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Today on the Sauna Talk podcast we welcome Ashley Mason.
Ashley Mason, earned her PhD in clinical psychology from the University of Arizona. She is an Associate Professor of Psychiatry in the Weill Institute for Neurosciences and the UCSF Osher Center for Integrative Health. Ashley is a clinical psychologist and directs behavioral treatment for insomnia at the UCSF Osher Center Clinic. She is Director of the UCSF Sleep, Affect, and Eating (SEA) Lab. Ashley is the Co-Director of the UCSF Center for Obesity Assessment, Study, and Treatment (COAST). She is primarily a researcher but also treats patients for insomnia within the Osher Center Sleep Clinic.
Whole body hyperthermiaIn our chat today, youâll learn about her work surrounding âwhole body hyperthermia.â
Her 2023 BrainMind Summit presentation touches upon sauna and how heat treatment may have a positive impact on depression by regulating body temperature. Reintegrating thermal stress could be an effective approach to treating some individuals with depression.
Heat treatment and antidepressant effectsThere is correlation between core body temperature and depression. Editing thermal stress out of our lives (air conditioning, climate controlled indoor living has put is in âthe narrow band.â, when all along, acute heat stress could help us! Especially when the idea of an ice cold lake plunge after sauna is about the best idea weâve ever heard!
Iâm pleased to welcome Ashley Mason to Sauna Talk.
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Today on the Sauna Talk podcast, iâm pleased to present Earric Lee, who is a leading researcher surrounding the health benefits of sauna.
As you listen along, youâll hear the background noise of the busy-ness and hustle and bustle of London streets. As, instead of on the sauna bench, we capture this episode outside a London hotel.
Earric and I converged for the recent British Sauna Society Sauna Summit. And it was here, in London, where I was able to capture Earric. And share with you his exhaustive yet budding effort to help bring sauna research to the forefront.
Earric Lee is a fellow board member of the Sauna Research Institute. He has a clear focus on helping de-silo sauna researchers globally. He is also committed to helping advance studies towards what you and I know to be true. Sauna is good for us.
So, letâs welcome ..
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Fehlende Folgen?
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This is episode #100 of Sauna Talk.
Do you want to know the Sauna Talk origin story? Well, when I started this podcast in 2016, 8 years ago, the idea was to help capture a bit of what felt like on the sauna bench. Thatâs a place where deep, collaborative conversations can happen. Itâs often a place of untangling the wires in our heads, where our minds can open up to creative thinking, and problem solving.
Itâs a fun place. Sauna Talk is described here as:
Sauna talk is a different kind of talk. It is casual talk between a father and his teenage son, and reconnection talk with a friend you wish you could see more frequently, or collaborative talk amongst NHL hockey players or business partners working through a strategy. This happens because we have no distractions and we are relaxed in mind, body, and spirit.
As we know, sitting on the sauna bench creates an interesting environment. Our bodies are being stressed, yet we are feeling very relaxed. For many of us, talking and thinking is difficult. Yet for others, itâs an environment where thoughts and ideas start flowing like in a kaleidoscope of colors.
In this episode, you will hear some excerpts from a few of the 99 episodes:
Tom RolandoThe Sauna Talk origin.
Tom and I are still very close buds. He and I are working on the book Sauna Life, and itâs a slow process.
Daryl LamppaDaryl Lamppa 22:46 â the old style stoves in the area.
Scott Olson17:48 peddling to hockey stores.
18:15 Finding the hockey player entrepreneurs in their own towns.
Wim Hof17:03 Sauna & Cold. 19:03
Dr. Jari Laukkenen30:10-30-55 goals for further sauna research
#063 Alex Blyashuk29:35-32:06, explaining veniks.
#072 Bruce Oreck33:20-35:21. Finland happiest country. Explains his reasoning.
#097 Lasse EriksonBring the owners into the sauna.
35:20 â 37:18. That feeling that you have contributed to something good in life.
I hope you enjoy any one or number of these 100 episodes! It has been a pleasure hearing and sharing the motivations and passions of so many remarkable people!
Putting these episodes together has been a privilege. Sharing them with you continues to be a joy.
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Today on Sauna Talk, we welcome Ragna Marie Fjeld, General Secretary, Oslo Badstuforening.
What does Badstuforening translate to in English? Sauna Association. So, let me tell you a bit about the Oslo Sauna Association. Founded in 2016, the same year as the 612 Sauna Society in Minneapolis, Minnesota. But the difference start here. Where 612 has one sauna, and granted it is the original sauna with the same work horse original sauna stove, benches, walls, and spiritual patina abound, Oslo Badstuforeningâs inaugural first sauna seeds were planted in much more fertile soil.
The soil along the harbor of Osloâs fjord was ripe for sauna expansion. Yes, their original first sauna is still operational, and with a spiritual patina rating of 9.4, but surrounding this flagship sauna is a fleet of 18 additional saunas: 14 other floating saunas, and 4 mobile saunas. And as you listen to this, chances are that these numbers will be outdated and higher.
The Osla Sauna Association train is not slowing down. As you will hear in this episode, the constraints to growth and expansion are, well, just not there.
Revenue? No. They are most often fully booked (and by the way, very reasonably priced for all economies of economic income scales).
Steam master hosts? No. As you will hear, their HR department is busy with applicants. Including doctors and politicians.
Builders? No. Matter of fact, every architect in Norway wants to design a sauna.
Their corporate offices are unassuming and yet buzzing with activity. People dig working here, and their Secretary General, Ragna Marie Fjeld runs a collaboratively effective ship. Letâs listen in.
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Today on Sauna Talk, we welcome Alan Jalasjja who shares with us âThe Spirit of Sauna.â
Alan is an evangelist who is with us to help promote the experience. Growing up with sauna his whole life, as a Finnish Canadian, we get the perspective of what sauna spirit means to him.
World Sauna Forum 2024The growth of the event compared to 2022
Globe and Mail articleI encourage you to click through the link towards his Op Ed opinion piece that recently appeared in the Globe and Mail, which discusses âenjoying sauna in the now.â Sure the health benefits are there for the long term, but wow, letâs enjoy our sauna time now.
Thermal cycleWe discuss the value of time. The holy trinity to a good cool down: cold water, nature, time.
The four elements to sauna fire air water earth (the stones).Some magical gems from Alan, and happy to share with you here.
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A lot has happened with Lasse Eriksen, 2.0, from our first Sauna Talk just a little over two years ago.
This meeting took place on the beach in front of Farris Bad resort, south of Oslo, Norway.
FarrisBadHere Lasse is the Development Manager for this top notch resort set along the shore of Norweigenâs majestic coastline. Development Manager means that Lasse is given a lot of reign to help steward sauna (bastu in Norwegian) as both a noun â the place we go, as well as the verb â the thing we do inside the hot room.
And for the verb, guests are treated to aufguss, and all its glory. Upon check in, guests are welcome to grab an updated flyer, which lists all the saunas on property, as well as a schedule of the aufguss events for that week.
Lasse Eriksenâs backgroundAs you will hear in this interview: Lasseâs aim is true. We know that sauna is wonderful for our wellbeing. And Lasse is deeply committed to sharing and promoting it. In addition to Development Manager for FarrisBad, Lasse is board member of the International Sauna Association, and the Norwegian Sauna Association. Lasse is Vice President of Aufguss WM, a kindred spirit to many of us, and Iâm pleased to say a great friend of mine.
I love this guy. Maybe iâm getting to be a soft in my grey hair age, but Lasse had me in tears a couple of times. I feel his passion, and I hope you do too.. Iâm pleased to present Lasse Eriksen, to Sauna Talk!
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Today on the sauna talk bench we are joined by Stew and his sons David and Kyle Wilson, from the Homecraft sauna heater family.
Who is Homecraft? Homecraft is one of Canadaâs longest running sauna manufacturers, this multigenerational, family-owned business has steadily grown in the shadows of towering old-growth cedar trees outside Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada.
We gather on my sauna bench, the three of them lined up for interrogation as I manage the steam and the microphone from down low. Yes, those in the sauna industry from Canada are well aware that the Wilsonâs are polite straight shooters from Canada, but these virtues come forth loud and clear during this episode on the sauna bench. As I throw water and make steam, there is little room for anything but clarity and transparency.
So, we are the beneficiaries. We learn about sauna culture in Canada, the history of this family company, and what good sauna means to Stew, David, and Kyle.
No matter what the product, it could be a couch, or a pen, or a bar of soap, more and more of us are interested in learning more about the people behind the product. And this is true also for electric sauna heaters. How a sauna heater preforms is critically important. How is the steam? Is there someone in North America to support the product after the sale? Are the elements going to fail? And if so, will I be pulling apart 300 rocks to replace an element in six months? These are the kind of questions we are asking ourselves.
And yet, thereâs another line of thought that goes into our electric sauna heater purchase decision. Who are these people? Some may be influenced by authoritarian foreign accents. But, beyond the sauna cognition theory, we may not be fully sure who is making our sauna heater. Is it Jens assembling the sauna heater, or Xinchongâs young teenage daughter assembling the sauna heater? And how far did this box have to travel before coming to our front steps? Well, in the case of Homecraft electric saunas, youâll be hearing directly from the people behind the product.
And whatâs cool is that Kyle, the younger son, like David from Superior Saunas, has a pastoral background. Who better to sit on the sauna bench with than someone who has a spiritual connection to sauna? Stewâs younger son, another David, is a licensed electrician, having run his own company for 10 years. Who better to have your electrician call with a screwdriver in their hands than David at Homecraft?
So, this is what we get with the guys at Homecraft. Practically designed and manufactured by and for electricians. And spiritually designed and manufactured for spiritualists.
We get into the weeds about the mechanics of electric sauna heaters. And I think youâll find as we listen through, I am the one to get nerdy. And the Wilson guys are the ones to keep it light. Those that know me, know my dedication towards good sauna. Iâve had a rocky road the last couple of years navigating towards both good products AND good people in this space. Like Lamppa Manufacturing in Tower, Minnesota, I am pleased to introduce you to Homecraft from BC Canada.
Again, itâs the people AND the product.. and when it comes to Homecraft, youâve found both. So, please welcome, David, Stew, and Kyle Wilson to Sauna Talk.
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As we look back upon Sauna Days 2024, walking from one sauna to the next, pretty much all of us were comfortably numb.
About 200 guest converged for the fourth Sauna Days event at Larsmont Cottages, North of Duluth, Minnesota, this past weekend. Some came from near, and many came from far. All were able to enjoy the multitude of saunas, speakers, nature, and locally crafted food, beverages, and live entertainment.\
The recipe for a comfortably numb sauna gathering is much like a basic chocolate chip cookie recipe. We donât need too many ingredients to make something scrumptious.
The foundation for Sauna Days 2024 was 12 mobile saunas and one lĂ€mpömassa enriched brick and mortar sauna. Then, sprinkle in various food tents, strategically located hydration stations. Add a pinch of LMNT hydration packets (flavors of choice) and a curation of interesting speakers. Finally, as icing on the cake, infinity cold plunge access into the worldâs largest freshwater lake.
Familiar facesA good number of the 200 plus Sauna Days 2024 attendees were repeat vendors and offenders. Familiar faces helped foster countless spontaneous re-connections either on the bench, by one of fire pits, at the bar, on the rocks, or in the lake. âSo great to see you again!â And they meant it. âIs this your second or third Sauna Days?â
The spontaneous gatherings were akin to traveling from stage to stage at an outdoor music festival. Then, bumping into familar faces from yearâs past. And, like attending a music festival with great bands and few yahoos, at Sauna Days, everyone knew the lyrics. Songs include: keep sandals outside the saunas, help fill up the löyly buckets, ask who is ready for steam before throwing water on the rocks, and by all means, close the sauna door.
Far and wideAs sauna becomes more popular, Sauna Days continues to draw people from places beyond the Great Lakes sauna belt region. I found myself on the bench with a couple who came all the way from the Yukon Territory. Other Canadians included Kyle Wilson, Homecraft Saunas, and his wife from Vancouver BC. We had guests from Salt Lake City, Oregon, Northern and Southern California, Florida. And yet none of these participants received the Furthest Traveled Award. That accolade was awarded to Jake Newport from Finnmark saunas. A close second went to Mika & Wendy from the British Sauna Society. The three represented the UK well, proucly wearing their signature British Blue robes as sauna uniforms.
Speakerâs cornerThe Brits added some great flavor to the Sauna Days speaker series. Jake Newport shared a slide of a map of Great Britain, showing 100 dots around the British coastline, representing the number of mobile sauna activations there. âPretty much every beach around the coastline now has a public sauna.â We breathed along with Nick Fox, Learned about Sauna and Sobriety, gleaned insight into the future and scale of Therme Groupâs wellbeing oasisâs (bigger than Yankee Stadium!) with President Robbie Hammond.
The Steam MastersMany were quietly sharing that a highlight experience for Sauna Days 2024 was getting wacked around by one of the three Steam Masters. The three administered venik treatments in either the Steam Lodge or Deep Wave Saunaâs Black Night sauna. We were blessed to have three steam masters lead rounds of venik treatments. Dan from The Banya House, California Alex, and B Alex from BSaunas in Buffalo, NY.
In addition to Sauna Days being the first weekend of May, the Steam Masters introduced us to a sister event first weekend of October: Banya Fest at a stately church camp just outside Minneapolis/St. Paul. A highlight of the weekend was learning more about the ancient practice of Eastern European banya and venik treatments, documented as a Sauna Days presentation and a soon to be released Sauna Talk podcast.
Sauna in natureAs wonderful as it was to experience multiple saunas scattered throughout the grounds at Larsmont Cottages, once again, nature seems to provide us with the best amenity. Larsmont Cottages is set along the shores of Lake Superior. Sauna Days guests were treated to rosy red skyline sunsets, night skies bursting with stars, and even a Hawaii-esque rainbow, as we celebrated a passing shower in the later afternoon sun.
Northern Minnesota sauna is always enjoyed in nature. Sauna in nature is bigger than all of us. And no bigger than within Sauna Days 2024 at Larsmont Cottages, Two Harbors, Minnesota.
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Today on the actual sauna bench, we are joined and talk with Jake Newport from Finnmark.
Jake makes the journey from Northern England to join me on the Larsmont Cottages sauna bench in Northern Minnesota, by the cold, clear clean water shores of Lake Superior. You can also check out my podcast with Jake and Brother Max from 2020 here.
During this episode, we learn more from Jake about the thermal bathing ecosystem in the UK and globally. From career path change to multi pronged sauna business. Investing and reinvesting in the culture and the company.
Super early bird groundingFully grounded by being the first guests to Sauna Days. We enjoy solitary quiet time to ground ourselves through the hot and the cold.
Mika & Wendy â lifetime achievement awards for sauna. BSS founding. The explosion of sauna in Great Britain. Huge number getting into the thermal bathing scene. Beautiful saunas on beautiful beach. Beach Box Brighton.
A meaningful thermal experienceThree things that give us the feeling of community: a the church, the pub, and the village green society. Britain has become more secular. People now are far more health conscious. A void around community, and a sense of community. A gap waiting to be filled. A huge spectrum of age. Mikkel Aaland, and the âlost bathing cultureâ and the return of uptick of thermal bathing.
Larsmont Cottages sauna talkJake describes the sauna in which we are sitting. How the sauna is Finnish style. He calls out the Western Red Cedar, and full wooden door. Jake describes the Kuuma stove: âThis is a heater that you buy once.â
Final words:Itâs the hot, then the cold, then the normalization. lying outside on the cold wet grass, Jake found himself unwound and relaxed.
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Today on Sauna Talk we welcome Charlie from Community Sauna Baths in England.
Who is Community Sauna Baths? Well, they are Community Interest Company, a CIC, who is dedicated to providing affordable sauna sessions to the communities they serve. Currently with four locations, including their flagship locale in Hackney, East London.
Here is where we catch up with Charlie, one of the directors at Community Sauna Baths for this podcast.
Currently Community Sauna Baths are serving thousands of customers from the area. Local Londoners as well as a lot of visitors from abroad. Irish, some Finns, you name it.
Early influencesAs youâll here, Charlie grew up with the classic toaster oven experience at health clubs. Then, he was deeply affected to the positive, partacking in sauna at the Finnish Church and also Lost Horizons, the pop up social sauna in London.
Feeling a tug to help advance the social communal experience, Charlie leaned in to helping with the ambitious Hackney Baths fundraising project with the British Sauna Society. The fundraising came up short, but it did pave the way towards a more organic project. 2 donated saunas, one from Charlie.
Covid and beyondWe talk about countless hours of donated time to host sessions. How they are learning as we are going, starting slow by serving random members of the public in Hackney London. Slow organic growth. Adding days. Modifying and improving the site. Victoria and Gabrielle building website and marketing.
Community Baths todayThe staff provides a real nice blend of skills. Part of the beauty is that good heat and cold does most of the heavy lifting. Staff supports the good heat and cold, and people benefit from and enjoy the experience.
Looking to grow. Charlie is helping work on a new site. We learn about the South London project, in Peckam, as part of the community garden. Bringing saunas into natural spots in London.
4th one in Normandy. Robâs project. The first beach sauna in France.
UK affordable and inclusive.
Charlieâs careerCharlie cut his teeth as a management consultant. Great learning experience. Freelance consulting. Started a mushroom farm. Full time. Able to pay himself a salary. Well paying job for staff. Community interest Company. A commercial mind with a non for profit structure.
New community sauna in Bristol. Using profits to seed other new saunas.
Setting the seeds for a community Sauna Network.
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Today on Sauna Talk, we welcome Tom Carlson, a sauna enthusiast and a SaunaTimes public sauna map supporter.
Tom caught the sauna bug in Germany, and brought home his love and appreciation for good heat. And, like many of us, Tom recognizes how good sauna is like a candle that lights another candle. And with this, there are really good saunas dotted all over the world.
Several years ago, we built the SaunaTimes Public Sauna Map. With over 200 entries and counting, thereâs a good chance that as you arrive in a new town, youâll be ale to click through and find a kick ass sauna for you to attend. And for Tom, youâll hear about his commitment to helping all of us find good saunas wherever we may be. Currently, he and Kevin are SaunaTimes public sauna map champions.
But I would like you to know how I first met Tom. It was a couple Sauna Days ago, at Larsmont Cottages in Two Harbors, Minnesota. A guy walks up to me with a Wisconsin 6 pack in one hand, and outstretches his other hand to shake my hand. âThis is for you. You helped me realize how great sauna is. Thank you Glenn, youâve pretty much changed my life.â
Wow, those are big shoes to wear. However, thankfully we were both bare footed, and we both hit the same sauna bench and shared some kindred spirit thermal action. And like convective heat transfer into hot rocks from protected elements, a logical, long lasting connection was made.
Tomâs TravelsTom lives in Wisconsin USA, and on a whim, came through Minneapolis, and naturally found himself on the bench in my backyard sauna.
We share stories and steam. And are joined with quiet guest Darin from Urban Wing.
As bonus, we enjoy an extended löyly. And if you are driving, please donât close your eyes, but this extended löyly is for you.
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Today on the Sauna Talk bench, we welcome three guests who are aligned to helping veterans through sauna as a means of healing our heroes.
Their stories are heartfelt, their passions are clear. And for those of us who know sauna, we know that their purpose is meaningful and their success rate undeniable. (ie sauna is good for us!)!
Who is Healing Heroes Saunas? The co-founders, Mike and Josh: as introduction:
Mike LotzerOn the right side of the bench we have, Mike Lotzer. Mike is the Lead Pastor of Mercy Road Church in Burnsville, MN and served in the Army Chaplain Corps. from 2004-2012. Stateside, Mike served as a Casualty Notification Chaplain, Special Troops Battalion Chaplain, and Marriage Strong Bonds Instructor. Also, he deployed in the Iraq War.
Mike has walked with soldiers, families, and loved ones through extreme pain both stateside and in combat zones. His experiences caring for dying soldiers have birthed a lifelong commitment to serve and empower Warriors and their families. Mike has been married to his wonderful wife Erica for 18 years. The couple have three children and live in Lakeville, MN. Mike has a B.A. in Comparative World Religion and Psychology from the University of Wisconsin, a Master of Divinity from Fuller Theological Seminary, and a Certification in Combat Medical Ministry and Suicide Prevention from the U.S. Army Medical Department.
KirkCenter bench, we welcome back Kirk Jensen to Sauna Talk. Kirk is longtime host and fellow board member of the 612 Sauna Society. You can learn more about Kirk as he was a recent guest to the Sauna Talk podcast. Kirk spent 34 years in the Air Force. He retired as Lieutenant Colonel with +7,000 hours as a C-130 Navigator. Kirk participated in every conflict during that time. Iraq, Afghanistan, Bosnia, Somalia. Kirkâs âday jobâ is flight simulator trainer for the Air Force.
Today, you can find Kirk either near the Minneapolis St Paul airport, where he runs Air Force flight training or alongside the 612 Sauna Society Sauna, where he serves as longstanding sauna host.
JoshOn the left side of the bench, we have Josh Meisberger (42). Josh has been married for 19 years and has 2 wonderful teenage boys. Currently living outside of Minneapolis in Apple Valley, Josh and family saunas frequently (3-5 times per week) enjoying their permanent wood fire sauna in the back yard of their home. Josh and family are active members at Mercy Road Church in Burnsville.
Josh spent 22 years in the military with 2 combat tours to Iraq before being medically retired for various military related injuries. Currently, Josh owns a construction company (Rare Homes Inc) where he and team do everything from small bathroom remodels all the way up to custom builds and commercial space work.
Mike and he more recently started Healing Heroes Saunas as a way to give back to the men and women who serve our communities in Hero rolls including Veterans, Police, Firefighters, and all first responder, along with their families. Mike and Josh are currently working on their 501c3 filing, as well as fundraising so that they can expand our reach providing hot and cold therapy.
Josh and Mike are very close to finishing their second unit, which will immediately be deployed around the state of Minnesota. They have a long term goals of 5-10 units in the state of Minnesota, as well as being able to build more permanent saunas at their residence for Heroes on an application basis.
Currently you can find them on Instagram @healingheroessaunas.
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Today from any one of 22 saunas, we Sauna Talk from the Great Northern Sauna Village, Malcolm Yards, Minneapolis, Minnesota, USA.
âThe Great Northern Sauna Village is a social and therapeutic experience hosted at Malcolm Yards. Visitors can immerse themselves in sauna culture by interacting with various Thermaculture traditions. And connecting with local sauna companies and builders. During 60-90- minute Steam Sessions, guests can explore various types of traditional wood-fired sauns. These include barrel, mobile, and backyard units; tent and floatings saunas. And a new shipping container event sauna for 20+ people. All this, while experiencing multiple forms of heat, steam, and aromatherapy with the cold contrast therapy of winter air and snow.â
The numbers speak for themselves: 22 saunas from over a dozen Saunapreneurs. Some of whom Iâve known, supported, and encouraged from back in the day when sauna in the public domain, even here in Minnesotaâs sauna country, was fringe and not so enthusiastically embraced as today.
Sauna Talk glowing from the Sauna VillageYou can see and feel the sauna glow. And as you listen along, you will be able to catch the spirit from a few of the people behind the scenes at the Great Northern Sauna Village. The event is three long weekends long. Here, we catch up with the folks today snap dab in the middle of the event on a chilly grey Saturday afternoon. Those interested in attending can catch the event during its last weekend, next weekend. Tickets are a reasonable $40, and available via the link supporting this podcast on SaunaTimes.com.
We start off this episode with Shaelyn from Superior Saunas, the mayor of the Great Northern Sauna Village. We meet up with Darin from Urban Wing, Jessie from Deep Wave. John from Superior Saunas, Nomad Phil. And Excelsior Saunas Jim, Matt from Superior Saunas, and a few other selected guests along the way.
Wherever this podcast may find you, I think youâll enjoy getting to know whatâs happening in this region. The boldly self proclaimed Sauna Capital of North America. Here is where youâll find open arms, steam billowing, endorphins rushing, and cold water plunging.
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Today we welcome back Dr. Charles Raison to this Sauna Talk podcast part 2.
I encourage you to check in with Part one, where Chuck and i work from the starting block about Sauna health benefits and research surrounding hypethermia and hot/cold contrast therapy.
In this episode, by design we go deeper.
We unpack hot cold therapy as a novel treatment for mental health.
101.3101.3 isnât just the radio frequency for a hit music station in the Twin Cities. We have foundational research surrounding the effects on the body and the mind of achieving this core body temperature. Ashley Masonâs work at University of California San Francisco is expanding upon the psychological and physiological effects of this level of heat stress when reaching this core body temperature. Physically, from, for example the standpoint of blood pressure and heart rate variability. Yet how do these physical changes affect peopleâs moods? Specifically, as a possible novel treatment in the area of depression, anxiety, and other mental health issues.
TotonuThe Japanese have a word for that nirvana feeling we get after a few sauna rounds and cold therapy action. They call it Totonu. And there is actually a published study on the neuro effects of sauna bathing. We link to this study on the Sauna Research Institute website as well as on SaunaTimes websites. In the study, it is recognized that sauna is an activity that promotes relaxation and health. Three cycles of sauna, cold, rest lowers your heart rate and makes you feel more relaxed. Intense feelings of happiness have been reported shortly after enjoying a hot sauna and cold water, what is known in Japan as the âtotonouâ state.
With this contrast therapy, we achieve a lower heart rate, changes of brain waves, and better metabolic health through the increase in brown fat production â known as âthe good fatâ. And one could argue that, for those horizontally challenged, sauna use raises heart rate to about the state we achieve with a fast walk. So there is a weight loss association to regular sauna use. But this is not something iâd get the scale out to rely upon.
The Vail Project â Eagle ValleyWe discuss a âTop Flight Saunaâ for Vail Healthâs Behavioral Health Innovation Center. Right now in development, the CHILLâD Study (âCold and Heat Investigation to Lower Levels of Depressionâ) will explore ways to optimize the proven benefits of hyperthermia for depression, including whether adding cold to heat will improve outcomes and whether hyperthermia can be effectively combined with standard antidepressants.
Vail Health is especially interested in thermic bathing within ancient practices. Many of us listening enjoy Nordic style sauna, where we pay homage to the origins of the word sauna (Finland). And sometimes many spend a lot of effort scolding its improper pronunciation. Yet, for those of us that share and know that good feeling, the definition of sauna is arguably much more important than its pronunciation. And for that matter, the definition of sauna is universal and straightforward:
Sauna Definition: A room, often lined with wood, with a heat source that heats rocks to sufficient temperature to create steam when water is tossed on rocks.
So, for example, Temascal, Native American Sweat Lodge, Banya and venik treatments, are all ancient sauna sweat bathing practices.
Chris Lindley is Chief Population Health Officer, Vail Health and the Executive Director, Eagle Valley Behavioral HealthExecutive Director at Eagle Valley Behavioral Health. I will save his bio for what I hope to be a dedicated podcast interview with Chris. But a quick note: Chrisâs education and passion revolve around improving the populationâs health, emergency response, and wellness. Chris is a decorated combat veteran, receiving a Bronze Star and Presidential Citation while leading troops in Iraq in 2005.
The convergence of the Sauna Research Institute, Vail Health, and the work happening with Charles through Ashley in San Francisco, Chris and team at Vail Health, as well as at Harvard are exciting examples for all of us, that right now, what we all know to be true is being studied and researched.
Sauna is good for us!
Soon, as we continue to unpack and understand how.. and why.. and how much.. I will say, I hope you enjoy my visit with Dr. Charles Raison.. and Sauna on!
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Today on the virtual smoke sauna bench, please welcome my friend Jarmo Hiltunen. Author of the brand new book: Building a Traditional Finnish Smoke Sauna.
I am overjoyed that for many, Jarmo will be your voice to the introduction to the wonderfulness of smoke sauna. Jarmo is a builder, but I would call him more of an artisan. Also, he is also a smoke sauna spiritual evangelist.
His book is now available on AmazonAs we type the words âsmoke saunaâ into the Amazon search bar, we have to sift our way through infrared âsaunaâ blankets and dozens of other misappropriations of the word âsaunaâ before finally finding this gem of a resource.
Small world
Many/most of us around the world have little knowledge or experience with smoke sauna. Itâs not just buried within the search bar. And for some of us, being hidden and special is a nice place for smoke sauna to reside.
For smoke sauna is a deep in history, culture, and spirit. Yes, we have had many fragmentations of sauna. But, there will be minimal to no fragmentations of traditional smoke sauna. And thanks to this comprehensive work, Jarmo Hiltunen ensures us that the purity and authenticity of smoke sauna will remain with us forever.
I love that smoke sauna is hard to build. It takes commitment and cash. And these barriers help ensure that those willing to take on the task are both committed to the work. And dedicated to its reward.
This book helps us decide if we want to undertake the challenge. The book clearly helps us decide for ourselves if we are ready to undertake building our own smoke sauna. We Get a flavor of the potential satisfaction in the work, and if committed, be able to realize the amazing löyly and hot room microclimate that may await us at the end of the smoke sauna building journey.I am blessed to have met Jarmo Hiltunen, the author, by upmost coincidence in a public (modified) smoke sauna in Helskinki, back in 2019. Despite living in separate continents, reading through his book, I feel once again that I am right there with him on the bench.
Buy this book. And whether you undertake your smoke sauna build or not, reading through the process will help you appreciate Jarmoâs dedication to smoke sauna. And that alone is worth having his book on your shelf.Wishing you all good sauna. And thank you Jarmo for your hard work and dedication to making this book come to life.
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Welcome to this Sauna Talk podcast episode with Nick Fox: Minnesotaâs first Wim Hof certified instructor and baker of amazing homemade bread.
We communed in heat, cold plunge and nature in my backyard sauna recently and youâll hear my interview with Nick in just a moment. But before then, Iâd like to take you back to a dark and cold February night in Minnesota a few years ago when Nick first sat down to watch the VICE documentary on Wim Hof, the Ice Man. Inspired by the science and adventures in the cold with minimal clothing, Nick began taking cold showers and practicing breathwork the very next day. His experience with the Wim Hof Method (WHM) initiated Nickâs breathwork journey. In January of 2022 he went to Poland to complete his certification as a WHM Instructor, and later he became certified in the Oxygen Advantage. Now, he guides breathwork and coaches ice baths in workshops around the Midwest.
Pulmonaut beginningsBefore becoming a full-time Pulmonaut, (a pulmonaut is simply someone who uses their breath as a tool for exploration and transformation) Nick taught Philosophy, History, and Art at both the high school and college level. He is also a Lieutenant Colonel in the Army Reserve, and spends his summers out in the field with the cadets at the Military Academy in West Point, NY. When heâs not playing Army, heâs writing and drawing with his young kids.
Sauna Talk Podcast cold exposure breathwork guestsThose familiar with this podcast are familiar with a few other Sauna Talk guests from the world of cold exposure and breathwork. A few that come to mind include Harvey Martin, who currently is on staff breathing and contrast therapy-ing with the San Francisco Giants major league baseball team, Jesse Coomer, trainer, breathwork coach and author of two books on the subject, and Wim Hof himself, back in 2017. So feel free to dig back and check out these episodes in particular.
Back to NickTeaching people deep conscious breathing and cold exposure techniques is his new passion. You can visit his website foxfirebreathworks.com where youâll be able to check out his upcoming workshops and classes. For example, in January 2024, it should be cold enough in Minneapolis for Nickâs winter swimming class at the Swedish Institute. He is mobilizing a kick ass wood fired mobile sauna (one that I actually had a hand in helping with with my friends Brad and Ben at Prairiewood Saunas, but thatâs story for another day coming soon). Anyhow, Nick looks forward to helping you explore your inner strengths. And I am super happy to share some breathing on the bench with you and Nick Fox from FoxFire Breathworks. Welcome Nick to Sauna Talk!
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Today we welcome a very special guest to Sauna Talk: Dr. Charles Raison. His biography is as follows:
Dr. Raison is a the Mary Sue and Mike Shannon Chair for Healthy Minds, Children & Families in the School of Human Ecology and a Professor in the Department of Psychiatry at the University of Wisconsin â Madison. Dr. Raison received his medical degree from Washington University in St Louis, Missouri, where he was elected to Alpha Omega Alpha and won the Missouri State Medical Association Award. He completed residency training at the UCLA Neuropsychiatric Institute and Hospital in Los Angeles. In addition to his medical training, Dr. Raison obtained his Masters of English from the University of Denver.
Dr. Raison has written and published over 100 scientific papers as well over 20 review papers and editorials. Chapters he has written have been featured in over 30 books, and he has written two books, most recently The New Mind-Body Science of Depression, published by WW Norton in 2017. Dr. Raisonâs publications have been cited over 14,000 times, with three publications having more than 1,000 citations. His H-index is 44. The recipient of several teaching awards, Dr. Raison has received research funding from the National Institute of Mental Health, National Center for Complementary and Alternative Medicine, and the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention. His visionary work focuses on the treatment of depression in response to illness and stress, translating neurobiological findings into novel interventions. In addition to his activities at University of Wisconsin-Madison, Dr. Raison is the mental health expert for CNN.com.â
Reference: UW-Madisonhttps://www.psychiatry.wisc.edu âș staff âș raison-charles
Sauna Talk excerptsWe discuss Charlesâ academic and personal background, how he has been interested in Worldâs ancient practices including Buddist Tuumo meditation, where Tibetan monks are wrapped in cold wet blankets and through breathing and meditation, are able to warm themselves for a long period of time. The area around research and studies to treat depression are of special interest. Reaching a hypothermia state has proven health benefits. Dr. Raisonâs 2010 depression study with 16 people, who reached 101.3 degrees f. shown a marketed decrease in depression. The participants actually lowered their internal body temperature.
The World leader in HypothermiaWe discuss other work and studies happening right now in the United States, through Harvard University and Massachusetts General. Also Ashley Masonâs work in San Francisco. More on this soon! The Vail sauna lab Eagle County Co. is an interesting place. The disparity of rich and poor, and people moving their and experiencing the Paradox of Paradise, are likely culprits that lead to the area having the highest suicide rate in the country.
Ashley Mason, UCSF. Heat has an antidepressant effect.
Transforming mental healthThe good news is a private investment of $100mm towards a new hospital in Vail that is committed to transform mental health in this country. Providing equitable care for rich and non rich, integrating mind/body practices. Vail Health is set to be a world class research institute. Heat, thermal studies, psychedelic research are all areas of study. It is an exciting time for sauna research.
The CHILL study. Can you benefit from heat whether you are taking an antidepressant or not?
This episode tees the ball up for our follow up conversation which I will be equally excited to bring to you in the future.
So, for right now, I am pleased to present to you Dr. Charles Raison.
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Welcome to this mini Sauna Talk episode from inside and around the Worldâs Largest Sauna. The sauna was constructed as part of the RunningMan festival outside of Atlanta Georgia, this past weekend, mid October 2023.
Iâll try to connect the dots to how the Worldâs Largest Sauna came about. And it started with the folks at Embrace North, building a few saunas for the All Day Running organization. And as All Day Running began planning for the RunningMan festival, well, their experience with good heat and creative right brain thinking on the bench fostered a way to âscaleâ sauna.\
And we move over to All Day Runningâs co founder Todd Ferneauxâs backyard. Here is where Todd built the mock prototype for the Worldâs Largest Sauna. Iâll spare the nuts and bolts of its creative construction, as you can listen to my recent podcast interview with Todd for more on that.
Worldâs Largest Sauna buildingI was able to lend to help with some of the construction of the sauna and set up.
For now, though, Iâd like to welcome you into the event: RunningMan. I attended for a few reasons, and one was to help share what I know about running the sauna stoves. I have used this same stove for 30 years. As elder statesman with more grey hair than most at the event, I was happy to help coach the stokers who became quick studies on stove operation. (note: you donât have to go into the hot room to see how your stove is performing. If you see smoke coming out the chimney, it needs attending).
Runners and Sauna enthusiastsAnother reason why I was happy to attend RunningMan is to celebrate and experience all the goodness happening with the Venn diagram overlap of people into hot/cold contrast therapy and people into running. As we look at the overlap, the commonalities become clear.
Runners:
know how to push the limits of human performance. are tuned into their bodies.. and their minds. get high on their own supply. are generally conscious folks who can feel when endorphins are rushing. know how good it feels the moment you stop banging your head against a wall.All above also applies to all of us who dig sauna. And cold plunge, as peanut butter and jelly. Knowing our bodies, minds, spirits. Runners, generally, all dig sauna. And when they feel good heat, itâs all over.
So, in this episode youâll hear from Todd at All Day Running, C T from Nomad Sauna, Tyler, one of the stokers, and a couple other guests, all of whom will give you a good flavor of what itâs like to be in and around the Worldâs Largest Sauna.
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Today on the bench, we welcome Todd Furneaux who is spearheading the building of the Worldâs Largest Sauna. The sauna is being constructed as part of Running Man, a three day festival happening outside of Atlanta Georgia this mid October 2023.
During this episode, youâll hear about Toddâs company and cohorts, All Day Running. And how the idea of building the Worldâs Largest Sauna was surely fostered on the sauna bench or in the cold plunge. As with endorphins running and community spiriting, this is the environment for Sauna Talk and crazy out there thinking.
Atlanta steeplechase. Grass track. Sauna Village, fun zone, DJs, live music, conferences,
October 17, 18, 19 event.
Sauna can hold. 250 â 350 people at a time.
Mechanics of Worldâs Largest SaunaSpecially designed Todd Right Brain Thinking:
3,000 square feet in modular squares using 4âx4âČ framing material. Side walls: sauna tent material 3 ply oxford. 9âČ tall 20âČ wide. Flooring: cedar flooring. Roof: Greenhouse style sauna inspiration from NorthUp in Minneapolis. Clear polycarbonate roofing. Same material Itâs rated to over 550f. to melt it. The material letâs the light in. There is a greenhouse effect with clear polycarbonate as roofing. On sunny Atlanta days, itâs about 120f. before lighting to the stove. Sauna stoves: 13 large Kuumas. oven for every 200 sf.Prototype: 200 sf sauna 20âx10âČ. A great way of testing the temperature of things. How the size of the panels.
Final dimensions of the worldâs largest sauna65âČ x 45âČ with extra 200 â 400âČ square feet entry and exit.
Exercising your immune system
Running and Sauna.. they go hand in hand.
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