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**Podcast Summary: Tackling Contact Center Attrition**
In this episode, Amas and Bob dive into the persistent challenge of attrition in contact centers. They reminisce about Amas's experience running a center in the mid-2000s, where the attrition rate hovered around 7-9%. Surprisingly, even after 15 years, the current rate remains about the same. They explore whether this issue is truly fixable and discuss the implications of attrition rates comparable to those in retail environments.
Bob emphasizes the importance of analyzing data beyond just averages to identify specific areas of concern. He points out that while some centers perform well, many still struggle with high turnover. They agree that rather than relying on superficial employee engagement tactics like pizza parties, contact centers should focus on improving the job itself and fostering trust between employees and supervisors.
Amas shares a personal anecdote about an employee who preferred working at McDonald's due to lower stress levels, prompting a conversation about the real factors affecting job satisfaction. The duo highlights the need for contact center leaders to rethink their approach to employee experience, advocating for genuine relationships and understanding the needs of their teams.
Bob suggests actionable steps for supervisors to build trust, including knowing employees' names, recognizing their strengths and areas for improvement, and understanding their personal passions. They conclude by stressing that relationships are key to employee retention and satisfaction.
Tune in to hear insights on creating a positive work environment in contact centers, and learn how to shift the focus from temporary perks to meaningful change.
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In this episode, Amas and Bob dive into the ongoing struggle with knowledge management in contact centers—a problem that's been around since the Clinton administration. Despite years of technological advancements, knowledge management remains a significant challenge, with many customer service representatives still struggling to find the right information quickly.
Bob shares his optimism about the potential of generative AI to revolutionize knowledge management by aggregating and analyzing data from various sources. However, both Amas and Bob acknowledge that while AI could improve information retrieval, the real challenge lies in the human and process side of things. The discussion explores the conflict between relying on AI to provide information and trusting human agents to apply judgment in delivering that information to customers.
They emphasize that AI should be used to augment knowledge workers, not replace them, particularly in the tedious task of keeping content up-to-date. The episode wraps up with the idea that AI could help reduce the noise in the information agents must sift through, making their jobs easier and more effective.
Listeners are encouraged to understand AI's capabilities and integrate it into their contact center operations, focusing on how it can help manage and improve knowledge over time.
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***Episode Highlights:**
1. **In-Person Events vs. Online Meetings:**
- Amas and Bob discuss the value of attending in-person events in an era dominated by virtual meetings. They argue that face-to-face interactions foster deeper connections, networking, and learning opportunities that virtual settings can't fully replicate.2. **The Importance of Networking:**
- Bob emphasizes the benefits of meeting new people at events, sharing experiences, and learning from peers. He suggests that these interactions can offer fresh perspectives and solutions to common challenges in the industry.3. **The Power of Human Connection:**
- Amas reflects on how he met Bob at an ICMI event in 2007 and how their professional relationship blossomed into a strong friendship. This wouldn't have been possible without attending an in-person event.4. **Exciting Announcement - Live Podcast at ICMI Expo:**
- Amas and Bob are taking their podcast live to the ICMI Contact Center Expo in Orlando, October 22-24. They will host four live shows from the expo floor, providing an opportunity for attendees to interact with them, ask questions, and participate in discussions.5. **Engagement Opportunities at the Expo:**
- Attendees can meet Amas and Bob, engage in debates, and share their thoughts on various topics discussed on the podcast. There will be opportunities to challenge the hosts and hear from special guests, including vendors and speakers.6. **What to Expect from a Live Podcast:**
- Bob explains that a live podcast involves real-time interaction with an audience, creating a dynamic environment that differs from their usual recording setup. They will host conversations, engage with attendees, and bring a lively atmosphere to the expo floor.7. **Join Us in Orlando:**
- Amas and Bob invite listeners to join them at the ICMI Expo in Orlando. They offer a discount for registration and encourage attendees to subscribe to the podcast for more updates and fun discussions.**Call to Action:**
- Subscribe and listen to full episodes of "The Contact Center Show" on Apple, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts. Join Amas and Bob live at the ICMI Expo in Orlando for engaging discussions and networking opportunities.**Note:** For those interested in attending, visit the expo floor booth located at the back left side to meet the hosts and participate in the live shows!
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In this episode of the Contact Center Show, co-hosts Bob Furness and Amas reconnect to discuss the evolving landscape of contact centers, focusing on the challenges faced by agents in today’s complex work environment. They delve into the increasing isolation that many agents experience, particularly with the rise of remote and hybrid work models. Amas and Bob emphasize that while technology plays a significant role in the industry, it cannot replace the critical need for human connection and empathy in the workplace.
The conversation highlights the importance of maintaining strong relationships between managers and their teams. Bob points out that many contact center employees feel disconnected from their supervisors, which can lead to feelings of loneliness and disengagement. He stresses the need for managers to be proactive in fostering these connections, whether through regular in-person interactions or creative use of digital tools like Teams.
Amas adds that despite the convenience of digital channels, voice interactions remain crucial for building customer loyalty. The hosts argue that contact center leaders must prioritize the agent experience, ensuring that employees feel supported and valued, especially when dealing with challenging customer interactions. They also touch on the broader implications of workplace relationships, citing studies that show employees are more engaged and satisfied when they have meaningful connections at work.
The episode concludes with a call to action for leaders to rethink their approach to management in the contact center, prioritizing the human element in an increasingly digital world.
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Welcome back to the Contact Center Show! Amas and Bob kick off a new season with a dynamic conversation about the state of contact centers and the experiences of contact center agents.
**Amas:** "Bob, it’s so good to see you again. How have you been?"
**Bob:** "I’m doing well, Amas. It’s great to be back in front of the mic."The duo dives into the evolving landscape of contact centers since their last discussion in 2023, particularly focusing on the impact of AI technologies like ChatGPT on agents’ experiences. Amas shares his observation that while technological advancements have been significant, the core issues agents face, such as job complexity and attrition, persist.
**Bob:** "High attrition and job dissatisfaction remain problems. AI has made some jobs easier, but for many agents, the work has become more complex."
They discuss the disparity between large organizations that have successfully integrated AI to improve agent workflows and smaller companies that are still catching up. Bob emphasizes the importance of addressing the agent experience directly rather than solely focusing on customer-facing technologies.
**Amas:** "We need to shift our focus back to improving the agents' work environment and overall experience."
The conversation concludes with practical advice for contact center leaders: engage with your employees, understand their daily challenges, and explore how AI can support rather than replace their roles.
**Bob:** "Talk to your employees. Understand their pain points and think about how technology can truly help them."
**Amas:** "Take care of your people, and they’ll take care of your customers."
Tune in to this insightful episode for more on enhancing the contact center agent experience, the role of AI, and practical tips for leaders in the industry. Don’t forget to subscribe and share the show with your friends. Until next time!
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Podcast Summary: The Future of Contact Centers with Amas and Bob
Hosts: Amas and Bob
Topic: The evolving landscape of contact centers and the impact of AI technology.
Key Points:
Introduction:
Amas and Bob reunite to discuss the future of contact centers, emphasizing their long-standing involvement and passion for the industry.Industry Predictions:
Amas shares a pessimistic view from a major IT consulting CEO predicting the demise of call centers due to advancements in AI and technology. Bob counters with optimism, likening the prediction to the exaggerated reports of Mark Twain’s death, asserting that contact centers will not disappear but evolve.Technological Evolution:
Bob and Amas reminisce about past technological advancements (IVR, the internet, social media) that were supposed to reduce the need for human agents but ultimately did not eliminate the necessity for human interaction. Amas highlights the continued growth in phone calls despite these technological changes.Impact of AI:
Bob acknowledges AI’s potential to transform the contact center experience for both agents and customers but believes human agents remain essential due to the complexity of certain problems. Amas emphasizes that AI should be viewed as a tool to enhance customer service rather than a replacement for human agents.Future Outlook:
Both hosts agree that while AI will change the contact center landscape, it won’t make it obsolete. They predict AI will help improve efficiency and customer service but stress the importance of human involvement. They advise contact center agents to stay informed and educated about AI advancements to remain valuable in their roles.Advice to Listeners:
Amas urges listeners to focus on how AI can improve customer experiences rather than solely seeking cost-cutting measures. Bob encourages agents to embrace learning opportunities about AI to better adapt to the upcoming changes.Closing Thoughts:
Amas and Bob conclude with a call for humility and caution against overconfidence in predicting the future of technology. They sign off with philosophical wisdom, quoting Socrates on the importance of focusing on building the new rather than fighting the old.Conclusion: The podcast wraps up with a reminder for listeners to subscribe and share, promising more insightful discussions on the future of contact centers.
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Bob, it has been a while since we have talked to the contact center show audience, and there are some rumors that I want to put to bed. Bob, the word on the street is we got rich and famous and we stopped putting out new show. I've gotten some responses from our fans. Can you put these rumors to bed? What actually happened here?
Bob
Well, as you can see, I'm calling you from my yacht. So the rumors are not true. I don't think anyone who uses the word customer service anywhere in their title has gotten rich from being in customer service. I remember the times I used to work with my budgets and nobody got rich there. Maybe some famous authors got rich writing books about customer service. I don't know why both of us are not in that category, but I do say we had a lot of fun doing that podcast we did. And we want you to follow us to the next podcast we're doing.
Amas
Yes.
Bob
So let's talk a little bit about that.
Amas
Let's talk about that. And we're going to talk about the new show, the customer happiness show. But before we do that, I went back and I looked, and over the course of those years, we put out over 70 episodes. I don't know many people, and they average about 45 minutes each. I don't know many people who can talk for 3 hours about most topics. Why do you love contact centers and customer service? Why have you stayed in it most of your career? What's in it for you?
Bob
Well, first of all, if we put out 70 episodes, then I probably have run out of things to say at this point. So maybe that's the reason why we stopped talking about contact.
Amas
Good point.
Bob
What do I love about customer service? I love that customer service is almost always a human experience. And yes, I know that digital is going to take over the world and call centers are going to go away. And all the pontificating about how much we're not going to have a call center, I don't think those are right. And I love that human interactions are almost always part of the equation. And it's in those times that we walk away from a company more loyal, saying, that was a good experience. That is why I like customer service. What about you? What's your draw to customer service?
Amas
I think, Bob, it's a profession that has allowed me to utilize many parts of my brain and my know, there's a little behavioral economics there, right? How do you get people to do things, whether employees, customers, how do you get them to behave? There's a lot of technologies, technology, and a lot of things. And then there is what we used to call soft skills. And one of our few guests we had on the show taught us there was tough skills. That's a great episode. You guys go check that out. And by tough skills, people used to think about them as just pleases and thank you. There's a little art about how you deliver information, how you listen, how you do that. So you have to learn about those things as well. Then there's data involved, right? You got to measure everything because you're trying to do things efficiently and effectively. And as you know, I tried to go do something else for a little while last year, and I came right back and I'll probably spend the rest of my career doing this, and I can't imagine doing anything else. And so we've stopped putting out. I mean, we'll come occasionally and put out some shows here. The show is still going to be up, guys. You can get it. But we have made this pivot. And I got to tell you the story about how this came of. The name of the show, by the way, is the customer happiness show, but the name of the show, the format of the show, all of this came. I took a trip to Bob lives in Memphis and I live in Oklahoma City, and we go and see each other as often as time, and all of that permits. So I go there. We had a few beers in Memphis. We took that really long walk. I don't know how many miles that thing was. I wanted to see the little river thing. I don't know what you call that body of water, but we took that walk around it and we agonized about what this format will be. All we were sure about is we know that we've put out tons of contents to help contact center people around the world till this date. I still get emails that I don't forward to, Bob. They don't come in as often anymore because there are no new episodes. And every time someone mentions the show, it gives me lots of joy that we put that out. But we wanted to pivot to go talk to consumers, the Joe blow consumers out, Bob, and you can share more about. It's been months since we were having that conversation. Why are you excited about this format and specifically talking about consumers? What really excites you about it? Well, I think the very first time.
Bob
You and I were on a podcast together, if I'm not mistaken, was sometime in late 2019, where I joined yours, and we started talking in the same vein along. What do we get? Could we do a podcast together and our main number one goal was to have fun doing it. And I think we've met that number one goal. I hope we meet that number one goal with this one. But I'm excited because like you said, we talked a lot about sales and contact centers and walk up service and just about every kind of service. And it's always been the knowledge from the inside out. It's always been helping people on the inside do it better. So I'm excited to take all of those years of knowledge of what happens on the inside and turn it around. We did a show recently over on the new podcast about customer service at SiriusXM. And so what we're able to do is we understand service in general. So we're able to take the inside view and share it with the consumer and say, here are ways that you can be a better consumer to get better service. That's what excites me. It's from the outside.
Amas
I think. I think for me, Bob, similar to what you're saying, I feel like because we were so focused on the inside, the professionals, we were always helping the consumer. We were trying to teach people who delivered your service, contact center leaders, et cetera, to deliver your good service. Now we get to kind of be in the middle. We're going to focus on the consumer, bring all of our inside information in and teach consumers how to do that. I remember I'm a foodie, as you know, and Bob is as well. We both love food. And the book that changed the way I order out is Anthony Bourdain's kitchen confidential. And that's what I hope this is in know. He taught me that don't order the special, don't order the like because he was a chef and he knew all of that inside deal. And he didn't write the book for chefs, he wrote it for people who go out to eat. Until this date, when I walk into a restaurant, the things I learned from him still kind of echoes in my brain. And I hope this show becomes that. But the second reason I'm really excited is the format that we haven't told you guys about is we debated a little bit on the contact center show, but this show is all it is, all of us, not every single show, but for the most part, we are going back and forth. And I don't think it will surprise anyone who's listened to Bob and I over these four years that I win almost every time. So that part also excites me. I don't know if it excites Bob so much. Losing to me every week. But that part really gives me a lot of joy.
Bob
You definitely win every time you're talking because you say the most absurd things that I've ever heard, much like the.
Amas
One you just said.
Bob
But that is part of the reason for me also. I enjoy the back and forth.
Amas
So we are on the show and I suspect, and guys, you got to check out the show. I don't think the show is us. While it's called customer happiness, we are not on the show talking about how great customer service is. We are often on the show talking about some of the things and helping consumers navigate it better. So let me ask you, let me put you on the spot. What is your biggest pet peeve? You are a consumer. All of us are consumers. What's your biggest pet peeve? Put your customer hat on.
Bob
Well, mine is always when I'm told this is the policy and that's the only thing we can do. I hate hearing the word policy. I think that we probably make those agents that way because we do have a policy and we do tell them they can't negotiate. But that's my pet peeve because there should always be negotiation. In fact, I'll tell you an experience. I recently was at a well known shoe store and the employee came back and said, I'm sorry, but that's the policy. So I said, well, the policy doesn't make any sense. And he said something to the degree of, if I had a dollar for every time a corporate policy didn't make sense in my job, I'd be a millionaire. And so here's a guy that would really like to help me. Agrees with me that the policy is crazy. But he's quoting me the policy. So the policy for me is the one. I don't know what yours is. What's yours?
Amas
Mine is maybe dishonesty is too strong of a word. I don't like the fact that I go somewhere, they ask me for my email address to send me a receipt, and then here comes all these emails. I don't like the we will be with you shortly. Your call is important to us. They will call me and they won't call me back. It's these broken promises for me that makes customer service a pain at times. And so I actually prefer just tell me what I'm getting so that way I know what this is going to look like. So, guys, again, I would be remiss if I didn't say thank you to every single person over the years who downloaded the show, who subscribed who liked, who told people about it, who shared it, I cannot know. Two guys, one in Oklahoma City, one in Memphis. Two friends got on the phone and talked. And at the peak of our show, 4000 of you would download the show. I am incredibly just humbled and thankful and just hope we get a little bit of that success onto the next show. So we're asking you to stick with us. Come with us to the next show. You're going to learn something. You're going to hear us even hopefully funnier and more entertaining. And Bob, by the way, is semi retired now, which means God knows what's going to come out of his mouth. So please come join us.
Bob
Yeah, I'm on my own now. I can say what I really want to say instead of what I need to be careful how I say it. But you can join us on the same channels you're used to. So we're on Spotify, we're on Alexa, we're on Apple, we're on all the places that you get your podcast. We're still distributing to the same places. You can do a search on the customer happiness show. We're the only one out there with that name. So you can search on that. We'll put the link in, put the name at the end of this video. But as Amas said, thank you so much for your listening to us. I had somebody tell me that was a new research analyst that just began to work in the contact center space in a financial capacity as a research analyst. Tell me that she felt like she got more information from our podcast. And I said, well, how many did you listen to? She goes, I'm too embarrassed to tell you how many of them I listened to. But she said that she got a lot out of it and it felt like she understood both sides of the contact center world by listening. So it's just those kind of comments and the emails that you send that have made us keep doing it. We just hope you'll join us in the new one.
Amas
Awesome. Well, please subscribe. Like comment. The show is still going to be available, we're going to keep it going, and every now and then we'll pop in and maybe produce some new content. But please subscribe the customer happiness show wherever you get your podcast. Thank you all. Bye.
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Amas and Bob take a look back a their third season of the Contact Center show.
"I plan to spend the offseason doing nonprofit, keisha Warrior Princess, we aims to educate women on the importance of self exams and of gynological appointments annually."- Bob
I'm increasingly getting feedback from people who are not deep into the contact center, but are contact center adjacent. Whether they be like, people who work in other departments, consumers, what have you. If you're out there again, we want to hear from you. - Amas
"Speech analytics is going to become more important in the contact center. "CCaaS and UcaaS are going to get blended into one." - Bob
- In the next 12 months, are we like to see GPT mainstream in the contact center? I don't think we can move fast enough as an industry to make GPT commonplace. But for it to be part of our mainstream way that we do business, I just don't Think it's been there long enough. - Bob
I will be spending a lot of time on conference calls, but also reading and getting smarter so we can come back and chat with you again. - Amas
"We'll talk about stuff and then invariably we get off on some tangent about this organization and this industry that we work in and we could hit the record button and publish it, right? Exactly. It's part of our DNA." - Bob
"We're in the midst of a sea change in Contact Center." - Amas
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Bob and Amas discuss how you should prepare for CCaas:
Three out of four contact centers today have not yet made the move. Every vendor is telling companies to make this move. The improvements are happening in their new cloud system. We're getting close to the point where this would be a baseline requirement.
CCaaS allows agents to use all of their channels in one interface. It adds some user capabilities for the agent. That makes their life a little bit easier. Is this something that's going to change my life at all?
- CCaaS projects thus far has been a little case of over promise under deliver. Lots of people have gone down this road, have said, Gosh, I like the new system, but they don't consider it a success in terms of ROI.
-: The vendors are saying that the ROI is better than it could possibly be. He says a 20% reduction in handle time is just not realistic.
Your ROI has to get a lot more creative and more thoughtful than that. It's about improving the agent experience and the customer experience.
"Data Center. That there is a refrigerator size box or there is a stack of servers. I probably just dated myself with the refrigerator size box." Bob
"I'm gonna go to an old reliable Seneca today. This quote is we are more often frightened than hurt and we suffer more in imagination than in reality." - Amas
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Amas and Bob tell you how to separate the hype from reality with GPT:
- AI will eliminate 75% of call center jobs. AI will even make your bed. These are some of the real headlines about what generative AI things like Chat GPT will do to the contact center.
- I think the next knowledge will be the impact. It's going to affect the way that we write knowledge articles. Marketing is an example of how knowledge is going to be second in the contact center. And then the last step is talking to the agent where generative AI actually talks to the customer.
- Generative AI is still on the way up in the Gartner Hype cycle. That means that the peak of inflated expectations are not over yet. Greene: It'll make the biggest impact on the agent, not the customer. Companies should be paying attention to it.
- You sound like you have a bias for disrupting and helping the agent as opposed to replacing the agent by putting this thing in front of the customers. Is this one of those kind of, hey, start here because it's safer? I still believe we have a place for an agent.
- What I want to do is help my agent versus replace my agent. Typical contact center probably has four to 500 knowledge articles. Think about having Chat GPT rewrite those articles through the lens of the customer. There's tons of improvement to the experience if you start there.
- Google CEO Sandar Pachaya said Artificial intelligence is one of the most profound things we're working on as humanity. That silence after that is what tells me we've got to understand what this impact is. I hope we helped you guys get smarter this week.
"It you know the demise of the contact center has been going on since since the IVR so. The reality is, is that contact the percentage of contact center jobs in companies have gone up compared to where they were before those technologies came into play." - Bob
" I want to point out to people who you heard me say that the most popular car in the 1890s was an electric car." - Amas
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Bob and Amas discuss the world of knowledge.
"I'm going to date myself that we had knowledge on paper in binders at every desk." - Bob
"In fact, I believe that if used correctly, knowledge or technical product content in this case is and should be seen as marketing." - Mike
"So we have this issue. There are 1400 page PDFs running out there. How would you think about the problem and and how? How have you advised people to begin to think about solving it?" -Amas
Connect with Mike Stock at https://www.linkedin.com/in/mikestockactual/
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Amas and Bob discuss the role of the CFO in the Contact Center:
"Yeah, there is a the metric but there reason your are measuring FCR, repeat call rates, average call rate, they should lead somewhere." -Amas
"I gotta be ready to tell the story of the history, the real-time and the future." -Bob
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Amas and Bob discuss the outbound call center:
"This is giving me flashbacks of my teenage years when I was doing telemarketing." - Amas
"Time is money!
Interactions to Sales matter - from a cost perspective." -Bob
"Well first of all it's a tough job, in that job I was talking about I called 60 people maybe 20 talked to me, that's a lot of negativity." - Bob
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Bob interviews Amas about his latest book "Waiting for Service"
"If our industry could get the waiting part right before worrying about the quality of service..." Amas
"So if you are listening to our podcast, he is not talking about you, he is talking about the other contact center professionals." - Bob
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Amas and Bob welcome Caryn Fried and Glen Stoffel to the Contact Center Show to discuss the reality of soft skills.
Quotes
"People drive the success of contact centers. I had someone say to me this week - I think people are going away in contact centers. ChatGPT and the future of voice bots and digital bots will replace the human. But I disagree. Technology will never replace the humans in contact centers." "Professional Teams practice. If it looks effortless It didn’t come easy, the effortless is earned” "These skills are not soft skills, they are tough skills" Interactions are harder because we have scraped off most of the transactional contacts and sent them to an IVR, to self service, to chatbots… so what is left takes human intelligence - takes the ability to listen and think through solutions.
About our guests Glen Stoffel is a master Strategist and Co Founder of Camp 4 connect with Glen at https://www.linkedin.com/in/glen-stoffel/ Caryn Fried is a leadership development savant and CEO of Camp4, connect with Caryn at https://www.linkedin.com/in/caryn-fried/ https://camp4network.com/
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Do you use social media to address your complaints or concerns with companies? What are the pros and cons of social service? Does anyone do it well? It is quite overwhelming to monitor the entire internet so where do you start?
“how would you feel if every decision you make privately on a contact center ends up on the front page of a newspaper or on facebook?”
"If it is written information, it is public:" - Amas
"Customers will figure it out...social is better" - Bob
And much more
Contact Amas and Bob.
http://linkedin.com/in/amastenumah/
https://www.linkedin.com/in/bobfurniss/
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Bob and Amas continue the conversation about Social Service:
"You know that quote from 10-15 years ago 'if you do something good your customer will tell 3 people and if you do something bad they will tell 10' now customers are like 'let me tell my 100 followers, 500 followers...." - Bob
And much more
Contact Amas and Bob.
http://linkedin.com/in/amastenumah/
https://www.linkedin.com/in/bobfurniss/
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You dial a 1800# and it tells you someone will hold your place in line and call you back when it is your turn? Is someone actually holding your place in line?
Key Quotes:
"It allows you to not have to listen to Michael Bolton sing “when a man loves a woman for the thirteenth time.” Or even worse, here the “your call is important to us” for the 25th time!"
"Yes it is lipstick on a pig- but I am not sure you want your pig to walk around all the time with lipstick on - instead, only use the lipstick for special occasions." - Bob
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Amas and Bob take a deep dive into the success of ChatGPT.
Chatbots are not new, why is this one capturing hearts and mind? What the heck is a chatbot anyway? Why do most customers hate chatbots and will it change? Will it replace humans in the contact center? How do I start building a bot customers will want?And much more
Contact Amas and Bob.
http://linkedin.com/in/amastenumah/
https://www.linkedin.com/in/bobfurniss/
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The contact center may be the biggest melting pot in corporate America.
Bob & Amas have 60+ years in the industry What does the contact center get right? Most incredible stories about contact centersMemorable Quote:
“Did you lose your daughter? Are you a NARC?” - Bob
And much more
Contact Amas and Bob.
http://linkedin.com/in/amastenumah/
https://www.linkedin.com/in/bobfurniss/
- Daha fazla göster
