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Discover how the Dinner Church Collective is revitalizing the way we experience church and reach the unchurched. In this thought-provoking episode, Verlon Fosner shares his journey of transforming a dying church into a vibrant community centered around the simple act of gathering for a meal and engaging with the stories of Jesus. Learn about the sociological challenges facing modern churches, the surprising spiritual experiences witnessed at Jesus' tables, and the growth of this innovative approach across the country. Gain insights into building an inclusive and accessible form of worship that resonates with those disconnected from traditional church settings.
Outline:
Introduction to Verlon Fosner and his backgroundThe decline of his church and the realization of a sociological problemThe idea of Dinner Church and its origins in the New TestamentThe structure and format of a Dinner Church gatheringThe impact of Dinner Church on isolated and unchurched individualsThe surprising spiritual experiences and healings witnessed at Jesus' tablesThe growth of the Dinner Church movement across the countryResources for learning more about Dinner ChurchKey Takeaways:
Despite everyone's best efforts Westminster Community was unsuccessful at revitalizing. Revitalization came by becoming aware of the sociological needs of their surrounding community. Verlon used words like 'rescue' and 'recovery' to describe their new sense of mission, rather than words like 'reach' and 'attract' which are often associated with church growth.Verlon's five aspects of what makes a church a church are a great way to measure the health of your church beyond just attendance or membership:WorshipFellowshipDiscipleshipEvangelismCompassionThe apostolic age of the church might be the best place to look for inspiration on how to be a church in an unchurched world. Given our society's current rates of loneliness, isolation and division, it's not that surprising to see Westminster Community Assembly of God grow across a city by building tables rather than auditoriums.Resources:
https://www.dinnerchurch.com/
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Karl Vaters joins The Last Service Podcast to discuss the unique challenges and opportunities facing small churches. With over 40 years of pastoral experience and as the author of several books on small church ministry, Karl provides valuable insights to help small congregations thrive.
Key Topics:
- Defining what constitutes a "small church"- The obsession with big church models and church growth movements - Finding metrics beyond attendance to assess church health- Navigating successful pastoral transitions and succession plans- The life cycle of churches and signs it may be ending- Creating a positive legacy when a church closes
Quotes:
"We have to be thinking more innovatively and creatively than just the church building itself." - Karl Vaters on repurposing church facilities
"Integrity is the new competence. We've been teaching primarily management tools for 30 years. People aren't leaving because we didn't get techniques right, but because of a lack of integrity." - Vaters
"There does come a point where a church closing becomes inevitable...you have to be proactive and make difficult decisions." - Vaters on knowing when to end well
Listen to this insightful episode to gain wisdom for thriving as a small congregation or navigating a church's ending with Christ-centered integrity.
3 Key Takeaways:
1. Small churches are different animals than large churches, and bigger isn't always better. Be careful of applying big church solutions and tools to small churches and find ways to define the church's health beyond Sunday morning attendance.
2. Pastor transitions can cause existential problems for a church. They require time, intention, and clear communication.
3. We can think of a church's lifecycle like flowing down a river. There will be an ending. We must be aware of where we are in our life cycle and pay attention to the signs of what's coming. When we've passed the point of no return, let Christ be your legacy and do the work to ensure the remaining resources build the kingdom of God.
Resources:
karlvaters.com
Karl's books, including De-Sizing the Church
Church Lobby Podcast
Ignatian Spirituality
Les McKeown and Carey Nieuwhof on Church Life Cycles
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In this insightful episode, Matt talks with Erika Cole, known as the Church Attorney, about navigating the legal process of church closures and mergers. Erika provides a wealth of knowledge on checklist items, vital documents, legal steps, and wisdom for churches going through this transition.
As churches across America continue to close at an alarming rate, having proper legal guidance is crucial for a good ending. Erika Cole, the renowned Church Attorney, joins the podcast to walk through the important steps churches need to take when facing a closure or merger. From collecting vital documents to understanding decision-making processes, asset distribution, and finding the right legal counsel - Erika covers it all with competence, character and compassion. This is an invaluable episode for any church leader contemplating the future of their congregation.
Keywords: church closing, church merger, nonprofit law, church attorney, church leadership, legal counsel for churches, ministry transition, ending well
Listen to this powerful discussion to gain Erika's expert guidance for churches approaching their final chapter. Her wisdom will help ensure an inspirational and God-honoring conclusion.
Key Takeaways
Cultivate a culture of self-assessment - this will help you recognize signs of decline and give you a healthy amount of time to weigh options and end well.Find your critical legal documents and review them every two years - Use The Church Attorney's Checklist (see below)Erika's love for the church shines throughout our conversation. Look for an attorney with Competence, Character, and Compassion—someone who has experience in non-profits and churches, not just businesses and contracts.Resources:
www.erikacole.com
Church Law Podcast: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/church-law/id1586340872
Masterclass: https://www.erikacole.com/thechurchattorney-masterclass
The Church Attorney's Guide to Church Mergers: https://www.erikacole.com/shop/p/the-church-attorneys-guide-to-church-mergers
Church Legal Document Checklist
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In this episode, Matt is joined by Rev. Diane Kenaston, co-founder of The Good Friday Collaborative. They discuss how churches can approach the difficult process of closing, merging, or consolidating ministries faithfully and pastorally. Diane shares her own experience leading a church through a merger and the valuable lessons learned. She also unpacks the five stages of church closures outlined by The Good Friday Collaborative as a framework for congregations.
Key Topics:- The origins of The Good Friday Collaborative- Diane's personal story of leading a church through merger - Dealing with the stigma and shame around church closure- The 5 stages of church closures: Quiet Wondering, Naming & Normalizing, Intentional Decision Making, Planning for Final Ministry, Leading Final Ministry- Providing spiritual care for "last pastors" overseeing church closures- Overcoming exhaustion to achieve a good, faithful ending- Embracing death and new beginnings as part of the church's resurrection
Key Quotes:"We need to approach discernment with open hands, listening for how God is guiding us." "A good ending is when the congregation has the chance to say thank you, I love you, I'm sorry, and I forgive you.""Dying is inevitable, so church closures are inevitable. But we believe in resurrection and new beginnings too."
This insightful episode is a must-listen for any church leader grappling with decline and facing difficult decisions about their congregation's future. Rev. Kenaston provides compassionate, theologically grounded wisdom for navigating church closures faithfully.
3 takeaways:
1. Many pastors at declining congregations are relatively young and in the first half of their careers. Closing a church earlier in life could profoundly impact the pastor's career for decades. Do what you can to provide spiritual aftercare for the pastor who has guided a congregation through merger or closure. It will impact future generations of the church.
2. Good Friday Collaborative 5 Stages of Closure is an invaluable framework for the spiritual, emotional, and logistical path to ending well. Read it and study it long before your church is in decline.
3. Rev. Kenaston's church was beautifully intentional about every aspect of their merger despite their exhaustion. I'm sure it wasn't perfect, but they found joy during their grief. They made decisions in keeping with where they believed God had called them until their final service. And then they were made into something new. This is the work of a good shepherd.
Resources:
https://www.goodfridaycollaborative.com/
Church Closure in 5 Stages: https://www.goodfridaycollaborative.com/writing/church-closure-in-five-stages
Article: How to Avoid the Stained-Glass Cliff When Leading a Dying Church: https://faithandleadership.com/how-avoid-falling-the-stained-glass-cliff-when-leading-dying-church
The Last Pastor by Gail Cafferata: https://www.amazon.com/Last-Pastor-Gail-Cafferata/dp/0664264980
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In this special "Potluck" episode of The Last Service Podcast, host Matt McGee is interviewed by his friend Michael Lomuscio about the origins of the podcast, the declining state of church attendance and membership, and what constitutes a good or bad church closing.
Key Topics:
Matt's background and what sparked his interest in researching closing churchesStatistics on dropping church membership and attendance rates in the United StatesThe possibility that more churches in America closed than opened in 2019 for the first timeThe rise of the "nones" - those with no religious affiliationEconomic factors like deferred maintenance costs contributing to church closuresExamples of good vs. bad ways for a church to close downContinuing the gospel mission vs. hoarding resources with no community impactResources:
Reorganized Religion by Bob Smietana
Fullstack Educator Podcast
Gone for Good? Negotiating the Coming Wave of Church Property Transition
Ryan Burge
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In this episode, Matt interviews John Muzyka, a church real estate expert, about how churches can navigate the end of their life cycle well. John provides wise counsel on assessing property needs, making tough decisions with church committees, finding the right realtor, and determining if the building still serves the church's mission.
3 takeaways for dying churches:
1. Think of your building as a tool for ministry. Tools expire, and your building may not be the right tool for your congregation during this phase of ministry. Keep in mind that getting people in the building doesn't necessarily mean your church is ministering to them if you don't actually have a relationship with the clients your tenant serves.
2. Consider how you can right-size your building to reduce maintenance costs and utilize a space that fits the size of your congregation.
3. Closing may not be inevitable, but it is normal. Churches are full of human beings who make mistakes, miss opportunities, and resist change. The question is how we move forward. Practice courageous honesty and ask yourselves how God is leading you to steward the resources you've been given. Get help when you need it.
Resources:
John's Contact: [email protected]
www.churchrealty.com
Church Leaders, Are Your Decisions Missional or Emotional? - by John Muzyka
Southern Baptists of Texas Foundation - Jubilee Program Client Story: https://www.sbtexasfoundation.com/articles/imagechurch
Keywords: church closures, church mergers, church life cycle, church property, church real estate, selling church buildings, donating church buildings, church committees, pastoring a dying church
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